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CR-V vs Escape

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Comments

  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    The Freestyle, while a good vehicle, has been underwhelming to say the least,

    Boy you ought to head over to the Freestyle thread and check out who's buying them and why.

    With the new RAV4 and the upcoming 3rd generation CR-V, there is no doubt the Escape will continue to see bigger rebates and more places in rental fleets.

    I wouldn't be so sure. The Escape will be receiving another refresh in a year or two (the spy shots are somewhere on InsideLine) and that may be enough for it to hold on to the top spot.

    Meanwhile, the Civic, Accord, Corolla and Camry soldier on and continue to get better and better.

    I'll defer this to the other posts. Honda may not be guilty of constantly changing names but Toyota sure is.

    Maybe it's because I don't care about reliability or resale or maybe it's something else but I like to see fresh new models. The Accord and Camry bore me to death.
  • dromedariusdromedarius Posts: 307
    Maybe it's because I don't care about reliability or resale or maybe it's something else but I like to see fresh new models. The Accord and Camry bore me to death.

    I agree, like the CR-V, the Accord and the Camry may not be the most exciting vehicles on the face of the planet, but they are very good at doing what they are designed for, and that is getting people from Point A to Point B. At the end of the day, that's what it's about.

    I live in the Midwest, so almost everyone I work with owns a big four door pickup or SUV, such as a TrailBlazer, Suburban, Durango or Explorer. Then there is this guy who farms on the side (we are both in Information Systems) who drives a little Metro. It's SO not macho like the other in-town guys who just HAVE to have that Dodge Ram with the Hemi to drive four blocks to work, but it is sure is sensible. I always get a chuckle seeing his little car parked between the parking lot behemoths, as does he I'm sure when he fills his car up at the gas station.

    Furthermore, you are only going to lose money on a vehicle, so my philosophy is to lose less. I'd rather spend money on my wife, my son or my house. The returns are much higher. I guess I'm just super practical.

    :shades:
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Maybe it's because I don't care about reliability or resale or maybe it's something else but I like to see fresh new models.

    Most people care about reliability for financial reasons. Many can't afford to miss work because their car broke down, and then pay $1,200 to fix it (e.g. our Sebring Convertible). Reliability is likely important to most, but the level of reliability is where many people vary. Some see it as good if they go 100,000 miles without spending $1,000 on their car in repairs. I'll take my $300 or so for my 160,000 miles.
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    I'll take my $300 or so for my 160,000 miles.


    That's pretty laughable IMO. Our Civic cost us quite a bit more than that in 30,000 miles.

    Reliability is likely important to most, but the level of reliability is where many people vary.

    I have to disagree. It has been written recently in the news that women are most influential when it comes time for a family to buy a car. Pretty much all of the women I know buy vehicles based on looks. For example, our Civic was my wife's first car and was bought by her before we were married. Want to know how she picked that car out? Yep, it was "cute". I could go on and on with these.
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    I agree, like the CR-V, the Accord and the Camry may not be the most exciting vehicles on the face of the planet, but they are very good at doing what they are designed for, and that is getting people from Point A to Point B. At the end of the day, that's what it's about.

    Yes and no. I guess most people probably just want to get from A to B in the end. How you get there matters to the rest of us. Ever since I leased my Mazda6 I have been taking back roads to and from work because they are very twisty and hilly. It's a hoot! Well, until I get behind an Accord or Camry that is. ;)

    Furthermore, you are only going to lose money on a vehicle, so my philosophy is to lose less. I'd rather spend money on my wife, my son or my house.

    How true. But we were more practical with our house which allows us to be gluttons in other aspects of our lives like the cars, each other, and the boys. We bought what we needed and that's it. All of our friends are building/buying giant 4 bedroom McMansions for three or four people and can't afford a swing set for their tiny backyards. I sat on a couch in front of my big screen HDTV watching The Masters for an hour or two yesterday while I sipped a freshly tapped beer from my kegerator. Some of those aforementioned friends were probably working so they could keep up with the rest of the Joneses. :sick:
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Posts: 2,882
    " Pretty much all of the women I know buy vehicles based on looks. "

    LOL......Exactly.......Fits my wife perfectly.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    You better make sure the wives don't read these forums...:)

    That's pretty laughable IMO. Our Civic cost us quite a bit more than that in 30,000 miles.

    I'm sorry to hear that, but my statement isn't laughable, instead, its true. You can actually see the car on carspace.com if you like. I fibbed a little, it's actually got 159,000, but over 150k, who's counting?
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    Once again, not the whole truth.. Should read " A 4cylinder 5spd CRV that is redlined through every gear, outruns a V6 Escape.....

