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Toyota Tacoma vs. Ford Ranger, Part XII

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Comments

  • Ok, sort of like if I want step bars, I don't have to buy it. Like a Limited Slip, another option you can get. Just like the Locker, but it's an option or available in a package. Different options all available at the factory. But for the mass public, a LSD is more useful than a Locker ever will. Any make gives you the option of purchasing options, hence the name, options.

    I guess a clock in the radio is too much to ask, too. At least in a Ranger you can read the time without moving your head.

    I will agree that the engine and drivetrain options are pretty much the mean and potatoes of any truck purchase, and are the more determining factor in truck purchases. However, you really can't knock other nice amenities being available, like a 6 disc in dash changer. That's just something extra for those interested.

    The other misconstrued point, was that if you want the ultimate off-road vehicle, you're probably not gonna have a very cherry truck when it's time to sell. Off-roading tends to beat up vehicles, especially sheet metal and drivetrain.
  • tbundertbunder Posts: 580
    the hard facts were ignored.

    pluto, your new 3.7 (is that all they can put out) will be killed by the new ranger V8 coming in '03. not to mention the 275 horse I-6 coming in the new colorado.

    again, you're using an article that is at least two years old.

    and now, you're ditching your claim to four-wheeler as being the experts? i mean, they're the ones who say the new dodge is better than the TRD, both tacoma and the mid-size tundra.

    scorpio- we may pay for these standard amenities, but we still get more stuff for less money than toyota offers. everything i stated costs extra on a tacoma. plus, you ever looked at those "bars" toyota offers? looks like something hanging off a hydraulic impala. at least ford builds their own accessories to fit each individual vehicle, and doesn't depend on an aftermarket company to do it for them.

    that power advantage just kills you guys doesn't it? and as far as the lock-right locker? i don't know what you've read, (why would toyota boys have one in their trucks if the stock one is so good) but its rated as the best locker out there for the money. plus, you don't have to worry about switching it on, it releases the axles in a straight line, but locks when needed. and it uses no clutches to wear out. its trick, you should check one out.
  • stang's words:

    "Any make gives you the option of purchasing options, hence the name, options."

    Well, although any make gives you options, only Toyota gives you the options of lockers, superchargers and what's been acclaimed the best off-road suspension, which is what performance enthusiasts want.

    "I guess a clock in the radio is too much to ask, too. At least in a Ranger you can read the time without moving your head."

    The Fords we have at work require you to put the display on either "clock" mode or "radio station" mode. I would rather have the radio always show what station it's tuned into, or whatever CD track it's playing and having a totally separate clock which always shows the time. I get tired of pushing buttons to see what time it is, or what the radio's doing.

    tbunder, do you really think I'm going to take any comparo pitting a Tacoma against a Ram seriously? Since you love that article so much, then why don't you go buy a Ram? And if a Ranger gets a V8, like others have stated, it will probably resemble something like the Dakota more than the current Ranger, putting it into a different class of truck anyway. Also, I would be a little cautious before jumping in and buying a new Ford V8 or the I-6 in the Colorado. History has shown that new engines/platforms, especially from Ford/Chevy, require several years before they are debugged. The 1999 Silverado/Sierra with the much anticipated Vortech engine is a perfect example. To this day, those engines still haven't stopped knocking...

    Oh, and your comment about the power advantage of the Ranger "killing" me doesn't make any sense, unless you're trying to kill me by making me laugh to death. The supercharged Tacoma makes 265 horses and something like 275 lb/ft torque, I believe. And the Toyota 4.7 V8 makes 245 horses and 315 lb/ft torque, which totally outperforms the current Ford 4.6 (231 horses and 292 lb/ft torque). So you better hope Ford doesn't put their 4.6 in the new Ranger because Toyota will still clobber it.

    As for lockers...well, you're probably more up-to-date on that stuff than I am. My truck came with a locker, so I haven't had to research the aftermarket ones, hehehe... Oh, and there's no cluthes to wear out on my locker either. Your LSD with no locker has that problem.

