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Ford Freestyle - Taurus X

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Comments

  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,786
    "My '05 FS FWD can get close to 30mpg on the highway if I keep the speed at 65mph, and I average in the low 20s with mixed driving...what are you expecting to get with the hybrids you're looking at and do you think it's worth all the money you'll lose when you trade in the FS for the new vehicle?"

    My FS was an in-town vehicle. It got about 18.5 in town if I was REALLY careful. Under similar conditions (but not as much trouble to achieve), I get 31 MPG with my FEH. That is a 60% increase in fuel efficiency. And keep in mind that my FEH is AWD, while my FS was FWD, and that the 2008 T-Rex will probably NOT get as good of MPG as my CVT FS. I also generally got 22 MPG on a mixed tank with the FS.

    I have always been impressed with the FS at highway speeds. My own experience is of 75-80 MPH with 25.5 MPG. At highway speeds the difference is less, but I suspect my FEH would get over 30 MPG in similar circumstances. FWIW, I find that my FEH is quieter than the FS at highway speeds.

    If I had needed the 7 passenger seating & etc. I would have stayed with the FS. However, I'm glad I switched. I suspect that gas is going to get far past $5.00 per gallon soon; I have heard predictions of $150 / barrel of oil by 2010, and possibly $200 / barrel by 2013. The developing nations are increasing their use far more rapidly than we are reducing our use!

    In my case, the payments were very close, so it wasn't an additional financial burden.
  • bobw3bobw3 Posts: 2,997
    It just seems like to me that there are lots of 5 passenger non-hybrid vehicles out there that get good MPG...unless you need a small SUV? Once you get of the 3 row vehicles, there are lots of options. Are other car is a Honda Fit that holds 4 adults plus a lot of stuff for such a small car.
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,786
    "It just seems like to me that there are lots of 5 passenger non-hybrid vehicles out there that get good MPG...unless you need a small SUV?"

    Take a look at the city MPG of the SUVs. It may surprise you. In actual use I doubt that most of them would get over 20-21 in town, if you check the forums for "real-world MPG" of each model. I'm currently getting 31 MPG, though I expect that to decline in cold weather.

    I do like the smaller SUV, just because it is easier to maneuver & etc.
  • passat_2002passat_2002 Posts: 468
    Good grief.. enough already. A transmission with gears has to shift gears in order to operate. A CVT transmission with no gears to shift cannot shift anything. Instead.. a CVT varies the drivetrain ratio in an infinitely variable fashion by moving a stainless steel belt between two conical cylinders. There is no shifting going on. By definition.. it cannot shift.
  • steverstever YooperlandPosts: 39,940
    Good grief.. enough already.

    All this time we had a Freestyle CVT discussion buried at the bottom of the topic list. :blush:

    So, most of the recent CVT posts have been moved over there; apologies if this thread seems a bit disjointed now, but at least we can get back to other X issues.

    Here's the link:

    stevedebi, "Ford Freestyle Taurus X CVT Transmissions" #54, 22 Apr 2008 4:52 pm

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    Need help navigating? stever@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • bprassbprass Posts: 1
    Ford brings many nice models with great accessories... but still most people go for Japanese cars.

    If Ford wants to attract people buy this lovely vehicle, they should introduce a Hybrid version, Hybrid+Deisel version will be great!

    Is there a way to pass this message to Ford people?
  • barnstormer64barnstormer64 Posts: 1,106
    Hybrid+Deisel version will be great!

    Have you priced diesel lately? ;)
  • larryqwlarryqw Posts: 52
    I would say Hybrid + Ford's new EcoBoost is even better, and that combination will likely happen anyway in the next couple years as EcoBoost permeates the Ford line. EcoBoost has a 25% fuel efficiency improvement like that of Diesel, using the same direct fuel injection into the cylinder, but adding a turbo charger providing a very nice flat torque curve across all RPM. And it can use gas or ethanol.

    As for the Taurus X, I love it and bought one. But I think it's on the way out next year, with Ford neglecting to even advertise it. It will be replaced by the Flex coming now, and the new car-like Explorer America, that's due in about a year.
  • peetertpeetert Posts: 124
    After much deliberation (still some to go) we have decided to upgrade to a Taurus X or Freestyle. I've got a few questions that I hope can be answered here.

