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Buying and Selling Cars: Post Your Experiences

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  • abacomikeabacomike South FloridaPosts: 3,815
    @driver100 said:

    "I guess the question is, if they know they can sell all they can get orders for, will the dealer try to put you off if you order a stripped down model? Like you said, if he can only get so many, and he knows they will all sell ot, he may as well try to sell the most expensive models he can get."

    Not necessarily. If the dealership tries any " hanky-panky" like delaying the order or saying he placed the order and it ends up he did not, oldfarmer merely calls Ford Consumer Relations and the dealership can be fined or receive a warning which can cost him bucks on terms of rebates etc.

    That's why you give the dealer a deposit, agree to price, get a copy of the agreement with estimated delivery date signed by the Sales Manager. Now the dealer is obligated and oldfarmer has cause for legal action.

    2014 Mercedes Benz CLS 550 - best car ever! 2nd best car ever, my 1967 Corvette Stingray Coupe with 435 hp.

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Posts: 6,595

    Now wait a minute! :s

    As usual after I re read information I realize I didn't understand what I was seeing. That $1 discount was something from Edmunds not the dealer and when I rechecked the dealer's site against the Edmunds Price & Build and it looks like this dealer is listing his 2015 Mustang GT for $400 under invoice.

    http://www.tomsford.com/auto/new-2015-ford-mustang-gt/1746441/

    What am I missing?

    2009 PT Cruiser, 2008 Eclipse, 1995 Mark VIII, 1988 GMC Van

  • abacomikeabacomike South FloridaPosts: 3,815
    @oldfarmer50‌ said:

    "As usual after I re read information I realize I didn't understand what I was seeing. That $1 discount was something from Edmunds not the dealer and when I rechecked the dealer's site against the Edmunds Price & Build and it looks like this dealer is listing his 2015 Mustang GT for $400 under invoice.

    http://www.tomsford.com/auto/new-2015-ford-mustang-gt/1746441/

    What am I missing?"

    I did not see that - I just saw MSRP. My guess is that they will sell you a 2014 for under invoice. The ad, if in fact is selling a 2015 for $400 under invoice, is either a mistake or false advertising.

    No one is selling a 2015 Mustang GT with automatic for $400 below invoice.

    Pull the trigger already , OF - order the darn car just the way you want it or drive over to the Ford dealer who advertised the car and buy it already!

    2014 Mercedes Benz CLS 550 - best car ever! 2nd best car ever, my 1967 Corvette Stingray Coupe with 435 hp.

  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 12,252

    @abacomike said: oldfarmer merely calls Ford Consumer Relations and the dealership can be fined or receive a warning which can cost him bucks on terms of rebates etc.

    Thanks for the answer, much appreciated.

    I think that if oldfarmer orders a Mustang the way he wants he should try to get a 5% discount. No one really knows if 2015 Mustangs are going to sell out. He may get a better deal if he places an order, the first ones may get bought up right away by the fans, and then a dealer and Ford will be glad to make him one.

    I would talk to a dealer. Order the car exactly the way you want it. You would have nothing to lose. If you don't get it at the first dealer just walk. If you find one you like you can go for it, if not, just sit back and wait until the dust settles.

    It sounds like a lot of money, but, it won't mean a thing in the big scheme of things. I probably overpaid for some cars....but, I have no regrets - liked all my cars and if I am out a few $$$$s, I wouldn't know it.

    2012 535ix 2013 Audi A4 2013 Passat

  • abacomikeabacomike South FloridaPosts: 3,815
    edited September 1
    @driver100 said:

    "I think that if oldfarmer orders a Mustang the way he wants he should try to get a 5% discount."

    If you build a 2015 Mustang GT with automatic transmission and one or two stand-alone options, you will see that a 5% discount off MSRP is close to cost on these cars. There isn't much of a mark-up on these cars. Dealers make their money on incentives from Ford - but there won't be any of those for quite some time.

    Ford, Chevy and Dodge dealers make their money on volume sales - which is not the case with most other brands.

    If oldfarmer tries to get 5% off MSRP from a dealer, his last rights will come sooner than his car if he wants one in the next few months.

    2014 Mercedes Benz CLS 550 - best car ever! 2nd best car ever, my 1967 Corvette Stingray Coupe with 435 hp.

  • stickguystickguy Posts: 14,722

    @nyc, I stopped at Kolb last winter. not far from the old homestead. And was actually right around the corner from there on Friday.

    My SIL has decided on a Forrester, and needs to get moving on it soon. She lives up past Albany, so I am limited here to giving her a target # and hoping her BF can take care of the rest! She is hopeless on her own.