    Have a nice day :-)
  • Hmmm, so they compared a Tacoma to a 1/2 ton V8 Ram...why didn't they include the Ranger? Talk about flattery! Now the automotive world is having to compare Tacomas to full size, 1/2 ton V8 trucks! I love it!

    Obyone used to love to compare Tacomas to his Chevy 2500HD...

    Really, you guys should be more selective on what you decide to post. When you keep comparing Tacomas to the full size 1/2, 3/4 and 1 ton V8 trucks (Lord knows you wouldn't want to compare Tacomas to the compacts - that's been done, and you guys just can't accept the results), all you're doing is speaking highly of Tacomas.

    Yes, I guess Tacomas are worthy of comparisons to the full-sized trucks. But why wasn't the Ranger chosen for these comparisons as well?

    Geesh, I should be WORKING instead of pursuing this nonsense...
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    My problem is: you still get all that stuff. I don't need it in my truck. I don't want it. And I don't want to PAY for it. With Ford, I have to pay for it, adn then I'd have to follow your advise and "pull it out and sell it on Ebay". With Toyota, I buy exactly what I asked for. I have somewhere between 20 and 30 CDs in my truck at all times, and I switch between them at random order, depending upon my desires. So a 6-CD changer would be useless for me.
    Step bars? I've said it again that on a compact truck they are for nothing but showoff. Pozers like them. So do you, apparently. On my last offroad run, I've made up my mind to take off the Westin bar, because it was limiting the entry angle, and I actually did not go somewhere because of that. If anything, I'm going to buy rocksliders, and buy them myself. They cost the same or little less (depending) than step bars, and are much more durable, and would be far more likely to be a "lifesaver" than a chrome stepbar.

    Oh, and by the way: "you are using an article thats at least 2 years old". That doesnt stop obyone from going all out about "98 Toy having a 1 star rating". Thats 4 years old.

    Power advantage doesnt kill me. My truck is probably rated at the same hp as yours now, or very close to it. I'd have to pull the dynoruns from the similar truck to see for sure. Thats without spending $3K.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    Will definitely move the Ranger out of compact truck category. But the word is, Taco is also being redesigned to be larger, so it'll probably no longer be a compact too. We'll have to wait and see, and not make the brave comments about how a V8 ranger will kill Taco with a 3.7L. Lets wait and see, tbunder.
  • eagle63eagle63 Posts: 599
    "we may pay for these standard amenities, but we still get more stuff for less money than toyota offers. everything i stated costs extra on a tacoma. plus, you ever looked at those "bars" toyota offers? looks like something hanging off a hydraulic impala. at least ford builds their own accessories to fit each individual vehicle, and doesn't depend on an aftermarket company to do it for them."

    -Another thing that gets ignored is the recall data. 19 for the ranger vs. 2 for the tacoma over the past 6 years. That's a MAJOR difference. That's like losing the Superbowl 54-3. Maybe instead of spending money on new features and options for their vehicles, Ford should go back to the basics and learn how to build a vehicle that doesn't break....
  • I wonder why companies make aftermarket changers... I mean who wouldn't like the convienence of listening to 6+ hours of music. Unless you buy one hit wonders...

    You may also get more than you want to pay for, but you still pay less than a Tacoma.

    Power advantage. Just because the supercharger is available, not many seem to be on the road. Compare amount of 4.0l's vs supercharged 3.4l's. But I forgot, no Toyota fan likes that comparison because Ford flooded the market and forced all the consumers to buy.

    The power debate is silly. If I wanted to make a hotrod, I could easily install a vortech supercharger for less than the TRD supercharger. If you talk "deck plate" mods, I laugh and say, just remove the intake snorkle on your airbox, or get a K&N filter charger kit or cold air intake. If you wanna talk mods, part for part, Ford has you beat hp/dollar. All you can say is factory warranty, which if that is what you want, why are you trying to make your compact pickup a hotrod?

    Ah... so you need to know that the hard rock station is on by looking at the dial, pluto? This argument is just about as ridiculous as your argument against Ford's unlocking when the person inside opens the handle.

    Well since most truck owners don't need or want lockers or the best off-road suspension, maybe that's why Tacoma undersell? They appeal to a limited market.