    The dealership we're working with doesn't currently have anything we're interested in, but is willing to do a dealer exchange for a new TX, or find a used TX or FS at auction based on our specs. This will be our 3rd Ford from the same saleman (new dealership). Currently we're considering the Used TX option, but want to see if the incentives on new get any better this month. We're not in a rush to buy, but the longer we wait, the less variety we'll have to choose from.

    Below is a pro/con list I've come up with and invite any comments /additions. Further below are questions regarding options we're trying to finalize.

    New
    pro - it's new,
    cons - more $$, quickly depreciates

    Used TX
    Pro - Cheaper, can get CPO to bring warranty out further
    Cons - Used and most of the current used mrk is former rentals

    Used FS
    Pros - even cheaper, slightly better gas mileage
    Cons - not as peppy as TX, CVT(?)

    Finally, we're REALLY undecided as to the 2nd row configuration. While the bucket seats are convenient for access to the 3rd row, they limit the car to 6 people. We tested all three configurations ( bench and buckets w/ & w/o console) and the kids had no problems with any of them. Please let me know which you chose and why.

    Thanks,

    Peeter
  • cmunizcmuniz Posts: 604
    Having had an 05 Freestyle and currently driving an 08 TX, both "Limited" , I think the TX is a better car. I liked the CVT, but it is a unique transmission for Ford that is no longer being used so future maintenance might be a problem. I like the 6 speed on the TX almost as well. The TX has better power and I like the power lift gate. The 3.5 engine and 6 speed trans is found on several Ford models so I think future maintenance support will be a lot better. As for configuration, your family needs and desires should drive that decision.
  • larryqwlarryqw Posts: 52
    The Taurus X has a big advantage in the more modern electronics such as SYNC, Navigation, and the rear Family Entertainment System.

    However, if you don't want these, the FS has an advantage in price and fuel economy. OTOH, many people have trouble finding anyone to repair the CVT, even if it's covered by warranty.

    A used TX may be fine, even as a former rental, if you get enough warranty. We bought my wife's Freestar minivan that way with a bumper-to-bumper 100K warranty, with the car at only 15K miles. The warranty lists like $3K, but you can bargain them down to well under $1500, especially by quoting web sources that sell the same Ford warranty for that. Overall, the Freestar at a year old was about 60% of new, even adding the warranty.

    The bench seats in the second row are nicer for the console and comfort. But if you need 7 passengers, get the bench.

    In my case, I got the bucket seats and console. My kids prefer the third row, where they can sit up high because of command seating. However, the little rascals don't always bother with the flip seats and often just jump like monkeys over the second row seats, folded down or not. They have lots of room in front of them to look around. Like the back of the bus when you were a kid. For bigger people the bucket seats in the second row are indeed nicer. Each can recline independently and there's a console and cup holders, etc.
  • I've never driven the Tx - but I'm very pleased with our 2005 Fwd FS. We leave the 40 portion of the 40/60 2nd seat down and the kids (9 & 7) step in no problem. We also have a 2 year-old who sits in the anchored seat directly behind the driver.

    I like that the 3rd row on the FS are vinyl. Spilled the chocolate milk? No worries.

    I like the CVT and view it as an enabling technology for the future - which I believe to be electric engines. We live in a VERY hilly/mountainous area and that played into my desire for the CVT. I do a lot of biking and wish I had a CVT on my bike.

    I think the improved fuel economy of the 3.0 w/CVT is worth it. There's plenty of power there. On fuel, the Fwd FS is competitive with anything out there that hauls 7 - beats most actually. 10% improvement is a lot at $4/gallon.
  • bobw3bobw3 Posts: 2,997
    I have an '05 FS FWD with 62,000 miles and I agree with you. The CVT is smoother than auto transmission and you can use the cruise on hilly and even mountain areas on the highways and the CVT will gradually increase/decrease RPMS as needed, versus the hard up and downshifts of an auto.

    And I've had 29mpg on highway trips if I keep the speed between 65-70mph. I have a 2500 mile road trip coming up this fall and I'm going to keep the speed at the posted speed limits to see if I can break 30mpg. Around town I get 20-23mpg consistently and it's rare that it ever goes below 20mpg.

    Personally I'd never buy the TX because the added HP and reduced MPG aren't worth it to me. Plus the price is too high in comparison to other vehicles. When I bought my FS, it cost me $25K and there wasn't much competition out there back in '05 for a 3 row vehicle that could hold adults in all rows with this MPG and price.

