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2013 and earlier-Honda Accord Prices Paid and Buying Experience

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Comments

  • veersveers Posts: 79
    Isell, you greatly understate the complexity and multitude of factors involved in getting a great deal on a new car. You say just figure out what the car is worth to you, and take that number in take it or leave it fashion to dealership after dealership until one accepts.

    This neglects the fundamental economic tension in the new car buying market. Dealers get the car from the manufacturer at a certain cost. Its not the joke "invoice" price, but rather a much lower true price reflecting all kickbacks. On the other side there is me, the consumer. The dealership has no idea of what the car is actually worth to me. That depends on my utility preferences, my time horizon, my liquidity situation, etc... To the extent my value on the car exceeds their true cost, there is a deal to be made. Both sides will try to get the better side of the deal. To wit, the dealer would like me to pay what the car is worth to me (your suggested solution!). I would like to get the car at the minimum price the dealership will sell it for, which is their true cost + some minimal profit margin. I'm ignoring some dynamic pricing and market factors for the sake of simplicity. The challenge here is that neither side knows the true numbers for the other side!

    Thus, my goal is to figure out the lowest price a dealer will sell the car to me for. I'd also like to know how much that will go down if I wait a few weeks. So, instead of going around like Bobst with a pre-written out check (which might well lead to overpaying!), I prefer to reach out to dealers, get their "best" price, and try to negotiate them down to their true best price. This is complicated because different salesmen at the dealer can often push through a different bottom line price, and the fact that the price changes over time.

    In my case, I feel confident that $27 flat would be a great price (though I'd like to see any applicable December incentives first). I will be shopping this price to the most competitive dealers over the next week and see if any of them bite, though I must say that most of them are still whining that they will lose money at that price (Lies!). If I fail to push through $27 flat by the end of the month, I will need to reassess.
  • Hi aaloke83,

    I am also looking to buy a EX around Hartford CT. Do you mind to share the info? Thanks

    deo
  • I know my friend used it as leverage for a better lease because her car was in good condition with no accidents and under the mileage allowed for the lease. If a dealer doesn't have to pay tax on the purchase of the lease, they can make money from the sale. I wouldn't worry about all that right now. You can go to the Honda site and look at the leases they advertise and the small print on the bottom where they mention residual value for each car.
    Lease payments are also based on your credit history. It's like with car insurance where you have to pay more if you are a guy between a certain age.
    Paying money upfront can reduce your monthly payments, but that was good advice you were given on this board not to do it next time. You do have to service your car as part of the lease, but I have learned to do the Honda recommended service and not the Dealer recommended service because of the cost difference. I do go to a Dealer for service because they have certified Honda mechanics.
    You can't believe everything on the internet, but I know the two posts I mentioned on Yelp were true as I know that dealership. The two guys wrote their reviews because they felt like you did. One guy said the dealership is evil!
    I am not an expert so I don't know how much less you could have paid for the car, but I would say the worst headache would be purchasing a lemon. Just drive safe, take care of your car, enjoy it, and don't beat yourself up over a few dollars. My lease it coming due so I have been reading about leases. I will try to post this article again as it didn't work the first time and see if you can copy and paste it. You can also just google what I learned the hard way about leasing a car, NY Times. http://bucks.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/08/what-i-learned-the-hard-way-about-leas- ing-a-car/?_r=0 Best Regards, Debbie
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 2,910
    Hiker

    Your leasing post in the NY Times is a must read for all buyers. Whether your leasing or buying finding that lowest price is the most important factor.. After you secure a acceptable price you need to know how to close the deal. little add on's and extra fee's add up to make a expensive purchase. which makes a good deal turn into a bad deal. Thousands of people make mistakes like this everyday by not knowing the game..

    2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2013 Accord EXL V-6, 2012 BMW x-5, 2012 ML350

  • hogan773hogan773 Posts: 255
    REMEMBER my price was 26,999 AFTER the 500 flex cash. So the way I assume the dealer is looking at it, he sold the car for 27,499, and Honda Finance kicked in the extra 500 bucks toward my down payment. By the way, at that price they didn't claim they were losing or making any money. The other dealer (the first one who welched on me) claimed they were LOSING money at that price, but they knowingly are willing to lose a little money with the hope that they develop a "relationship" that will translate to service business etc. I have my doubts, and not sure why I should believe anything this lying dealer tells me. From an overall standpoint I highly doubt that a dealer is REALLY incurring an economic loss on any car sale once you factor in the back-room incentives and monthly blah blah etc. Maybe the salesman doesn't even know what these numbers are, but I highly doubt a dealer willingly parts with a unit of inventory and actually pays me to take it from him.

