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Toyota Tundra vs. Chevrolet Silverado

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Comments

  • beliasbelias Posts: 316
    I think you're better off going to Chevy and Toyota's web sites for accurate information. Not that Edmund's is bad but keep in mind that both of these trucks are new and obviously information can be easily misrepresented.
    On Toyota's trucks, trailer hitch is standard on all V-8s and it is attached to the frame of the vehicle as well. Limited slip differential is standard on all Tundras.
    For future reference, go to the actual manufacturer's web site. Why on earth would you rely on specs produced by others instead?
    As for the comparison, there are literally hundreds of different ways to compare because of all of the bed lengths, cab options, etc.
    They both seem to compare quite well to each other and I honestly can't see much for price difference except that the Tundra starts at a higher price (though includes more with it).
    So again, take something specific and see where either truck has an advantage. Here is an obvious one; the Tundra has a 6-speed transmission on its 5.7L engine as opposed to Chevy's 4-speed transmission.
    Find something like that and see what you can produce.
  • ggesqggesq Posts: 701
    has deteriorated into talking about OT stuff e.g. the Denali and how Edmunds' is biased, name calling and how many workers are employed by GM and Toyota. :sick:
  • We are looking for one with haul to work farm. Folks is postin lots of paper facts on them tundra ones, but we are lookin for them folks that is worked them some. Anyone workin em have something to tell on them ones? How bout that fella with that corn farm? Did you work that tundra at that corn farm? Did it haul and not break? Has anyone looked up under them new ones to see if they have them t100 pumkins? Not interested in what them magazines have to tell, need some one to use them eyes for this one now. So, is anyone workin em, and if so, what say? Give us a tell on how them ones worked. Good luck on this one now!
  • beliasbelias Posts: 316
    You know, as I read many of these posts, it seems to me that geo9 is straddling the line of being a troll. Typically trolls just post inflammatory remarks, misrepresent information, and really just poke at people and not deal with the issues at hand to create controversy and stir up debate. Not sure if he is all-the-way there though, but I know that name-calling and references to a person's sexual orientation (or at least the insunation of it) are certainly points in favor of making that argument.
    Truly though, I think there is just a lack of ability to criticize the Tundra based on its merits. Lets face it, most manufacturers would love to take that truck and put their own badges on it. But that doesn't mean its perfect, its got good competition from the Silverado. I just don't see the Silveraldo being better in any category so far except starting price. At best it is equal to the Tundra given what we know about both vehicles. That is good for everyone concerned.
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    "Please check this Edmunds link and comparo. on the
    Rado and tundra...........
    NO hitch or locker. Heck N/A means NOT avail. right? "


    Wow.

    You don't know the difference between a locking differential and a limited slip differential? Because previously, you said the Tundra doesn't have a limited slip.

    Yes, Edmunds is wrong about the hitch. The towing package (which, as I understand is standard on the V8 models) includes a hitch RECEIVER. Maybe Toyota doesn't inlude the actual hitch and ball. Big whoop. Probably because there are several sizes and drops available depending on what the owner intends to tow and the fact that one can get a hitch at WalMart for around $10.
  • beliasbelias Posts: 316
    Hey framer_rube,
    You've been asking the same questions and making the same statements as far back as you've posted in this forum. What the heck can somebody say? No, the "pumpkin" isn't from the T100 (that was mentioned about a dozen times already), it is 10.5" in diameter and is all-new from Toyota. I don't know how many times the payload/towing information can possibly be posted before you actually read and acknowledge it. Even if somebody has used the Tundra for hauling, what kind of time-frame would be meaningful to you anyway? The truck is barely out and few people have had the chance to fully evaluate it or use it to its potential. You can only estimate from reviews and specs as to what it can possibly do. However, judging from the fact that it has outperformed other challenges in most areas, I think it is safe to say that, at the very least, it appears to be as good or better than most every truck out there. You could do much worse with Dodge, Nissan, and even some Ford models...
  • How is folks to work them ones without that hitch? Is that factory givin that hint here? Wonder if that warrenty on them ones is voided out if that hitch is added to them. How is folks to haul without that hitch? This is a mystery for sure now... any folks know? Good luck on this one now!
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    Since the new Tundra has just now gone on sale, I don't think you'll find "them folks that is worked them some". Try checking in again in 6 months.