    Eagle--->I think it's more of an issue with suppliers, and making sure the new design elements doesn't sacrifice any quality. (I.E. Nassar cost cutting)
  • kg11kg11 Posts: 530
    "Another thing that gets ignored is recall data"
    Aren't you the one who told me my '95 taco didn;t get recalled for head gaskets?I was mistaken about the date.It was '99 not '97.The recall afected 3.4s from '95 thru early '97.If there's no public record of this it makes me wonder WHO is doing the ignoring!
    kip
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    How exactly do you tell that someoen else is driving a charged Taco?
    I can't tell one Ranger from another. Even 4x4 models look like 4x2. So how can you tell whats under the hood? Sure, when you are racing someone and see them disappearing through your windshield, thats one way :), but in non-racing conditions?
    There seems to be enough charged Tacos out there for the market supply to exist. That alone tells that it's not a rarity.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    Havent you read the news? Ford has fired all the troublemakers, and is now proceeding to do it "The Ford way" :)
  • cpousnrcpousnr Posts: 1,611
    Cant tell one Ranger from another?

    Cant tell whats under the hood?


    I assure your, a 4X4 Ranger looks quite a bit different than a 4X4...the grill...about 3 inches higher due to taller lift blocks...bigger tires.


    Except for the Trailhead, or 4X2 Edge.


    But what about the Toyota Pre-Runner?


    Hmmm.


    Your argument is not too good. BTW, I never take anything personal out our your comments.


    BTW Ranger owners, you want power in your engine, here is the primier 4.0 engine builder. "Considered by many Ford V-6 enthusiasts to be one of the worlds' best kept secrets, Vanir Technologies continues to expand the Ford 4.0L "Cologne" 60 degree V-6 performance envelope through dedication, innovation and superior engineering.":


    http://www.vanirtechnologies.com/

  • eagle63eagle63 Posts: 599
    I guess I'm confused by your dates. In your previous post that I replied to, you said it was '97. Now it's '99?? or '95? Toyota's head gasket problems were well known on early to mid '90s engines. But everything I've read suggests that the problem was taken care of by 1995.
  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    to half of the arguments here, especially the one about the Ranger V8. OK, it would be totally cool to have one, but tbunder said they were moving up to mid-size with that addition. To start with, I am not conceding that the new V8 will even beat Toyota's newest powerplant - but comparing the admittedly MID-SIZE new ranger to anything to Toyota's MID-SIZE (as you call it, tbunder)tundra would just be sinful. Do that now - think about how a mid-size 4.6L ranger would stack up to a 4.7L tundra. What comes to mind? I'll tell you - BLOW OUT. I have developed alot of respect for some of you Ford guys, especially tbunder, but if you try to compare the new Ranger to a compact truck with an engine that is a full liter smaller, then you got problems. If Ford does indeed do what you say they are going to do, then it is clear to me that they have admitted defeat and are throwing up a white flag to Toyota. Ford says, "If we can't beat 'em, lets get the he!! out of dodge." If Rangers are so superior to everything else, why leave the class? That seems stupid to me - or maybe cowardly. Like I said, this isn't a stab at the Ford fellas, but this argument that you're using all the time is just WACK. L8r
  • kg11kg11 Posts: 530
    the letter I got from Toyota is dated April 17,1999.The work was done Mar 4.I also thought it was only the earlier 3.0 V6s when I bought my Taco in '95.After 2 trucks with the same problem I still reguard Toyota as top quality.The letter says the head gaskets could fail under heavy loads,but I abused the truck well beyond it's advertised capacity for 4 years before the recall.
    kip
    BTW it still performs flawlesly at 103,191 mi
  • when u are talking about the difference between a deckplate mod and a k and n fipk kit the deckplate has been dynoed by a fellow ttora member of mine to make more power for like let me see here 215 bucks less money.and about the locker i never thought i would need it. but as of right now i have used it 3 times in one month and it has gotten me in some spots i dont think a lot of stock 4x4's could and i am completely stock.
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    Perhaps newer Rangers do. I ran into a 4x4 that was stuck in mud in San Antonio, and I actually had to ask the guy whether it was a 4.0L and 4x4....it was sitting too low, perhaps because of the mud.
    I agree. Prerunner looks exatly like a 4x4. The only way to tell is to check for 4x4 mudflaps, or get up close and see whether it actually says that it's a Prerunner. And of course, they only come in automatic.
    My original comment to "I can't tell one Ranger from another" was to stangs' "How many supercharged Tacos are there?". You can't tell whether a Taco next to you in parking garage has a charger or not. So how can stang tell? Can you tell a new 4.0L engine from an old one just by looking at a Ranger drive by you in town?
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    You talking about Tonka Toy dynoruns? I don't think he had a KnN FIPK. If not, what dynoruns are you referring to? Got a msg. #?
  • tbundertbunder Posts: 580
    pluto, all new ford radios have the frequency and time displayed at all times. you have to go back to the '97 year to have the radio you speak of. again, you're posting mis-information. at least ford doesn't charge you $85 JUST for a clock.