    That said, I'd think at 27,499 they probably are indeed making a little profit on the sale. As to why Honda Finance kicks in 500 bucks when so many people are probably just going to borrow the minimum and pay down the loan in a month or two...I don't know. But maybe there aren't really that many people like me (or us) on this board, and maybe that 500 incentive really does "buy" people to finance through Honda versus their local bank, and in the long run they make up for it through originating all those loans. They're gonna lose money on my loan since I only borrowed 7500 and I will pay it off in the first month.
  • bluemkn57carsbluemkn57cars Posts: 242
    edited December 2013
    From the New York Times article: Now, here is where it gets tricky. Directly under the line for capitalized cost is the capitalized cost reduction, which the leasing agreement describes as cash down and the value of any trade-in vehicle. In a no-money-down lease like mine, that line should read $0.

    So why was mine $1,993? This was a number we had never negotiated or even discussed. When I asked Khaled’s brother Amir, who was handling the paperwork, he said that included the destination charge and “other fees.” Of course, I should have stopped everything right there, but I had already been at the dealership for more than an hour, and he sounded so reasonable and matter-of-fact about it that I just let it slide. Another big mistake.


    I spent an hour each at two Honda dealerships when I was looking to purchase my new car. I walked out after I felt the staff was playing games with me, after we had already agreed on a deal via email.

    At the end of the day, it is your money and your signature on that contract. Once you sign the papers, there is no turning back. So if something does not seem right, you can always walk out of a dealership. That's part of negotiation 101.
  • All, I purchased a Red EX-L accord sedan (4cyl) 2014, no navigation, for $26,000 flat (I mean flat - including that $795 delivery fee). Honestly, I could not negotiate down any lower in the Connecticut market. I actually walked out (nicely) when the dealer would not budge lower that $26,000; however, I ended up swallowing my bargaining pride and accepting at $26,000. One tip I'll pass along. If you find a car you like, consider negotiating by accepting offers from the dealer - just tell them I need you lowest and best offer to sign now. If you don't like the number, just get up, and say thank you that won't work at this time and leave (don't give any more info). Never. Never. Never counter or start off giving the dealer a number (bad business law and just bad negotiationg imho). Ok, here is my point. I really wanted the car (it had literally under 3 miles on it and it was the color I wanted) and the price seemed really good. I still walked out. However, 24 hours later I ended up closing as much of the deal by email/phone as if I was in the dealership. In this day and age, don't fret about extra trips to close the transaction. Once you get their best price and you act within a few days, you can secure the vehicle by calls/email.

    Oh, and the paradox of the Honda Accord ---- it's such a beautiful car, it is quite simply an amazing ride; however, at the same time it is a "toaster" - there are so many of them, you will always be able to find another.

    Good luck!
  • gmanusmcgmanusmc SoCalPosts: 436
    Congrats on your new Accord - 650 below invoice is not that bad, especially if you love the car - enjoy it! And you are right - first rule of negotiation - he who speaks first - loses. I like to solicit dealers' best quotes and work from there comparing them to what people are reporting on sites like this and then getting some competition going - this usually results in a great deal.

    Bill G
  • When you say $26,000 flat does that include admin fees and taxes or is that your out the door price?
  • I live in Connecticut - but bought in DC - saving $2000 two years ago. You could have went into MA and I bet could have saved yourself at least $1000. There are a number of Mass Dealerships which give way better deals than CT. When I shopped CT every dealer told me that they couldn't match the deals in other areas because they don't have the same regional incentive structure. So - my incentive was to save money and I did. Just like gas prices and things we pay for here which are way overpriced - so are the cars. If I could buy it and save it was a great thing. I went to Maryland and bought my Honda - they did all the paperwork and I left with a heavier wallet.

    You did buy a great car but I am really tired of the reasons we are overcharged for the same things. When filling out the FAFSA for colleges us Connecticut types don't get credit for living in a high tax burdened state - but we still get to pay high taxes and pay $2000 more for the privilege of buying a new Honda in Connecticut. I will never buy a new Honda in CT again.
  • Congratulations on your purchase.

