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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

1785786788790791842

Comments

  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,052
    oh billy billy billy-- billyboy wow - blaming buick, a division of GM for its management faults (& labor issues) and not the actual cars they produce..Seems fair-- oh wait honda didnt ask for a bailout in 09 are you sure billy?/

    http://www.newser.com/story/52383/honda-hops-on-bailout-bandwagon.html
  • billyperksiibillyperksii Posts: 198
    Answer these questions and try to analyze where the company stands-

    1). What is Honda's Market Cap and how many shares are outstanding?
    2) How much Debt is on their balance Sheet?
    3). What is their free cash flow?
    4). What is their EBITDA?
    5). Whats the PMV?

    Creating a model on the above information probably will give you a true outlook on the companys future.
    Again I am just trying to help you in your attempt of the demise of Honda.
  • flightnurseflightnurse at 35K feetPosts: 1,523
    Oh I wish I had time to pop some popcorn and watch this, however, I need to go pay some bills.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,052
    i can run those numbers asap if needed- but i never said honda- i said acura.. hello

    numbers you requested

    market cap is 65b, 1.8b outstanding, rev growth looks good. free cash is 547, ebitda has risen from 12 levels, trading at a 52 week low yday--
  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,897
    Does it really shock you that a 6 yr old design(and which wasn't liked well in the first place) is being heavily discounted with the knowledge that the car is basically going to be discontinued? You really need to take things in context. Facts and statistics are useless without context and relativity. You're right about one thing....they do need a midlevel sedan with great looks which may or may not be the new TLX.

    You talk about discounts without having a clue as to what the real margins are. Like I said, context is very useful and if you were right 5 yrs ago Acura should be kaput by now. So much drama for no reason. Nobody is saying Acura has not made mistakes but you make it sound like the sky is falling.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,052
    You talk about discounts without having a clue as to what the real margins are
    no i mentioned that above but please feel free to drop those numbers on me.

    Does it really shock you that a 6 yr old design( no but why didnt they chaange it earlier- like they did the civic of 2012??

    sky is falling. no just sedans (the volume leaders) sales numbers

    and im spent
  • billyperksiibillyperksii Posts: 198
    Dont want to get into this kiddy talk but from the numbers you cut and paste, what is your deductive reasoning on how the company (Honda/Acura) is doing? Build a model and let me know.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,052
    edited June 2013
    billy - i've done enuf of the kiddy talk, the numbers I cut and past are the numbers you requested so... why dont you present a case and do some research.. like the article above that stated HMC took GOVT money- but you have yet to respond to that, its almost like you just said it to say it, which i guess is ok but I would like to know the true facts, which i supplied. This is a car chat while I can run thru the business side of this I can also show facts about car sales and trends, car rag articles that dispute M3s claim it a One Car fix, which I have.
  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,897
    edited June 2013
    no i mentioned that above but please feel free to drop those numbers on me.

    I didn't make the wild statements about Acura making little to no profit and may be on a real downward spiral, you did. In order to know that you would have to know margins. Knowing discounts means nothing without knowing the original markup. It's just like volume...it means nothing unless you can make a good buck at it.

    no but why didnt they chaange it earlier- like they did the civic of 2012??
    Ummhh...they screwed up. That's the car I was referring to that they have to change drastically and it needs to be a winner. However, even if they don't get it absolutely perfect the sky is not going to fall. Sorry.

    I think you could make some of the same comments about Infiniti. I love Infiniti but they have pulled some real boners too. And some of their models are real low in the sales numbers but they seem to plugging along fairly well without the huge sales numbers....just like Acura. Acura may be doing even better because their SUV sales are better than Infiniti's and that's where a ton of profit is. Just like Ford and GM with their trucks/suvs. Not saying it's the best of all worlds but as far as making profit it works pretty well.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,052
    Acura may be doing even better because their SUV sales are better than Infiniti's and that's where a ton of profit is what are the numbers, the profit you speak of?? you are saying they are making big profits but have yet to produce one number.. i present sales numbers you mock and are wild statements? Volume tells a story - its black and white - when they sell 350 RLs it tells a story - reasons car companies produce cars its to SELL CARS-- On the infinti thing for sure they have made mistakes-.
  • billyperksiibillyperksii Posts: 198
    The article you cut pasted did not say Honda actually got the money and secondly what is 5 million compared to 50 million. Lastly, you are cut and pasting information that you dont even understand, look at the revenues that HONDA is genarating-the same number you cut and paste. Go find out the their outstanding debt and probably that will paint a better picture of where they actually stand financially.
  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,897
    what are the numbers, the profit you speak of?? you are saying they are making big profits but have yet to produce one number..

    If you read at all about the auto industry you know that manufacturers make big profits off of their truck and suv sales. How much exactly I don't know. But the important thing about that statement is that I don't know exactly. That's why I don't make statements about a companies overall profit or loss. In the case of SUV profits I assumed it was pretty well known or accepted that manufactures back big bucks off of those sales but to be honest I really don't know. I'm not saying that either company is making huge overall profits because I simply don't know. YOU are the one that made statements about Acura profits or lack thereof mainly because of their lack of sales in the TL. You seem to base that theory on the fact that they are offering big discounts on the TL. I don't believe that is enough info to broadly state that Acura is making little to no profit as a company. If you do know then please enlighten us as I have never said that I do.

    Re volume, if we were talking about Camrys I would agree that huge volume is absolutely neccessary, but when you are talking about luxury cars I think they can be profitable without selling on volume. There are tons of car companies and most are doing ok even if they are midpack in sales or even on the lower end in sales. Being tops in sales means something I agree, but it's not the only factor when it comes to being a viable business.
  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,897
    And some have nothing to say about cars but simply to critique others.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,052
    billy we are talking billions not millions- lastly both tm and hM got govt subsidies that ended in 2012 as well.

    honda revs- they dont just include car sales- kiddie talk- I would also look at the currency moves and see what they are doing to said revs- if you could cut and paste something i would love to read it. Prob learn a thing or 2 while cutting and pasting...
  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Forest Lakes, AZPosts: 3,206
    Let's just say you weren't the target demographic.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,052
    so just to confirm no "big profit" data availible- ok thanks- ill stick with the sales and pricing data as more of a guide because atleast its in print and not an opinion
  • billyperksiibillyperksii Posts: 198
    ok I am out.
    As another poster would say- "Happy Motoring".
  • m6userm6user Posts: 2,897
    edited June 2013
    This sounds like a very nice package.

    "Opting for the 2014 Infiniti Q50 Hybrid will get the buyer a powertrain consisting of a 3.5-liter V6, a 50kW electric motor and a lithium ion battery that offers up a total power output of 354 hp and a highway fuel mileage rating of 36 miles per gallon, all for a starting price of $44,855, which includes the Premium group. The most expensive version of the new sedan is the Q50S Hybrid with all-wheel drive. That model carries an MSRP of $49,055."

    Above was copied from an article on Autoblog.com.

    I think the Q50H with AWD would be around $46,655. I think I read someplace that the H version would also be the fastest. Don't know what sacrifices(if any) they made for the hybrid MPG like tires, brakes etc.
  • sweendogysweendogy Posts: 1,052
    Btw hmc on a chart does look interesting.
  • albanytimalbanytim Posts: 18
    You can build a Q50 on the Infiniti site under Future Vehicles. The Hybrid AWD is $46,405 but there are 2 option packages (Nav and Tech) that take it to $52,805 including destination. The Sport version is another $2,400 to $55,205.
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