    "Has anyone looked up under them new ones to see if they have them t100 pumkins?"

    The T100 used a 8.2" rear. The new Tundra has a 9.5" rear on the V6 and small V8 models; the 5.7l V8 has a larger 10.5" rear. I doubt that either a 9.5" or 10.5" ring/pinion will fit in a pumpkin made for a 8.2" rear.
  • Thanks for that reply on them ones Belias... but was lookin for folks who is workin em, not readin on em. We work that farm with these trucks, so we need one that works well, not reads well in them magazines. As for them pumpkins, was lookin for folks who is really eye balled them ones. Heard tells on them older tundra only to find out that them ones was using that t100 drivetrains. Don't need to be tricked on this one now, thats for sure! Have you measured them ones up and eye balled em? If so, give us a tell, but not lookin for no book readin on this one now. Lookin for folks who is workin them ones, don't need no book measurements now. Good luck on this one now!
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    "How is folks to work them ones without that hitch?"

    Get a grip.

    The Tundra includes a 2" receiver hitch. Do you have any clue as to the number of available hitches/ball combinations to fit a 2" receiver hitch? Which one should Toyota offer?

    Just out of curiousity: can someone specify which hitch drop and ball is included on the Chevy/GMC?
  • i have driven both the new 5.7 tundra and all of the other 1/2 ton trucks side by side.. loaded with 1000lbs payload.. and towing 3500 lbs with payload.. my opinion is that the chevy-gmc product is comparable (2007) with the tundra.. all others are far back.. imo the tundra with its 6spd tranny, bigger brakes, vsc trac, bigger rear end is the better value/buy/product than the chev.. however the chev is still a nice product..btw the tundra smoked them all in acceleration..
  • Once again, you are ignorant of the facts. The only UAW members employed by Toyota are the ones at the GM-Toyota joint venture plant in Freemont, CA (NUMMI). The Flat Rock, MI plant owned by Mazda/Ford also has UAW members. Otherwise, NONE of the foreign owned plants have UAW members.
    Some of the best jobs in the US auto industry are not the UAW factory jobs, but the design, engineering, and R&D jobs that are NON-UAW salaried workers. The fact is that Toyota does much of this work outside the country. There is a small tech center in Ann Arbor, MI, but no where near as big as even the DCX Tech Center in Auburn Hills, MI, much less Ford's campus in Dearborn, or GM's in Detroit and Warren, MI. My numbers include salaried and hourly jobs, non-union and union. The source for those numbers are the individual companies, Automotive News, and the AIAM.

    The 70% number is as of 2005 (source = Automotive News).

    The first transplant was built by Honda in Marysville, OH and started producing Accords in 1981. That's why I started from 1980.

    YOU (not me) brought up that Toyota is such an American company. I'm just trying to show the point that the Big 3 are still (BY FAR) the most American companies, producing the most vehicles, employing the most people, and paying the most taxes in this country.
    Yes, Toyota is building plants here. One of their plants got such a large tax break that EACH JOB costs the state $360,000 in tax incentives.

    Both the Tundra and the Silverado are great products. My whole point here is that you CANNOT say the Tundra is "more American" than the GM trucks. More parts are coming from overseas. Yes, this is true. It's part of globalization. Ultimately, more $$ of a Tundra's sale go to Japan than $$ of GM truck. That's a fact.

    I have facts to compare, as you can see. And the facts support my point.
  • geo9geo9 Posts: 739
    I guess I have to be literal :
    Trailer hitch........aka Trailering Platform aka class 4
    or whichever weight rated hitch PLATFORM that is installed. No vehicle mfr. gives you the actual
    "hitch" aka ball and leveling bar assembly...........

