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2013 and earlier-Honda Accord Prices Paid and Buying Experience

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Comments

  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 2,049
    edited November 2013
    Good job on your purchase. What were your dealers doc fee charge?

    Enjoy your new accord.

    2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2013 Accord EXL V-6, 2012 BMW x-5, 2012 ML350

  • veersveers Posts: 79
    meh... liars always gonna find a way to lie. Remember that one of the key metrics for car salesmen is what % if test drives lead to a sale. So when you test drive, realize the price was a lie, and then walk, the end up being the ones holding the bag. Food for thought.

    What I find amazing in this process is the obsession with the fraudulent invoice price of $28,543 ($28,043 after flex cash). lol such bs since we know there is around $1,000 holdback plus potentially massive bonuses from Honda for sales targets. Dealer after dealer cites this price to me, and treats it like the holy grail of pricing. When I tell that that I think their true cost after flex is $26,800 and that they could sell to me for $27,300 and make a tidy profit, 80% of them recoil and tell me that the price is IMPOSSIBLE, and that no one else will give that price since "we all pay Honda the same price for the car and no dealer will LOSE money on the sale." bs bs bs bs.

    Thankfully I'm finding the MD market a lot better than tri-state. A firm $27,500, a possible $27,250, and a possible under $27,000 (hard to believe). Would like to tie this up this week... we will see. Would be great to send a smarmy e-mail to the dealers telling me I will never get under $28,000 pointing out that useless overpriced stone age shops have no future in the open information internet age.
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 2,049
    edited December 2013
    Honda's dealer hold back is 2% of base MSRP. Not Including dest charge of $790..

    Hold backs will range from 400's on the lower models to about 700 on the top of line accords. Plus dealer incentives, manufacturer to dealer cash, hush money, sales incentives all things we have no clear cut proof how much they are getting. And on top of that this so called dealers invoice price is probably padded for dealerships to make a few more bucks.

    i guess its safe to say you did not buy a car today.

    You should hit your mark this month.

    2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2013 Accord EXL V-6, 2012 BMW x-5, 2012 ML350

  • veersveers Posts: 79
    You figure they sold to hogan at $27k and said they are making minimal profit, so put real cost at $26.8 or so.

    Super busy and the dealerships I wanted to do business with ran out of flex cash. I'm going to try to get the same prices they offered minus the $500 flex cash this week. We will see how that one goes. Obv they wanted me to buy today, so they claimed they "adjusted" the prices down $500 to account for no flex cash. Sounds like bs, their margin should be the same pre flex and post flex -500 $.

    Aaloke,

    There is no PM here from what I can tell. on the Driveaccord forum you said you got 24,900 + 399 dealer fee = 25,300 on an EX-L or $1350 under invoice. That is a great deal. If you pm me the dealership and salesman names on driveaccord, I will reach out and see if they will do $27,200 on a V6 which is also $1350 under invoice. If they will, and my sub $27k offer doesn't pan out, I would pull the trigger at that price, and you should get a referral fee. Not sure they will agree to go that deep though on a V6 though.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,367
    So, instead of trying to micro analyze this to death why don't you simply make them a COMMITTED offer of what you think the car is worth to YOU?

    Tell them that you WILL make that one offer and that if accepted, you WILL buy it and drive it home today?

    Instead of worrying about how much evil profit they just might be making, just offer what you are willing to pay!

    Tell then that it's a take it or leave it offer...PERIOD!

    If they accept it, you should be happy. If the decline, you'll know you didn't offer enough and you can go from store to store making that same offer.

    It really doesn't have to be that difficult!
  • Brian and Veers,

    My offer was structured this way. Cost 24900 (tax was on 25500 because I got 500 off via Honda financing cash and 100$ visa gift card) + 399 dealer fee + 6.35% CT sales tax + 188 registration

    Veers, I PM'ed you on driveaccord for dealer name and my information so you can try your luck on a V6.
  • It looks like the amount you put down brought down the residual on your car. The Honda LX is 13891. Yours for the top of the line is14681. 15000 miles a year will cost more monthly than 12000 miles. You have to remember that if you decide not to buy your car you can use your leased car as equity. Turning it in early will cause you to pay more for your lease again. Dealers don't have to pay tax when purchasing a leased car. You say you are planning to buy the car, so if it's a good car you can do so, and if not turn it in and that will be to your advantage. The oil changes keep your car in top condition so take advantage of that. The oil changes on the Honda cost more because they need to use a certain type. That is worth something.
    True Car is a business and gets a referral, so take that into consideration. It is hard to figure costs from a board when the geographic location is a determining factor in that. There is a Honda dealer near me in Woodland Hills CA that will add on to the lease. I just read about two guys that had that happen to on YELP. I always think I shouldn't go in alone because they will take advantage of a woman walking in alone. If you feel you paid a little more, they certainly didn't take your life savings. Enjoy your car and remember that you bought a good product. I think it's hard for a dealer when some people basically want a car for free. I wish it was a set price. I read this article in the NY Times that talks about car buying.http://bucks.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/08/what-i-learned-the-hard-way-abo- ut-leasing-a-car/?_r=0
  • Hello, anyone know how much off invoice can people get today for a 2013 Honda Civic Ex since it is one month from 2014?
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 2,049
    edited December 2013
    Depending on your area with supply and demand of 2014's on dealers lots your target price to buy or lease should be

    1800 to 3000 below invoice plus any incentives and rebates that apply to you on the 2013.

    what state are you looking to buy..

