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2013 and Earlier - Hyundai Sonata Prices Paid and Buying Experience

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Comments

  • rotaryrotary Posts: 71
    Backy. I'm planning on test driving the new '09 as soon as my local dealer gets one. The interior is a major league improvement over the current gen. If they fixed the suspension issues and introduced proper damping so it's more 'buttoned down,' that will sell me. My only concern is resale value, which is why I may wait a year or so - but then, the 10 year power train warranty gets cut down to 5 years. You can't get everything you want, I guess.

    I wonder what vehicle the 'global engine' (which, as you said, shares its block with Chrysler and Mitsubishi) is put into (maybe the Elantra?).
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,687
    I am amazed your local dealer doesn't have a 2009 Sonata yet. The dealers in my town started getting them about 3 months ago.

    Buying used can save a lot of money, although as you can see from this discussion there are some darn good discounts to be had on new 2009 Sonatas. Yes, if you buy used and don't spring for an extended warranty, you get what's left of the 5/60k bumper-to-bumper warranty. The good news there is that it's 2 years and 24k miles longer than the standard bumper-to-bumper warranties of many competitors, and the same length as some competitors' powertrain warranties.

    I think there is some confusion over this "Global engine" thing. It is not in fact a complete engine that is put into a car. It's a design spec for parts of the engine, the spec is shared by Hyundai with partners Mitsubishi and Chrysler, but each automaker has its own unique version(s) of the engines(s) built from the spec. Hyundai's version is the Theta (now Theta II) that goes into the Sonata and other cars e.g. Optima. If you want to discuss this more, we should move it to a different discussion other than "Prices Paid." :blush:
  • bhmr59bhmr59 Posts: 1,598
    Rotary, you offer a lot of opinions, which is fine, except you state your opinions as facts.

    Hyundai's Alabama plant is state-of-the-art. But it isn't quite new, being more than 3 years old.

    Forget invoice vs MSRP in trying to figure dealer margin. There are manufacturer to dealer incentives. Dealers' aren't losing money on sales. If what you say were true, places like Fitzmall and Town Hyundai would not be seeking buyers from outside their local area. Neither would any dealer more than, say, 30 miles away from a customer. (This is true for most brands.) Who in their right mind would drive 30 or more miles for an oil change?

    I haven't seen much lately about a suspension problem and, of those who earlier reported it, most said it was a minor annoyance.

    The "quality" of my '05 Sonata has not "degraded" one bit since I bought it (new).
  • dgs4dgs4 Posts: 66
    "Exact invoice is pretty expensive in the Hyundai world. Generally you want something $1000+ under invoice to get a good deal. Depending on the market however..as it varies."

    Well I did get the car for under invoice when you figure in the $1,000 rebate from Hyundai. As far as expecting the dealership to sell me a car for $1,000 under invoice without the rebate, I don't think that's really fair. How is a dealership supposed to make money selling a car for $1,000 under invoice? I'm sure that pretty much kills their holdback money. I think the dealership is allowed to make a little money on the sale of a car, no? Hyundai makes a quality product now, and Hyundai dealerships have every right to start making money on the sale of their vehicles. They are every bit as good as any Honda, Toyota, or Nissan and it's doubtful you would be able to purchase a top of the line (as is my 09 V6 Limited with nav) vehicle from those manufactures for a thousands under invoice. If more people start viewing Hyundai as the quality product it is, rather than thinking of them as a bargain basement vehicle to get for dirt cheap maybe the perception and resale value of their cars will start to equal the Honda's and Toyota's of the world. Invoice minus the $1,000 rebate was very generous for me, and I was very happy with the price, nuff said.

    "No offense, but that seem awfully steep. I priced out a very similar vehicle as yours (not white, though) for around 21,300 plus TTL."

    There is no way you priced a Limited V6 with the navigation system for $21,300. That is about $4,000 under invoice and there is no way I dealer can afford to sell a car at that kind of price. You must have been looking a different model.

    "The reason the pearl white paint is extra cost is because the paint process used for that special color is more involved/expensive. You've probably noticed it's not just plain white, but has a lot of depth to it. I think it's a very sharp color, and I think you'll grow to like it over time. It's a very easy color to maintain also--it won't show dust easily, like darker colors will.

    Quite a step up from an old Neon, eh? Enjoy!!"


