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Toyota Tundra vs. Chevrolet Silverado

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  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Subquestion: with 200,000 units to sell do you concentrate on all sectors of the potential buying public? Or do you concentrate your efforts and resources on establishing your bona-fides in a narrow focused sector where towing is of more importance.

    Walk before you run.

    As you say there are plenty of Toyota's all over the world proving themselves in areas where US half ton pickups would never go.
  • Belias, I have to say the majority of your arguments for the Toyota are subjective. I will say that some of the reasons I prefer the Chevy are subjective as well. You say that Chevy doesn't have the technical side but then admit that it has the locking differential, which is admittedly better (technical?).
    The argument for the previous GM trucks was that the interior was poor especially the gaps. Now GM has improved the gaps dramatically but "it's not your thing" and it's "subjective". I have the same response to the Toyota's interior...It's not my thing but agree it is subjective. I think the Chevy interior is well laid out and gauges are close and directed to the driver. Edmunds also agrees. :P
    Also, no mention of the gas mileage advantage of the Chevy. I do understand that it doesn't matter to a lot of people that drive trucks but the amount of people that use them as a daily driver and care about gas mileage is a factor.
    Can you explain to me the amount of technical advantages in favor of the Tundra that are "overwhelming". I don't see it. I guess I don't know what I'm admitting to when I don't see almost any advantage let alone overwhelming ones.
    You say that the Chevy is missing critical safety features...such as? You say that Chevy is missing air bags but yet when I go the website I can see Chevy has dual stage front/side impact air bags and stability control. I will give you that they are not standard in all trims but it will become the standard by 2008 for all vehicles in the US.
    Also, I'm not sure about the stereo system either. Chevy offers a Bose 6 disc CD changer. Seems pretty good to me.
  • pmuscepmusce Posts: 132
    How can you not order it when there are Silverado's on the lot with it already. He is assuming you can't order it because he could not figure it out on the 'Build Your Own' section of Chevrolet.com.
  • blufz1blufz1 Posts: 2,045
    Strongest frame? Who cares? The frame just has to be strong enough to do the job that's all. On the street I don't think the chevy get's better mileage on an engine by engine basis than the Toy. If you can, just wait a few years into the model run and you will get a better truck at a better price. Think of the incentives when gas is $4 a gallon and Honda has diesel power across it's entire lineup. :)
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    OH..

    On our Chevy lot, we sell both, there are none. If you can show me on the Chevy Build module where it is then I will apologize profusely.

    But I don't think I'll have to ;)

    It's clearly there on the GMC site and Build module, but not on the Chevy version.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Yes if the Ridgeline gets Honda's diesel in 2009, along with the Ody, MDX/Pilot and Accord then all the gassers here may be sucking wind ( or diesel exhaust ) trying to get their diesels on the market.
  • blufz1blufz1 Posts: 2,045
    It's going to happen. Wait 3 years,if you can, to buy a pickup. Ah.... I can see it now....$4000 cash back and 200,000 mile warranty.
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    "Also, no mention of the gas mileage advantage of the Chevy."

    Odd thing is, that in Edmunds direct comparison test between the 5.7l Tundra 4x4 and the 6.0l Silverado 4x4, they observed 14.4 mpg on the Tundra and 12.7 mpg on the Siverado. Both trucks driven by the same panel of drivers in the same tests over the same roads.

    As usual, YMMV..... ;)
  • dieselonedieselone Posts: 5,650
    The latest issue of Trailer Boats Magazine did a 1/2 ton comparison test of the Dodge Ram 1500 Mega Cab 4x4 with 5.7 Hemi, F150 supercrew 4x4, GMC 1500 Sierra crew cab 4x4 w/ 6.0L, Nissan Titan crew cab 4x4 SE, and a Toyota Tundra Double cab 4x4 with the 5.7.

    Note, I've subscribed to this magazine for many years and they are as unbiased as I've seen, if anything they prefer domestics as do most of their subscribers.

    The Tundra was picked as 1/2ton tow vehicle of the year due to posting the best overall scores related to towing a 6,840lb boat with 500lbs of tongue weight.

    Over the course of 2 weeks of testing, the tundra avg. 13.2mpg non towing and 9.1 while towing. The Sierra got 12.2mpg NT and 8.9 while towing.

    Since this was a towing test, the Tundra excelled at handling the tongue weight, pulling up grades, and towing stability. They commented the Tundra's towing performance felt more like a 3/4 ton than a 1/2 ton with the way the boat felt much smaller behind it than the other trucks.

    Surprisingly, the titan won the 0-30, and 0-60 times, beating all the other trucks by nearly a second or more to 60. The toyota posted by far the best 40-60 times while towing. The toyota posted a 7.7 second 40-60 time where as the sierra was 12.3 (the slowest of the bunch) that's a huge difference and a prime example where the sierra is hamstrung by it's gearing. Ironically, all of the OHC engines in the test had torque peaks under 4000rpm. The titan's 385lb-ft of torque comes at 3400rpm vs. GMs 6.0 375lb-ft @ 4300rpm, that's a big difference and partially explains the performance difference. So much for the torque advantages of OHV.