    You did not say whether there was any flex cash offered or available.
  • bluemkn57carsbluemkn57cars Posts: 242
    edited December 2013
    I live in MA. I bought a 2013 Honda Accord EX-L 3 months ago. At the time, most dealerships were quoting about $800 - $1000 below invoice. Even the high volume dealers such as Herb Chambers and Boch Honda were over priced. Most did not have any flex cash available. I was able to negotiate a sweet deal of $1400 below invoice plus $500 flex cash from Honda Cars of Boston. I dealt directly with the internet manager.

    Some forum contributors in the DC area were posting better deals but only a few hundred dollars less. It was not worth my time, and me driving back and adding all these miles on my new car.

    To each their own.
  • I was told by a Honda dealer that Hond Finance charges a $75 fee if you pay off your loan before 6 months. the $500 flex cash is not affected. Is this correct
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 2,910
    That is a dealer Lie.

    2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2013 Accord EXL V-6, 2012 BMW x-5, 2012 ML350

  • deodingdeoding Posts: 2
    edited December 2013
    CT market is known tough, so I was amazed when I saw aaloke83's EX-L deal. Actually I just bought my EX from the same dealer for $23,200 + $399 fee + $178 Reg + Tax. Not as good as his EX-L at $24,900, but not too bad. Actually the Maryland top dealer is offering me $23,000, maybe little lower if I really pushed hard, but my dealer is close by, thus save me time to drive to MD.

    At the end, was tricked for the $199 VIN Etch fee. They told me it was already etched on the glass, so can not be removed. I found out later it can be waived by CT law, but too late. One good thing is that dealer help me find 1.34% via Well Fargo for 60mo, a little lower than what Honda is offering.

    Again, if I had waited one more day, I should have got better deal by reference to aaloke83's file.

    Thanks aaloke83 and everyone here sharing the information. I love my EX so far, driving 29mpg and 27mpg on the 16miles winding back road to work.
  • adamr1adamr1 Posts: 28
    Interesting post Brian, I haven't been on the forums for a while. My perspective as I have told others who I have helped is that it is all a game. The dealer is out to make as much of a profit as possible...period. I am in NJ and don't recall ever seeing a Honda dealership here going out of business. So they must be doing well.

    I actually enjoy the game of car buying. In some ways I wish it wasn't a game, but if it wasn't then we would all be paying the same price. In today's game, some people pay much higher, and I pay much lower. So the law of averages comes in and the dealer still makes a profit. I have no interest in whether a dealer should make a profit, or what it costs them to be in business, blah blah blah. I want a car and I want to pay the least amount possible for it.

    That is the same for most people. It just happens that the car buying industry has created this complex game.

    Did anyone stop to think about that black friday item they bought, thinking that it was sold at or below cost, and felt bad for the store selling it? No, everyone wants to pay the least amount for an item. But with most other things there isn't much negotiating room. Cars are the exception. So I try not to take it personally on the games dealers play.

    I have bought 6 honda over the years, and I used 6 different dealers. Each time the game is played the buyer learns more and can get better at it. I am still made at the stupid window etching fee they stuck in my finance papers a while back. That won't happen again!
  • adamr1adamr1 Posts: 28
    Of course the dealers will say that. If they told the truth, then everyone would want to buy at true cost. The more smoke they throw up, the more they confuse the average person. People on this forum are not the average car buyer. So of course you say you know it is all BS. But I don't believe most people do.

    A dealer is out to sell a car with a profit. They rarely if ever lose money on a sale, but there are times they come close to breaking even. Many dealers don't want to sell a car without a profit You just have to find the dealer who is willing to sell the car near the cost.

    The current Accord I am driving I found the same stories when buying. I found that dealer willing to sell the car near cost. All the other dealers said there is no way he will produce the car at that price. They were wrong, and I bought the car. But it isn't always easy to find that dealer. That is where the work comes in to find them.
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 2,910
    edited December 2013
    Yes interesting and true. Isn't it nice to know you help someone save hundreds if not over 1k for a new car purchase.

    Knowing how and when to buy. Having a target price, getting many dealerships involved, cutting out the middle man, helps when you play the game right. This will result in you making the best deal possible in your area..

    When you guys learn how to get the internet managers to fax you the buyers order for the sale that day makes .............. alot of that extra add on nonsense stop. Not all dealers will do a fax order buy. Especially dishonest dealerships they want you in that showroom.. The Dealerships that do makes this process a wonderful buying experience. All out of state purchase should be done this way.

    You read from time to time in these forums how somebody did a fax buy and picked up vehicle a few days later. Read the details of the sale usually very smooth sale and pick up. these dealerships usually sell cars and tend to be more on the honest side of pricing.