    I plan on keeping my FS for many more years (no major problems so far), but if I was in the market, I'd look at a Mazda5 on the small end or a Honda Odyssey at the large end. You can get a well-equipped Odyssey for the same price as a TX and get more space and better mpg with the Odyssey. There are a lot of full-sized crossovers out there, but if I'm going to spend $30K then I'd rather get a minivan with better MPG and more space.
  • amckenz1amckenz1 Posts: 2
    Did you ever find a solution for this? The same thing is happening to me. A very audible clicking sound that comes from somewhere behind the glovebox. When I start the car in the morning it clicks about 5 times and then stops. It happens after I start the car later in the day, but not all the time (more than 10% though).
  • amckenz1amckenz1 Posts: 2
    I have an '05 FWD Ford Freestyle. When I start hte car in the morning I hear a very audible clicking noise that seems to originate somewhere behind the glovebox area. It clicks about 5-6 times and then stops as I slowly accelerate. If I start the car later in the day, it's not guaranteed that it will happen, but probably does 30-40% of the time.
    Has anyone one else encountered this or know where it's coming from?
    Any help/direction would be much appreciated

    Thanks!
  • elibrunoelibruno Posts: 16
    had this same noise and Ford dealer quickly diagnosed and fixed it under warrantee - it is some type of A/C machinery part that Countryside Ford of Clearwater told me is common, not dangerous and easy to replace part. So discuss it with your service dept and tell them where I got quick resolution!
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Posts: 877
    Should current Freestyle owners be upset about this? Ford found a way to get more power and fuel economy out of the 1995-vintage Duratec V6 design. I have an '05 Freestyle with 203 HP and 18/25 EPA rating (new rating method here), and the '09 Ford Escape is getting a 240 HP version of the same engine that is said to get 1 MPG more. Since the basic engine design goes all the way back to the early 90's, why couldn't Ford have "discovered" the way to make this engine more powerful and slightly more fuel efficient just 4 years earlier, in time to take away the critics of the Freestyle who say 203 HP is just not enough.

    I wonder if Ford will allow me to trade my 203 HP 3.0L Duratec for the new 240 HP one? Should bolt right in. A little extra power with more fuel economy is always welcome.

    Also, why not drop the 240 HP 3.0L Duratec in to the Taurus & TaurusX for more fuel economy with gas at $4 per gallon? That would give the Ford Edge the more powerful, newer 3.5L Duratec for some differentiation with the TaurusX at least, making the Edge the "sporty" one and the TaurusX the more serious utility model. Ford would still have the larger Flex with the newer/bigger V6; more differentiation there for the luxury crossover. Ford, are you listening to my wise opinion? ;-)
  • ronsmith38ronsmith38 Posts: 228
    Who knows, maybe the only difference is a new chip!
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,786
    " I have an '05 Freestyle with 203 HP and 18/25 EPA rating (new rating method here), and the '09 Ford Escape is getting a 240 HP version of the same engine that is said to get 1 MPG more."

    I think ford has added a version of VVT to the new engine, that technology wasn't available until this year for the 3.0.

    Also, note that the Escape is 600 lbs (at least) lighter than the FS, and the engine might not yield the same 1 MPG advantage in your FS.

    Any "engine swap" would also have to modify the CPU code so that the transmission and engine were matched correctly.
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Posts: 877
    Replying to the last post, remember that the variable valve timing version of the venerable 3.0L Duratec was available in Jaguars and Lincoln LSs since about 2002, and even the lower-cost 2006 Fusion had the VVT version of the Duratec V6.

    I got some more info on what Ford did to evolve the 3.0L Duratec for the '09 Escape from Motor Trend: new intake and exhaust manifold shapes, new fuel injectors, higher compression ratio ( I think from 10.0 to 10.3), new heads, variable valve timing, and revised valve cams. Those changes would have been great just a little earlier. Ford could not find the budget to do this over the period from 1994 to 2007 to the Duratec 3.0L V6 while it was being put into everything on the planet. Now other V6s are taking over where it used to be, while the 3.0L V6 finds its way into fewer and fewer applications. Maybe it will make a comeback as fuel efficiency gets priority. Fusions and Escapes still get it, although Taurus no longer has it.
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