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2014 Honda Accord Lease Questions

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  • persianaraspersianaras Posts: 8

    Hi, I just got off the phone with a dealer who was insistent on factoring in the drive-off fee's (acq fee, doc fee, tag, etc) into the cap cost. I was very clear that I wanted to pay these fees up front and not roll them into the lease payments, but he said I had to account for them as part of the cap cost. He gave the example that if the price of the car is $30k, and there's $2k in drive off fees, the net cap cost would be $32k and I could not calculate the lease payment based off of just the $30k. This scenario makes no sense to me. I have leased several cars and I have always asked to pay these fees separately without any problem. Essentially, I negotiate the price of the car (cap cost), excluding these fees, and go from there. Either this was an attempt to confuse me, or Honda's leasing program is structured differently (?) I think the former. My questions are:

    1) Is there any benefit to the dealer if one rolls these fees into the monthly payment, vs paying for the these fees up front as part of "cash due at signing" ?

    2) Is the acq fee taxed if payed up front?

    3) Is the doc fee or any other fee taxed if payed up front?

    I have read that such fees (acq and doc) are service fees and therefore not taxed. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance. (in AZ)

  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 29,217

    @persianaras said: Hi, I just got off the phone with a dealer who was insistent on factoring in the drive-off fee's (acq fee, doc fee, tag, etc) into the cap cost. I was very clear that I wanted to pay these fees up front and not roll them into the lease payments, but he said I had to account for them as part of the cap cost. He gave the example that if the price of the car is $30k, and there's $2k in drive off fees, the net cap cost would be $32k and I could not calculate the lease payment based off of just the $30k. This scenario makes no sense to me. I have leased several cars and I have always asked to pay these fees separately without any problem. Essentially, I negotiate the price of the car (cap cost), excluding these fees, and go from there. Either this was an attempt to confuse me, or Honda's leasing program is structured differently (?) I think the former. My questions are:

    1) Is there any benefit to the dealer if one rolls these fees into the monthly payment, vs paying for the these fees up front as part of "cash due at signing" ?

    2) Is the acq fee taxed if payed up front?

    3) Is the doc fee or any other fee taxed if payed up front?

    I have read that such fees (acq and doc) are service fees and therefore not taxed. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance. (in AZ)

    Usually, acquisition and doc fees are taxed, even if paid upfront...

    If Arizona is a state where they tax the payment, each month (and, I think that it is), the only amounts that would be un-taxed are government fees (title/registration, for example).

    The lease calculation looks a little convoluted on a dealer's screen.. But, even if they add everything in, and then you give them $2000 upfront, it will still be broken out into taxed and untaxed.. Of course, the payment will be exactly the same (and the monthly tax). But, your $2000 upfront will still be separated into 1st payment (with tax), acquisition fee, doc fee, title and registration, with the rest (if any) going to Cap cost reduction and tax on the acq.fee and doc fee.

    In other words, as long as your amount due at signing is the same as the fees they are rolling in, you shouldn't get taxed on the title/registration fees.. There would definitely not be any advantage to the dealer doing it differently, unless they are just trying to hide a fee by lumping it into the $2000.

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  • pcarlson1pcarlson1 Posts: 4
    Residual Value on Honda Accord Sport 15k miles?

    Thanks
  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @pcarlson1 said: Residual Value on Honda Accord Sport 15k miles?
    Thanks

    Lease term?

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  • gueloxguelox Posts: 1

    What do you guys think.

    Honda accord Sport CVT. Msrp 25,305 Sale price 21,740 1100 drive of fees included the first month payment, 250 dealer doc fee,ectt

    residual 56% MF 0.00026

    12k/36m tax is 6.9%

    payment of 224.00 tax included.

    does this seam like a goo deal?

  • gueloxguelox Posts: 1

    What do you guys think.

    Honda accord Sport CVT. Msrp 25,305 Sale price 21,740 1100 drive of fees included the first month payment, 250 dealer doc fee,ectt

    residual 56% MF 0.00026

    12k/36m tax is 6.9%

    payment of 224.00 tax included.

    does this seam like a goo deal?

  • deniska1deniska1 Posts: 24

    Hi looking for accord sedan ex-l v6 and v4 residual and MF for 24 months 10K per year in NY and NJ.

    Thank You

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @guelox said: What do you guys think.