    also, im not the one comparing the full-size ram to the tacoma; four-wheeler magazine is. you know, your favorite? id assume the reason the ranger wasn't invited is because it didn't offer anything significantly new for '02. bottom line is your TRD came in third, in the same shootout it once won. face it, it's getting old and dated. and i notice you didn't address the FX4 issue. tell me, did you ever find one of them? this little shootout also tells me how much ford cares about this type of thing. i mean, they really could care less. they could have sent over an all new F150 FX4 and a Ranger FX4, but all they sent was a regular off-road F150. and it wasn't even an '02 model. they know they're going to sell more trucks than anyone, so why worry too much about it.

    pluto, did you ever buy that supercharger to make your tacoma more powerful than my ranger? i mean, (for only around $3000 installed right?) when someone speaks so highly of it and brags it up like you do, i would think they'd be driving it daily.

    oh, and your torque numbers are incorrect on the f150 4.6. it makes 300 lb/ft. yep, your tundras mighty 4.7 makes more power. what about the 5.4? 6.8? 7.3? oh yeah, the toyota stops at ONE engine in what THEY call full-size needs. and how much can that tundra tow? not as much as f150 can it? so, you're basically shooting yourself in the foot with this argument. what good is more power if it can't tow as much as the engine with less power? and one magazine said that a person would need helper springs if you wanted to do any serious towing with the tundra. thats just downright funny. and you're bragging it up?

    saddaddy- the 4.6 can tow more than the 4.7. how funny is that? yeah, the 4.7 may have a power advantage, but big deal. that much power in a lighter truck with an advantage in towing already will sell me. the rest of your post i dont really understand. who is comparing what to an engine a full liter smaller?

    scorpio- only 4.0 rangers come with the factory step bars and 6 cd changer. also, lsd is an option as well as 5-spd and a/c. what are you talking about? yeah, in '01 you couldn't get a 4.0 with a manual, but now you can. you say you have like 20-30 cd in your truck at all times. me too. you know what's cool though? just pushing the cd select button and moving to the next cd, instead of grabbing the cd case, deciding what one to get, taking both hands off the wheel to get it, ejecting the cd and putting in the new one. having a changer sure is awesome. i truly believe you are dissing them simply because you don't have one, or one would have cost you an arm and a leg. also, bars are just for looks? when one has 31" tires on their truck, they are truly more than "Just for looks". ask my wife. you can't tell the difference in rangers from 4x4 to 4x2? please dude, you're smarter than that aren't you? 4x4 rangers have flares ('cept for flareside beds), 4x4 have torsion bar suspensions, mudflaps, fog-lights, and a considerably higher stance since they come with 30.7 inch tall tires. 4x4's have cv joints coming out of the front axle. this is how i distinguish toyota pre-runners from 4x4's.

    scorpio- any indication is just that. already the 4.6 can tow more than the 4.7, and i highly doubt the new 3.7 will have more power than the tundra's 4.7. so really you could just concede that the ranger's engine will be more capable than this "all new" 3.7. you all have to remember, it's not horsepower that is important in trucks as much as it is torque. that's why the ranger is so awesome now. its very torquey. also the reason it can tow more.