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (daughter stole that one), and 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again)

  • tyguytyguy ColoradoPosts: 831

    @nyccarguy said I'll keep you guys updated.

    I own 2012 Impreza 2.0 Limited with 5-door. Having just bought a 2015 Outback, which is a brand new model this year, I'd recommend targeting 3% below invoice plus TTL.

  • tyguytyguy ColoradoPosts: 831

    @stickguy said: My SIL has decided on a Forrester, and needs to get moving on it soon. She lives up past Albany, so I am limited here to giving her a target # and hoping her BF can take care of the rest! She is hopeless on her own.

    My father-in-law loves his 2014 Forester. Perhaps you could help your sister through email negotiations with dealers near her? Essentially set the deal so she just needs to walk in sign paperwork.

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Posts: 6,595

    @stickguy said: nyc, I stopped at Kolb last winter. not far from the old homestead. And was actually right around the corner from there on Friday.

    My SIL has decided on a Forrester, and needs to get moving on it soon. She lives up past Albany, so I am limited here to giving her a target # and hoping her BF can take care of the rest! She is hopeless on her own.

    A woman at work bought a new Forester and loves it. It's gotten big over the years.

    2009 PT Cruiser, 2008 Eclipse, 1995 Mark VIII, 1988 GMC Van

  • mako1amako1a VirginiaPosts: 1,738

    2013 Mustang GT, 2006 Silverado 2500 LT HD, 2001 GMC Yukon Denali

  • jayriderjayrider Posts: 3,329

    @oldfarmer50 said: Now wait a minute! :s

    As usual after I re read information I realize I didn't understand what I was seeing. That $1 discount was something from Edmunds not the dealer and when I rechecked the dealer's site against the Edmunds Price & Build and it looks like this dealer is listing his 2015 Mustang GT for $400 under invoice.

    http://www.tomsford.com/auto/new-2015-ford-mustang-gt/1746441/

    What am I missing?

    When it comes to the new Mustang and all the excitement -- I don't think I want the first few months of production. Also, I would want a thorough test drive to make sure it lives up to my own expectations before I placed an order. Probably takes a lot of the fun out of it but six months of patience makes sense.

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,765

    @cdnpinhead said: I thought people who finance a car for six years don't spend time on these boards, but I'm always interested in learning how many other ways I can be wrong.

    Well I am back from the Caribbean (hate the thought of going back to work tomorrow), well anyway, it would depend on the interest rates being offered. Offer me 72 months at 0% and I will snap it up. I could always pay it off faster and I do keep cars for longer than 72 months. You will even pay less with a 72 month loan at 1.5% than you will with a 48 month loan at 4%. So it would all depend on what the particulars are.

    The sign said "No shoes, no shirt, no service", it didn't say anything about no pants.

  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 12,252

    @abacomike said:If you build a 2015 Mustang GT with automatic transmission and one or two stand-alone options, you will see that a 5% discount off MSRP is close to cost on these cars.

    I think it is worth a shot, the most the salesman can say is no. We may think the 2015 is going to be a huge seller but what if it isn't as big as everyone seems to think. There isn't much profit in selling cars these days anyway. The profit is in the servicing, and they really try to stick it to you there.

    No one wants to pay more than they have to, so by asking for 5% off you can get a sense of whether any discount is possible. It might lead to a different strategy too, like wait for 5 months until the hoopla is over and there might be excess cars in stock.

    2012 535ix 2013 Audi A4 2013 Passat

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,765

    @ab348 said: According to the dealer's own website the E350 sedan they have on their lot that I looked at is a color called Dolomite Brown. I don't know what a dolomite is but apparently they are brown.

    Dolomite is a carbonate mineral that could be almost any color.

    The sign said "No shoes, no shirt, no service", it didn't say anything about no pants.

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,765

    @abacomike said: I GUESS I HAVE NO TASTE OR SENSE OF HUMOR
    I have been watching the Emmy's on TV and it would appear that the nominees and the winners of the first 8 or 9 Emmy awards are as foreign to me as an Alfa Romeo is to the car enthusiast.
    I don't watch any of those shows nor any of the networks. "The New Black Is Orange"? "Mom"? "Veep"? It's like I've been in a coma for 10 years and just woke up and this is all that's on TV.

    I have seen a couple of episodes of "Mom" (that's an hour of my life I will never get back) and it's not you that has no taste or sense of humor it is those who pick who wins Emmys that has no taste if anything on that show won.

    The sign said "No shoes, no shirt, no service", it didn't say anything about no pants.