    Honda accord Sport CVT. Msrp 25,305 Sale price 21,740 1100 drive of fees included the first month payment, 250 dealer doc fee,ectt

    residual 56% MF 0.00026

    12k/36m tax is 6.9%

    payment of 224.00 tax included.

    does this seam like a goo deal?

    Seems pretty good. Base MF and a healthy discount from sticker. What's not to like?

    Enjoy your new Accord, and when you're ready, write up a review using the link in my signature block.

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  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @deniska1 said: Hi looking for accord sedan ex-l v6 and v4 residual and MF for 24 months 10K per year in NY and NJ.

    Thank You

    No 10K numbers from Honda, but if they did exist, add 1% to 12K numbers I cite below.

    EX-L 4-cyl - 62% for 24/12

    EX-L V6 - 61% for 24/12

    .00026 MF. $850 lease cash on the 4-cyl; $1200 lease cash on the V6.

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  • carmenohiocarmenohio Posts: 5

    Residual & MF on an Accord Sport and EX sedan (manual transmission on both) in Ohio?

    12,000/yr; 36 month lease 15,000/yr; 36 month lease

    Thanks in advance!

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @carmenohio said: Residual & MF on an Accord Sport and EX sedan (manual transmission on both) in Ohio?

    12,000/yr; 36 month lease 15,000/yr; 36 month lease

    Thanks in advance!

    Sport - 54% for 15K; add 2% for 12K

    EX - 55% for 15K; add 2% for 12K

    .00026 and $850 lease cash for both

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  • carmenohiocarmenohio Posts: 5

    So I got an offer from the dealership on an EX.

    MSRP - $25,670 Price - $22,418 (w/lease cash taken into consideration) (claimed this was $1140 under invoice, correct?)

    Previously stated .00026 MF

    Both are 36 month leases.

    $243.58/12k $258.63/15k

    Good deal? Average deal? Horrible deal?

  • carmenohiocarmenohio Posts: 5

    After a little research, I'm thinking that under invoice statement is false.

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @carmenohio said: So I got an offer from the dealership on an EX.

    MSRP - $25,670 Price - $22,418 (w/lease cash taken into consideration) (claimed this was $1140 under invoice, correct?)

    Previously stated .00026 MF

    Both are 36 month leases.

    $243.58/12k $258.63/15k

    Good deal? Average deal? Horrible deal?

    Using your MSRP and selling price along with the .00026 MF and 55% residual for 36/15, I get a pre-tax payment of $240.04.

    36/12 residual of 57% takes the pre-tax payment down to $225.91

    Both seem to be good deals.

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  • boxfan03boxfan03 Posts: 2

    Hi. I just got back from a dealership in southern california. The best deal they would offer for a honda accord sport was $1500 for drive off fee (80 doc fee, first month,...) and monthly payment of $232 tax included (I live in Glendale so I believe it's 9%). MF .00026 residual 53%. 36month 12k mile lease. I believe they dropped to 22500 on the sale price.

    When I asked about the $850 lease cash they basically said that it was for them and not me lol. They did give me the conquest $500 bonus. Can these both be used together?

    I walked away from the deal. I believe the deal was ok but could be better. How much lower can I reasonably get the monthly payment with the drive off fee at $1500? Thanks for all the advice on here. Really helps.

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @boxfan03 said: Hi. I just got back from a dealership in southern california. The best deal they would offer for a honda accord sport was $1500 for drive off fee (80 doc fee, first month,...) and monthly payment of $232 tax included (I live in Glendale so I believe it's 9%). MF .00026 residual 53%. 36month 12k mile lease. I believe they dropped to 22500 on the sale price.

    When I asked about the $850 lease cash they basically said that it was for them and not me lol. They did give me the conquest $500 bonus. Can these both be used together?

    I walked away from the deal. I believe the deal was ok but could be better. How much lower can I reasonably get the monthly payment with the drive off fee at $1500? Thanks for all the advice on here. Really helps.

    It's possible that the $22,500 sale price included the $850, but if you weren't comfortable, you were right to walk away. They were using the base MF, however, so that was a positive.

    Not like there aren't dozens of Honda dealers in Southern California.