    Yes, you're right. The pearl paint is really nice. And I see what you mean by the color having a lot of depth. I guess they must use a different paint process for that color. It was only $200 so I really shouldn't be complaining. I've just never heard of paying extra for a particular color, but then again I'm not the most experienced new car buyer, so maybe it's common and I just don't know it.

    Yes, quite a step up from the Neon, and I'm enjoying it very much. The only thing damping my enthusiasm are the ridiculous gas prices. But that's not a fault of the car. I could be driving a scooter and I would still be bummed out by these gas prices. When is the madness ever going to end? It seems like the prices are going up on a daily basis.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,687
    Actually, charging extra for "special" paint is pretty common, especially on European brands, some of which charge extra for any kind of metallic paint. (I'm glad Hyundai doesn't do that.) Another example is the Malibu, which has an additional charge ($95 to $295) for certain colors.
  • bhmr59bhmr59 Posts: 1,598
    As far as expecting the dealership to sell me a car for $1,000 under invoice without the rebate, I don't think that's really fair. How is a dealership supposed to make money selling a car for $1,000 under invoice?

    That is about $4,000 under invoice and there is no way I dealer can afford to sell a car at that kind of price

    See fitzmall.com or townehyundai.com.

    These are not end of the month or end of the quarter deals. They have been offering these kinds of deals (varies from month to month) for well over a year that I'm aware of.
  • jfritschjfritsch Posts: 958
    There is no way you priced a Limited V6 with the navigation system for $21,300. That is about $4,000 under invoice and there is no way I dealer can afford to sell a car at that kind of price. You must have been looking a different model.

    Avoid using published figures of invoice as dealer cost. They have been nominal figures for decades. You already got about 4000 off msrp or more depending on how much tax in your state (100 to $2200). This is when you consider almost $2000 of favorable financing. Be fortunate they had some mercy on you, or needed to make a sale. If you paid a lot of tax with the figure you gave otd, you may have approached 22000 on the actual sale price.

    When is the madness ever going to end? It seems like the prices are going up on a daily basis.

    I assume you mean stabilize and you know 2.70 and 3.00 gasolene is probably stuff you will tell your grandchildren about. Actually its probably cheaper than what it was in 1982 and numerous other points in the last 90 years.

    It was pretty ridiculous when you could only get about a gallon of spring water for $1.50 to $3.00 and gas was less. You probably couldn't have purchased a gallon of hardly anything for less than gas at one point. Especially when you consider the complexity of producing and distributing gas vs. anything else.
  • 2002slt2002slt Posts: 228
    Does bluetooth come with the navigation package? Or is it a dealer installed option?

    No, it doesn't come with the nav. The one that is dealer installed uses the space of the overhead sunglass holder and doesn't interface with the audio system. I'm waiting for something aftermarket to come out.
  • moocow1moocow1 Posts: 230
    *cough* ahem, I also bought a 2009 sonata and did get $1300 under invoice. If you factor rebates, it was $3300 under invoice. The dealer was perfectly happy to give me this price with NO HAGGLING AT ALL. I don't think they'd do the deal if they were losing money. Invoice price means nothing on cars. Most car manufacturers have even bigger incentives than even holdbacks now. They're putting in tons of hidden rebates to the dealer to help them sell cars these days. And please don't give me bs about which car is better, this is a price discussion thread, not a car quality thread. We are here to get people the best prices and let them know when it's a good price. Also top of the line usually means BIGGER discounts. You get discounts off the prices of packages as well. Also I didn't even get the best deals compared to the Towne Hyundai people and their $4000+ under invoice.
  • dgs4dgs4 Posts: 66
    $1,300 under invoice and no haggling. You mean you just walked into a Hyundai dealership and they magically offered you the arbitrary number of $1,300 under their invoice price and price never came up? Why do I find that very hard to believe. I still don't understand how any dealership is supposed to make money selling a car like that. Better yet, if Hyundai is offering all kinds of hidden rebates to dealerships so they can afford to sell cars for thousands under their invoice price how is Hyundai making any money selling cars?

    You know why MINI and Scion hold their value so well, because they take very little off the price of the car, because they don't have to! People want those cars and they will pay for them. Hopefully Hyundai will move to that pricing model someday soon, instead of cheapening themselves the way they do. A Hyundai should have the same resale value as all the other big manufactures, but that will never happen if people such as yourself will not buy one unless you're getting it for thousands under invoice, and needing factory incentives thrown on top of that. Sad.