    Remember Jan,1 st 2014 your 2013 model is considered 1 year old model. If your car is totaled or stolen you need to Re-coupe the depreciation value of a 1 yr civic. Not to mention your INS co. will take the deductible off the top of the vehicle price before sending out the check. Keep that in mind when negotiating price on a 2013... Good luck

    2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2013 Accord EXL V-6, 2012 BMW x-5, 2012 ML350

  • Hiker, thanks for the reply. I am young in my 20s and learned from my mistake. I am locked in for 3 years and I don't plan on turning it in early. It is a good product and I enjoy driving it.

    The only thing that can help me now is to learn more about my options at the end of 3 year lease. Can you please elaborate on "if you decide not to buy your car you can use your leased car as equity"? What steps should I take to find out the true value and by how much over/under it is from residual value? Lets say I find out the car is worth $16,000, or about $1,500 more than residual value, how can I use this towards my next lease or purchase?

    Thanks,
    Al
  • veersveers Posts: 79
    Isell, you greatly understate the complexity and multitude of factors involved in getting a great deal on a new car. You say just figure out what the car is worth to you, and take that number in take it or leave it fashion to dealership after dealership until one accepts.

    This neglects the fundamental economic tension in the new car buying market. Dealers get the car from the manufacturer at a certain cost. Its not the joke "invoice" price, but rather a much lower true price reflecting all kickbacks. On the other side there is me, the consumer. The dealership has no idea of what the car is actually worth to me. That depends on my utility preferences, my time horizon, my liquidity situation, etc... To the extent my value on the car exceeds their true cost, there is a deal to be made. Both sides will try to get the better side of the deal. To wit, the dealer would like me to pay what the car is worth to me (your suggested solution!). I would like to get the car at the minimum price the dealership will sell it for, which is their true cost + some minimal profit margin. I'm ignoring some dynamic pricing and market factors for the sake of simplicity. The challenge here is that neither side knows the true numbers for the other side!

    Thus, my goal is to figure out the lowest price a dealer will sell the car to me for. I'd also like to know how much that will go down if I wait a few weeks. So, instead of going around like Bobst with a pre-written out check (which might well lead to overpaying!), I prefer to reach out to dealers, get their "best" price, and try to negotiate them down to their true best price. This is complicated because different salesmen at the dealer can often push through a different bottom line price, and the fact that the price changes over time.

    In my case, I feel confident that $27 flat would be a great price (though I'd like to see any applicable December incentives first). I will be shopping this price to the most competitive dealers over the next week and see if any of them bite, though I must say that most of them are still whining that they will lose money at that price (Lies!). If I fail to push through $27 flat by the end of the month, I will need to reassess.
  • Hi aaloke83,

    I am also looking to buy a EX around Hartford CT. Do you mind to share the info? Thanks

    deo
  • I know my friend used it as leverage for a better lease because her car was in good condition with no accidents and under the mileage allowed for the lease. If a dealer doesn't have to pay tax on the purchase of the lease, they can make money from the sale. I wouldn't worry about all that right now. You can go to the Honda site and look at the leases they advertise and the small print on the bottom where they mention residual value for each car.
    Lease payments are also based on your credit history. It's like with car insurance where you have to pay more if you are a guy between a certain age.
    Paying money upfront can reduce your monthly payments, but that was good advice you were given on this board not to do it next time. You do have to service your car as part of the lease, but I have learned to do the Honda recommended service and not the Dealer recommended service because of the cost difference. I do go to a Dealer for service because they have certified Honda mechanics.
    You can't believe everything on the internet, but I know the two posts I mentioned on Yelp were true as I know that dealership. The two guys wrote their reviews because they felt like you did. One guy said the dealership is evil!
    I am not an expert so I don't know how much less you could have paid for the car, but I would say the worst headache would be purchasing a lemon. Just drive safe, take care of your car, enjoy it, and don't beat yourself up over a few dollars. My lease it coming due so I have been reading about leases. I will try to post this article again as it didn't work the first time and see if you can copy and paste it. You can also just google what I learned the hard way about leasing a car, NY Times. http://bucks.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/08/what-i-learned-the-hard-way-about-leas- ing-a-car/?_r=0 Best Regards, Debbie
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 2,049
    Hiker

    Your leasing post in the NY Times is a must read for all buyers. Whether your leasing or buying finding that lowest price is the most important factor.. After you secure a acceptable price you need to know how to close the deal. little add on's and extra fee's add up to make a expensive purchase. which makes a good deal turn into a bad deal. Thousands of people make mistakes like this everyday by not knowing the game..