    You forgot to mention that Escape is redlining too and still can't catch up. Despite having 2 more cylinders, and 0.6 liters more of displacement, still can't beat CR-V.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    Are you really comparing the Fit to a Corvette?? This is the silver "H" syndrome again...

    Did I anywhere compare all of the Fit to all of the Corvette? I just stated what Car and driver stated, that Fit bested Corvette in the slalom.

    As far as the H-syndrome, someone should be checked for PARANOIA, and CONSPIRACY syndromes.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    Once a car has sufficient power (again, I'll make the exception for sports cars), then adding hp just for the sake of faster 0-60 times is a waste of engineering and $$. I'd rather see that engineering and $$ go into some other aspect of a car.

    That clearly shows that Honda has put more engineering in other aspects of the vehicle than the engine alone. How can a 4 cylinder 160 hp vehicle outrun a V6 200 hp vehicle if is it not better engineered?
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    As far as the H-syndrome, someone should be checked for PARANOIA, and CONSPIRACY syndromes.

    The H-syndrome for us has consisted of only $300 in the way of repairs (except for wreck) on my old Honda Accord (160k miles). The brakes (although mostly highway driving) lasted 128k miles on the front, and are the original shoes on the back. The main cooling fan motor failed at 145,000 miles. Original tranny, motor, engine parts, exhaust, etc., and I got 27.6 MPGs in mixed driving on my last fillup (I average 26 in town, 30 HWY)
    .
    .
    .
    .
    Consider me brainwashed.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    most of the pro-v posters don't own one. they just recite stats and magazine reviews.

    I own both, 2005 CR-V EX 5MAN and 2005 Escape XLT, and can REALLY COMPARE. So, whatever anyone else is posting is just hearsay. They don't deal with both vehicles on the daily basis. Until they do, they should just keep quiet and stop posting about nonsensical conspiracies and H-syndromes.
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 40,861
    So, which one is cuter?

    :D

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    Moderator
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  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    So, which one is cuter?



    Steve, Host


    Escape, that is why we have it. Originally we were going to become a 2 CR-V family. But, she thought Escape was cuter. Since she is paying for it with her own money, she can get whatever she wants. There is no way I could reason with "cute!"
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    There is no way I could reason with "cute!"

    See, I wasn't making that up! ;)
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    but my statement isn't laughable, instead, its true.

    Sorry about that. I didn't mean to imply you were lying about the $300 but rather was pointing out that your experience is not necessarily the norm.

    What was the $300 for? How much did it cost to replace the timing belt? Once or twice so far for that last one?
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Posts: 2,882
    Now that's the best reason I can think of to buy a particular car. I guess the Escape wins this contest...LOL
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    "where are the 600, prelude, crx, del Sol, s2000?"

    Not at all on topic, but since when has that stopped us... Interesting that you mention those. The reasons behind those are kinda interesting.

    First, if you are referring to the S600, then you're talking about one of Honda's very first cars. It was a small roadster with a motorcycle engine and chain-drive. It was followed by the S800. The vehicle was cancelled when roadsters fell out of fashion. The same was done by every other manufacturer until Mazda revived the segment in the 1980's. The S2000, which you also mention, is named after the S600. S=Sport and the number is the displacement of the engine. It's not unlike the way Nissan named their sport cars 240Z, 280Z, 300Z, and now 350Z. So, this is a perfect example of Honda sticking with the same name. Even though the successor arrived many, many years later.

    And the S2000 is still being produced, so I'm not clear on why you mention it.

    The Prelude was killed because the market disappeared. Basically, the same deal as when roadsters died off in the 60's and muscle cars died off in the 70's. No real news there.

    The name of the CRX was changed (get this) because of insurance costs. Insurance companies were cracking down on hi-po cars at the time and slapping big rates on any vehicle with a name which included Z, or X (300Z, IROC-Z, Z-24, etc.) So Honda changed the name from CRX to "Civic del Sol" to make it seem more like a common economy car. They later dropped the Civic part and just called it Del Sol.

    Actually, one of the best things about the Integra was the fact that it was initially registered as a compact economy car, not a sports car. The insurance companies caught on after a while, though.

    Oddly, enough you forgot to mention the two most famous (and in one case, disastrous) name changes from Honda. When they changed Legend to RL and Integra to RSX.

    But when it comes to those vehicles which are doing well, Honda (and Toyota) have not changed the names. They keep the name around and it eventually becomes an icon for the segment. Honda doesn't really have to spend money marketing the Civic or Accord because they are so well known.

    This is not unique to the imports. Ford has kept the F series alive for decades. Ditto for vehicles like the Vette or Mustang. But the domestics haven't been as successful as Honda and Toyota. With the exception of the competition-lacking world of big trucks, the domestics have not been able to build the same nameplate equity as the imports. They only achieved the same success in niche markets.
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    With the exception of the competition-lacking world of big trucks, the domestics have not been able to build the same nameplate equity as the imports.

