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Inconsiderate Drivers (share your stories, etc.)

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  • andres3andres3 CAPosts: 5,341
    edited May 2013
    Interesting experience doing the "out LLC a LLC technique" to force them to move right.

    I would say 33% of the time they get it right away when you get in front and start slowing down gradually, and move right.

    I would say another 33% might get back in the left as soon as you speed off after they move right, you must repeat, half will make you do it a 3rd time.

    Out of the remaining 1/3, half of them will get extremely pissed. I find this to be the most satisfying as LLC's don't like to be out LLC'd. You are just giving them a taste of their own medicine. I'm shocked, as I see no need for middle fingers, racing you up to 100 MPH to try and re-pass you on the right. The other half are just stubborn and I find myself going down to 43-45 MPH (very gradually; no braking) for about 20-30 seconds and they just continued to follow imitating my slow speed in the fast lane. After 20 seconds I dare not go any slower than about 45 MPH for long, so I sped back up and left them in the dust and exhaust of my vehicle.

    Making them move right quickly is a great service that benefits all and is for the greater good (although you have to waste a few seconds of your own time).

    If it takes 3 or more tries or slowing down ridiculously before they move over then you probably have both done more harm than good to the greater population of traffic behind you. AFterall, out LLCing a LLC requires the act of LLC, which does increase congestion and traffic.

    I do find it extremely hilarious that someone would be willing to race up to 90+ MPH on a 65 zone because they are being impeded a bit in their left lane, when they weren't willing to even go a smidge above 60 -65 MPH with someone behind them clearly trying to get ahead, (and someone else going .01 MPH slower than them on the right).

    I felt like slowing that guy going 40-45 behind me to 40, then 35, then 25, then 15 if I had to, but I'm afraid he'd of stayed behind me short of me stopping on the freeway. I felt that might be a tad dangerous even for me, although even more dangerous for him!
  • hammerheadhammerhead Posts: 889
    Easy. Right lane clear? Double check. Then take it. Move briskly on by, leaving trouble behind :)
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,271
    >Easy. Right lane clear? Double check. Then take it. Move briskly on by, leaving trouble behind :blush:

    Good post. Exactly right. If the LLCer is wrongly using the left lane when they could move to the right into another lane and if the state laws there require same, then why try to pick a fight. Just move on along by passing on the right in one or more clear lanes.

    Aggressive driving is the problem. Adding aggression even more doesn't fix anything. Consideration and sharing the road is the answer.
  • andres3andres3 CAPosts: 5,341
    edited May 2013
    Not trying to pick a fight, just gently reminding the LLC that they shouldn't be in the left lane, capped with an exclamation mark of full throttle acceleration as soon as they move right.

    This actually facilitates the flow of traffic as the congestion building up behind the LLC is then able to flow freely through once they move right. It is the good Samaritan move to do!

    Picking a fight would be cutting off the LLC and slamming on the brakes in front of them.
  • gogogodzillagogogodzilla MarylandPosts: 701
    And?

    That doesn't negate the "Keep Right Except to Pass" law.

    You don't get to pick and choose.
  • gogogodzillagogogodzilla MarylandPosts: 701
    It would be better if the people wanting to speed and yet point fingers at others would just take care of their driving and not try to enforce the lane laws.

    That happens with lane discipline.

    LLCers are the embodiment of those who would try and take care of other's driving.
  • gogogodzillagogogodzilla MarylandPosts: 701
    Indeed. Odd that speeders who are often tailgaters and aggressive drivers project their own imposition of will into the idea that it's others trying to control them.

    Tailgaters cannot force one to speed. LLCers force others to slow down.

    I mean, when someone tailgates you, there is no one in your car pushing your gas pedal down, making you accelerate.

    Whereas, should someone ignore an LLCer, a collision quickly appears on the road.
  • gogogodzillagogogodzilla MarylandPosts: 701
    However, they do intend to "make" everyone else clear "their" lane.


    If you are passing, you can use the left lane. If you are not, you cannot.

    That is the law.

    If the right lane is clear... why are *YOU* in the left?
  • gogogodzillagogogodzilla MarylandPosts: 701
    edited May 2013
    Also, "sharing the road" means both moving around the slowpokes without aggression, and for the slowpokes to know their place and move over. It needs to be a two way street.

    I would say that in most situations, most slowpokes (ie: not keeping up with the flow of traffic) are simply oblivious to their surroundings. They are too busy talking on their cell phones/texting/eating dinner/reading a newspaper/etc.

