Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

1453454456458459575

Comments

  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,111
    But you havent driven it or seen the sales numbers- do I'm sticking with my comment unless its a proven sales giant as the Lexus- I drove the old rdx and the golf based vw Tiguan- and the vw was a better small ute - in every way
  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,963
    Why would you say I haven't driven it? How the H would you know? I've driven both so I think I can offer a decent comparison. . I've talked with a few salesman about it and also have frequented several forums. You're right, I haven't seen the sales numbers, that's why I said it was premature for someone to label it "dominant". Do you even read posts completely?
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,111
    edited June 2012
    "while I've never driven the new rdx" - tHis is what you put in bold- so I was assuming it was your comment - but when I re-read the comment I guess you were quoting me - next time I would quote me. For you to say you've talking to salesmen about a car they sell is like me talking to a priest - they are trying to sell you something.

    I hope the car does well- but it's got a long way to go before becoming a serious player-

    The Ellps category has expanded overnight
  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,963
    edited June 2012
    In many forums here on Edmunds people copy and paste and then bold to indicate a quote. This is one of the few I don't see it much. If this is about the only forum you frequent I can see how you mistook my quote from you. I know the salesman very well and believe what he says. He also told me the ILX was not doing well at all and may not even be around after a couple of years. He's pretty upfront and little BS, retired state trooper whom I've known for some time.

    It will be interesting to see what Acura keeps the TSX or ILX or both. I think if they put the 2.4L in the base ILX it would probably sell pretty well. As it is, it is underpowered for luxury or near-luxury model.
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 14,294
    I was at the acura dealer Saturday looking at the RDX, and on the way out (walking next to sales guy) I glanced at the sticker on the ILX on the floor (not actually bad looking, but yes, it screamed economy car to me!_ and it was ~32k. Not sure which model, but it had an AT so not the hot rod version.

    I commented "expensive Civic" and he looked pained, and mumbles something about there were lots of changes to the platform, but he didn't really sound too enthusiastic about it!

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (when daughter lets me see it), 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again), and new Jetta SE (son's first new car on his own dime!)

  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,963
    edited June 2012
    Yeah, the base platform is the same but everything else is different. Suspension, drivetrain, body, interior....pretty much everything. People that say it's just a upgraded Civic really haven't looked at the car or specs carefully. The 2.0 puts out like 150hp which is just not competitive. The car, IMO, is actually pretty nice looking and has a nice interior befitting of an Acura, not the crap that is the Civic interior with all apologies to Civic owners. It's just weak. If they upgrade to the base to a 2.4L later on it may be attractive. People expect some grunt with their luxury. It still could be competitive MPG wise with 200hp I think.
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 14,294
    so a gussied up civic for 32k? Tough price range to compete in.

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (when daughter lets me see it), 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again), and new Jetta SE (son's first new car on his own dime!)

  • ivan_99ivan_99 Posts: 1,665
    People that say it's just a upgraded Civic really haven't looked at the car or specs carefully

    I recall in early 2002 I had purchased a new 2003 G35. I had a nail in my tire that I was getting fixed.

    The tire guys were all around the car and one guy said "wow, that's cool"...then the other guy said "Its just the same as the Altima".

    :surprise:
  • graphicguygraphicguy SW OhioPosts: 7,147
    I'm a Honda fan. My son is driving an Accord approaching 100k miles that has been perfect. I loved my TL SH AWD.

    That said, Honda has lost its way a bit. They used to set the bar with all of their products....with sterlingengineering, build quality, value, performance, reliability, etc.

    Like Toyota, they've slipped. However, instead of just being excellent at whatever they do, now they're merely very good.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    I agree Graphicguy.

    It's the "what have you done for me lately" syndrome combined with the fact that the Europeans have made big strides while Acura has been resting on their laurels.

    The current Acura lineup is good, but Acura should not be satisfied with just good.

    Acura needs a good entry-level car (like the aforementioned ILX with 2.4L), a sporty RWD/AWD mid-level car (like a "TLX" with 3.5L) and a large top of the line RWD/AWD sedan like the RLX.

    Acura needs to stop marketing a line of "luxury cars" based on a FWD Honda platform. Period.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,602
    Acura is selling the living H out of the new RDX.

