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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

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Comments

  • sweendogysweendogy Left lanePosts: 1,162
    Good response. Agree- completely- infact a lease in some cases can be a cheaper alternative monthly then a used car- look you can get a bmw 328 for 339 a Month (not a leader ad, it's on BMW commercials). Could prob do better in some markers. Why do you think the great bmw stays in biz- it sells cars to non enthusiasts.

    Others who have yet responded to there "backwardsb hat" comments cannot take the youth buying the prestigious bmw, so called enthusiast. Lets go on a road trip with the GFs - but please don't tell us who should be driving such cars.

    Act as if.
  • scwmcanscwmcan Niagara, CanadaPosts: 394
    I agree people can do what they want, but how much goes down on that $329 BMW lease, 3 or 4 thousand? If they have that kind of money to put down on a lease they could just buy a pretty good used car for that, no it won't be fancy, but it would be more financially sound, that said that certainly isn't what they have to do, and they are free to go for the fancy car if they want, it is one of the reasons we live in the area we do, people are allowed to make their own decisions, but they are also supposed to live with the consequences of those decisions, not go blaming someone else for them and ask for handouts. Anyway I am getting off topics so I am going to stop.
  • sweendogysweendogy Left lanePosts: 1,162
    edited March 2013
    Scwman- classic responce - my rebut - evenif it's 4k down and that's an if- you get a brand new BMW (with "free maintence") for 3 years - and if you are a recent grad and have an entry level job- you don't have to worry about a new transsssion -'or something similar that you would get in a used car- plus you don't have to pay the full nug at pickup. - a good used car that's 5 years old depending on model is a min 10k. Lux cars could be close to 20 or more.

    Not saying anything wrong with a used car - but a new car under certain lease requirements and given certain situation is not a bad option- and could be a better option. Rock on

    I got an integra GSr in 2000 for 25O a month 1500 down- could not get a better deal- had a 3 year lease- warrantee - no issues- I was a young buck just out of college - last 3 cars have been bought new- all bought- but even if I had the money I would still finance because the rates are so low- case in point- after trade we owed less then 5k for my wife's crv- I financed for 60 mths at .9 because rate was so low- not because we didn't have the extra 5- all about what fits
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 14,722
    the BMW leases are usually $3,500 IIRC. sometimes a little lower. but rule of thumb, add about $100/month to get a nothing down number. No longer silly cheap, but often still a good deal.

    and $3,500 down on a mew 328 is going to leave a eye watering payment!

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (daughter stole that one), and 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again)

  • stickguystickguy Posts: 14,722
    well, I used an example, but was not considering a BMW for a new grad. More like a Civic, Imprezza, or maybe an ILX with a heavily discounted lease.

    The goal really is to get him established, and saving money. In 3 years he can go for a BMW if he wants one, and can afford it!

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (daughter stole that one), and 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again)

  • sweendogysweendogy Left lanePosts: 1,162
    Look nothing wrong with civic or whatever he can afford- please no 320 BMW - get the civic or tsx or Mini Cooper- the 320 should be reserved for very old people given its weight and displacement and price.'
  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Forest Lakes, AZPosts: 3,285
    edited March 2013
    pay big money upfront on a lease need to be aware that if the car is totalled, bad things ensue. Being upside-down when that happens wouldn't be an especially big deal for someone who could actually afford the car, but for those who lease because they can't. . .
  • sweendogysweendogy Left lanePosts: 1,162
    Or you could roll the down payment and tax in a lease and be right side up given a total. Then lease another using the same formula-

