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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

1499500502504505840

Comments

  • dan12dan12 Posts: 114
    (But I still cannot fathom iDrive)

    Personally, I like it. I find it useful and intuitive. I also have regular buttons for the most frequently used functions but I find myself using iDrive for everything except vents and A/C. I can only talk about the 3-series iDrive which is supposed to be simpler than the 5 and 7 series. I haven't tried the more complicated systems, but the 3 is quite nice.
  • Hi Mark,

    I can agree on some of your points and disagree on others. First, I do think the CTS is a member of the 5 series competitor club with the exception of the non-availability of V8 power. It has just about everything else. There are a few options sometimes found in this group (lane change avoidance) that are still only available on the STS, probably to keep some product seperation while that model goes on its long march to oblivion.

    And regarding Infiniti, ah yes, they do upset the ol' product line apple cart, don't they? The M35 is on the large size of the class, mostly in terms of length (one of the reasons I liked it...it's always been on my short list). The G35 is supposed to be the BMW 3 series competitor, but in terms of size, it's the "tweener car" that the old CTS was. The G35 is a small midsize car that's on the small size of the 5-series class in terms of length and about and inch and change shorter in wheelbase. The width is narrower, much like the old CTS. As a result, it's playing in that "I can be a 3 series competitor and give you more room" role that the old CTS was doing. As a result, it's simular engine power but smaller mass gives it a small advantage to the new CTS but still nips the heels of the smaller BMW.

    Given your previous posts, I know AWD is a bigger priority for you up in Ohio versus for me down in Tennessee. And that's fine by me. The G35 AWD will probably pull a more sporting performance that the CTS AWD given a likely 400-500 lb weight advantage. The CTS gives the driver more interior room (especially leg room) which is a bigger priority for me (top priority really).
  • A reporter from a national newspaper is hoping to talk to consumers who have been shopping for a European vehicle (BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Volkswagen, Audi or others) and have found them to be more expensive because of the Euro exchange rates. Please reply to ctalati@edmunds.com no later than Monday, October 1, 2007 with your daytime contact info.

    Karen-Edmunds Community Manager

  • Isn't the writer assuming their story's angle is correct then? If the writer is only seeking buyers who think the price is too high based on euro exchange rates, then the writer's looking only for people who will support the story's thesis. Bad way to write an article.
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    A reporter from a national newspaper is hoping to talk to consumers who have been shopping for a European vehicle (BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Volkswagen, Audi or others) and have found them to be more expensive because of the Euro exchange rates.

    What does the exchange rate have to do with an American consumer paying US dollars in the US for these European vehicles? As far as I know, the European automakers haven't raised their US MSRP's due to the declining dollar. Those European manufacturers stand to make less money, having to convert their US sales to Euros when they repatriotize the funds. But until they start raising MSRP's. the US buyer could care less what the Euro exchange rate is.

    And, by the way, the dollar has also dropped substantially against the Yen.
  • circlewcirclew Posts: 8,244
    That CTS is sure looking cheap to everyone in Europe and Asia. Too bad the import duties would raise a US car over the cost of domestic purchase of a home grown variant over there.

    Regards,
    OW
  • texasestexases Posts: 5,423
    I sat next to a guy from Australia, showed him the CTS and its price, he said it'd be $80k (Aus$, about $70k US) if it sold over there. Ouch!
  • circlewcirclew Posts: 8,244
    Wow! "Made in the US" means big $$$ to the importer! What a rip!

    Regards,
    OW
  • texasestexases Posts: 5,423
    I think it's also the duties/taxes/etc., too. BMWs are also much higher there.
  • louisweilouiswei Posts: 3,717
    Just for chuckles, in Taiwan...

    330i: NT$2,520K = $77,538 USD (They don't have 335i sedan over there)
    IS250: NT$1,960K = $60,307 USD (No IS350 over there)
    G35: NT$1,920K = $59,076 USD
    '07 CTS: NT$2,280K = $70,153 USD
    C300: NT$2,430K = $74,769 USD (No C350 over there)
    A4 1.8T = NT$1,679 = $51,661 USD (No 2.0T and 3.2 over there)

    All prices are including tax.

    Guys, we got it good here...
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Posts: 5,751
    How many G35s would be sold in the US for $59K? :blush
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    Interesting Taiwanese prices, Louiswie - but you know I have to ask - how much for a 911S?? ;)
  • louisweilouiswei Posts: 3,717
    Ferrari 612 Scaglietti 5.7: NT$ 15.3M = $470,769 USD
    Porsche 911: NT$ 5.38M = $165,538 USD
    Porsche 911S: NT$ 6.08M = $187,076 USD
    Porsche 911 Turbo: NT$ 9.08M = $279,384 USD
    Porsche BoxterS: NT$ 3.98M = $122,461 USD
  • circlewcirclew Posts: 8,244
    GULP!