    this whole argument/debate is what this forum is about. i like it. but that sales thingy, just can't be debated can it? nor can the power advantage. i mean, what good is a debate when the only way you can come out with an advantage is by saying "yeah sure,we can have more power, it will just costs us $3000 more than our underpowered stock offerering". to me, having that much power in a compact truck is silly. unless its a low rider. but a 4x4? just puts drivetrain parts under more stress and uses more gas.

    you guys' turn. or is it guyses? hehe

    smile guys, its fun. :o)
  • "oh, and your torque numbers are incorrect on the f150 4.6. it makes 300 lb/ft"

    Just where do you get your information? According to Edmunds, here are the Ford's 4.6 F-150 specs:

    Base Engine Size: 4.6 liters
    Base Engine Type: V8
    Horsepower: 231 hp @ 4750 rpm
    Torque: 293 ft-lbs. @ 3500 rpm

    Here are the Tundra 4.7 V8 specs:

    Base Engine Size: 4.7 liters
    Base Engine Type: V8
    Horsepower: 245 hp @ 4800 rpm
    Torque: 315 ft-lbs. @ 3400 rpm

    "pluto, did you ever buy that supercharger to make your tacoma more powerful than my ranger? i mean, (for only around $3000 installed right?)"

    An installed supercharger on the Tacoma can now be had for MUCH less than $3000. $2000 is more realistic.

    And to answer your question, no, I don't have the supercharger. You've been making me think that $2000 would be more usefully spent on things like CD changers and shiny, cool nerf bars/running boards or whatever you call them. HAHAHA...that was a joke, tbunder. How old are you, BTW? Sorry bud, I'm only in my mid 20s myself, but I've already outgrown the car stereo and "tricking out" my truck scene. Actually, I was never part of it...

    "this whole argument/debate is what this forum is about. i like it. but that sales thingy, just can't be debated can it? nor can the power advantage. i mean, what good is a debate when the only way you can come out with an advantage is by saying `yeah sure,we can have more power, it will just costs us $3000 more than our underpowered stock offerering'."

    This one I REALLY like! Hey Einstein, the Tacoma 3.4 has been more powerful than the Ranger 4.0 for 6 of the past 7 years, and that's WITHOUT the supercharger. Now, the Ford 4.0 has been updated AGAIN and finally has a slight power advantage over the Tacoma. Wow, that's impressive. It took Ford 7 years to make a 4.0 outperform a 3.4! Enjoy your updated 4.0 while you can, because in a year the Toyota 3.7 is going to clobber it...

    Besides power, why don't we talk longevity and smoothness for a second. Toyota drivetrains are some of the longest lasting in the business, and the DOHC Tacoma and Tundra designs are arguably some of the slickest, smoothest and quietest ones out there. The Toyota engines are much more refined than the others. Everybody, including those pesky automotive reviews you hate, has said the Tundra's V8 was very quick and powerful, yet incredibly quiet and smooth.

    You know, tbunder, I have a pretty good memory. Not so long ago, you wanted to buy a Frontier and the fact its engine was some 20 horses weaker or so than everybody else's didn't bother you a bit. Now this 20HP difference between the Tacoma and the new Ranger seems to be of paramount importance to you. You thought your "locker" on your Ranger was the greatest thing since sliced bread, then you were informed you had an LSD, and suddenly you began spouting that lockers were totally worthless. You've stated in the past that you "jump" your truck and haul tons of firewood through the woods, yet your E-bay advertisement claims the truck has never been abused or off-roaded. You seem to exaggerate, post misinformation and lie whenever it suits whatever argument or point you're tying to make on any given day.