    Please point me to the data that proves this, I have only seen one on the road, and it was in Phoenix. So far haven't seen in NY (Lawn Guyland), but so see the new CR-V (in borh cities.) One would assume if they are selling the hell out of them, I would be seeing them on the roads in Phoenix and in NY, so far this isn't the case.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,602
    Ivan, the problem the ILX will have is it is based off the Civic, Place an upgraded interior in it which is fine, but if you park a Civic and ILX next to each other you will see the similarities. If one is going to spend (cough) 32K for a ILX, it better not look like a 18K Honda Civic.

    Acura built the ILX to get the Gen X'er into their brand, but for 32K one can buy a CPO 328i and have a much better brand identity and better warranty. The ILX's price needs to be less then 30K for a top of the line if they want to be competitive with other sport/luxury brands.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,602
    Acura needs to stop marketing a line of "luxury cars" based on a FWD Honda platform. Period.

    It works for Lexus, why not Acura? RX/Highlander, ES/Camry, GX/4 Runner. LX/Land Cruiser.

    Now the GS isn't based on anything that Toyota sells here in the states, however, if you look at the new Toyota Avalon that will go on sale in a couple of months, there are lots of lines that are very similar. Granted the GS is RWD and the Avalon is FWD.

    Is it the dealership experience that sets apart Lexus and Acura? Or is it the way Lexus cars drive overall and people are willing to pay more for a Lexus then a Toyota version?
  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,963
    edited June 2012
    I have been actively looking at the RDX and driving it at several dealers. I've had to wait because the only one they had left was out being test driven. I have a guy I trust that sells Acura he tells me they are selling like crazy. I've stopped in several Chicago area Acura dealers and have yet to see all the colors because they have been selling them very quickly. My guy also says the ILX is not doing well so far but I guess he wouldn't know anything about that either. I think he bases his comments on first hand experience and customer interest versus how many he has seen on the road.

    You ask for sales data? Well, they have been on the lots for about a month give or take a few days. Just what sort of internet type data do you expect me to provide you with at this point in time. I just don't think any real data has been gathered yet. So until then, you'll just have to not believe me and wait!. Cr-Vs by the way have been out for over 8 months so I would expect you to see them.

    There is also the case where you might have seen them and didn't realize it. They now look like a slightly smaller version of the MDX and from a distance it is very hard to tell the difference. You really have to look at the lower grill in front and the exhaust pipes in back to tell the difference. Just walking around the new car lots it's a little difficult picking them out until you really zero in on the tailpipes or front facia.

    I remember when the new Focus first came out. I knew from everything I read that they were selling like crazy but it was a long time before I started noticing them on the road.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,602
    M6 no one is doubting what the sale's persons are saying, however, when you make a claim as you did, some data would be nice to look into. Regarding the lack of RDX's on the lot could mean two things, 1, yes, they are selling very well, or 2, Acura isn't shipping many of them at this time. So there is an illusion of them selling well.

    A quick check of a Acura dealer in Phoenix, has 13 RDX's, one happens to be a 2012.
    A quick check of a Acura dealer on Long Island (7 miles from me) has 35 2013 RDX's.

    Maybe the Chicago area likes the new RDX, but in Long Island so far they do not...
  • ctlctl Posts: 123
    edited June 2012
    easy to google.

    3301 RDX were sold for May 2012, 8183 YTD May 2012 Acura

    10647, 35376 YTD for Lexus RX. May 2012 Toyota/Lexus

    Just to compare, 2,678 for the new Infiniti JX May 2012 Infiniti
  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,963
    edited June 2012
    Thanks. Is that 2013 RDX or a combo of 2012 and 2013? I have found inventory online to be optimistic after getting to the dealer to look at the twenty they are supposed to have in stock and they end up having 8. Don't know who keeps up the internet inventories but they are way behind sales it appears.
  • laura80laura80 Posts: 3
    :confuse: what type of oil for a 89 bmw 750 il
  • laura80laura80 Posts: 3
    what type of oil for 89 bmw750il
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,111
    edited June 2012
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    "It works for Lexus, why not Acura?"