    2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2013 Accord EXL V-6, 2012 BMW x-5, 2012 ML350

  • ken117ken117 Posts: 196
    Not true. The dealer F&I manager will likely lose any dealer reserve he may have attained via the financing if you pay the loan off within six months. Just one more example of why consumers should never rely on statements from anyone at a dealership.
  • ken117ken117 Posts: 196
    While I do not always agree with Isell, he is correct. Buying a new vehicle is truly not difficult nor complex. There are three main areas: price, trade, and financing. All these areas should be thoroughly researched and a purchase plan identified before engaging in negotiations with a dealer.

    If your numbers are realistic, a dealer willing to sell can almost always be found. Worrying about an extra couple of hundred dollars is silly.

    And in all cases, the buyer is not negotiating with the sales person. Rather the negotiation is with the sales manager.
  • gmanusmcgmanusmc SoCalPosts: 436
    Wow - someone who actually talks a little common sense.

    Good points ken

    Bill G
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 10,897
    If you are a parent of young children (at least one under 12 years old) who owns a 2013-14 Honda Accord, a reporter would like for you to fill out a survey, due by December 13, 2013, for use in a print publication. Please email PR@edmunds.com no later than Wednesday, December 11, for a copy of the survey.

    MODERATOR
    Need help navigating? kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    Share your vehicle reviews

  • Thank you deoding. Reading through the forums helped me learn the various incentives and negotiating tactics available & probably helped me negotiate a good deal. Thank God I didnt believe Truecar!

    If anyone else in and around CT is looking for a good deal on 2014 EX-L 4cyl sedan CVT, let me know & I can provide necessary details.
  • bethpabethpa Posts: 29
    The Wall Street Journal had an article saying Honda Nov sales were off so they are bringing a December dealer incentive for $3000 per car for any deal who increases their Dec 2013 over Dec 2012 sales. It is capped at $60,000 or 20 cars.

    I guess the trick is to come in at the end of the month and see which dealers are in need of some sales. Assuming you leave some for the dealer any new car sold over their Dec 2012 numbers have higher profit for the dealer. I'm not sure if this would also include Flex cash.

    I'd target invoice plus $2500 to start and see what happens. It all depends on the actual dealer and their ability to beat last December's sales. And this is on all Honda cars from what the article stated. The actual terms might be different than what was reported. I hope this helps someone who is shopping.
  • neil_hneil_h Posts: 11
    "I'd target invoice plus $2500...."

    Not sure if I understand this correctly....I am in Atlanta and looking to purchase a 2014 EX-L CVT. Since the invoice price is $26,650 should I be looking for the dealer to sell the car for $24,150 (or did I misunderstand the $2500 number).

    If anyone in Atlanta has purchased the above model recently and can provided specific recommendations, I would appreciate it. Thanks for all the useful posts in the forum.
  • gmanusmcgmanusmc SoCalPosts: 436
    Bethpa - are you able to post a link?

    Thanks, Bill G
  • bethpabethpa Posts: 29
    Here is the link to the WSJ article. I am not sure if it will be available to non-subscribers.

    http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303722104579239983004270504

    http://www.autonews.com/article/20131205/RETAIL/131209903/honda-offers-dealers-c- ash-if-december-sales-top-2012-levels#axzz2miNbkCdw

    I have no idea what a dealer will do with this incentive but I think it completely depends on the individual dealer's situation. Maybe they give up some of the $3000 to help sell the car. Read the article and it may give everyone some additional information when negotiating for a Honda this month.
  • gmanusmcgmanusmc SoCalPosts: 436
    edited December 2013
    Thanks - you're right - only subscribers can see the whole article but you can see enough to get the gist - might be some great deals to be had this month.

    Bill

    Wow - just read that second article you linked - this sounds promising indeed.
  • Oh, sure, the 26,000 flat was just the car price. The additional fees were that silly $399 dealer conveyance fee (even consumer reports could not get that negotiated down....they test their cars in Connecticut). The only other fee was the doc fees for registration, which since I transferred plates, was a about 110. I didn't include the 6.35 per cent Connecticut sales tax as it won't be apples to apples for most folks. Oh, I didn't complain about the Goodyear assurances I got v. The michelins...however, if it means someting to you, negotiate on the tires too.

    Btw, getting rusted plates off an old car is one of those things in life like a prostrate exam. I should be smart and try to get a stainless steel screw set, if they are even sold.

    Good luck to all. I'm happy to be back in a Honda.
  • Sure, no I didn't get offered any flex cash (student, etc).
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