    Oh well, I'm driving my car until the wheels fall off and the engine dies, so resale value means very little to me. Most cars after 10 years aren't worth a whole bunch, so whatever money I get from selling it will just go towards the down payment of a new vehicle. Actually it will be another Hyundai, and hopefully I won't be able to buy one for invoice at that time.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,687
    It may be hard to believe, but some dealerships (Towne and Fitzmall come to mind off the top of my head) do offer buyers huge discounts off invoice, no haggling needed--they offer everyday "Internet" prices, advertised for all to see on their web sites. Not every dealer offers prices like that, or not as easy to come by, but it does happen.

    I too am hoping Hyundai can cut back on incentives and raise the resale value of their cars... right after I buy my next car! :)
  • nareknarek Posts: 37
    A Hyundai should have the same resale value as all the other big manufactures, but that will never happen if people such as yourself will not buy one unless you're getting it for thousands under invoice, and needing factory incentives thrown on top of that. Sad.

    You're missing the point. Invoice, MSRP, is doesn't matter. You compare features and final price against features and final price of the competition. Hyundai wins in most cases. Resale prices have to be adjusted accordingly for comparison against other manufacturers, since original sale prices can vary by thousands of dollars.

    Also on the point of resale prices, as the quality of Hyundai vehicles has come up to, and even surpassed some competition in recent years, so too will resale values follow. It'll just take a few years for that to show up.

    FWIW, My Honda did NOT live up to the resale value 'adverstised'. I blame that primarily on the current gas prices, which no one could have forseen 4-1/2 years ago when I bought it. Since no one can tell what will happen that might affect future resale, no one should by a specific vehicle primarily on resale value. I know I won't. I'm more interested in quality, safety and the price today. That's why I bought a new Hyundai. ;)
  • moocow1moocow1 Posts: 230
    No, I'm not stupid enough to walk into a dealership without asking for prices first. It was simple as calling up three different dealers(two that gave actual prices), getting a price, walking in, and buying the car. Nothing else needed. I knew there was no way they'd go much lower because they were basically two of the biggest dealers here. Why haggle? Just shop online and get a great price.

    Imho, resale values are better personally if you're getting a car cheaper. It means you lose a lot less money when you drive the car off the lot. And imho, it doesn't matter at all whether the price is invoice, under invoice, or above, as long as you get the best price.possible. That should be everyone's philosophy here. And I saw some mention of people getting 1000+ under invoice on even Hondas, so it's not like a premiere brand cannot have discounts also.

    Hyundais "supposedly" have terrible resale, but the resale value on my old Elantra was pretty awesome because I got a pretty damn cheap deal. I think these hidden prices mean that good buyers will get an advantage of resale over buyers who buy at or over invoice.
  • rotaryrotary Posts: 71
    Please. You can't even possibly compare the resale value of a Honda and a Hyundai. That's absolutely ridiculous.

    There are 2 year old Accords and Civics that sell for near new prices at some of the chain used car auto dealers like Auto Nation, while 2007 model year V6 Sonatas with under 20k miles can be found for 10k to 11k.

    I'm not a Honda fanboi, but that's just ludicrous to even make that comparison.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,687
    Please. You can't even possibly compare the resale value of a Honda and a Hyundai. That's absolutely ridiculous.

    I can, and I have. I don't think it's ridiculous at all. When I do it, I look at dollars of depreciation, not resale percentages (which are misleading when there's a big difference in purchase price). When I do compare, however, I compare apples to apples--not the highest possible price for one car vs. the lowest possible price for another car. And the two Hyundais I've owned have done very well in that kind of comparison. My current Hyundai has an Edmunds TMV for private party sale (I sell my cars myself) of just over $8000, which means in a little over four years I've lost about $5000 in depreciation on it. When I compare that to the dollars depreciation on a like Honda model (which there isn't one, but the closest would be a 2004 Civic EX with leather added), I think the Hyundai compares very well.
  • chuck1chuck1 Posts: 1,405
    One can do much better than "Auto Nation" or "Carmax" haggling with a traditional new car dealer (for used cars) or private party. It's well know the two above stores are higher priced than the "street price".
  • wanna_azzywanna_azzy Posts: 41
    There are 2 year old Accords and Civics that sell for near new prices at some of the chain used car auto dealers like Auto Nation, while 2007 model year V6 Sonatas with under 20k miles can be found for 10k to 11k.

