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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

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  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,141
    Listen to yourself man- porshe and Alfa -'come on dude - the last Alfa was imported here what 20 years ago- I stand corrected the [non-permissible content removed] comment should also equate to Alfa owners as well-
    :shades:
    My wife once oned a 1998 crv or code name EJ8, on the civic boards no one called it the EJ8-( it came in 5 or 6 different styles with 3 different engines) - lots of variations just like all bmws. :shades:

    And to say most enthusiasts know the difference is incorrect. but, i guess I would know the porshe speak if i was a person who test drove such cars on Saturdays with no intension to buy. :shades:
  • xrunner2xrunner2 Posts: 3,062
    edited June 2013
    This topic is Entry-level Performance Sedans, a category pretty much invented by the cars from Munich. A little homework about BMWs might help you in this discussion. If you find this too confusing perhaps your time would be better spent on other boards

    Here is a web site that untangles the mystery of BMW E and F, listing all numbers and what they mean such as F30 is a "6th gen 3-series saloon, 2011".

    http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/News/Search-Results/Industry-News/All-the-BMW-E-and- - -F-codenames-explained/

    Here is a summary of F model numbers: F01-03, 10-13, 15-16, 20-23, 25, 30-35, 44-46. A summary of E model numbers: E3, 9, 12, 21, 23-26, 28, 30-32, 32/2, 34, 36, 36/5, 36/7, 38, 38/2, 38/3, 39, 46/5, 52, 53, 60, 61, 63, 65-68, 70.

    Perhaps BMW could have been putting a small chrome plaque on the trunks of their vehicles showing the E and F numbers.

    I would bet a cup of fancy coffee that the vast majority of BMW drivers/owners/leasers, many being the mcmanion variety, have never heard of E or F numbers.
  • andys120andys120 Loudon NHPosts: 16,617
    Perhaps BMW could have been putting a small chrome plaque on the trunks of their vehicles showing the E and F numbers.

    That would make more sense than the current scheme which makes little sense but they'd still have to distinguish between the various powerplants. The F30 with a 2-liter Turbo diesel (320D) is a bit different than the same chassis sporting a 300hp 3 liter gas turbo motor (335i) Perhaps they ought to have something like F30-TD2.0 or F30-T3.0 on the tail.

    I would bet a cup of fancy coffee that the vast majority of BMW drivers/owners/leasers, many being the mcmanion [sic]variety, have never heard of E or F numbers.

    I'm not sure about the "vast" majority, I'm sure most owners have no clue but enthusiasts know. I thought the Edmunds Townhall was supposed to be a site for auto enthusiasts. Pick up a copy of Road and Track, Car and Driver or Autoweek and I'm sure you'll find references to BMW Type numbers.

    2000 BMW 528i, 2001 BMW 330CiC

  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,141
    I subscribe to motor trend- and an edmunds user among others. Sure the major publications mention the f30 or e20 or whatever mention of past BMW 3s but if you read these publications you notice it's mentioned once maybe twice- never in the header and never in the stats sheet. I would say "vast" is probably the correct terms- I mean in the states the "vast" majority of 3s sold are 399 lease deals (leader ads in flight terms) right.

    I don't think enthusiasts need to remember the 2001 525xi was a f32. Seriously BMW guys put down the single malt and the Cuban and comeback to the real world - it's make year and model, then engine- you are not special.
  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,498
    What is your problem, man? I like lively discussion, but you seem to be more interested in slinging a small stone and see if somebody jumps. You continue this on and on. Snite here, zinger there, small insults in between. This chip on your sholder is getting bigger by and bigger. I'm losing my patience. Go back and read your posts again, then stop trolling. Disagreements are fine, calling things silly, douchy, etc. is not. Perhaps it is you needing some intoxicant to take the edge off.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • xrunner2xrunner2 Posts: 3,062
    edited June 2013
    I thought the Edmunds Townhall was supposed to be a site for auto enthusiasts.

    It depends. The title of this thread includes a number of brands and models including the Acura TL which I have a copy.

    This thread covers a number of brands, models. There are threads for a particular make and model. Maybe those are the place where diehard BMW enthusiasts can bask in their "E" and "F" trivia. And, commiserate on their beloved brand being softened for the masses with electric power steering and handling that trails the Cadillac ATS, according to C&D in handling and performance. BMWs today perhaps are mostly for poseurs. Mcmansion types. We know who they are.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,141
    Dino I'm sorry if you cannot take the response at what they are- my writing is sometimes a little to honest- I agree - but it's fact based (see Altima argument above) - I think if you are going to have an opinion be prepaired to back up any statements - this is a forum - it's a back and forth, some are better prepaired. Blind statements are layups to knock down, everyone has an opinion- doesn't mean it's right of wrong - but some are better researched and fact based, while others are just random thoughts. Again I'm sorry you feel that way.

