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Toyota Tacoma vs. Ford Ranger, Part XII

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Comments

  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    yes, it's what im saying here. since ive got my BFG all-terrains on my jeep, id gladly take you anywhere you want to go. but bring a tow rope, you'll get stuck- 4x4 or not. pencil thin lower control arms? read and learn my friend.


    http://www.jeep.com/liberty/suspension/details.html


    also, this article pretty much sums up what ive been saying about the liberty, and what you didn't know about the liberty. yeah, it'll go get groceries, but it will also take them back to camp. hmm, how much ground clearance did you say your tacoma had? hehe


    http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/firstdrive/46722/article.html

  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    you will notice that I said a 4x4 tacoma, thus neglecting me from having to back myself up, hehe. But it is completely ludacrous to say that you could hang with a locked tacoma offroad, sorry. You can't even clear 31s w/o a mild lift. A rock of any size would be just like a wall.

    Go on and admit what you got the thing for and be done with it. I defended you when folks made fun of it - and I thought for a little while you were gonna be realistic about it. I don't like em, but I think they are neat vehicles. However, to say that Jeep did not bring them out so that posers would buy it just for the 4x4 on the side is a joke. If they had wanted for folks to get it for its capabilities they would have at least put a solid axle under it, even GCs still have them. You are exactly why they came out with the Liberty and thats all there is to it. Now we are having to pay for your blindness. And you called my truck "not even a real truck," - give me a freakin break. Im tired of listening to this crap. But thats just my opinion, I could be wrong. You can just keep posting those links to Jeeps "totally unbiased" website and Ill keep saying exactly this: YOU ARE THE REASON WHY THE LIBERTY SELLS SO WELL. Jeeps marketers are rippin' geniuses. Does it have unibody construction, and, if so, could you explain the pros and cons of having no frame?
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    you're starting to sound ignorant. it does have a frame, it's body is welded to the frame. it is more rigid than a frame. please read and learn before you post stuff like your last post. you sound really dumb.

    "i dont like them, but i think they're neat vehicles". that makes sense my man. go drag race your 4x2. you sound funny mr. no transfer case man. to rip on a liberty when you don't even have a t/c is ludicrous. and what about those iron a -arms? conceding that one?
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    saddaddy is right. Any rock, any step is like a wall for them. Yeah, you got better entry/departure angle than Tacomas, but without decent tires you won't be able to take advantage of them. It'll be your bumper that takes all the abuse and the components behind it...like the advertised 2 gallon windshield fluid reservour. I've seen a 3" lifted Liberty offroad....he tried to go up a step (I'm trying to find some pix for you), busted the bumper and ruptured the reservour. And that was WITH rock stacking.

    You can't lift Liberty very well: GC, C and W actually look good lifted with big tires. Liberty looks......well...you'll find out.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    you're starting to sound ignorant. it does have a frame, it's body is welded to the frame. it is more rigid than a frame. please read and learn before you post stuff like your last post. you sound really dumb.

    "i dont like them, but i think they're neat vehicles". that makes sense my man. go drag race your 4x2. you sound funny mr. no transfer case man. to rip on a liberty when you don't even have a t/c is ludicrous. and what about those iron a -arms? conceding that one?
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    I've been in the TTORA club for 8 month now, been on many runs, some actually pretty hard ones (rode shotgun).....I've never seen or even heard of anyone on the board busting A-arms. What's that obsession with them, tbunder?
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    as you'll remember, i hate lifts. and i have new BFG tires. equivalent to 30x9.50/15. no lift required. they fit fine and are just .5 taller than stock. no i have no locker. but i could get one if needed. yeah, the stock lib tires suck. what oem tires dont? that's why i changed them. got five of 'em. no worries here. only 339 miles, so still not broke in. id love to see those pics though.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    thats why it was a question. Someone told me something that I wasn't sure about, so I asked you. Is that a problem? What good is a transfer case if it never engages? Answer that one for me, mallrunner.