    The only way to get them to pay attention to the road is to create situations that actually require attention. For when they pay attention, their driving changes to meet the circumstances.

    Case in point: There are far too many people in my neck of the woods that will camp in one's blind spot, oblivious to this fact. Yet, when I will turn on my blinker, looking as if I might move into their lane (this is a head game, I'm not actually changing lanes)... they'll suddenly move out of my blind spot and freeing up space to allow traffic to pass freely.

    All from creating a situation that forces one to pay attention to the driving situation.
  • ronsteveronsteve Posts: 435
    Case in point: There are far too many people in my neck of the woods that will camp in one's blind spot, oblivious to this fact. Yet, when I will turn on my blinker, looking as if I might move into their lane (this is a head game, I'm not actually changing lanes)... they'll suddenly move out of my blind spot and freeing up space to allow traffic to pass freely.

    Of course, this goes out the window when you actually NEED to change lanes, because then a signal typically causes the BSC to speed up just enough to box you in.
  • andres3andres3 CAPosts: 5,341
    They do say in driving 101 that it is advisable to speed up a bit when changing lanes. Find the next open spot ahead and speed up into it.

    I've never understood people's need to stop traffic in one lane simply so they can change lanes.
  • ronsteveronsteve Posts: 435
    They do say in driving 101 that it is advisable to speed up a bit when changing lanes. Find the next open spot ahead and speed up into it.

    I've never understood people's need to stop traffic in one lane simply so they can change lanes.


    You missed my point. I was referring to the situation of someone camped in your blind spot. That assumes similar speeds. Sometimes it's a matter of needing to move left to pass a slower car... ability to speed up is a bit limited there. And there have been times when the BSC/LLC will speed up to disallow the lane change, but not complete the pass.

    I try to keep moving at a consistent speed as much as traffic conditions allow. But too often people take that as an affront, and feel the need to race for the open spot.
  • andres3andres3 CAPosts: 5,341
    I hereby condemn BSC. I think BSC and LLC are 1,000 X more dangerous than even the speeders in the top 1%.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 33,820
    edited May 2013
    Easy drive to work this morning, other than an idiot with no lights (streelights still on).

    The drive home, not so nice. Started off with a woman in an Odyssey trying to turn left out of a parking lot, onto a busy street, where she wanted the far right turn lane (across 4 lanes). She couldn't do it cleanly, so she just pulled out and blocked a couple lanes. Then got behind an Outback merging onto a highway - I stayed right as I was exiting immediately, Outback merges left at the typical 43mph, I move by on the right, Subiedouche leans over and gives me the finger :confuse: ...typical passive-aggressive faux outdoorsman. Not long after, several cars ahead saw a rental T&C make a right turn from the left lane, onto a street I'd also be choosing. I scoot by on the left going about 45 in a 40, he was going maybe 25 (seriously) But by the time I was a few seconds past, he had sped up and was pacing me at about 50, genius. He later dropped back again and vanished. Also saw an older woman in a MDX following way too far behind traffic, being passed on the right, and a tiny girl in a Versa who required a honk to get moving on green.

    Then while on foot, encountered a newbie looking crosswalk crowder woman in a Maxima, phone yapping light running airhead in a big late model Suburban, smarmy greybeard crosswalk crowder light runner in an SL55, and a texting Jetta driving princess who only moved on green when I yelled and motioned at her from the sidewalk.

    It sure is good licenses are so easy to get/buy.
  • xrunner2xrunner2 Posts: 3,062
    edited May 2013
    Started off with a woman in an Odyssey trying to turn left out of a parking lot, onto a busy street, where she wanted the far right turn lane (across 4 lanes). She couldn't do it cleanly, so she just pulled out and blocked a couple lanes.

    Yeah, well that is an ordinary woman driver of an Ody. Too bad you can't be in our area. Most Mercedes Bens drivers would be left far behind by my wife driving one of her vehicles, an Ody. What I see in Mercedes cars is mostly "seasoned" citizen drivers, and, sometimes blocking the road.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 33,820
    edited May 2013
    MBs tend to have more conservative/"experienced" drivers and driving styles than other highlines, esp. BMW/Audi/Infiniti, which in my area seem to attract the intentionally jerky. I am still not convinced that BMWs come standard with turn signals, nor anything that aids in parking.