    Enjoy the stick 328 wagon - don't know the code is but great rig
  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,498
    Opinions and challenges are fine, the tone can be a problem. The Altima was a good challenge. Calling people self centered douches (whether directly or not), because they used some unfamiliar vocabulary is not.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,141
    The idea that one select car company (i guess alfa guys do as well) and its owners uses terms that are not widely used in a car conversation is what it is- this is not just a bmw forum, and I think it's douchie- I never called anyone self centered but this idea that real car enthusiasts have to know the code for a 2001 525 is. (As noted by my cigar and scotch comment)

    And the Altima challenge was very one sided if you ask me- :shades:
  • tlongtlong CaliforniaPosts: 4,751
    Opinions and challenges are fine, the tone can be a problem. The Altima was a good challenge. Calling people self centered douches (whether directly or not), because they used some unfamiliar vocabulary is not.

    As somebody who posts quite a bit in other Edmund's forums but only mostly reads this one, I do find this forum has quite a bit more attitude than others. Perhaps fitting of the "higher-end" snobbish stereotype that I'm sure the forum posters don't want to convey to a general audience? (not directed at you, but a general comment on the "ELLPS" forum.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    I personally dont find it snobbish. I find it childish. In a forum where adult car enthusiasts come to discuss, debate, learn about, and/or admire luxury performance cars, slinging personal taunts and making ascerbic condescending comments brings the entire community down.

    Im not saying anyone has violated this, but here is the Edmunds Member Conduct Agreement for perspective:

    "We welcome all points of view on automotive matters. However, although interactions within the Community Services occur in cyberspace, everyday manners apply. Please respect and interact with fellow Members as you would in any public arena. Civility and respect underlie the success of an on-line community; if you wish to take issue with the statements of other Members or the Hosts, please engage in healthy, mature debate and not immature behavior or name-calling. While we want to maintain an inviting environment for all visitors, disruptive conduct, such as off-topic comments in a topic-oriented discussion in the Forums, is not allowed. Neither is "spam" (e.g., posting your message in multiple places throughout the Forums)."

    As for the BMW "E" and "F" designations. I agree most people dont have them all memorized (and who does?). On the other hand, we are mostly enthusiasts in this group and since it is the ELLPS thread, the only BMW being routinely discussed here is the 3-Series. And over the past 30 years, there have only been five (sedans):

    E30, E36, E46, E90, F30

    The E90 (2005-2012) and F30 (2012-present) are clearly the most talked about here so if you only know those two, you're good to go. And if you dont want to learn them, thats ok too - you probably call them "Beemers" anyways so it doesnt matter ;)

    But, for that one-in-a-hundred mention of a rogue E-car, if you're curious there are ways to be in the know. For example, people have used the M-B "W" codes here before. I dont know them, but google is just a couple keystrokes away...
  • scwmcanscwmcan Niagara, CanadaPosts: 394
    edited June 2013
    I know it may not be in the same performance class as your current BMW wagon, but it may be comparable to the latest one, but the Volvo V60 is coming to North America, by all reports it is a very nice driving car, and with BMW toning down the sportiness, and Volvo upping it a bit, it may even wind up being a better drive ( probably not, but the s60 is apparently pretty good, and since the v60 is the wagon version it should also be good).
    Thogh of course since it won't come with a manual it will be off some people's lists for that.
  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Forest Lakes, AZPosts: 3,257
    As somebody who posts quite a bit in other Edmund's forums but only mostly reads this one, I do find this forum has quite a bit more attitude than others.

    I would agree, but it appears to be due only to one or two people. This board was really active for quite awhile years ago, then went dead for quite some time when the regulars who populated it moved on to a couple of other boards. There was no hint of attitude in the "old days" that I recall.

    When it came back to life, there was, and is. The majority of people (not posts, people) on here these days are fine and have interesting points of view. For the others, well, that's what the scroll wheel is all about.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,631
    edited June 2013
    That said, I also know it has what Audi calls a "soundaktor".