    2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2013 Accord EXL V-6, 2012 BMW x-5, 2012 ML350

  • hogan773hogan773 Posts: 255
    REMEMBER my price was 26,999 AFTER the 500 flex cash. So the way I assume the dealer is looking at it, he sold the car for 27,499, and Honda Finance kicked in the extra 500 bucks toward my down payment. By the way, at that price they didn't claim they were losing or making any money. The other dealer (the first one who welched on me) claimed they were LOSING money at that price, but they knowingly are willing to lose a little money with the hope that they develop a "relationship" that will translate to service business etc. I have my doubts, and not sure why I should believe anything this lying dealer tells me. From an overall standpoint I highly doubt that a dealer is REALLY incurring an economic loss on any car sale once you factor in the back-room incentives and monthly blah blah etc. Maybe the salesman doesn't even know what these numbers are, but I highly doubt a dealer willingly parts with a unit of inventory and actually pays me to take it from him.

    That said, I'd think at 27,499 they probably are indeed making a little profit on the sale. As to why Honda Finance kicks in 500 bucks when so many people are probably just going to borrow the minimum and pay down the loan in a month or two...I don't know. But maybe there aren't really that many people like me (or us) on this board, and maybe that 500 incentive really does "buy" people to finance through Honda versus their local bank, and in the long run they make up for it through originating all those loans. They're gonna lose money on my loan since I only borrowed 7500 and I will pay it off in the first month.
  • bluemkn57carsbluemkn57cars Posts: 242
    edited December 2013
    From the New York Times article: Now, here is where it gets tricky. Directly under the line for capitalized cost is the capitalized cost reduction, which the leasing agreement describes as cash down and the value of any trade-in vehicle. In a no-money-down lease like mine, that line should read $0.

    So why was mine $1,993? This was a number we had never negotiated or even discussed. When I asked Khaled’s brother Amir, who was handling the paperwork, he said that included the destination charge and “other fees.” Of course, I should have stopped everything right there, but I had already been at the dealership for more than an hour, and he sounded so reasonable and matter-of-fact about it that I just let it slide. Another big mistake.


    I spent an hour each at two Honda dealerships when I was looking to purchase my new car. I walked out after I felt the staff was playing games with me, after we had already agreed on a deal via email.

    At the end of the day, it is your money and your signature on that contract. Once you sign the papers, there is no turning back. So if something does not seem right, you can always walk out of a dealership. That's part of negotiation 101.
  • All, I purchased a Red EX-L accord sedan (4cyl) 2014, no navigation, for $26,000 flat (I mean flat - including that $795 delivery fee). Honestly, I could not negotiate down any lower in the Connecticut market. I actually walked out (nicely) when the dealer would not budge lower that $26,000; however, I ended up swallowing my bargaining pride and accepting at $26,000. One tip I'll pass along. If you find a car you like, consider negotiating by accepting offers from the dealer - just tell them I need you lowest and best offer to sign now. If you don't like the number, just get up, and say thank you that won't work at this time and leave (don't give any more info). Never. Never. Never counter or start off giving the dealer a number (bad business law and just bad negotiationg imho). Ok, here is my point. I really wanted the car (it had literally under 3 miles on it and it was the color I wanted) and the price seemed really good. I still walked out. However, 24 hours later I ended up closing as much of the deal by email/phone as if I was in the dealership. In this day and age, don't fret about extra trips to close the transaction. Once you get their best price and you act within a few days, you can secure the vehicle by calls/email.

    Oh, and the paradox of the Honda Accord ---- it's such a beautiful car, it is quite simply an amazing ride; however, at the same time it is a "toaster" - there are so many of them, you will always be able to find another.

    Good luck!
  • gmanusmcgmanusmc SoCalPosts: 436
    Congrats on your new Accord - 650 below invoice is not that bad, especially if you love the car - enjoy it! And you are right - first rule of negotiation - he who speaks first - loses. I like to solicit dealers' best quotes and work from there comparing them to what people are reporting on sites like this and then getting some competition going - this usually results in a great deal.

    Bill G
  • When you say $26,000 flat does that include admin fees and taxes or is that your out the door price?
  • I live in Connecticut - but bought in DC - saving $2000 two years ago. You could have went into MA and I bet could have saved yourself at least $1000. There are a number of Mass Dealerships which give way better deals than CT. When I shopped CT every dealer told me that they couldn't match the deals in other areas because they don't have the same regional incentive structure. So - my incentive was to save money and I did. Just like gas prices and things we pay for here which are way overpriced - so are the cars. If I could buy it and save it was a great thing. I went to Maryland and bought my Honda - they did all the paperwork and I left with a heavier wallet.

    You did buy a great car but I am really tired of the reasons we are overcharged for the same things. When filling out the FAFSA for colleges us Connecticut types don't get credit for living in a high tax burdened state - but we still get to pay high taxes and pay $2000 more for the privilege of buying a new Honda in Connecticut. I will never buy a new Honda in CT again.
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