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  • pj_patelpj_patel Posts: 13

    Hi,

    I have never leased a car before and I am completely new to this. Here is my situation I have a 2003 Nissan Maxima GLE which is in okay condition but it needs some fixing up, but I don't think it is worth it. It will probably cost around 1000 to 1500 to fix the car up and my only concern is will it break down again a year later, so I want to lease a Honda Accord and I saw this deal online at VIP Honda. I will put up the link can someone tell me if it is a good deal and what I should negotiate. I actually want to get the Sport model or the EX L. I spoke with a sales person from VIP honda and he gave me some rough figures on how much my monthly payments can be based on the information I gave him. So he said I would be paying around 229 for the sport and 279 for the EX L. I would need almost 1800 for first month payment including bank fees, plate fees, and not sure what else makes up the http://viphonda.com/model/2014-honda-accord/

    All comments and suggestions will be really helpful. Im actually trying to make a deal within the next couple of days since it is the end of the month.

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @pj_patel said: Hi,

    I have never leased a car before and I am completely new to this. Here is my situation I have a 2003 Nissan Maxima GLE which is in okay condition but it needs some fixing up, but I don't think it is worth it. It will probably cost around 1000 to 1500 to fix the car up and my only concern is will it break down again a year later, so I want to lease a Honda Accord and I saw this deal online at VIP Honda. I will put up the link can someone tell me if it is a good deal and what I should negotiate. I actually want to get the Sport model or the EX L. I spoke with a sales person from VIP honda and he gave me some rough figures on how much my monthly payments can be based on the information I gave him. So he said I would be paying around 229 for the sport and 279 for the EX L. I would need almost 1800 for first month payment including bank fees, plate fees, and not sure what else makes up the http://viphonda.com/model/2014-honda-accord/

    All comments and suggestions will be really helpful. Im actually trying to make a deal within the next couple of days since it is the end of the month.

    You should negotiate your lease just like you would a purchase. Get the best selling price, and ensure that the dealer isn't marking up the money factor on you.

    Not a good idea to negotiate based on payment.

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  • pj_patelpj_patel Posts: 13

    @Michaell said: Not a good idea to negotiate based on payment.

    Michaell

    Can you give me some advice on what I should be asking and what I should be negotiating. I know my friend recently bought the 2014 Honda Accord Sport for 22k and with all the fees and what not he walked out the door paying 24k. He didn't lease so I don't know if that applies in this situation. Also how does Honda decide the residual?? I was looking to lease but buy out the car at the end because I know that I will not be driving the car a lot. My commute to work is only 3 miles one way, which is amazing. I will not even use the 36,000 miles for the three years. Thats why I wanted to know how the residual is determined because if it is set in stone the car will be worth more than the residual at the end.

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @pj_patel said: Can you give me some advice on what I should be asking and what I should be negotiating. I know my friend recently bought the 2014 Honda Accord Sport for 22k and with all the fees and what not he walked out the door paying 24k. He didn't lease so I don't know if that applies in this situation. Also how does Honda decide the residual?? I was looking to lease but buy out the car at the end because I know that I will not be driving the car a lot. My commute to work is only 3 miles one way, which is amazing. I will not even use the 36,000 miles for the three years. Thats why I wanted to know how the residual is determined because if it is set in stone the car will be worth more than the residual at the end.

    You negotiate the price for a lease just like you would a purchase. Aim for the lowest possible price - Accords are going for $1-2K under invoice at the moment. That becomes your net cap cost.

    The residual value is set by Honda Finance and cannot be modified. You can get a 12K mile per year lease - the residual goes up if that is the case.

    If you drive the car only 20,000 miles in the three years, then it's very likely your car will be worth more than the residual value in the lease contract. If so, should you decide to buy the car out, you could then resell it for a profit.

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  • pj_patelpj_patel Posts: 13

    @Michaell said: If you drive the car only 20,000 miles in the three years, then it's very likely your car will be worth more than the residual value in the lease contract. If so, should you decide to buy the car out, you could then resell it for a profit.

    Thanks for the advice. Now one more thing, which fees can I try to get the dealership to drop? There roughly talking about 1800 that I need to put down the day of even though its zero down. How much would I expect to pay per month for a Honda EX L if I wanted to lease one?

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @pj_patel said: Thanks for the advice. Now one more thing, which fees can I try to get the dealership to drop? There roughly talking about 1800 that I need to put down the day of even though its zero down. How much would I expect to pay per month for a Honda EX L if I wanted to lease one?

    Not many of the fees can be waived - there is an acquisition fee imposed by Honda Finance, a "dealership handling" fee that you can negotiate out of the deal - "Oh, I see you charge a $499 dealership fee, I'm reducing my offer by $499 to compensate". You can also choose to roll these fees into your cap cost, which will increase your payment but reduce the initial cash outlay. Generally speaking, you want you out of pocket to be just the first month's payment.

