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Corvettes and all things about them

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  • ultraman19ultraman19 Posts: 24
    As the 2004 Z16 being a collectable or worth more, the dealers have told me 2424 have been made, however the Corvette Quarterly said 1800.

     Will I had an added value in a Z16 over the other special badged 2004?
     You have probably noticed that every year, year in and year out,Dave Hill, etc. talks about the vast new improvement for the upcoming year. AND as likely as not, the improvement are barely noticed by the public. In fact, in real world use many folks wouldn't know anything was improved if they were not told.

     Could the Z16, because of it's power and race breeding become a "collectable"? You really have to drive a Z06 to understand the real world hp-torque, awesome exhaust sound and of course
    extreme cockpit noise. It is a rush!!
  • starrow68starrow68 Posts: 1,142
    Had to decide recently on C6 early on or later and the wife needed a ride. Got a deep discount C5, 51.5 MSRP and 39.4k out the door, taxes still to be paid. Actually seen the price drop 2k since I ordered, it was ordered in April and they increased discount in May and then added loyalty discount in June when we take delivery. Given how nice the C5 is I can't imagine I'm going to wish I got the C6 for her early and paid $12k+ more for that 50 hp. Now Z06 is different timing, not going to be out for a year and don't know the pricing on Z51 Coupe in C6 which should be close on performance to Z06 C5, but again can't see $10k + extra at this point. To some 1st on the block counts, to me, best deal on the block is what provides personal satisfaction and I'm not sure I care what the crowd thinks. Anyway, by ordering at end of model she got exactly what she wanted, color, options, etc., lot to be said for satisfaction. YMMV

       As to Z16 being collectible, read back about a page of posts, most here doubt it.
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,758
    I would tend toward a 2004 Z06 instead of the new C6 Z06. The deals that you can make will be far better (I have heard up to 10-12k off MSRP). As for whether or not certain models are collectible, remains for a future market to determine. I am not holding my breath, even though I have a "RARE" :)(1/5773) 2001 Z06 speedway white,(1/352) with red and black interior (1/137).
  • gbjerkegbjerke Posts: 158
    WOW, you do have a rare one, especially with the mod red interior.
    I think white looks awesome in the Z06 and could never quite understand why Chevy only put it out in '01.
    It certainly is rare and I suspect has a greater value than a regular Z06. Not to someone "looking for an '01 Z", but rather someone who recognizes that color combo would be virtually impossible to find.
    Enjoy the car...and hang on to it!
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,758
    Thank you! I really love this car! :)
  • ultraman19ultraman19 Posts: 24
    I have a deal on the table for a inbound 2004 Comm. Ed.Z06 for under $47,000 delivered. Kerbeck has the same for $45,335 but by the time I paid to have it shipped the cost is a little under $47,000, which my local dealer is matching dollar for dollar.
    A very good deal? The salesperson said I will kick myself in a month when the new ones are available. But they will cost $10-12K more.Will the C6 be that much better of a car? If I wait will I see deeper discounts?

    Reality: At my age, I will probably only own one more new Vette--

    I appreciate all views, opinions,guidance and
    mentoring!
     