    I love the US!!

    Regards,
    OW
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    Thanks. Guess I better wax my $200,000 911S Cab this weekend. While drinking a few $1 Yuenglings.
  • My A4 2.0T lease is up. Current deal was $1100 down with $409/month AT for 24 months. Looking at the same thing, Infinity G35, or Luxus IS250. Any strong opinions on which is the best car and if I can get a similar deal on the Lexus & Infinity?

    Here is the offer I received on another A4.

    2008 Audi A4
    Model # 8EC5EH 4dr Sdn CVT 2.0T FrontTrak
    PX - PREMIUM PKG -inc: leather seating surfaces, 17" x 7.5" 5-spoke cast alloy wheels, P235/45HR17 all-season tires
    PT1 - BLUETOOTH PHONE PREP
    36 month lease – 12,000 miles per year
    $ 2,122.00--> Total Amount due at Signing of Lease
    - 750.00 – Audi Loyalty Bonus
    = $1,372.00 – Total Amount due at signing of lease.
    35 monthly payments of $404.24

    $ 32,800.00 --> Manufacturers Suggested Retail Price - 1,887.00 --> Discount
    = $ 30,913.00 --> Capitalized Cost
    - 713.96 --> capitalized cost reduction
    = $ 30,199.04 --> Total Net Capitalized Cost
    $ 19,024.00 --> Residual value at end of month
    .00128 --> Money factor
  • laurasdadalaurasdada Posts: 2,480
    Wax? Don't you mean Zaino???

    Sorry, I have a Zaino problem (Z-7 & Z-6 into the dark of a Friday night. Thinking of Z-2 first thing in the morning...). But winter doth approach, ending my season of Zainoing.

    '13 Jaguar XF, '11 BMW 535xi, '02 Lexus RX300

  • you're approaching your leases wrong. You should negotiate the price of the car and find out the MF and residual at another dealer. Never take the deal in the paper. Always negotiate the price of the car and call another dealer to get the Audi lease rates. You can save thousands this way.
  • I have found faults with the new CTS. For the most part, these faults would not rule the new CTS out. The thing is, to my eye, beautiful and seemingly well made (fit and finish wise, at least.)

    I think it is an STS killer and if that does come true, it will probably enter the LPS class. It is, at this moment in time, still a "near" LPS contestant. NOT because I say so, heck it is virtually in the class now by most "measurable" accounts (content wise.)

    It is not the most modern, it breaks very little new ground (if any) in the ELLPS or LPS class -- other than its styling. When compared with the LPS class it comes out as a bargain, when compared with the class "the pundits" place it in, however, it is about 15% or so too pricey.

    I do not think it is Cadillac's Phaeton -- indeed, I think it will be thought of as the beginning of a new Cadillac. It will find itself -- if it is forced to play in the LPS class -- the bargain car.

    That may not be enough.

    I would compare the new CTS with the BMW 3, the NEW (not in the US yet) A4 and perhaps an Infiniti or Lexus of the tweener variety as you suggest.

    Now, for me, the interior and the 300+ HP motor are winners -- and knowing GM, the lease incentives will start second quarter '08 and make the new CTS hard to resist for many of us who have "been there done that" with similar sized cars from Europe. My Audi is lovely to behold, but breathtakingly expensive to "hold" beyond the warranty period.

    "All" my friends say their experience with 'merican cars and trucks have typically been experiences with reliability and longentivity, if not the last 1/10th of performance.

    This might be quite refreshing.

    As a fur instance: My wife's BMW's brakes (when they need repair) if the thing is out of warranty cost $950 per axle -- I hear they go out about 55K miles.

    I can only assume the GM product would be friendlier to keep longer.

    Moreover, despite my comments about the Cadillac being state of the art, 2004, well, that's not entirely a bad place to be.

    As I get down closer to the final 5 or 6 months before I order the "next" -- more data will be available. Hopefully, I can turn that data into information.

    :surprise:
  • You won't be able to touch that deal with an Infiniti or Lexus..

    $1372 upfront and $404/mo. for 3yr/36K is a good deal for a $33K MSRP car....

    regards,
    kyfdx
    visiting host

    Moderator - Prices Paid, Lease Questions, SUVs

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