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Volkswagen Phaeton



  • monakhmonakh Posts: 16
    Well--I am getting rid of my 2004 E500 and I actually saw a Phaeton on the road for the first time last night.

    Having owned a '99 Jetta--the VW brand left a bad taste in my mouth, but a Phaeton (while not in the same class as the E) seems quite worthy. If they had a competitive 36month lease on it, I would seriously consider it.

    It's a shame there aren't more owners on this thread. The info is good all the same, though.
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,069
    . . .here's a clue: this board hasn't had any postings until now for over 5 days.

    Another clue: day 180 2, new Phaeton's held hostage by local VW dealer. Cars kept out of sight and even when you do pull into the lot there is a Passat sitting in front of the Phaetons which means, at first glance, one might actually see only a slightly longer Passat, unless one was actually seeking the Phaeton out.

    Monthly lease costs now begin with the #5 and this is with almost nothing down.

    Advertising? NONE, ZIP, NADA, ZILCH.

    This is no way to bring a fantastic new car -- that after all, IS a bargain -- to market.

    Did I mention that all maintenance is included?
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    This is the oddest new vehicle introduction I've ever run into.

    Rich, I don't mean to put you on the spot, but can you shed any light on the strategy (or lack thereof, I guess) going on here?

    Sure seems like VW is going out of its way to make sure all of the early predictions of failure will come true.
  • vwguild2vwguild2 Posts: 113
    but, I can tell you the following...International events, including the operations in Iraq, and other Ports of Call...have caused the decline of the $ v. The Euro substantially since product launch planning began in the 4th Quarter of 2002. Then the USD=$1.25 to the Euro...but tonight it is worth $.82. 34%...And has been as much as 44%.
    Imagine that happening to the value of your house...This is the opening hand.

    We are currently gracing the inside cover and first page of THE NEW YORKER, a two page spread in
    the June VANITY FAIR...last month we had the back cover of VANITY FAIR, and again two weeks ago the same buy for THE NEW YORKER...So ad dollars are being spent, just not on TV.

    We are bringing 5 new vehicles in the next 18 months...the first two being a new A5 Jetta and a new B6 Passat...thus, job #1 is depleting current inventories.
  • vwguild2vwguild2 Posts: 113
    PHAETON sales are holding their own with minimum
    support...not bad, in my opinion, and speaks volumes regarding the quality of this automobile.
    Q4 will allow us to shift focus back to this really great car.

    I have 6200 miles on my V8, in service since Dec.7th, and not one glitch, not one rattle, not one squeak. Everything has been plus perfect...same is true with customer cars; all I get are referrals...

    Does the VW Dealer in Cincinnati need to get off
    his a-- and start Marketing the car? It probably would not reap what you sow...
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    "PHAETON sales are holding their own with minimum support...not bad, in my opinion, and speaks volumes regarding the quality of this automobile."

    I have to ask what is the point then? No support for the flaship product? It doesn't make any sense. They're only moving a few hundred a month that hardly says anything when competitors are doing 10xs as many. Why would a dealer spend their money on the car when VW itself isn't doing anything either. The whole Phaeton market situation just seems so hopeless and senseless, even being the great car it is. I wouldn't mention that reap what you sow cliche because VW is the one in trouble right now.

  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,496
    "This is the oddest new vehicle introduction I've ever run into."

    Pat - all due respect, but I think that the VW Passat W8 may still hold the (rather dubious) record in this category - at least in the past 10 years or so. . .

    - Ray
    Ex-W8 owner - despite VW (lack of) marketing support, etc.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    vwguild - sorry, I got you mixed up with another (knowledgeable and helpful) dealer. Thanks for the response.

    Ray - okay, I hear you on that one. :)
  • vwguild2vwguild2 Posts: 113
    I am firmly convinced that there still exists a gross misunderstanding regarding the goals with the PHAETON...

    There was never the itention to sell thousands of these automobiles every month...It is not a big Passat. Target number was 5000 units a year...400~ a month...We will probably do that next year. Again...each PHAETON is built to order. I cannot order from the factory without a name, address, and customer phone #. We can pull from Ports V8s with Standard paint and Standard options. However; there are no 4 Seaters in Port,
    and none with Special paints or leathers.

    Next is basic economics and budget...You can only spend what you have, well that isn't always true but that is what we are doing...New B6 Passats are coming and the new A5 Jetta arrives in 6 months. Inventories of current models MUST be depleted, and right now that is the priority.
    This does not seem, to me, to be a such a difficut concept to grasp...
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    "I am firmly convinced that there still exists a gross misunderstanding regarding the goals with the PHAETON..."

    I'm convinced of that very same thing, but I think it is VW that has the misunderstanding.....of the luxury car market in this country. The car isn't even meeting the 400 units a month goal either. I understand the point of special ordering each unit to make them unique, but still with no marketing support there will be no one to order them. That part about concentrating on Passats and Jettas is an excuse in my book. I could see if the Phaeton was an old product, but it is brand new and doesn't get much support from the marketing department, that simply doesn't make good business sense, and VW isn't a postion to be so wasteful...building such a extravagant car and then not telling anyone about it. I do have a grasp on the concept, but it makes no sense to anyone but VW employes at this point. Don't get me wrong, I love VW/Audi products but the Phaeton is just pointless as a VW.