    As for the sales numbers...I can't tell you why Toyota doesn't mass produce Tacomas like Ford does Rangers. I don't work for Toyota, and I couldn't care less. What I can tell you is Toyota has no problem selling its Tacomas. They're a hot item and always in demand, which is too bad because that gives the Toyota dealers more leverage against you when it's buying time. If you look at best selling designs, most (if not all) have been on the market for many years, just like the Ranger, Corolla, Camry and VW Bug. The Tacoma hasn't been on the market as long as the Ranger. How that equates to the Ranger being better, I'll leave for you to decide...
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    Yeah, you are so smart, you know about how jealous I am of all that equipment you guys have. You're so smart you have to lie when you sell your truck :). The CD changing process is not a problem for me. When I drive in the city, I just pop a CD in when I am leaving the house. Otherwise, on the freeway, it's not a problem to change CDs.
    What are you talking about "when you have 31" tires". I have 31" tires. Well, I'm not gonna get into the whole arguement about "Yours are 265s, not 31s", but the point is, my truck sits higher than yours as it is. I have no problem.
    Once again: read my previous posts about distinguishing the 4x4 from 4x2. What am I supposed to do when I see some Ranger sitting knee-deep in dirt, and not being able to get out? Drop down and check CV boots?
    And once again: read my previous post. I've given you my story on the sales, and I've given you the story on power. Without having to spend $3K on a charger. So what are you now, selectively ignoring things I say too, just like you've accused us of doing?
  • 2k1trd2k1trd Posts: 301
    Well i have the charger on my 01 Tacoma and the thing rules!...and i drive it every day.I kinda like having two vehicles in one.I have a capable truck do do just about anything i want and when some punk kid thinks he's got a hot rod i can make him think otherwise.It's great fun driving my "sleeper" tacoma around,the look on peoples faces when i go by them is priceless.
  • cpousnrcpousnr Posts: 1,611
    No, cannot tell a 4.0, only on the Mazda with the 3000 or 4000 on the side. There is one marking back by the Ford oval on the talegate that indicates a 3.0 flex fuel, but other than that, nope.

    Can pretty well tell the 4x4 by the 4x4 sticker on the side or gate of the bed, unless they have been removed. Like I said, the grill on the 98-00 I think the years are right.

    I don't know about you but my preference is for a cleaner truck, no badges/dealer names ets. I take them off right away as they will fall off at some point in time, leaving non-faded paint.
  • smgillessmgilles Posts: 252
    My favorite with the S/C has to be the people in theif full size trucks with their "dual exhaust". There are always taken by surprise when they can't get around you.

    Best thing about the S/C. Stay out of it and you gain mpg, but of course you get on it and well you know....
  • Kind of looks like what the offspring of the older VW Transports and the newer Dodge Rams would be like...
  • sc0rpi0sc0rpi0 Posts: 897
    I do like some of the exterior design. The interior, however.....personally, it'd sad to see manual transmission go away. And I definitely don't like all the electronic fail-safe devices that are "replacing" the driving skills (like the lane-shift camera mentioned in that article).
  • saddaddysaddaddy Posts: 566
    It looks like you did understand my last post, as you have gone 3 posts I think without mentioning the Ranger v8. That was my intent. It worked. If you really didn't understand, I just meant that it was pretty low to compare the two who are not even gonna be in the same class (If and when that new engine really does make its way under the Ranger's hood). Also, I raised the question in the other post as to why Ford is taking the Ranger out of the compact class where they lead sales by an ungodly margin. It almost seems that they are tired of trying to outdo the one that is obviously -- awe forget it. Take it EZ guys!
  • Or is Tacoma trying to catch up with Ranger? Ford's not running away, they are just going to deliver what more people want. Size matters(cubic inch engine, interior size, bed size, towing ratings)

    How do you expect both side of this view to meet? Ranger engineers regularly meet with Ranger owners to see what their wants and needs are. That's how the FX4 was born. That's how the Edge package was created. It will still be the compact truck offering from Ford, like the Dakota is from Dodge. If (and when) the v8 appears under a Ranger hood, there will probably still be a v6 or two available, and maybe even a 4 cylinder. It would make sense to be no larger than an Explorer sport trak. Either way, my money is still waiting to see what Ford brings out. Until then, it's quite academic.
  • tbundertbunder Posts: 580
    like i said in an earlier post, no i didn't understand that post of yours. and no it didn't work. because, what else is there to say about a ranger with a V8 that i haven't already said? besides that it will probably tow more than your light-duty "full-size" tundra's lowly tow and payload rated 3.7.
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