    Locker, Posi aka limited slip nowadays.
    Limited slip is preferred because a true locker does
    not allow for unequal wheel turning (like rounding a
    corner) without axle hop or chatter.
    The best true locker applications are mainly for drag racing.
    No light truck (or car) mfrd.that I know of has a true locking rearend anymore.
    Back in the dark ages mfrs. had their own trade names:
    Safe-t-trac, Traction lock

    Sorry to confuse you...........
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    This is too funny.

    Toyota Tundra with TOW PACKAGE (which is standard equipment on V8 models) includes the following:

    "V8 Tow Package [2]
    Heavy-duty tow hitch receiver, 7-pin connector, Trailer brake controller prewire, Supplemental transmission cooler, TOW/HAUL mode (not available with 4.7L V8), Automatic-transmission temperature gauge, 4.100 rear axle ratio (on 4.7L models) or 4.300 rear, axle ratio (on 5.7L models)"

    http://www.toyota.com/tundra/models.html

    I know you may soil your computer actually (gasp) LOOKING at the info on Toyota's website. But if Toyota says the V8 models include a hitch receiver, I don't know why you guys continue to foist the crap about not having a hitch.

    "Locker, Posi aka limited slip nowadays.
    Limited slip is preferred because a true locker does
    not allow for unequal wheel turning (like rounding a
    corner) without axle hop or chatter.
    The best true locker applications are mainly for drag racing.
    No light truck (or car) mfrd.that I know of has a true locking rearend anymore. "


    Again, too funny. There is a BIG difference between a locker rear-end and a limited-slip. I'm sure that others will tell you this as well. Just how towing inclined ARE YOU if you don't know this?

    BTW - The new GM's DO HAVE an automatic locker rear-end rather than a limited slip.
  • geo9geo9 Posts: 739
    The towing figures in post 257 are comparing the
    tundras 5.7 vs. 4.8 figures............

    Lets do 4x4 reg. cab. short box with the 4.7 and 4.8 engines
    tundra: 8200 lbs.
    Silverado: 8900 lbs.

    RORR:
    I DO know how to tow and have a Chevy 2500 to do it with !
    You see I ACTUALLY OWN a truck !!!!!!!!!!!
    My camper, boat, or watercraft (I would refer to them as
    "jetskis" but I must remember to be "literal" so NOT to
    confuse anyone) need to be towed.

    And yes I know what a true LOCKING REAR is.........
    Even they are not installed in pass.cars or light trucks
    anymore...........
  • beliasbelias Posts: 316
    If you want the best towing specs, compare the "Best" towing models... do Tundra's 5.7L to Chevy's 6.0. The highest numbers for each are 10,800 and 10,500 lbs. Not much difference...
  • Rorr, edmunds tells that them tundra ones don't come with that hitch now. Guessin that edmunds knows them ones, and they say no hitch. Seems like workin them without that hitch mean lack of that haul. Now if folks go to addin that hitch, what happens to that warranty on em? We haul 7 to 8 tabacco trains nose to tail. Don't need to be bustin one of them ones doin this without that factory warrenty now. Seems like them older tundras had some hitch mystery too. Have you seen them new ones with that factory hitch? How bout them pumpkins, they full size? Need to know that we can work em at that farm now. Lookin for folks who eye balled em, not read on em. Good luck on this one now!
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    "Rorr, edmunds tells that them tundra ones don't come with that hitch now."

    Edmunds is wrong.
  • all v8 tundras come with tow package standard!! that information direct from toyota corporate.. they decided two weeks ago to make it standard.. that is why there is a discrepancy.. all standard...
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Earth to geo....

    Edmunds is not the final source for information. There is an outside possibility their data is not completely up-to-date ( they are missing all the information on the 5.7L introduced last month )...Hellooo. Again have you been asleep for a year or two. You really didn't know about any of this?