    U hate lifts, isn't that convenient. I hate posers who think they are the best thing since sliced bread and all they have is 30 inch tires, I know a guy that drives a Ranger just like that. And no, Im not conceding anything. You can't prove jack about any A-arms. Find a report of even one breaking. Take that challenge and you might conclude that they are better made than Ford Ranger axles and Liberty fuel pumps. How can anyone sing the praises of a new vehicle when they needed a loaner after a week. Ridiculous, even for you.
  • BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!

    Man! That was a good laugh!
  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    How much ground clearance DID I say my taco had? I don't recall any remark about ground clearance.

    There is a thread at the taco board now, that I started. A few guys there wheel with liberties a good bit they say. With lockers they do pretty good, apparently. However, it is a consensus that they need at least 4 inches of lift in order to have enough ground clearance to do anything in the way of hanging with stock tacomas. Whats the number on liberty g/c?

    Liberties will walk the dog on anything in their class, probably. But you went too far when saying that they can do everything a tacoma will. Honestly I would be arguing just as hard if you had said the Lib could hang with an FX4, its just wrong.
  • eagle63eagle63 Posts: 599
    Did you test drive the Xterra at all before you bought your Liberty? If so, what did you like/dislike about it? I've kinda got my eye on an Xterra, even if the V6 is a little underpowered.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    yes, i did test-drive an Xterra. very nice vehicle, but here's what the jeep sold me on. the Xterra's low range gearing is extremely tall. on the jeep liberty (only) when in four-lo, the idle automatically adjusts itself for a higher idle which is nice as you don't have to feather the gas pedal when cruising real slow. and it is a very low crawl in 4-lo. also, the jeep has dana axles all the way around. that alone should sell a prospective off-roader.
    the Xterra feels extremely tinny. on the other hand, the liberty feels like a sherman tank when closing a door. it is very quiet and the door mounts are huge and bolted to the body. it also is pretty hefty in weight and gets good crash test scores.
    Xterra's are all over the place, whereas libs are still kind of a rare sight although they are getting more common.
    the Xterra is kind of under-powered, but it does a good job with what it has. otoh, the liberty flat out hauls [non-permissible content removed]. at least as quick as my ranger if not quicker since it has less tranny gears.
    lib offers an off-road pkg with real tow hooks and solid steel skidplates under the fuel tank, t/c, and all libs get a solid skidplate under the engine/susp up front.
    with some BFG tires, the liberty im assuming is vey hard to beat in tight trails. it's short wheelbase and short overhangs will take it a lot of places other vehicles wouldn't dare.
    i compare these two because i like them both. the Xterra is just too old hat for me. the liberty is a very well thought out vehicle, it even has a water deflector in front of the air intake. pretty trick. plus, it has nice hydraulic hood holder uppers and not a cheap bar. my jeep barely stickered over $22K and it has power everything and CD and auto. nothing else can touch that price for it's capability. all i got was the BFG's. and the fifth one hanging back there on the steel jeep rims looks real tough. the nissan is a nice vehicle though. but to get a nice looking one, you have to get the SE model which is at least $26K. a cool Xterra would be the one with just the enthusiast's pkg. it basically has nothing except what an off-road enthusiast would want. manual hubs, no power, steel wheels and stuff like that. you'd have to order that to get it. no nissan dealer will stock such a special vehicle. good luck. go drive both unless you are totally ruling out the jeep. but i highly recommend one.
  • tbunder1tbunder1 Posts: 257
    ground clearance on my jeep.
    front susp. clearance between the axles is 10.5.
    rear susp. clearance at middle of axle is 8.75.
    i have stock sized BFG tires on it. i do believe you don't have much of an advantage if any on your tacoma.
    im not saying the lib can do everything a tacoma or ranger, just that they may do better off-road. i would never jump a jeep liberty.
  • bessbess Posts: 972
    Been a while since I visited here.