    Without an MSRP or negotiated selling price, I can't model a payment for you.

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  • pj_patelpj_patel Posts: 13

    @Michaell said: Without an MSRP or negotiated selling price, I can't model a payment for you. Can I use True Car as a rough estimate for MSRP? For the EXL Factory invoice is 26,650, average paid is 26,890, and MSRP is 29,060. I have excellent credit and I will be paying all fees up front. Does that really work if I tell them that i'm reducing my offer by 499 to make up for the dealership fee? I really haven't bought many cars in my time. Only one car and I was young so I got ripped off 8 years ago. That is why I am asking a lot of questions.

  • zedmzedm Posts: 6

    Hi,

    Please help me with MF and residual for Accord Sedan 4cyl EX-L with Nav and 6cyl EX-L with NAV for 12K/36 months in Los Angeles area.

    Appreciate the information Thanks Zed

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @pj_patel said: Can I use True Car as a rough estimate for MSRP? For the EXL Factory invoice is 26,650, average paid is 26,890, and MSRP is 29,060. I have excellent credit and I will be paying all fees up front. Does that really work if I tell them that i'm reducing my offer by 499 to make up for the dealership fee? I really haven't bought many cars in my time. Only one car and I was young so I got ripped off 8 years ago. That is why I am asking a lot of questions.

    If I use the MSRP and "average paid" prices with the 36/12 residual of 55% for the EX-L and the money factor of .00074 (there are two different MF, based on state; I am using the higher of the two), I get a pre-tax payment of $334.70. The lower MF (.00026) gives a pre-tax payment of $314.12/mo.

    Also note there is $850 of lease cash available on 4-cylinder Accord sedans this month.

    If the dealer is quoting you a payment of $279/mo, I'd ask them to show you the math.

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  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @zedm said: Hi,

    Please help me with MF and residual for Accord Sedan 4cyl EX-L with Nav and 6cyl EX-L with NAV for 12K/36 months in Los Angeles area.

    Appreciate the information Thanks Zed

    EX-L 4-cyl - 53%

    EX-L V6 - 52%

    .00026 MF for both. $850 lease cash on the 4-cyl and $1200 lease cash for the V6 this month.

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  • pj_patelpj_patel Posts: 13

    @Michaell said: If the dealer is quoting you a payment of $279/mo, I'd ask them to show you the math.

    Isn't 279 a good deal? Does that mean I would be paying more at the end of the lease? What do you mean by pre tax as well? Is the 850 included in the discount or would I ask for the 850 because I am looking to lease a 4 cylinder.

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,659

    @pj_patel said: Isn't 279 a good deal?

    It looks too good to be true, based on my math. I am just skeptical.

    Does that mean I would be paying more at the end of the lease?

    Not sure what you mean by that .... the lower your payment, the lower the total amount paid over the full lease term.

    What do you mean by pre tax as well?

    Sales tax is added into the final monthly lease payment ... what state do you live in?

    Is the 850 included in the discount or would I ask for the 850 because I am looking to lease a 4 cylinder.

    You would have to ask the dealer that question .. my guess is yes, their discount includes the $850 lease cash. But, you might be able to negotiate a better discount ... check the Accord Prices Paid discussion.

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  • boxfan03boxfan03 Posts: 2
    Hi. Just got back from a dealership. Negotiated to $21500 for accord sport with propack including destination fee before rebates. Mf .00026 and 53% residual. 12k/36months. There doc fee was $80 and there where no extra misc charges. When it came time to sign the paperwork they had changed the price to $21995. I got upset and walked out. They came after me and told me that they couldn't go any lower and I was at 21500 if I included the conquest bonus of $500. They offered me car washes and oil changes. I had spent so much time there and I needed a car soon so I eventually signed. I think I got a good deal but not the best. It still irks me they pulled a bait and switch for $495. The finance guy told me to go there tomorrow and talk to the general manager to tell him what had happened. He doesn't like the manager that I was dealing with. My questions are do you think the general manager will do anything and if I got a good deal as it stands? Thanks
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 29,217

    You signed.. they aren't going to do anything. The finance guy was just deflecting your objections, as he is trained to do.

    Trying doesn't cost anything, but it could lead to a lot of frustration.

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