     Thanks, Ultraman 19
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,758
    Which ever one that you finally decide, the best investment would be a driving school; such as, Bragg Smith etc., if you plan to drive it anywhere in the vicinity of 9/10s of the capacity of the vehicle! :)
  • gbjerkegbjerke Posts: 158
    Boy, you really are between a rock and a hard place. I don't remember the upcharge for the Z16 but think it was in the area of 5k? Sticker must be 58k? If so, that's a pretty good discount but I'm not so sure that if you offer your local what Kerbeck will sell for they would probably take it.
    You can play hardball here.
    Will the C6 be that much better than the C5?? Too early to tell but the C6 will not out perform the Z06---close, but no cigar.
    C6's will likely command sticker or sticker+ out the chute. C5's sure did when they hit in '97.
    A year from now, the '05 C6's will have some deep discounts.
    It all goes back to "instant gratification" and what you are willing to pay for it.
    I shop hard for cars and am waiting for the C6 Z06 to hit the ground...I'll have one, just depends on when. Sticker+ next summer or wait 6 months and get the discounts.
    I try to "screw every screw" when buying but must admit, the older I get (63) the more I lean to some of that "instant gratification".
    Don't think I helped much here....go with your gut reaction...you will enjoy it no matter what!
    Don't even think of looking back.
    Keep us posted on your decision.
  • ultraman19ultraman19 Posts: 24
    The list is $58k, I could play harder for the bottom line, but I have bought five new vettes from them and they have always treated me with respect and kindness. It would cost me that much from Kerbeck and I would rather give it to a local(state)dealership. The relationship and history with them is important to me.

    I appreciate all advice etc.,The car will not be on the ground until this weekend and I choose at that time. Please keep the comments coming.
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,758
    I think you have a six of one half doz of the other scenario. My real close local Chevy dealer's wouldn't even budge off MSRP and gave a clear indication they wanted above MSRP, but that was almost 5 years ago. So I went to a higher mile radius dealer and was going to try the out of staters! So if I understand what you are saying, I think I would also tend to go with the local and the 5 time repeat dealership!
  • avolvofanavolvofan Posts: 358
    If you have a good relationship with the local dealer, it would even be worth a premium over an out-of-state deal. If you have any problems with the car, the local dealer is going to be the first place for resolution of the problems. Having the 5x repeat business gets you to the front of the line in credibility with all of the dealer staff (sales through to service). Further, Lemon Law coverage is usually based on where the first retail delivery occurred.

    I had a similar experience when I purchased my coupe in 2003. When I placed the order in December, 2002, the local dealers were asking and getting MSRP for non-Z06s ($2,500 over MSRP for Z06s). As a result of the considerable business that I had done with other dealers in the group that the dealer is a member of, I was able to get a significant discount.

    Warranty service is another area where a prior relationship pays dividends. This past March, I had a problem with the transmission. I dropped the car off on a weekend. On Monday, the service manager called me to let me know that he had assigned their top mechanic to fix the problem. By Friday, the car was fixed and when I picked it up, it had been freshly washed and vacuumed.

    To net it out, I have a relationship/reputation with the group of dealers - they give me their best price and I give them the service business on the cars. They in turn put their best people on any problems that need to be fixed. If you have a similar relationship with your local dealer (it sounds like you do), that relationship is worth keeping as the dealer can make or break the ownership experience.
  • starrow68starrow68 Posts: 1,142
    Sounds like after extra cost for out of state you have a wash deal so staying with the local is a win / win for you and them. I had never been able to get to that point with the dealers around here so I'm going out of state again. Good luck and to me the most important thing is getting exactly what you want, not what is left on the lot. Enjoy the ride!
       We are set to pick up the wife's new Vette in early July and are already booked on the lake in Yellowstone on the way back. I think that combination will be worth the extra effort to get it home.
  • ultraman19ultraman19 Posts: 24
    I get the distinct impression that you all have more knowledge and experience that I have. I just don't want to ruin a possibilty to leverage a position to purchase a 2006 Z06. If I sink most of my $$$$ into a 2004 Z06,and it takes a steep devaluation for trade-in or resale purposes then
    a 2006 Z06 will not happen. You all would not believe that I make a living as a crisis consultant( USA and Europe) where quick and sound decisions can be a matter of life or death--and I stress,ponder, rationalize, yin/yang and vaciliate over C5 or C6.Deep Discounts on Corvettes can make you crazy.
     Please continue to share, this weekend is Decision Weekend!