    I don't know where you are getting your "facts". Many used car dealers advertise their cars at, or near, new car price, but anyone would be a fool to actually pay that price. Therefore, the advertised price is a gimmick so they can lower that price greatly, making some feel like they got an excellent deal, rather than pricing the car realistically to begin with. The possible exception to this is for those buyers with no credit, and the seller floats the loan themselves. The seller is then getting up-front money to offset the possible(probable) default and the cost(risk) of carrying the loan. Anyone who can qualify for a new or near-new car, whether purchased outright or with financing, generally will not be fooled by this type of sales practice. Thus, any car, any brand, can be priced as new, but the actual sales price is usually not know by anyone other than the buyer and seller, and of course the tax collector.

    In most cases, if you pay more, resale will be more, dollar-wise. Likewise, if you pay less, the resale will be less. You have to work off the sales price, not MSRP. And percentages can be very confusing as well. A new car buyer has $27,000 to spend. As an example, a new top-of-the-line Honda sells for $27,000, three years later is worth maybe $19,000. That's only a 30% depreciation rate, but an $8,000 loss. A comparable Sonata sells(not lists) for $20,000, three years later worth about $10,000. That's a 50% depreciation rate, a $10,000 loss. If that $7,000 difference had been invested at 5% for those 3 years, that's another $1,100 in interest. So now the "loss" on the Sonata is now only $8,1000, or 42% depreciation. Both cars are now sold. The honda owner has $19,000 left, the Hyundai owner has $10,000 +$1,100 + $9,000, or $20,100. The depreciation rate is greater for the Hyundai, but the owner still has much more money in his/her pocket at the end of those 3 years than does the Honda owner. Which one costs more to own? And what is the satisfaction of owning one or the other worth? This is only an example, but shows that the cost-to-own, in dollars and cents, is more realistic than using percentages. The resale values will change, especially for the Hyundai as customer acceptance rises, making even more of a difference. Bottom line is, if you want, and can afford, a certain car, you probably will be happier spending more, but if safety, reliability, economics and general comfort are your priorities, spending less just makes more sense to many.

    Thank God for all the freedoms we enjoy(even the freedom to choose what we drive), and all those who fought to ensure those freedoms. God bless America!!!
  • rotaryrotary Posts: 71
    My current Hyundai has an Edmunds TMV for private party sale (I sell my cars myself) of just over $8000, which means in a little over four years I've lost about $5000 in depreciation on it.

    LOL. There are 2007 Sonata GLSs (both 4 and 6 cylinders) with under 20k miles all over the place for 10k to 11k. That's a one year old car that has lost half its value in one year.

    I like Hyundai and respect the improvements in quality they've made, but their resale values are terrible, and I'd love to see the person that buys your 4 year old Sonata for 50% of what you paid for it. Tell them to buy my Sonata for 30% of its value.
  • jlindhjlindh Posts: 282
    First of all, the 2007 Sonata is a 2 year old car as I'm sure you realize. Secondly, who in their right mind paid $20-22,000 for a 2007 GLS?

    You have an interesting way of playing with numbers.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 27,923
    Let's get back to them... The resale argument between Honda and Hyundai can be carried on somewhere else (besides the Prices Paid Forums).

    Thanks,
    kyfdx
    Host-Prices Paid Forums

    MODERATOR
    Prices Paid, Lease Questions, SUVs

  • rotaryrotary Posts: 71
    You're right. kyfdx.

    My apologies to the degree I took the conversation off course..
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,687
    Just so there is no misunderstanding.... my 4-year old Hyundai is not a Sonata. But I did I sell an older model (5.5 years instead of 4 years) of the same car (lesser trim) for 50% of what I paid for it. And they love the car. :)
  • yjbeachyjbeach Posts: 5
    I am looking to purchase a 2007 Sonata Limited (V6 with leather). One vehicle has about 15k miles (Vehicle A) the other has about 33k miles(Vehicle B).

    Vehicle A is listed at $18K
    Vehicle B is listed at $17K.

    What is a reasonable amount to pay for either vehicle from a (hyundai and toyota used car dealer), both in good condition?

    I was thinking Vehicle A around $14.5K and Vehicle B for about $15.5K.

    Anything I should look for that has failed others on their 2007 Limiteds?

    Thank you,
  • lordy1952lordy1952 Posts: 8
    hi, I am new to the buying process. this forum really help.

    here is my question, does any one know a good site that have dealer reviews?
    things like...is the internet quote trust worthy?

    also there are 2 townehyundai??? one in NY, another is NJ. Which is the real one?
    is towne hyundai's(NJ) internet price true? has any one bought from them? any will help(tip, advice)

    thanks
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,687
    Not sure why you would be willing to pay more for a car with over twice as many miles, especially since the list price of the more-travelled car is less. Is that a typo?