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,765

    @oldfarmer50 said: Watching Fast & Loud and they bought a 1984 Seville. They all trashed talked it during the show and just dumped it on the internet but I kind if like that quirky style.

    I think it was Motor Trend that when that Seville came out stated that "The garbage truck that ran into the back of that Seville should have kept going".

    The sign said "No shoes, no shirt, no service", it didn't say anything about no pants.

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,309
    edited September 1

    @snakeweasel said: I think it was Motor Trend that when that Seville came out stated that "The garbage truck that ran into the back of that Seville should have kept going".

    Maybe they would have liked it more if the same styling cues were to have come from other manufacturers? ... Oh wait. Here's one. There's a strong resemblance in the shaping of the rear. I recall when the Seville came out and that styling was likened to some earlier older style vehicles. I'll have to see if I can find a picture of the old cars.

  • abacomikeabacomike South FloridaPosts: 3,815

    @snakeweasel said: I have seen a couple of episodes of "Mom" (that's an hour of my life I will never get back) and it's not you that has no taste or sense of humor it is those who pick who wins Emmys that has no taste if anything on that show won."

    I have finally figured it all out about why the shows we don't watch or care to watch are doing so well via the Emmy's and why the shows we did/do like are at the back of the pack. Here is my analysis:

    *Shows like "Everyone Loves Raymond", "Frasier", "Seinfeld", "Two and a Half Men" and the like, are situation comedies that require "logic, cerebral analysis, deductive reasoning, inductive reasoning, etc.," in order to appreciate the humor and the "read between the lines" punch lines, as well as excellent performers who deliver the humor. Additionally, shows like "Perry Mason", "Ironsides", "Murder She Wrote", etc., were shows that required excellent actors to perform to perfection!

    Today's situation comedies are very, very different - the actors are fed the lines and they deliver them as written without the need for the audience (us) to decipher or use advanced cerebral systems to derive the humor - it's put out there right in front of us and all we have to do is watch and listen.

    I remember the days of "Seinfeld" when we would go to work the next morning and the discussion in the lounge or in the offices was all about, "...did you see...what did you think about...wasn't that hysterical...it was just too funny the way Jerry's parents...etc., etc., etc.," Not any more - there is no show on TV that is good enough for people to gather around the lounge or water bottle and discuss, at length, the intracasies of the humor.

    So that's my analysis of today's shows vs. yester-years shows.

    2014 Mercedes Benz CLS 550 - best car ever! 2nd best car ever, my 1967 Corvette Stingray Coupe with 435 hp.

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Posts: 6,595

    @jayrider said: When it comes to the new Mustang and all the excitement -- I don't think I want the first few months of production. Also, I would want a thorough test drive to make sure it lives up to my own expectations before I placed an order. Probably takes a lot of the fun out of it but six months of patience makes sense.

    I tend to agree with you. Besides, that would give me an extra 6 months to obsess.

    BTW, the dealer from NJ emailed me back and invited me to come in this morning at 9. I guess he didn't know I was 160 miles away. Asked him again about the below invoice price. We'll see.

    2009 PT Cruiser, 2008 Eclipse, 1995 Mark VIII, 1988 GMC Van

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Posts: 6,595

    @mako1a said: roadburner, this may be of interest to you and anyone else that likes modified BMWs. http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-2002-Pete-McHenrys-personal-M20-from-the-1st-2602-1971-BMW-2002-Roadster-with-Pete-McHenrys-/301294584903?forcerrptr=true&hash=item46268e8447&item=301294584903&pt=US_Cars_Trucks

    Be interesting to see what that car sells for. There might some real enthusiasts who would like a piece of history.

    2009 PT Cruiser, 2008 Eclipse, 1995 Mark VIII, 1988 GMC Van

  • verdugoverdugo Posts: 2,014
    edited September 1

    @nyccarguy said: Not sure how many of you guys here know this, but I'm in the market for a new car.

    I'll keep you guys updated.

    We had an Impreza back in 2005. It was my wife's car. We got rid of it 2 years later because it was too small for us. When going on any trip, it'd be a tight squeeze for the 2 of us. If friends came along, we looked like sardines.

    Having said that, she still misses it and everytime when we see one driving around she gives me a hard time about selling "her" Impreza. And my wife doesn't care about cars at all.

    So if the size is right for you, I'm sure you'll do great.

    Also Subaru offers invoice minus X pricing if you're part of several organizations. http://www.cars101.com/subaru/subaru_discounts.html

    IIRC, you can join Leave no Trace and then get the discount. Good luck.

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Posts: 6,595

    @driver100 said: ...it's worth a shot...

    According to Edmunds there's about $2000 markup as I configured it. 5% would be $1775. That would be a heck of a shot for a new model.