    Others love the song "upside down" by jack Johnson - me not so much
  • scwmcanscwmcan Niagara, CanadaPosts: 394
    I have no problem if they can afford the payments, as I said they can do what they want, and you did bring up the BMW which is what I replied to, it would be slightly more reasonable to get a new civics or whatever, but that was not what was being discussed here, it was the leasing or purchasing an entry level luxury car right out of college. Now nobody but the actual person knows what their financial situation is so really we have no business deciding what they should be doing with their money ( as I stated in the my original reply) and the payments on the BMW may be about the same as on the civic ( though with a bigger upfront payment) so why not go for it if you can and want to, but in general it make more sense to have fewer and lower payments to get yourself out of debt before you go adding new debt, of course I agree with the size of many peoples student debt they can't put their lives on hold for twenty years, but a lot of people seem to want it all as soon as they graduate and get into further financial difficulties, I guess all I am saying is they have to make sure they can actually afford what they buy, and that they have to be aware that just because you get a job as a fresh graduate doesn't mean they are going to still have that job in a year or two ( in today's workplace there are very few guarantees) and that they also need to budget savings so they can afford to survive and continue to pay for things in the event they do lose that great first job. In other words don't live beyond your means, its not just advice for governments it is for all of us.
  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,506
    edited March 2013
    Those friends I had, who paid off student loans in just a few years, did not live like paupers. This forum is about ELLPS, which has word "luxury". Last time I checked the definition, it meant things that are not necessary in life. Last time I checked the word "pauper", it meant somebody deprived of the basic goods and services. There is world between those two point. A three year old domestic or imported compact car is not beyond dignity of a recent graduate. Plenty of people live like that and are not considered living like paupers.
    I'm not going to tell anybody how to live their life, I just rebuff claims that life without a nice car is somehow going to less fulfilling. There is no entitlement of having a nice car when one graduates from college, or medical school. Those feelings are internally developed due to social pressure and marketing. Does not mean we all have to obligue. However, if somebody considers a new Lexus or BMW more important than being debt free, it is their choice. But is was a choice, not necesity. All I ask then is that one does not say later "it was not my fault", "nobody could see that coming", or similar excuse phrase, when things don't go according to plan.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,506
    All standard leases include GAP coverage. Putting money down on a lease is a bad idea, period. It is usually based on desire to lower payment and projecting what one should do on a loan, where large downpayment is actually a good idea. The difference is in completely different type of risk in each of those financing schemes. Loan puts risk of ownership on the buyer, lease puts it on the bank. So banks will love people putting money down on a lease.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,692
    Dino - I don't like to dispute what you say because you always research before you make your point (and very well I might add), but I think GAP insurance laws vary by state. I know where I used to live (NY), that GAP insurance is included in every single auto lease & finance contract written in the state. Where I live now (CT), GAP is something they push on you in the F&I office.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2011 Pilot EX-L 4WD, 2015 Subaru Legacy 2.5i Premium

  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,506
    edited March 2013
    On the leases or loans? I never leased, but every article I read about leasing said GAP is now standard with leases. Perhaps our hosts (kyfdx) could confirm/deny this. Btw, even if I am right, it will not surprise me if some dealers double sell to uniformed.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,692
    Hey Dino - this is WAAAAY off topic, but I'm going to look at a Saabaru 92X Aero for a friend later today. Since I know you are a former WRX owner, is there anything that I should be on the lookout for specifically?

    It wouldn't surprise me if dealers were double selling either.

    I'm not sure because I've only purchased a car in CT, but leased my E90 from a dealer in NY (so GAP is included).

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2011 Pilot EX-L 4WD, 2015 Subaru Legacy 2.5i Premium

  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,506
    edited March 2013
    I liked 9-2x, they were Subarus all the way, but with small value added in (available leather, HID lights, nicer wheels, all on top of the line vs. Subaru did not offer it in WRX, only STI). The only thing I'd say, only manual transmission is worth the buy. The auto is an awful antiquated 4-speed, feels like 90s. No worries on service, any Subie dealer will do it, all mechanical parts and vast majority of interior are identical.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,644
    you can get a bmw 328 for 339 a Month (not a leader ad, it's on BMW commercials)

    You do not get it, that is a leader ad... and how much out of pocket to get that price? If it is more then first month payment and Fee's it is a leader ad... :confuse:
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,644
    Scwman- classic responce - my rebut - evenif it's 4k down and that's an if- you get a brand new BMW (with "free maintence") for 3 years - and if you are a recent grad and have an entry level job- you don't have to worry about a new transsssion -'or something similar that you would get in a used car- plus you don't have to pay the full nug at pickup. - a good used car that's 5 years old depending on model is a min 10k. Lux cars could be close to 20 or more.

    How much do you think insurance will be on a brand new 328i for a 22 years old????
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,692
    The one I'm looking at is a 5 speed with 70K miles. It is an Aero (Turbo).