  • vwguild2vwguild2 Posts: 113
    a view from another angle is needed here...Try going to Autoweek Magazine on line. Click on the tab titled "car news"...5th story down dated June 16th..."Ultra lux segment"...

    Also do a search for "Rechtin", as in Mark Rechtin...You will discover a May 5th Story about Toyota/Lexus plans to do a $100,000 automobile...
  • vwguild2vwguild2 Posts: 113
    here of late...?????
  • scottphillipscottphillip Posts: 249
    Any special 24mo leases on the V8 or W12? Would those be national?
    Are all the dealers going to sell/service the Phaeton?

  • vwguild2vwguild2 Posts: 113
    are National, but not all Dealers are PHAETON Dealers...You will need to go, then go to "Dealer Locator", put in your Zip Code and radius of miles that will travel and click on PHAETON Dealers...Done...

    24 Month Lease...65%/15K, 67%/12K, 68%/10K
  • fish8fish8 Posts: 2,282
    If you could induldge me: I am picking up my new '04 Passat GLS tomorrow morning. They are giving me a price of $21,900 for a GLS automatic. Does that sound like a good price? I currently own a VW. Also, what are your thoughts on Leatherette?
  • vwguild2vwguild2 Posts: 113
    The least expensive INVOICE that I have on a Passat GLS is $23,465.00; so I had would say that they are treating you very well...

    Leatherette, today, is great...Same look/no maintenance...Think MBTex for Mercedes.
  • ffb13ffb13 Posts: 181
    well, after a few months looking and getting a lexus for my wife ,over the phaeton ,and returning the lexus because it so boring even with the sports susp.,took a small loss on it but very small .bought it right.

    i kept looking and again test rode the phaeton,---i really wanted this car.--after much difficulty in dealing with vw dealers in the miami area.........but,the problem with dealers in the miami area applies to all makes,not only vw.---i decided to try elsewhere,and because i also live in the fairfield county --connecticut area,i tried here and it is a pleasure to deal with local dealers versus miami. but,
    the problem with the phaeton kept creeping back-----lousy handling--too much understeer......lack of feedback,but great interior,radio.
    lousy navigation system
    and,lousy computer controls.

    i then drove an infinity fx 35----------SOLD.
    it drives like a sports car yet you sit high.
    excellent navigation controls and all comp. controls great.
    radio poor compared to vv,bmw mb and acura.

    and it is in a way a luxury car.

    the greatest thing ,the direct feeling of the steering/suspension.and the handling vis a vis the steering input.

    this is what vw should have built into the phaeton.the connection between driver and car/ a great luxury car.

    the beemer has lost it here.and so has mb.
    even the new bmw 530 with the active steering is not that good or should i say direct.

    ---( also,i tried the new beemer 6 series and it was o.k. not great . lovely. but no spare tire of any kind.
    only run flat tires---which only a few places can handle. here in fairfield county connecticut,only 4 tire dealers can handle these tires .blow one on a trip and get ready to wait it out in a local motel.--)

    no ,the toureg is not that good .unless you go off the road.then is one of the best out there.

    so,guys,i wish vw the best......but they have failed to build a great car.....they could have.
    if you travel to germany and talk to a dealer there you will hear a repeat of the above.
    the phaeton has it almost right.......but there is that 2/10 th missing......
  • vwguild2vwguild2 Posts: 113
    found an automobile that you are comfortable the end of the day, that is all that matters...We live in Consumer Heaven...No matter what our preferences...there is a car that fits the bill.

    The only comment that I can make comes back to this issue of steering. "Servotronic", "Active
    Steering", whatever the name, are appreciated or rejected on pure subjective reaction. These things are not good or bad; they just are, and you like them or dislike them. The same can be said for the NAV in the PHAETON.

    I sold a V8 PHAETON today to a gentleman whose
    first question was about the steering and staying in a lane...after about 90 seconds at 120MPH that objection went away. Next came the NAV..."It doesn't show the street names on the map"...I said, no, the street names are there in front of you on the center screen...They are there so you don't have to take your eyes off of the road...SOLD. After all is said and done the entire purpose of a NAV is to find your way when you don't know where the hell you are...Your only concern is to get to the address that is your destination...The PHAETON NAV system shows you the street that you are on and where to turn next...What else would anyone want to know or see? And...You are not required to look 120 degrees away from the roadway.

    And finally...Dealers, whether in New York or Berlin, would love nothing better than for people to walk in and say "this car is perfect, I cannot find anything that exceeds it's capabilities on any plane...I will pay you whatever you want for this superb product".

    Nothing is perfect across the board for all
    consumers...That is what makes a market...
  • sam818sam818 Posts: 127
    Quote: "The PHAETON NAV system shows you the street that you are on and where to turn next...What else would anyone want to know or see?"

    WELL: Like George Bush, no matter how many times you say it, it doesn't make it "right": One of the primary purposes of a NAV system is to use it as a general reference in an area with which you have familiarity, but are nor sure exactly where to turn.
    Your assumption is that everyone takes the time to enter a destination and use it as a definitive navigation system. Most people don't have the time to enter a destination. They know the approximate location, and then make occasional references to the map (with street names) to check progress. Even VW seems to agree and the forthcoming update bears witness to this.
  • tariktarik Posts: 344
    I sold a V8 PHAETON today to a gentleman whose
    first question was about the steering and staying in a lane...after about 90 seconds at 120MPH that objection went away

    You mean, like it would after trying that in any German luxury car?
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