    I remember several years ago on I5, seeing a late model S-class in the middle-left lane, going about 20 under the flow of traffic. Little old man driving.
  • ronsteveronsteve Posts: 435
    MBs tend to have more conservative/"experienced" drivers and driving styles than other highlines, esp. BMW/Audi/Infiniti, which in my area seem to attract the intentionally jerky. I am still not convinced that BMWs come standard with turn signals, nor anything that aids in parking.

    The worst ones I have seen (going strictly anecdotally, and maybe it's skewed because if you see a brand rarely enough, it only takes a couple to make you think they all drive that way) have been Audis.

    Although the last two people that came really close to killing me were in a Chrysler 300 and a Cadillac.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 33,820
    edited May 2013
    If you watch Top Gear, no doubt you have seen Clarkson pine about Audi replacing BMW for drivers with a certain panache. It's not untrue.

    Funny that yesterday's commute was torture, today's was a breeze - no real complaints at all. On foot, no crosswalk crowders, but did seem to notice a lot of phone yappers - once again most likely to be in large (and more dangerous to others) vehicles.
  • andres3andres3 CAPosts: 5,341
    In a change from talking about the inconsiderate, I thought I'd mention the cars that were driven by the best and most considerate drivers outside of an Audi club member driving event.

    1. Toyota Corolla Sport model on a curvy windy road coming back from Julian towards San Diego. Upper middle almost old aged man kept up an EXCELLENT pace considering his vehicle for a fun weekend twisty run.

    2. BMW 3 Series on a road going up towards Julian from San Diego. I think it might have been a lady and she kept a very good pace on a fun twisty road.

    3. Lotus - Had to go almost all out to keep up with this guy, fun times on the best back roads near Palomar Mountain in Southern California.

    4. Driver over a decade ago in a Mustang that moved forward and over a bit when he realized traffic was coming to a stop for no reason on the freeway and the guy behind him might have taken his eyes off the road for a second or two overtaxing his '03 Accord's meager brakes. The extra car space worked wonders to avoid a minor fender bender.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 33,820
    Considerate drivers - hmmm...I am happy when someone simply wakes up and moves into an empty right lane when I come up behind them. Not unusual, really.

    Nothing really bad on the drive today, but was annoyed by an airhead in a Lexus RX who slowed way down a block before her turn, and then turned at ~3mph. Also saw a woman in a 2010+ S-class, going around a blind corner, fast, wobbly, no visible signal, leaned over into the passenger seat - maybe she spilled her Starbucks. And I want to ride a motorcycle around these simps?
  • jjackson12jjackson12 Posts: 36
    Not trying to pick a fight, just gently reminding the LLC that they shouldn't be in the left lane, capped with an exclamation mark of full throttle acceleration as soon as they move right.

    You could also try flashing your high beams a couple of hundred times.

    That will teach them a lesson.
  • gogogodzillagogogodzilla MarylandPosts: 701
    The lack of repercussions is precisely why so many drive so poorly.

    I favor cattle-catchers mounted on the front of cars; that way, should someone not recognize the 'slower traffic keep right' ideal... one can simply ram the offending driver off the road (given an appropriate warning, such as a flash of the high-beams, and time to respond).

    You'd quickly see the errant behavior end, as there would actually *BE* repercussions for doing so. Much in the same way that speeders are pulled over by police, ticketed, and points assessed on their record.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 33,820
    A small car-to-car missile or some kind of EMP probe would do the job, too.

    I was out today, got behind a couple of women in an early 00s STS - so slow. I had to honk to get them to exceed 20. Going downhill, would hit the brakes when they got within 5 of the limit. Would tap the brakes everytime an oncoming car passed by. And the driver didn't even appear to be very old, nor a newbie. Finally turned - signaled two blocks beforehand before rounding the corner at 4mph. Seriously. Why are people like this?
  • andres3andres3 CAPosts: 5,341
    edited May 2013
    Finally turned - signaled two blocks beforehand before rounding the corner at 4mph. Seriously. Why are people like this?

    Well, you can start by firing their driving instructor, and firing their DMV driver's license tester.

    Their trainer should have taught them better, and the driver's license test should fail such shenanigans.