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2011 Pilot EX-L 4WD, 2015 Subaru Legacy 2.5i Premium

  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,506
    edited March 2013
    Exactly. This one of those classic mental schemes. Make one look at one number, say it is x per month and forget about anything else that may be associated with it. This is not just cars, it is a lot of other things, house being most obvious, but also entertainment services, electronics. Always "only X/month and before you know it, you're in bank chains, paying thousands of interest each year and complaining about student loan from 20 years ago and wondering why it's not paid off.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,506
    edited March 2013
    Good deal. Just check the mechanicals, if they're OK, car should be great. Check the insurance, because I don't know about those body panels availability.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • sweendogysweendogy Left lanePosts: 1,162
    I love the first post directed at me- then the follow up post that is basically my answer to the first question you ask. Now leader ads are your specialty - but instead of trying to be confrontational lets add some value, do a little research - something - the insurance answer is "a lot" just like it would be on a new civic relevant to each selling price.

    Here we go let's go used 3 purchase verse new 3 lease- both examples are 335.
    All information from BMW.com

    09 3 series 42k miles cpo from BMW used website- this
    Selling Price $34,950 (there price prob negotiable)
    2500 down, .9% (promotional rate, doubt a 22 yr old but lets use it)
    Term 48mths, payment 689 a month.

    Brand new 335 2013 special bmw lease
    Vehicle Registered outside N.Y.
    • $389 First months payment
    • $3,000 Down payment
    • $0 Security Deposit
    • $725 Acquisition fee
    • $4,114 Cash due at signing
    Or doing the math 492.47 a month for 36 months
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 14,722
    Q&D math, 1 more year of payments but after 4 years with the 2009, you are out about $12K, but own the car outright. With the lease, you are 1 year deep into another set of payments!

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (daughter stole that one), and 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again)

  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,506
    edited March 2013
    But don't you think living in low payment fantasy world is much cooler? ;)
    Who cares about such tedious details as equity, mileage limits, full cost, etc., you can have new 335 for x per month and nothing else matters.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • sweendogysweendogy Left lanePosts: 1,162
    edited March 2013
    Q&d math? Don't get that term.

    I've never said leasing was better- but it's an option. Also I'm sure under the q&d math someone would also note that interest rates are typically lower on new cars then old ones. -

    Btw over 50 % of those nice bmw3s come back to the show room as lease returns -
  • tlongtlong CaliforniaPosts: 4,766
    But don't you think living in low payment fantasy world is much cooler?
    Who cares about such tedious details as equity, mileage limits, full cost, tetc., you can have new 335 for x per month and nothing else matters.


    Yep, pretty soon we'd be expecting people to balance their budgets, too. Live it up like the Federal government! :cry:
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 14,722
    quick and dirty, meaning I just did it in my head so a little bit ballparked.

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (daughter stole that one), and 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again)

  • sweendogysweendogy Left lanePosts: 1,162
    Q&d math - first time I've seen that one for that explanation now i know- wtf, lol and now q&d
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    edited March 2013
    I bought my Volvo V70 new in 2004 for around $30,000. Paid it off on schedule and haven't had a car payment since 2008.

    It's not as cheap to own and maintain as a brand new car, but so far, the $100/mo I stick in the "car maintenance fund" has more than covered everything that has come up.

    It doesnt have Bluetooth, Nav, iPod connectivity, etc., but it goes down the road like a magic carpet and has never left us stranded on the side of the road. It even looks as good as new (well...from 3 feet away :shades: ).
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    edited March 2013
    And speaking of used cars, my BMW and Porsche both passed their one year anniversary with me!

    I spent about $3000 on the 911 for a 90K service and new tires a few months ago, but I haven't spent a dime on repairs for the E30. It's going to get an annual oil change next week.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,644
    Your math is not correct as Dino and pointed out, the 2009 you own, the 2013 you do not, so in the end, the 2009 is the better deal, once it is paid off, the kid has something that is worth $$.

    You keep keep accusing me of these "leader ad" crap. however, you have no proof of it, so please show this forum any proof of this, since you are accusing me of something that is not true.
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