    Short answer - because Lexus has the IS, GS, and LS RWD sedans.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,671
    Go compare the sales of the IS, GS and LS to the ES and RX then tell me how important RWD is to Lexus.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    edited June 2012
    The RX is their biggest seller, but it's not the topic of this discussion.

    2012 IS and GS sales are very strong.

    But FWIW, I wasn't talking about sales. Going by sales figures, you might believe that the Dodge Caliber is a world beater... :lemon:
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,602
    The IS and GS are based off JDM Toyota's, the only non Toyota is the LS then.
    So if Lexus can make a go of it, Acura should also.

    I believe it has to be more with dealer experience then anything. Acura set the bar as far as the luxury car brands from Japan, however, Lexus has taken it to the next level. Infiniti almost closed up shop here because they did not explain what kind of car company it was, having ads with babbling brook, and streams wasn't tell Americans what kind of cars they built. Lexus wanted to be the #1 luxury brand in America they succeed until the Germans got their composure back and took it over again.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 10,850
    That's really not a good question for this particular discussion, since we focus on a variety of vehicles rather than the BMW 7-Series. I think your best bet is to go to our answers section here:
    http://answers.edmunds.com
    Once you've posted a question, you can find it again by clicking the "my answers profile" link on that page.

    MODERATOR
    Need help navigating? kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    Share your vehicle reviews

  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,963
    edited June 2012
    This is something posted on cars.com today regarding the Acura RDX. I know it's still a little off topic but wanted to provide the info requested.

    "The compact crossover just went on sale amid a major marketing campaign. May 2012 sales were nearly triple what they were in May 2011 at 3,301 units. That's more than the BMW X3 (2,460), Audi Q5 (2,332), Mercedes-Benz GLK-Class (2,133), Volvo XC60 (1,751) and Land Rover Range Rover Evoque (706). Only Cadillac's SRX did better with 3,900 units sold in May."

    I've read that both the new X3 and the Q5 are pretty popular. So the RDX beating them handily now versus, I assume being beat by them last year, would indicate that Acura is selling a bunch even if you haven't seen any.
  • graphicguygraphicguy SW OhioPosts: 7,147
    fed....we're on the same page. Acura has let the RL become an afterthought. I know whenever I went into my local dealership for service, if they had one RL to sell, I was surprised. They just didn't market them. On the other hand, what was there to market? The TL had everything the RL had, at a much lower price. While a bit of a stretch, it was almost like GM putting some baubles on a Cavalier and calling it a Cadillac.

    That said, it seems like Acura has gone out of its way to be "different" for difference's sake. I liked that with my TL. But, Civic vs ILS isn't going to win them any converts. Plus, the TL is now their flagship, for all intents and purposes.

    I believe they try to split the difference between the German lux marques and the American lux brands. Acuras are sportier than Lexus, but not as soorty as a BMW or Audi. Lexus has carved their own niche (which they're desperately trying to expand from with the "F" versions of their mundane cars.

    That said, you'd be hard pressed to find a more reliable, relatively inexpensive to operate, tech filled vehicle than an Acura.

    M6.....quite frankly, I've yet to hear any car sales person say that business was bad....at least not to a potential customer. I usually hear them say that every car they are trying to sell is "in short supply".

    It's that whole "buy it now while it's hot" syndrome. ;)
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,602
    M6,

    it appears that Acura has a excellent lease rates, and 0.9% Financing right now, so this could also be why it is selling very well. It does look like a smaller version of the MDX, which BTW, is Acura top seller. I'm sure once the hype is done and the intro lease special is over with sales will settle down.

    The ILX doesn't look like has taken off, even though the lease price is about the same as the top end Civic.
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 14,294
    Those deals are for the outgoing 2012 model. The new 2013 doesn't have the subsidized leases, etc.

    as to the ILX, FWIW, by son (just turning 21, and just finished his Junior year at college) texted me last night that "he just saw a commercial for the ilx and it looked pretty snazzy".

    so just maybe there is hope to pull in a younger generation, and his dream is to get a BMW before I do!

    Of course, once he sees the price of a nicely equipped model, the fever will probably cool quickly.

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (when daughter lets me see it), 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again), and new Jetta SE (son's first new car on his own dime!)

Sign In or Register to comment.