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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

1677678680682683860

Comments

  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,475
    edited May 2012
    There is no way TL will go. TSX is definitely the one, if something goes. I think the US market is just too small and too tough to support car like that. It probably costs them too much vs. what they can charge in volumes those things are selling. I actually like it, but I know when I like something, it won't sell. ILX being based on economy car spreads the costs much better.

    The problem I cannot see how in the world they could make anything close to TSX experience with ILX. The thing is based on Civic platform :sick: whereas TSX was based on Euro/JDM Accord, which were positioned similarly to US ELLPS (and sold at appropriate prices). So you know the pedigree of TSX is much more noble than coming ILX. This is just another example of Acura and Honda losing their way. They are undoubtedly going through some kind of crisis.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 27,666
    They had good success with the Integra and RSX.. which were both Civic based.. Maybe they can do it again..

    MODERATOR
    Prices Paid, Lease Questions, SUVs

  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,107
    i 2 had the Integra GS-R - best civic ever made
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    Speculating on whether the TSX or TL (or both) will go away is futile.

    I believe Acura will likely maintain a 3-car lineup. RLX at the top, ILX at the bottom, and something in between. Lets just call it the TLX for now...
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,107
    edited May 2012
    Not the point- is it a 200 hp sudo lux accord - or is it a 36k entry 6 with sport (er) option
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    How about offering a FWD turbo 4 TLX for $35,000 and an AWD V6 TLX for $42,000? Fully loaded in the Japanese tradition, of course.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,407
    Do you guys read the READERS RIDES BLOG? If not, here's my write up on my 2001 Honda Prelude

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    Nice write up!

    I've always liked the Prelude and yours looks just amazing. You've really taken good care of it.
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,069
    edited May 2012
    I don't see Acura stopping the slide out of the premium class if the emphasis (based on dealer inventory) continues on obviously tarted up Hondas (no matter how nice) with FWD and 5 or 6 speed autos.

    My opinion is that Acura needs to offer the entire lineup with SH-AWD and nothing less than a 6spd auto, moving toward 8spd autos (and if possible keeping stick shifts if for no other reason than marketing.)

    The direction Acura seems to be moving is to build nice cars -- that neither offend (once the beak styling is banished to at least the '12 TL level if not moreso) nor excite (visually at least.) The current and apparent upcoming future direction is to slowly continue to slide out of the Premium class. One $100,000+ NSX doesn't change anything.

    Driving my 2012 TL SH-AWD Advance is very much like driving the previous generation Audi A6 (known as the C6), perhaps a 2009 or 2010 model.

    That may be damning with faint praise or it may be simply mild, not wild praise that Acura in 2012 can build a decent 2009 Audi A6 clone (that isn't as good looking.)

    In two years I move to a new car -- at this point Acura will get a look-see, but I'm thinking so will Infiniti and Audi and Cadillac. The Acura will have to step up its game.

    Today, Acura reminds me, in the pecking order of the world, as the Japanese VW. :confuse:
  • ivan_99ivan_99 Posts: 1,663
    ...that neither offend (once the beak styling is banished to at least the '12 TL level if not moreso)

    The ol' beak works for some of us. Reminds me of a time, many years ago before marriage, in Venice where I saw a stunning Italian lady. She had a beak...but somehow, it worked for me ;)
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,496
    'Acura will get a look-see, but I'm thinking so will Infiniti and Audi and Cadillac'
    Why does BMW not make the cut?
    - Ray
    Just curious....
  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,475
    I agree. In my opinion Acura's issues are reflection of its parent Honda problems. I'm not sure if it is simple funding, excessive aversion to risk, or what it is, but their recent offerings are really so unispiring that it seems like they're sliding into second tier (Honda) or even oblivion (Acura).

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,590
    Interesting that you bring up the Integra, it was based somewhat on the Civic, but the ILX is a civic in a pretty dress. So we shall see how it sells, if Honda can't sell the new Civic, then Acura will have a harder time selling the ILX.. The buyer they are shooting for is a very savoy buyer, doubt they will spend 31K for a ILX when they can buy a 2 yr old BMW for the same price... Honda has some problem, the Insight is not selling, the current Accord hasn't sold in the #'s that honda was looking for, the current Civic was cheapened and it shows. Lets hope that Honda gets it right soon, or they might be in a world of hurt.

    Acrua should have made the ILX into something that the Integra was, a sporty entry level upsacle car... Not a luxury car, but an upscale car.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,590
    Hey Fed, I have stated before that Acrua needs to drop the turbo 4 in the TSX, make it a low pressure turbo, 225hp with 240lbs of torque. this would give the TSX the need off the line power it has been lacking. Drop the V6, and if Acrua thinks a AWD version is needed, just increase the boost of the turbo to counter act the added weight. Have a Dual Clutch Auto with, have the 0-60 times in the high 5's... Keep the price right about 35K, Acrua would sell every since one of them...
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,069
    Well, I would include, believe it or not, BMW and Volvo whilst I was shopping. I might even test drive a Mercedes just for the heck of it too.

    My wife's 3 Bimmers were pretty much joys to drive. The exclusion of any ELLPS or LPS car from future consideration was an oversight. Nothing more.

    :blush:
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,590
    Hey Mark, is appears BMW has brought back their Value Package, which gives you leather interior, iPad connection and BMW App for free on the E90 body style cars (Wagon and Coupe) this is about a $2500 saving. Not too sure what you are looking at, however, this is a nice savings.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,107
    edited May 2012
    I agree turbo 4 seems the way to go but it looks like Acura Killed the turbo in the rdx and now has a standard 6. It has Nothing to do with the transmission, duel clutch might be nice but as you and another have mentioned its not the reason they are going the way of the Dodo bird.

    Sports update rangers lose, yanks up 3-0.

    The Acura brand as stated before is the Asian Buick of this segment. No coupe, no convert, one standout with the mdx. NSx will be cool to see at the dealerships- but going to take more then a commercial with Jerry and Leno to get people to buy.
  • flightnurseflightnurse 35K feetPosts: 1,590
    Acrua (Honda) could not do anything wrong, which was nice, the original NSX was years ahead of the competition, it is not uncommon to find a early NSX with 150K miles on it that is squeak free and runs like it is new. The early MDX the same thing, built very well, styling was typical Japanese you either loved it or hate it. Acrua (Honda) of today has made some big mistakes, and it shows. Their sales have dropped, cars that were the benchmark are not today. Placing a V6 in the TSX was the biggest mistake for them. The price places the V6 TSX in BMW territory. Drop the V6, bring a nice turbo 4 in, 235hp and 255lbs of torque (at 1700) as the top engine, and the base engine be the engine they have today the 2.4l.

    Place a nice turbo 4 in the TL as the base engine, add a 7 or 8 spd Dual Clutch transmission, keep the base price under 35K, have leather standard, along with Nav. FOr the Type S, V6, dual clutch 7 or 8 spd, AWD, fully loaded price 44K. ACrua needs to go back to the pricing game and continue to give people more for their money.

    Drop the ILX, it is a POS, too expensive for what you are getting...
  • dino001dino001 Tampa, FLPosts: 3,475
    edited May 2012
    It is spelled ACURA, not Acrua. I write it only because the misspelling error seems to be repeated many times here (I mean on the forum, not just your post), for whatever reason. Wouldn't bother to correct anyone if it was sporadic, but reading back the pattern of posts indicates incorrect knowledge, not just typos.

    2012 BMW 328i wagon, manual and sports package. No. sold in the US: 1. Probably.

  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,107
    Dino - just did a search of the last 20 acrua "typos", flight was responsible for 15- you might be on to something.
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