    Time will tell if the Tundra will hold up, but you can't deny it is capable truck.
  • blufz1blufz1 Posts: 2,045
    Good post w/ facts not conversation. Thanks!
  • The Toyota Tundra looks better, gets better mileage, the resale is way better, and the truck has more balls. The overall powertrain destroys the American competition.

    Not to mention the Tundra isn't an American made piece of junk. :)

    I think it's laughable when the American made truck fans constantly use the same lines like the Toyota needs a FBF, or the "interior is ugly." It's all they have left. It kind of reminds me of the Bush administration constantly using terms like "Hold the course" "Weapons of mass destruction" to brainwash the sheep into believing lies.

    Anybody who looks at the Tundra knows the Interior is by FAR better than any truck to date. It is FAR from ugly in any way. But they will keep reinforcing the point saying the "Interior is ugly" so they eventually believe it themselves. It's laughable!

    Oh and the mighty Duramax diesel? It's built by Isuzu. Another [non-permissible content removed] company. If Chevy wouldnt of bought duramax from Isuzu they wouldn't even have that.

    Now the thread has switched to gap tolerances? LOL!! American made companies have always had the worst gap tolerances by far no questions asked.

    Walk up to any Toyota, Lexus, Honda, Infiniti, Acura and check out the gaps and then look at a ford taurus or a Pontiac Grand Prix or piece of crap g6.

    American made vehicles are a joke. I have to laugh when I see people blow thousands on them. There not worth anything.
  • pmuscepmusce Posts: 132
    Here are the February 2007 Sales. I don't have numbers for Ram yet. A couple of observations:

    - Silverado outsold F-Series. Thats huge
    - The GMT900's are dominating the market

    Silverado
    Feb 2007 - 58696
    Feb 2006 - 46387
    Up 26.5%

    F-Series
    Feb 2007 - 55251
    Feb 2006 - 62862
    Down 12.1%

    Sierra
    Feb 2007 - 18140
    Feb 2006 - 14787
    Up 22.7%

    Tundra
    Feb 2007 - 9669
    Feb 2006 - 10566
    Down 8.5%

    Titan
    Feb 2007 - 6058
    Feb 2006 - 7009
    Down 13.6%
  • fshifshi Posts: 57
    you have too much OPINION in your post. "American made vehicles are a joke, I have to laugh when I see people blow thousands on them, there not worth anything"

    This harsh statement almost immediately disqualify you from making objective comparison between a forign brand with any domestic brand.
  • pmuscepmusce Posts: 132
    There was some good, intellictual debate going on in this thread until I read your post.
  • fshifshi Posts: 57
    this is what AMERICAN vote for the trucks, LOUDLY.
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    "...where as the sierra was 12.3 (the slowest of the bunch) that's a huge difference and a prime example where the sierra is hamstrung by it's gearing."

    I was very surprised by that result. I was expecting the Tundra to have a slight advantage in that kind of test with the Titan and Sierra very close behind. I figured the F150 would be bringing up the rear....
  • The Toyota Tundra goes 0-60 in 6.4 seconds?

    That's faster than most of my cars!!

    Truly awesome!
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    "The Toyota Tundra goes 0-60 in 6.4 seconds?

    That's faster than most of my cars!!

    Truly awesome!"


    :confuse:

    Personally, for trucks I'm more impressed by acceleration times when either hauling or towing a load; since this would be a better indication of how the vehicle performs when actually working.

    How well the thing scoots when being used essentially as a commuter vehicle is kinda pointless IMO. Kinda like discussing towing capacity of a Mustang......

    If all you wanna do is go fast, there's lots more suitable vehicles on the market than either the Tundra or Silverado.
  • fshifshi Posts: 57
    I know how to type in complete sentence, but I have no interest in typing in anything that makes YOUR sense.

    As an asian, I have driven many toyota/honda cars/suvs. Now I own a cts, and an envoy. I can attest that domestic cars are not inferior to toy/honda vehicles, they acutally give me less headache than my previous camry (bought new).

    The way you talk about tundra is very much like the way people (same group of people) talked about titan several years back. Has titan made a big dent on Silverado/F150 as someone would hope? Nissan is laying off assemply workers for the titan now. Calm down, same thing will happen to YOUR tundra ...

    hehe, I have not done the spelling check. I did not know that is your hobby.
  • maple2maple2 Posts: 177
    The Toyota Tundra looks better, gets better mileage, the resale is way better, and the truck has more balls. The overall powertrain destroys the American competition.