    2009 PT Cruiser, 2008 Eclipse, 1995 Mark VIII, 1988 GMC Van

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoPosts: 5,892

    @abacomike said: Not any more - there is no show on TV that is good enough for people to gather around the lounge or water bottle and discuss, at length, the intracasies of the humor.

    So that's my analysis of today's shows vs. yester-years shows.

    That may be true of today's sitcoms, but there are plenty of shows that folks talk about the next day - Game of Thrones is one, and Breaking Bad, when it was on, was another.

    Another thing to consider about water cooler talk is that so many folks time-shift their viewing now with DVR, TiVo's, Apple TV and the like, so not everybody watches the show when it is originally aired.

    MODERATOR
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  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 7,878

    I'm not a fan of the show "Mom." Even so, it's not a normal sitcom. It deals with very heavy issues such as alcoholism and cancer. Everybody Loves Raymond and Two and a Half Men wouldn't be able to could never be able to do that. The latter I watch solely for mindless escape and there is very little there that stimulates my brain.

    IMHO, Modern Family is one of the best comedies on TV. It's full of inside jokes and breaks down the fourth wall.

    I think the real issue here is the age of the viewer. I think we all hearken back to the past and see things as better. I see the crud that my 14 YO daughter watches on Disney and Teen Nick and shake my head. But then I realize, I'm not the person it's written for.

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,693

    Thanks verdugo. It's a nice discount (invoice minus 2%), but you need to be a member for 6 months.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2011 Pilot EX-L 4WD, 2015 Subaru Legacy 2.5i Premium

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog North CarolinaPosts: 6,956

    @nyccarguy said: Explorerx4

    Looks good. I still need to do some more digging. It seems this Mitchell gives healthy discounts, but adds on accessories to ever car they have. I do like to make apples to apples comparisons.

    ab348

    I know its going to be a step down, but it is something I have to do.

    Don't you worry about stepping down. You have set your goals for the future and it appears that you are sticking to them. You'll be very glad later. I'm proud of you.

    Richard

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,693

    Thanks for your vote of confidence Richard,

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2011 Pilot EX-L 4WD, 2015 Subaru Legacy 2.5i Premium

  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 12,252

    @oldfarmer50 said:According to Edmunds there's about $2000 markup as I configured it. 5% would be $1775. That would be a heck of a shot for a new model.

    Yeh, but just go in acting dumb and you can ask for 5% off and he may come back at 3% off or 2.5.

    When I bought the E we agreed on the trade in first. I didn't expect this fancy dealership to discount the E. When he calculated the price I asked him where my 10% discount was. We both laughed knowing that was ridiculous. Then I said it is a deal if you take 4% off. He was really caught off guard, he hesitated, and then said yes. It seems to me there was something that worked...maybe he knew I was serious but if I left he could lose me. Maybe it was better to make a sale without fussing around because I seemed to be knowledgeable. Maybe I should have tried for 6% off....who knows, but, if you are reasonable and are willing to come to a reasonable agreement, it should work. Of course, some dealers won't give much....that's just their business model......I'll have to have exhausted my options before I go down that road.

    2012 535ix 2013 Audi A4 2013 Passat

  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 12,252

    @imidazol97 said:Oh wait. Here's one. There's a strong resemblance in the shaping of the rear. I recall when the Seville came out and that styling was likened to some earlier older style vehicles. I'll have to see if I can find a picture of the old cars.

    I am not sure I am reading that right, but, the bmw 740 shown came after the 87 Seville I am sure, and I think it was a slightly different look they were trying to achieve.

    The 87 Seville looked more like this 1953 Triumph Mayflower. There were many cars in the 40s that had the bustleback design. My guess is the Seville designers were trying to capture the romance of another era....but, kind of bungled it.

    The rear end of that 7 Series car was actually a scientific masterpiece in a way. New European designs were up against some heavy design parameters.

    First, they had to deal with what were new Euro-spec rear-crash protection standards, which were tougher than ever before. Bangle also had to deal with something tougher than a bunch of European bureaucrats — aerodynamics. It’s a sad fact of nature that if you want to cut wind resistance, keeping your vehicle low in the front and high in the back is a good rule of thumb. So, the car was designed to overcome these obstacles, and that's what it did...and sales numbers don't lie...people bought them.

    IThe Bangle butt actually worked better on the 2003 to 2007 5 Series, where it blended in more with the trunk. These cars actually look better today than they did when they were new. They are very distinctive looking, and the styling gives it a stately appearance.

    2012 535ix 2013 Audi A4 2013 Passat

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