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Minivans - Domestic or Foreign

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Comments

  • jipsterjipster Posts: 5,345
    Personally, I don't place resale value high on my list.

    You're looking at the best minivan on the market, at the best price... the Mazda MPV! Now you want a written invitation? Go out and buy that last Mazda MPV before hans or thegraduate buy it.
  • Absolutely no activity! I'll start posting there when I receive one as a company vehicle next week. As bad as the Freestars are, it can't be worse than the 1984 design of the current new Astro (Jetson's dog!!) I'm now driving.
  • guestguest Posts: 774
    What criteria do you use to determine bad?
    IF you want a truck, the Astro is # 1 of the minivans.
    It had a powerful, fuel efficient engine, BIG towing capacity, and large interior space in a vehicle shorter than most minivans.
  • guestguest Posts: 774
    How does the driver know if D means Drive for all 5 speeds or D means it is only 3-2-1? Is there any visual reminder? :shades:
  • It's bad because it remained basicly unchanged since it's inception in 1984. Very cramped foot room up front, poor crash ratings, and handles like a truck. Why did they stop making them if it was the only vehicle like it in it's class? The 4.3 engine was the only thing it had going for itself, for the reasons you mentioned.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    There is "D", where you put it once you crank the car. If you push the D3 button, a "D3" indicator shines in yellow in the dash next to the indicator in the instrument panel (as bright as the cruise control indicator does - you can't miss it). You press the D3 button again to go back to normal "D" operation, just as you would by shifting the lever on the Sienna back to "D."

    PS - I'm guessing this is hansienna? The Edmunds.com bug of names not showing up is at it again!
  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,233
    Consider two things when determining if the need for locking in 4th gear is necessary on the Odyssey:

    1. The automatic transmission typically does a very good job of knowing what gear is proper for the situation. Grade braking, acceleration, etc. are all performed fairly accurately in auto mode.

    2. 5th gear is an ultra-tall gear for the most part, and 4th is similarly to most OD's. 3rd is the usual 1:1, which is what you'd want for highway acceleration/braking so I can't see how locking in 4th would make any difference for utility purposes. 4th provides very little acceleration/engine braking advantages over 5th although the engine will choose that gear in certain circumstances. It's still a tall OD gear and if you are overriding gears for utility purposes, it's not the gear you'll want anyway.
  • hansiennahansienna Posts: 2,312
    All of the above is true, but an Ody owner does NOT have all of the choices a Sienna owner does with D-4-3-2-L.
    Just another example of one company having a better idea than the others. :shades:
    In fairness, Honda has a better idea placing the compact spare conveniently inside the Odyssey while Sienna and DC minivans store the compact spare underneath the minivan. The Odyssey Plus 1 Seat between the 2 captain's chairs of 2nd row is another good idea no other minivan has.
  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,233
    My point was, with the gearing of the Ody, that extra "choice" is not necessary, important, needed, et al. Having the option to lock in 4th would simply make it more difficult to lock into 3rd (1:1) which is the gear anybody would want to lock into anyway.

    The Sienna is geared completely different and 4th gear is 1:1 vs 3rd gear for the Ody. So you absolutely need to be able to manually lock into 4th on the Sienna and 3rd gear on the Ody. 4th on the Ody is just a bonus OD gear and if you're driving passive enough to need it, why would you need to lock it in?
  • hansiennahansienna Posts: 2,312
    IF the overall engine RPM per gear is equal, the Sienna AT gives the driver 3 accelerating gears while the Ody gives the driver only 2.
    Does the driver prefer 2 Overdrive speeds and 2 accelerating speeds of the Ody :confuse: or 1 Overdrive speed and 3 accelerating speeds of the Sienna? ;)
  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,233
    Well it's more like 3 accelerating gears in the Ody and 4 in the Sienna. Unless you believe 1:1 is not a reasonable accelerating gear.

    The extra gear in the Sienna is actually 1st, which is a very short 4.24, compared to the 2.56 of the Ody. So it should feel quicker off the line, but will require a very quick up-shift (35mph at WOT according to C&D). Which is better? I dunno. Performance wise they seem to be about the same in the real world. I guarantee a lot of folks think the Sienna is more powerful during a test drive simply because it will pull harder right at first. I would say the Sienna is also the better choice for towing, which is even more obvious once you look at Honda's asinine tow package option.
  • d5ad5a Posts: 63
    Hey room took your advise. Bought the last MPV in my area. Base model with rear air, roof rack, floor mates, and cargo net. So far so good. IT only had 28 miles on it. I was shocked since it had been sitting in the lot. IT now has 200 miles on it and it seems to be a nice van. 17,500 on the road and its has just enough room and it moves. ITs really fast and I just came out of a BMW so for a van to move like it does I'm happy. I hope i stay happy for years driving it. Could not beat the price and it seems just as good as any other van i drove. Hope it last and the transmmsion is ok.

    Thanks for every ones advise. I'll keep you posted on how it works out as we put more miles on the van.
  • jchan2jchan2 Posts: 4,956
    Congrats on the purchase. $17,500 is an excellent price- I think for the same price you'd only be able to buy a Civic LX. :)

    Is it a 2005 or a 2006?
  • d5ad5a Posts: 63
    Thanks, Thats what i thought when i bought it. For the price what else would I be able to get with all the room it has. :)
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Debuting next week in Detroit!!! I can add one feature as certain - LED track lighting!!! (use less energy and last forever)

    The production date appears to be September 1, 2007.