    In another Edmunds Forum, the topic diverged a bit, and it was posted:
    --------------
    "Yes, the rear axle of Tacoma/4Runner/Tundra/Sequoia (all the same size) are not of a 1-ton truck; however, it's wheel bearings, joints, etc. are! (Please RE-read what i wrote.) Axle size of the 4Runner is more than adequate for an SUV it's size. (Just the fact that the 4Runner has the same axle as the Sequoia is pretty impressive!) In addition, the 4Runner also has 4.10 axle ratio...with a "crawl ratio" of 29.5, which is better than most other off-roading SUV in it's class, including the Xterra, Pathfinder, Explorer, and Land Rover Discovery!

    The '02 4Runner does NOT need a rear locker. Why? Because it has 4-wheel traction system, similar to ones use on Land Rover Discover, Land Cruiser, etc. It able to provide ONE wheel traction (if the 3 other wheels have no traction). Before 2000, 4Runner HAD the same locker that is found on the Tacoma...but when 2001 were updated with this 4-wheel traction control, the locker became obsolete."

    -----------end quote--

    My questions:
    a. Are the wheel bearings and joints the same size on all Toyota trucks?
    b. Is that size (bearings/joints) equavilant to what I'd find on my F250 SuperDuty or F350?
    c. Is the 4runner 4x4 system (which has no locker) really better than a locker?
    d. If so, does the Tacoma have this superior system as well?
    --------------
  • a- probably. all small corporate. the tacoma's drivetrain is the same as the tundra so it's been said around here. and since the tundra is just the sequoia (sp?)in a pickup form means they may very well be the same. however, is this impressive? depends if you think toyota's corporate axles are impressive. imo, they can't be compared to dana axles. you don't see true off-roaders running around swapping out their dana axles for toyota corporates. same with nissan.

    b- uh, no. use a little common sense here bess. comparing a super-duty to anything toyota builds is just ludicrous.

    c- hmmm, good question. i guess if you have at least one wheel spinning if the others don't have any traction, that's a good thing. but it sure sounds like a lsd to me.

    d- no. just a locker, or open diff when not ordered with TRD pkg. or locker as a separate option. and when not locked, it's an open diff.
  • eagle63eagle63 Posts: 599
    I won't even bother trying to answer your first 2 questions, but as for the 4wd systems, the 4-runner (2001 models and higher) uses a full-time 4wd setup whereas the Tacoma uses part-time 4wd. The Tacoma's locker is an "augmentation" to its 4wd system.
    Full-time 4wd is great becuase it's virtually idiot-proof. It's similar to all-wheel drive in that it's always on and you can use it on dry pavement. Part-time 4wd is manually controlled by the driver, and can only be used on slippery surfaces. I'm sure many people would say that full-time 4wd is "superior," but it really depends on what you use the vehicle for. I tend to favor part-time as it's durable, simple, and cheap. I also like that it's controlled by me. I know when the road is slippery; I know when I need the 4wd engaged. I don't need a computer guessing for me. Hope that helps.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    and the only modification to 2003 Taco is a standard ABS. Oh well.....4Runner will be unveiled on the 10th, we'll know then for sure.
  • Thats some tech. that Rangers won't see for awhile, I bet.
  • sad- just how is the throttle controlled on a ranger? magic?

    it only took eight years for toyota to offer abs standard. hmmm, now that's a big deal i see. an afterthought in ranger land. i understand though, when you guys get something like a sliding window you're ecstatic. a cd player? instantaneously ravenous.
  • eagle63eagle63 Posts: 599
    where did you hear that??
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    Haha. You should have been a stand-up comedian.
    Sliding window? Don't matter...it's nice, but not something worth raving about. CD player? Who cares......I can go and buy one cheaper.