    Lacking? I disagree. Toyota has been trying for years without any major success (that one was renamed too if you recall) and Nissan is struggling along now. I'm sure there will be more in the future just as more have come along in the Civic and Accord class over the years. Those weren't always as competitive as they are now either and the last five years have really been good for competition and the consumer.
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,798
    "most of the pro-v posters don't own one. they just recite stats and magazine reviews"

    Well, I owned a 2003 CR-V until recently... not everyone is a troll!
  • tidestertidester Posts: 10,110
    not everyone is a troll!

    Some trolls are owners and some are not. Thankfully, they are relatively rare. :)

    tidester, host
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    Hey John (stevedebi),
    Why don't you tell dromedarius what a flop the Freestyle is. ;)

    It's an obvious upgrade option for a CR-V or Escape owner but which one is it more like?

    This very well might be the missing link between the two camps present in this thread. :surprise:
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    I consider the timing belt a maintenance cost, since EVERY car with this belt should have it replaced at the recommended interval (just like transmission fluid, oil changes, etc...). The timing belt was changed a little early at 87k, and is due for another one at 177k.

    It's ok, I did misunderstand, and any unkindness wasn't meant.

    The $300 was to replace the main cooling fan motor(radiator fan). It just completely failed last summer (bad timing).
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 40,861
    I think maintenance is part of the Total Cost of Ownership (title case in deference to the TCO tool).

    My minivan maintenance has cost me $2,809.96 over 109,000 miles. That includes brakes, oil, tires, battery, bulbs, IM inspections, etc. Parts that failed would be a CV boot/axle at $169 plus some stuff that was replaced under warranty early on, like the wiper switch and power window motor. That doesn't count, right? :shades:

    Got a handle on the other number?

    My total operating expenses for the van, not counting depreciation, is $16,636 over ~7+ years or .18 a mile (per Excel anyway). Double that for the depreciation. :cry:

    Steve, Host

    Moderator
    Need help navigating? stever@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    I consider the timing belt a maintenance cost, since EVERY car with this belt should have it replaced at the recommended interval (just like transmission fluid, oil changes, etc...). The timing belt was changed a little early at 87k, and is due for another one at 177k.


    I consider it routine maintenance as well but I was just curious as to how much it cost to replace. Most, if not all now, Fords use a timing chain and don't require that extra visit. Those that did have a belt were not in danger of valve interference and didn't get destroyed. I realize Honda finally woke up and began using chains recently but I feel too many people were ripped off when having to deal with that belt. It's not cheap right?

    I wish some numbers were available to show how many people destroyed their engines simply because they didn't follow the maintenace schedule. I bet the data are eye opening.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    I wish some numbers were available to show how many people destroyed their engines simply because they didn't follow the maintenace schedule. I bet the data are eye opening.

    That would apply to any car.
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    That would apply to any car.

    Yes it would but as I stated Ford's engines typically are not of the interference type and Honda's are. If both have the same failure rate for timing belts then Honda owners are the big losers.

    As a side note an interference type motor is not a bad thing at all. This type of engine is typically built with tighter tolerances and more efficient which is the definition of a modern Honda engine. Just maintain the stupid belt if you have one!
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,798
    "Why don't you tell dromedarius what a flop the Freestyle is. ;)

    It's an obvious upgrade option for a CR-V or Escape owner but which one is it more like? "

    Well, it is styled like a Ford Explorer, which is similar to the Escape styling, though updated last year. So it looks more like an Escape. However, it runs 4000lbs, has a CVT, and can seat 7 comfortably and still have 22 CuFt behind the 3rd seat. No comparison on ride to either CR-V or Escape - no surprise there due to the longer wheelbase.

    However, the Freestyle drives like a Volvo, which is the platform upon which it is based.

    The FS is selling pretty well, considering the fact the Ford doesn't advertise it at all. I think they're afraid of destroying their Explorer sales. The FS is a much better family car for those who do not need towing.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    "Now I'm curious if anyone in here has had their CR-V or Escape for more than, let's say, 6 years and 80,000 miles?"

    Don't have it anymore, but I had my CR-V for almost 7 years and 114,000 miles.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    "Lacking? I disagree. Toyota has been trying for years without any major success (that one was renamed too if you recall) and Nissan is struggling along now."

    How long has Ford been selling the F series? 50 years?

    Toyota has been in the market for what? A decade? And Toyota would bring the total number of competitors in the field to four. The number of nameplates in the mid-size sedan market is something like three or four times that of the big truck market. And that market has been competitive since the dawn of the automobile.
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