    No more four cylinders: four speed automatic on base models with 3.3 engine
    Top end 4.0 engine with six speed
    ESP (stability control)
    MyGig sound system with built-in hard drive for music storage and more
    Power third row seat
    Rear backup camera
    Illuminated cupholders, probably heated and cooled
    Heated second row seats
    Ventilated front seats
    HID headlamps
    Sirius Streaming Video (movies on demand over the air?)
    Hybrid-electric version (possibly late availability)
    We'd also expect the fancy new LED lights used in the Sebring and Aspen to make their way into the Caravan and Town & Country.

    2008 DCX Van Details and Pics

    Autoblog Article
  • joe97joe97 Posts: 2,248
    Overly conservative - takes some chances (except for Crossfire, Sebring, Compass, and Aspen :-)

    Market Collapse: Detroit 3 count on fleet sales to move minivans

    http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070103/FREE/70102005/1528
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Over Conservative? We all know how well the Nissan Quest is doing in market place with it's radical styling. I think DCX went back to their roots and they look great for being a Minivan. Love the Chrome mirrors and door handles!!! I just hoped they moved the interior up a notch. I'm glad there's no ribs on hood aka Crossfire and Aspen!!!
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Love the Article's last comment "Minivan Market is Collapsing"!!! Note this was written by an expert in Detroit, where GM/Ford sat on their butts while Honda/Toyota and even DCX were the innovators with features and technology. Then their Minivans don't sell and they're jumping on crossovers to save their butts. GM/Ford stopped making minivans in the late 90s in my opinion. Look at a Winstar and Freestar and note the differences - hardly any, same with Venture/Uplander etc.. Boo Hoo, their minivans aren't selling :(

    I think DCX is trying and even if you omit fleet sales from DCX numbers, they're selling more Minivans than anyone else.

    Personally I think CUVs aren't much better than SUVs!! Unless you need AWD, you're losing space, MPG, utiity, and ride. How many Pilots, Murano, Highlanders are on the road compared to Odys, Quests and Siennas? Not Many! CUVs aren't going to save GM/Ford!! Look at Ford's new Edge - weighs 2.5 ton!!!! no space and seats 5!!! NO THANKS!!!
  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,233
    Until they put a sliding door on these "CUV's" they're not going to hack too far into the minivan world. Loading/unloading younger kids is just a complete PITA with normal doors, nevermind the other advantages of the big boxes.
  • d5ad5a Posts: 63
    I have to agree with the fact that like it or not minivans are the best bang for the buck when it comes to hauling people and things. I've had car's SUV's and CUV and now have a minivan. I fought the minivan purchase but now wonder why. It beats everything I've had before including many large SUV's for room. My large SUV's could not handle the room and space a minivan can. If you need all wheel drive which i wanted I can see looking at CUV's but you wont get the room or gas mileage. I wish more minivans had an AWD option but it would effect the mileage but at least if you wanted it you could have it.

    Hate to say it but I would find it really hard to live without a van in my family now that we have one. I can't day that about a CUV or SUV or even a car.
  • hansiennahansienna Posts: 2,312
    GM NEVER put much money into their minivans while Ford never had a good idea. GM tried to fool people by putting an SUV like hood on their poorly designed, small 2nd generation FWD minivans and called them CUV's.

    Meanwhile, Honda and Toyota greatly improved the Odyssey and Sienna while Kia improved the Sedona and they have replaced GM and Ford in the minivan market while Chrysler still remains THE MOST Popular minivan.

    It will be VERY interesting to see how well the public likes the new, more conservatively styled 2008 DaimlerChrysler minivans.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    What do you think? Looks like the 2nd row not only Stow but also rotate 180 degrees!!! and the back windows have built in shades, there's switches on IP for folding and stowing the seats, the gearshift looks like it has manual shift capability even!! and the over level of refinement is incredible!!

    2008 Town and Country
  • joe97joe97 Posts: 2,248
    The Stow 'n' Swivel looked and sounded pretty cool, from I am hearing. Otherwise, the overall package is okay.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Looks pretty cool to me, with best in-class interior packaging. Refinement is something that, IMO, must be felt as well as seen, which is something that we can't do yet. If the tactile quality of the interior is there, then looks like DCX will stay right in the thick of the battle!
  • Looks really good. The swivel chairs are a neat idea, and they also have the power fold down 3rd row which is a first. They catch up in all other features as well. They also are offering the 3 seating configurations (BELOW), which should satisfy just about everyone up to 8 passengers. Good stuff. I think I will wait until early '08 to look for my new van

    Three distinct seating configurations are available for 2008 in North America: a second-row bench seat with second-row covered storage bins and third-row fold-in-the-floor seating, a Stow ’n Go® seating and storage system with the only second- and third-row fold-in-the-floor seats in the industry, and the new Swivel ’n Go seating that allows the second row seats to swivel 180 degrees to face rearward. Swivel ’n Go also includes a removable table that fits between the second and third rows with a fold-in-the-floor third-row seat. A one-touch power-folding third-row seat also is available.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    they also have the power fold down 3rd row which is a first.

    I think a couple of vehicles beat Chrysler to the power-fold third-row seat.

    Check out Toyota Sienna Limited with Option Package 3. It has a power folding 60/40 third row. The Ford Expedition has offered this for awhile now, also.

    EDIT: - I just realized you may have meant that this was a first for Chrysler, and not to the vehicle market in general. If so, my apologies. :)
  • Actually I thought it was a minivan first. Didn't realize the Sienna just started offering it (I assume it's new for 07?). I knew about the Expedition - they had commercials for that (I'd never shop an Expedition, so that's how I knew)
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Didn't realize the Sienna just started offering it (I assume it's new for 07?).

    I honestly don't know when they started offering it. I know the design was refreshed a little bit in 2006 also, so it could have been then. I'm not sure though.
  • Good info, thanks.

    The Sienna third row power seat was a new option for early 2006. It is not available with the four wheel drive option. Really excited about the T&C and hope the tactile quality is there as well as overall improved reliability.
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