    Looks better? not to me but thats subjective, gets better gas mileage? neither one gets good gas milage if you want gas milage get a moped. More balls, il give you that one for now. Overall powertrain destroys American competition, laughable to say the least, cmon lets be reasonable here the chevy powertrains are tried tested and guess what, they hold up. Do you have any data to show you the reliability of this 5.7l powerhouse over the long haul? Of course you dont. How about this new 6 speed tranny how do they hold up after 100k miles? nobody knows the answer to that, we will just have to wait and see. The 6 speed camry has more than its share of problems that toyota still cant get right,what makes you think that the tundra will be different? Im not saying they will have problems but it is certainly possible. In 5-7 years you might be able to make a statement like "overall powertrain destroys American competition" (if warranted) but not today you cant.

    Walk up to any Toyota, Lexus, Honda, Infiniti, Acura and check out the gaps and then look at a ford taurus or a Pontiac Grand Prix or piece of crap g6.

    How about I just walk up to a tundra and a silverado since I only drive trucks and that is what we are talking about. Hmmm tundra has big gaps silverado has small gaps. but they did that on purpose, right. As someone else posted probably to accomodate the flexing of the frame so the panels dont rub. Toyota engineering at its finest. :P
  • dieselonedieselone Posts: 5,650
    I was very surprised by that result. I was expecting the Tundra to have a slight advantage in that kind of test with the Titan and Sierra very close behind. I figured the F150 would be bringing up the rear....

    The f150 posted a 12 flat 40-60 time. The Dodge was 10.8 and the titan 10.1 seconds

    The Sierra did post better acceleration numbers than the f150 in the 0-30 and 0-60 tests.

    The Sierra posted the best braking results while towing, stopping from 55mph in 162' vs. 172' with the Tundra.

    As for comparing reliability, who knows. The trans in my suburban didn't make it to 45k before needing a rebuild and I personally know 4 other people with 1/2 ton based GM vehicles that have had transmissions (4l60e) die under 80k miles, 3 were under 50k. What we all have in common is, we all tow boats.
  • Interesting post.......You must not be familiar with R.L. Polk. The latest results show that the domestic manufacturers do quite well when you look at who repeat buys a model, make or manufacturer.

    GM is number one for the manufacturers and the Ford F-150 is number one for the pickups. There must be some very satisfied customers out there somewhere.

    What is good about this survey is that it measures where people actually put their money and not just some subjective dribble like Consumer Reports.
  • toykickstoykicks Posts: 95
    careful there thats your opinion vs. 1.3 million other people ;)
  • drfilldrfill Posts: 2,484
    Full-ramp up won't be until April, at the earliest.

    I think the Thundra goes should be just south of Sierra sales, around 15k a month this year, and 20k next year.

    2007 Tundra didn't officially sell until 2/12.

    DrFill
  • joeshmowjoeshmow Posts: 9
    "Over the course of 2 weeks of testing, the tundra avg. 13.2mpg non towing and 9.1 while towing. The Sierra got 12.2mpg NT and 8.9 while towing."

    USA Today road tested the new Chevy "fuel-efficient" engine and they got a very disappointing 12 MPG combined city and highway, towing nothing. I get about 15 MPG with my '97 F150 4WD big V8, 300,000 miles. Sounds like these new trucks are all getting even worse MPG's than ever!
  • pmuscepmusce Posts: 132
    Yeah, I would agree that Tundar is still in ramp up mode. I would think it will be around April-May until their sales show some bigger gains. It will be interesting to see where the sales come from. Do you think Tacoma sales will be affected at all by the new Tundra?
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Actually there are a lot of current Tundra owners that think this new Gen is too big. They don't want anything bigger than what they have. When these start to get 8-10 years old and 200K miles these owners are going to have to make a decision about a 'nearly-as-big' Tacoma or a HUGE Tundra. All the other options are just as big.
  • drfilldrfill Posts: 2,484
    That's probably the percentage that may need a full-size, but don't want to buy a domestic, and can use the good mid-size until the Tundra came out.

    Was standing next to a 2000 Tacoma the other day. The current tacoma is MUCH larger than that. You can really see the difference between compact and mid-size.

    DrFill
  • jreaganjreagan Posts: 285
    You cannot go on Chevy's Build/Price module and actually build a Silverado with this option. They don't offer it.

    Just because their "Build Module" doesn't let You, does NOT mean you cannot order it. GO TO A CHEVY DEALER and ask them, I will bet you one of these trucks that you are WRONG, are we on?

    I drove one for crying out loud!!! What more proof do I need than that? I have told you this SEVERAL times, why do you still deny it and make this BS claim? Because a stupid internet build module says so? Sheesh.
  • jreaganjreagan Posts: 285
    Nice post, care to reply Belias? I would like to hear it too.
    Other than slightly more power and a 6-speed tranny (which is yet unproven in the long haul and GM has one and will be phasing it in as std this year). What advantages does the Tundra have over the GM's?
    Look at the big picture, and the facts and overall, the GM is clearly superior. Toyota still has to prove it is as good/better, until then GM is better, period.
This discussion has been closed.