    As for ABS: Seeing how Tacoma was a very popular truck with offroader crowd, having ABS only makes life worse. I'm sure someone will rig up a on-off switch soon so people can offroad without ABS getting in a way. But watch out, bundy.....Toyota is catching up onto your "We get this standard, we get that standard"....remember how you went on and on about why ABS was something people just HAD to have in order to survive on the road? Well, it's here now. Pretty soon there'll be 2 suicide doors in the Xtracab Tacoma. Your list of standard equipment over optional equipment on Taco grows thin.
  • hehe. woohoo, we're impressed. yeah, catching up.


    well, i figured SOMEONE who drove a toyota would copy what jeep has already done with the liberty. ie. when an abs equipped liberty is engaged into 4-lo, abs is automatically shut down. too bad toyota didn't think of that on their big bad off-roader.

    there's only one.


    here, read about the abs defeat.


    http://www.edmunds.com/news/autoshows/articles/45676/page001.html

  • It works the sameway on Toyota, if in 4lo the ABS is disabled.... Imagine having a Locker engaged and ABS activating..! Not pretty.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    tbunder is wrong again. What else is new?

    I didn't know about ABS and 4lo for a simple enough reason: I don't have ABS, and don't care for it.
    Thanks, smgilles, for pointing this one out.

    well, I figured SOMEONE who praised FX4 would copy what jeep has done with the Wrangler Rubicon: full time LSD/air locker. Now THAT is cool.
  • If Im not mistaken, Rangers use cables for their throttle just like 90% of all other vehicles on the road right now and just like Tacos do now. Sorry if I was wrong and Ford is putting cutting edge drive-by-wire technology in them, but I don't think that's the case. Not trying to cut down the Rangers, it just doesn't seem very "Ford-esque" IMO. Take that how you will. This is just what I heard so it might not come thru, but its one more thing that the Ranger doesn't have. Or are you going to tell me that Rangers do have throttle by wire?
    Oh and I hope you read what smgilles just posted. You must hereby leave the preverbial foot in your mouth for exactly 16 hours. Nice try. How does that feel? And just so I can get a mental picture, what shoe size do you wear?

    Eagle --> a Toyota salesman that frequents the TTORA board gave us the news last week that the additions for 03 would be abs and throttle by wire on v6s.

    Scorpio --> You are right how the Tacomas are catching up in the std. equip. category. I can't wait to hear the new excuses when the Taco gets its new engine. Its liable to get really interesting here in the next 12 months or so.
  • i was just taking what scorpio said as the "general truth" as i consider him the toyota authority here. seems he didn't know this about his own vehicle. now i have doubts what he says about off-roading. made up stories? hmmmm. i could care less about toyota and their abs.

    smgilles- got any proof to back up what you said? im just curious. at least i provided a link. i like how you guys just ignore stuff i post about the jeeps. hilarious how you want to discount them, saying they are terrible off-road and have no ground clearance. and then when i post links that state 10.1 inches of GC and what a bull it is off-road, you have no comment as usual.

    sad- so if what you say is true about the throttle by wire. does that make the taco better? ill take a nice strong cable any day over a little wire. either way, the ranger has more power and torque than any tacoma and is thousands cheaper with more standard features.
  • First of all, with each post you are looking dumber and dumber. Its not a wire vs a big cable. Its not connected to the engine at all. It means that it is totally computer controlled. Much more efficient, and lets the computer control cruise control totally instead of cruise controlling the actual position of the accelerator. LMAO, its clear that you are a domestic loyalist. I guess now you will say that vehicles with computers are less reliable, too? You were the guy who was dogging taco's lack of an mp3 player b/c it showed Yota was behind the times. Keep tryin, though, its good for a laugh.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    Nor has claimed to be. You're making things up again, and then drawing your own conclusions. Made up offroading stories? Fine. If you think they are made up, thats alright. You're not going to see any offroading now anyway, not in that praized Liberty of yours that needs lift to clear 31s. Here comes tbunder, let us begin rock stacking!


    And if you want to read what other Jeep owners think about your Liberty, read here:

    Pirate 4x4 forums

  • I would be afraid to look if I were you, tbunder. LMAO!!! Im gonna have a look see, though.
This discussion has been closed.