    18k miles is more than a year's worth of miles. So IMO I think the price differential between the 15k car and 33k car should be more.

    You might want to be sure to check on the suspension noise on these cars... several reports on the Sonata Problems discussion about that. There is a fix for it, but better the fix be done before you buy, if there's a problem.
  • bhmr59bhmr59 Posts: 1,598
    Towne Hyundai does have two locations.

    The NJ dealership has the better prices from what I have seen on the internet. Akthough the NY location doesn't post internet pricing.

    Yes, Towne's internet prices are real and no BS. We bought from them in 2/07 and several friends or friends of friends have done so also. All these people raved about the buying experience.

    NJ is townehyundai.com---NY is townehyundaiusa.com.
  • dgs4dgs4 Posts: 66
    "And I saw some mention of people getting 1000+ under invoice on even Hondas, so it's not like a premiere brand cannot have discounts also. "

    Yeah, that's probably true. It just seems like when it comes to Hyundai, buyers already assume to get a price like that to make buying a Hyundai a good value. I often hear the argument, "yeah, Hyundai may not be as good as the other guys, but I got it for so cheap how could I refuse." I just hate hearing that. I get a little defensive when it comes to Hyundai, as the company has totally turned themselves around. Their cars are every bit as exciting, well made, safe, reliable, fuel efficient, and feature packed as the other big players in the industry, maybe even more so. I just hope someday Hyundai gets the respect they deserve, and people want to buy them not because of how "cheap" they can purchase a Hyundai, but because of how much they want to own the car. Like I said earlier, I could have purchased a much more expensive vehicle than my 09 Sonata, so I didn't buy it because of it's price, but because I really, really liked the car. Much more than anything else in the class I test drove.

    Anyway, I'll get off my pro Hyundai rant and let you all get back to talking about prices.
  • lordy1952lordy1952 Posts: 8
    thanks for the info :)
  • jfritschjfritsch Posts: 958
    If one could find a v6 sonata with 20000 miles around here, with about a $12000 or so used wholesale price by the consumer book, You should jump on it in a minute. Better car than the Chev Impala, with possibly 36k of bumper to bumper and 60k of powertrain warranty? (xfer hyundai warranty)

    That guy is the only one posting sonatas 07 used everywhere for 10k. He probably misread something or saw a car on a lot that was wrecked and has a salvage title. That would put the wholesale value at 8000 or less and depreciation from msrp year 1 or so at about 13000+. Even the chevy's don't do that. No used vehicle like this is going to do it.

    Think about it. Dealers would be fools to price a car with bluebook figures of 12000 wholesale and 15000 inflated book retail numbers for 10k retail, even in the unlikely event the books are that far off. With the normal jokers with shot credit and people who even check on the book value, a gift like that from the "bibles" would help them move them all for good dough.

    Even the depreciation king, the Chevy impala V6 and other chevys don't do that. If you see a used 07 impala with even 12k on the windshield it's probably been totaled. Or you have a used car lot getting out of business ahead of the attorney general.

    So in the unlikely event you can find used 07 sonata's msrp 20000 and up for 10k all day retail with a clean carfax, take advantage of the consumer misperception and jump on it. Its a bargain between a Chev impala and accord in quality and a good warranty to boot. Even the used chevys wholesale 12000 will have 16000 or more on the windshield. The 09 is even better.

    With respect to value, with the average price paid, and the price savings of a Hyundai, it probably is about equal. Perhaps less because of poorer folks getting taken more by Hyundai dealers

    Sorry mod but this belongs here.. it is prices paid. (You don't want anyone having a coronary trying to find 10k Sonata's common on dealer lots)

    Good luck
    --jjf
  • moocow1moocow1 Posts: 230
    I just checked some hyundai fact information and workers actually make far more than the average Alabama person. With experience, most jobs pay $21-26+ per hour + benefits. Obviously starting out, workers will be in the $15ish range. I figure when that plant first started, there were still some kinks to iron out. Hopefully with the 2009 models, we'll have something more solidly reliable :)
    Not sure what the wholesale cost really is, but it's obviously something probably a couple thousand under invoice, which does leave us all plenty of bargaining area to get that best price. And buy that sonata because the car is awesome :)
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