    Speaking of which, doesn't the DMW usually only require teenagers to spend just 6 hours driving with an instructor in the vehicle? If your an adult suddenly learning how to drive correctly is no longer important and zero hours are required I believe. All you have to do is get lucky and make 25 good guesses on a multiple choice exam, and avoid breaking any obvious laws during a 5 minute drive around the block.
  • hammerheadhammerhead Posts: 889
    I have 2 kids in Driver's Ed now. 6 hours of instructed drive included in the course, but they must also have a minimum of 50 hours of practice driving (documented by parents) before they qualify for the drive test for their license. Drive tests are now administered by the driving schools, not the DOL. Pass the class, pass the drive test, get your hours in, take all the paperwork to DOL & smile for the camera.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 33,820
    edited May 2013
    Yeah, here the testing is privatized - which is probably more efficient, but I bet opens the door for potential shenanigans - ie: spend enough, get a license. I suspect it won't help conditions on the road.

    And that's right, IIRC at 18, one can simply pass the written and 15 minute driving test, and that's it - you're free to drive an Accent or a Veyron or a 42ft behemoth motorhome. It at least needs to be as difficult as getting a motorcycle endorsement. Those are also privatized now, but from the motorcycle instructors I have met, they won't just pass someone for the hell of it.
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 40,862
    edited May 2013
    Kids here always seem to flunk at least the first test and often the second, and often for no rhyme or reason.

    That costs the family another $100 to retest, most of which goes in the tester's pocket. Quite the scam and it really hurts the family when you live in a place where there's no good jobs.

    My neighbor is retired DMV; back in his day he'd ask the parents if their kid could drive (everybody knows everybody). If Dad say yes, the kid would get the license - no test. :)

    Moderator
    Need help navigating? stever@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 6,578
    edited May 2013
    Drive tests are now administered by the driving schools, not the DOL. Pass the class, pass the drive test, get your hours in, take all the paperwork to DOL & smile for the camera.

    I've mentioned this before, but I sent my son to the two day teen school at the BMW Performance Center as well as to the BMW CCA Foundation's one day Street Survival course(which let him experience how his own car handled in extreme situations). The Street Survival course is a huge bargain at just $75.

    Kids here always seem to flunk at least the first test and often the second, and often for no rhyme or reason.

    My son flunked the first time because he bumped one of the cones in the parallel parking test. That's totally understandable; hundreds of kids die every year while attempting that dangerous procedure...

    2009 328i / 2004 X3 2.5/ 1995 318ti Club Sport/ 1975 2002A/ 2007 Mazdaspeed 3/ 1999 Wrangler/ 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica

  • slorenzenslorenzen Posts: 306
    "hundreds of kids die every year while attempting that dangerous procedure... "

    You owe me a keyboard...mine has coffee on it now...
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,271
    edited May 2013
    Construction zone: I was at an unfamiliar ramp onto an overpass on a major back highway where they built an overpass instead of the ground level stoplight intersection with US Route 40. They have a stop sign on a ramp at a 90 degree turn that's on the uphill part of the overpass. Apparently they didn't want to buy more land to build a real ramp.

    I looked, gauged the oncoming Honda to be far enough away in a 45 mph construction zone and accelerated. But not full throttle which would have wound rapidly through my lower 2 gears and had me moving.

    I didn't realize that the uphill slope would cut my acceleration along with the AC compressor that was on low volume. So the oncoming Element had to slow down for me as I was doing about 40 by the time he caught up to me. I didn't accelerate full throttle at first underestimating the slope AND I didn't accelerate at first enough to cut off the AC with the throttle position.

    The Element tailgated me at 5 feet behind up over the top of the overpass and down the other side at 45 mph. The speed limit of the road was 50 in that area normally. If I'd been in my 98 leSabre, I might have had to brake for a dog or cat on the road, but I'm not ready to trade this 03 leSabre.

    So I was the inconsiderate boob who didn't just wait. But I decided I was no longer the problem and the tailgating Element was the problem. Of course he zoomed around me since I was only doing 50 in the high semi traffic zone at the I-70 service area. The driver was doing nothing to mitigate the effects of my driving error.

    You really don't want to tailgate someone with the company name on the doors of your company vehicle. Maybe he thought gray hair meant I wouldn't be able to see the sign. But I've spent lots of money from me and Mediscare getting new eyes last summer. I called his company asking what this guy's problem was other than I slowed him down by about 10 seconds in his arrival to the I-70 ramp to Columbus from London. I admonished the manager about how that kind of driving appears to the general public and how I really would like to have a replacement car for my 98 leSabre and I wished I had been driving it. I believe I also mentioned road rage as an adjective for the 5-foot tailgating.

    I was inconsiderate. I am a recovering inconsiderate driver. This is the first step of the 12-step process. :)
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