     Thanks, Guys---Ultraman19
  • gbjerkegbjerke Posts: 158
    We all go thru these crisis' when it comes to cars or other "toys".
    Sure, the C5 Z06 will take a hit depreciationwise. How much is questionable right now...depends on the sticker of the C6 Z06. If they tag the new one near 60k, then the '04 will remain an attractive buy for those looking. If GM mid 50's it and it comes with 500+hp and 3000# then the C5's will get hit harder. Remember also, the C6 Z06 will command sticker+ when it comes out next summer so figure spring of '06 before you see some good discounts on the '05.
    Sorry I can't be more help...whatever you do, DON'T LOOK BACK and enjoy whatever you get!
  • starrow68starrow68 Posts: 1,142
    My almost 3 year old Coupe was a deal at $45k and my wife's has $2k more in options, price increases for 2 model years and it goes out the door at $39k. Vettemag.com price guide, which they did acknowledge some problems with, says a 2002 Z06 was going for $39k to $43k last year. What you're paying is bottom dollar and should hold for some time since the replacement is going to be a C6 Z51 coupe for the next year, which only places on the web are going to sell at MSRP. All the local dealers are going to be trying to get premiums from the early adopters. That's sure to be over $50k and more like $52k and up.
       The current Z06 had about a $7k premium from a coupe so that puts the new one very close to $60k and I'm guessing more, early on. Enjoy the ride for a couple years, at that price the value will hold to some extent.
       BTW, I've got just a couple years info on you and never looked at a Vette before the one I bought in 2001. No expert here, just like to think I'm observant of the market.
  • avolvofanavolvofan Posts: 358
    It would seem that you have a really good deal on the table - good price, good local dealer, and good car. Honestly, unless you are planning on autocrossing your car, I doubt you will see a significant difference performance-wise between the Z06 and whatever the C6 equivalent (Z07?) will be. It is not as if the Z06 suffers from some sort of handicap. You might have to wait 2 - 3 years (or more) before you get the level of deal that you are presently looking at on the 2004 that you are considering. If you are concerned about depreciation - don't buy a car. Very rarely do they appreciate. If you are looking for a great performing car (fastest production car made by GM) that will put a smile on your face every time you drive it, then now would seem to be the time to take the plunge.
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,758
    A bit off topic, but a pretty well known Corvette writer/enthusiast, who probably is in the know about coming models changes improvements etc., just recently bought a z16 Corvette Z06 2004.
  • ultraman19ultraman19 Posts: 24
    The car will be on the ground tomorrow afternoon and ready for delivery late Sat.or
    early Monday. You guys have been a wonderful help in giving me perspective and the benefit of your expertise.
     Thank you and please share any further ideas and guidance. I promise I will pass on your advice and feel grateful for your interest in someone you don't even know. The "Corvette Family" is special.

     Ultraman 19
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,758
    WOW! This seemingly is getting pretty real for you. While I am sure the dealership in which you are planning to deal with knows Vettes, take extra care in looking at the undercarriage. My sense is that at 3.5 in clearance, it is probably one of the lower to more probably lowest of the 5 previous ones you have had. I am looking forward on this thread to hearing the 411 on your experiences!
  • avolvofanavolvofan Posts: 358
    And the amazing thing is that there are owners out there that lower their car even further from the standard setting. What I have found is that the skids on the front undercarriage get the most damage (unless you go over parking lot speed bumps - in which case, the frame gets whacked.... I have installed the following wheels:

    http://www.westcoastcorvette.com/shop_online/prod_detail.cfm?id=5- 13

    The wheels are very handy - more so if you have bad (dippy) roads.
  • starrow68starrow68 Posts: 1,142
    You are right about the Corvette Family being special. I started from scratch myself and I've picked up tons from the web, local club, and friends/co-workers that I didn't really know until we found out that both of us owned Vettes. Local clubs come in all different flavors so it helps to look around. I like to track my car and our local club didn't seem to have anyone interested. Now a year later six of the locals have been out on track and a couple of the old hands who used to do it are getting the bug to go out again since there are some newby's to lend a hand to. There are then many who like to shine and show on weekends, those who like to tour, both local and national, and always a few who go to the drags and autocross.
  • ezraponezrapon Posts: 348
    just bought a 2001 c-5 convertible with 4000 miles on it. The car was owned by an old guy and never has been in the rain. I considered the impending c-6, but how fast do you need to go, and it's just not a vette with out pop-up lights. This same car in c-6 form would probably be very close to 60 K. My wife says it is a mid life thing, but I'd have to live to be over a hundred for that to be true... another gray-beard has joined the ranks. Already bought the cags setup and I'll slip that on at the 1st oil change, no use getting under that rascal twice. Anyway... I'm considering an add on XM radio (have it on our Denali and love it), anybody explored this yet? They say the antenae can be installed on the dash and the head unit in place of the ashtray. Former vettes; 74 L88, 85 4+3 speed, and 2 c-4's. This is the 1st c-5 and the 1st rag top. I'll not lose any sleep with the new c-6 hitting the ground!
  • starrow68starrow68 Posts: 1,142
    Interested to hear what real world values are getting to in round numbers if you wish to share. Was it fully optioned, HUD and which suspension? That was a real find with very low miles, hard to figure how someone could only put on just over 1k miles per year. That said, I see the same in CA as well and never cease to wonder, I have trouble keeping it down to 10k per year. The Corvette is not what I consider a car with a long option list but the options can add up to about $7k to base sticker which is always a surprise. That's why I wonder about general price guides like in Vettemag.com but it does help on older cars. Oh, what color and top, just remember is picture is worth ...
  • ezraponezrapon Posts: 348
    very lightly optioned. Group 1. No HUD or select ride. Does have the 1200 wheel up grade, mats and cd changer...and the 6 speed. I guess money dictates the amount of miles you put on. If you got lots of it, you probably have several other rides to divide up the miles. (I guess if you have a LOT of money, you're not driving a 2001 vette)I have an old 98 Park Ave that will still see most of the miles. I'm a teacher so its only on the road 9 months anyway. With the nasty weather here in St. Louis, winter provides a good reason to put it away for a while. I still don't know what I really paid for it. They wanted 37,000. I gave them my 04 G-35 and 5k. numbers can say anything you want them to say. I quote it one way to my skeptical wife, and another to my friends. Had it not been for the impending C-6, it would be a justified investment. At night, with the top down on a country twisty, any amount of money seems irrelevant... therapy for the soul. I just ran out the tank of 87 octane the dealer provided and have filled it with 93 Mobil @ $1.89... I'm expecting better performance this time around, although, it ran great on the 87. Something to keep in mind should gas approach 2.00 again.
    My option list was about 4500. I had HUD on my old SSEi. It was neat but could be forgotten. I'd like to see heated seats, garage door opener, XM radio, on star ...all stuff on my wife's Denali. Maybe one of those stratolounger chairs that lifts old people out of the seat would be nice too. Black over silver/black interior.
  • ultraman19ultraman19 Posts: 24
    The two'04 Z06-Z16's are on the ground with plastic on the seats--I have my choice of either one AND I have offer to pay $45,479(Kerbecks price). The dealer will accept or reject by noon tomorrow. Logic says he will take it, but he's a gunslinger and he might counter -- if not I will jump at the deal.

       Comments?

       Thanks,
       Ultraman19
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,758
    Welcome back to the fold! :)
  • bigmike5bigmike5 Posts: 960
    Do you know if the C5 can take mudflaps? Are they out there as a GM accessory? I have always put them on my new cars and I wondered if they can go on an 04 Coupe?
  • Great thread. Used the BMW 3 series one 2 years ago to help decide on taking European delivery.

    Now ready to trade up to the Vette and need help. I got a price on an '04 convertible in torch Red with no options from a local dealer. MSRP $51,535, Net price of $46,535.

    From earlier postings I've seen discounts of up to $10K and wonder if I'm not getting the best price possible. With the 2005 coming shortly, I think this would be my best opportunity.
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