    It appears that BMW and Ford do the same thing these days... This is what happens when people want a quite car the soul if taken from them.
  • rockshocka1rockshocka1 Posts: 310
    But I love single malt & Cubans. As an Audi owner I'm aware of enhanced engine sound, but there are many that do it & more to come. Just reading reviews will tell you that. That being said, I would take the 4.2 in my S5 over
    the supercharged 6, 10x outta 10. The 6 gives you as marginal mpg boost as the 8 gives you speed. But the sound of the 4.2 is sweet! The supercharged 6, not in the ballpark. & I feel good having ready available E93 ethanol free in my area, which I've noticed gives me 1-2 more mpg than corn swill.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,543
    Just thinking about BMW's E Codes. I know MB uses "W" codes, but I have NO CLUE what they are. So I can understand if someone who is an auto enthusiast, but not completely focused on BMWs doesn't know "E" codes.

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    If you are not completely focused on BMW, then I contend you are not an auto enthusiast ;)
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 28,457
    That's nice about ethanol-free... nothing within 50 miles of where I live... :(

    MODERATOR
    Prices Paid, Lease Questions, SUVs

  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,498
    Thogh of course since it won't come with a manual it will be off some people's lists for that

    Since neither will new BMW wagon, it's a fair game for me. At some point I liked the idea of V50 T5, but it did not have manual tranny, either - then it disapeared altogether. Saab was a decent entry, at some point you could get Aero wagon with manual. I liked its looks, I did not drive one, but I could imagine. RIP, Saab.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,498
    Sure, I don't expect people to know all the codes. I learned these codes just a few years ago, when I started reading bimmerfest and other related posts. I don't know all of them, either. If somebody throws an unfamiliar code, my reaction would be either check it myself, of politely ask where I can find it, so I know what it is. Same comes to many acronyms and abbreviations used - I sometimes have to go to a dictionary to find out what all they mean - English being a second language and all.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,543
    Ha!

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,543
    Very true

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • andys120andys120 Loudon NHPosts: 16,617
    In my defense I'll remind everyone that the codes I used in the reply to a post were probably the best known in the BMW world E39 (5 series 95-03) and E46 (3series 99-06). I know I'm not the only one who believes they may be the best Bimmers ever, they hark back to the Reitzle/Pischetsraeder era when the Japanese were chasing BMW. Now it's the other way around.

    2000 BMW 528i, 2001 BMW 330CiC

  • billyperksiibillyperksii Posts: 198
    I just got an email from my dealer in regards to a special edition 2014 TL.
    Does anyone have any details on this?
    I hope its not all special stiched seats, special color seats, paint job or badging.
    If they beefed up the torque, power, suspension and nicer wheels, probably that will arouse my attention.
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 7,795
    According to the Temple of VTEC, it's keyless access, push button start, 18" wheels, lip spoiler and SE badging:

    TL Special Edition
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,141
    Hear they are adding another foot to the grill and putting more chrome everywhere as well. Also spec is they are going to expand the name even further - Acura 3.7 Tl - sh-awd sde (super Dupper edition) .
  • xrunner2xrunner2 Posts: 3,062
    I just got an email from my dealer in regards to a special edition 2014 TL.

    Will it be based on the platform of the 2009-2013 models? Sorry. Don't know what the code number was for these years' cars, otherwise would use it here.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,141
    edited June 2013
    Xrunner - come on all real Ellps guys know the Fourth generation code as UA8-UA9, silly. Knowing honda products they use this car as a filler car- a car that appeals to the masses- so they can sell more of them- it usually has more features then the base but its not a marked out edition as "special" would indicate. It's based off the UA8. Shame they didn't make a type -s edition. Most enthusiasts agree the UA6-UA7 was the best edition of this car if equipped with type -s and 6 speed.
  • xrunner2xrunner2 Posts: 3,062
    Most enthusiasts agree the UA6-UA7 was the best edition of this car if equipped with type -s and 6 speed.

    So my wife has a 2007 TLwith a lot of miles on odo and does not like the styling of the current GEN. So, she has a UA6-UA7. She has had TLs - a 2001, 2004 and 2007 currently. When I log off, how should I ask her how she likes her UA6-UA7 compared to her previous 2001 UA what? She has had the UA8-UA9 for loaners a couple of times and besides the styling was not impressed with these. So, am I in sync with the "required" vernacular on this thread?
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,141
    edited June 2013
    I'm happy to clarify, for your wife she had the Second generation (UA4-UA5) this was for her 01. I'm sure she would agree the current car is vastly superior, while a lot heavy and not as attractive.

    the 04- the 07 was part of the Third generation (UA6-UA7)- this is considered the creme del la creme of the TL cycle thus far- infact the 07 and 08 were the years to get as they upgraded it a bit- the TL-s came with brembos and other goodies and is best of breed of all TLs. For future reference- even if they are rarely talked about First generation (UA1-UA3 and current is the Fourth generation (UA8-UA9), current gen has lost it's audience and is well known as the beak.

    Hope that helps.
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