    The Toyota website is the source. It won't bite you or leave a scarlet letter on your forehead if you click on the Toyota site. It's amazing what you'll find on the competition's website, such as the fact that GM has taken away the top towing capacity from the Silvy and given it to the Sierra. It's made the Silvy very middle of the pack.

    Also note the PRICES AND the Features that are STANDARD on
    the Silverado and either the tundra
    doesn't offer or must be purchased on a more expensive "package".....................


    please explain this gibberish.

    Here is what the Silverado is lacking in standard equipment
    6 spd tranny
    Max Trailering Package ( in the Sierra not the Silvy )
    auto LSD
    Side and Curtain airbags
    Stability control / Trac control
    Brake assist
    Tailgate damper

    When you add all this to bring the Silvy near the Tundra ( the Silvy still can't tow more than 9000# ) the pricing tops out around $35000 vs $33000 for the Tundra. The Sierra with similar equipment to the Tundra ends up around $37000 vs $33000 for the Tundra.

    This is going to be a tough fight..rebates coming soon on the GM twins.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    To be direct... see you in 3 years.

    The new Tundra's with the biggest rearend in the field is just hitting the street, fields this week. Go drive one. You will be shocked.
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Posts: 2,770
    Funny. Very funny. I think what you have to remember is that Ford, Chevy, and Dodge ALL offer LIGHT DUTY pickups that can tow FAR more than the Toyota. Yes, these are the 1 Ton versions of the SILVERADO, RAM, and F SERIES. However, if you want to compare the "TUNDRA" with the "SILVERADO", "F-SERIES", "RAM", etc, you have to compare ALL models in the lineup. Otherwise, offer the disclaimer that you are comparing 1/2 ton models ONLY!!! Also, metion that Toyota offers NOTHING MORE THAN A 1/2 TON, and NO DIESEL (It's coming doesn't cut it if someone wants one now). If you want to compare gas engines, both Ford and GM offer gas engines with FAR MORE TORQUE than the Tundra, and can be had in a 3/4 ton 2wd standard cab, not just a Dually (ALSO, something Toyota doesn't offer). BTW, Chevy DOES offer a 6 speed auto. It's made by ALLISON- a division of GM- and it's more bulletproof than ANY reputation Toyota thinks it has!!!
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Well that's exactly what I said in my post.

    If you need to tow more than what's shown in that chart then you need a diesel. For the present in the 1/2-ton segment the Tundra is the Boss in just about every performance category. The others are close ( Sierra ), in the middle ( Silvy /Titan ) or not in the same class ( F150 / Ram ).

    The GM/Isuzu DuraMax diesel with the Allison tranny is Boss in the diesel category.
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    "I think what you have to remember is that Ford, Chevy, and Dodge ALL offer LIGHT DUTY pickups that can tow FAR more than the Toyota. Yes, these are the 1 Ton versions of the SILVERADO, RAM, and F SERIES."

    Yes. The Tundra 1/2ton truck doesn't tow as much as the competition's 1 ton versions. SURPRISE!!!!

    "However, if you want to compare the "TUNDRA" with the "SILVERADO", "F-SERIES", "RAM", etc, you have to compare ALL models in the lineup. Otherwise, offer the disclaimer that you are comparing 1/2 ton models ONLY!!!"

    Fair enough.

    The new '07 1/2 ton Toyota Tundra compares very well with the new '07 1/2 GMC Sierra/Chevy Silverado. The new '07 1/2 ton Toyota Tundra is substantially better than the 1/2 ton offerings from Ford and Dodge.

    Disclaimer: these claims only apply to 1/2 ton models. Expect similar claims when Toyota releases HD versions of the Tundra. If someone wants a 1 ton or diesel truck NOW, they can skip the Toyota dealer.

    "If you want to compare gas engines, both Ford and GM offer gas engines with FAR MORE TORQUE than the Tundra, and can be had in a 3/4 ton 2wd standard cab, not just a Dually (ALSO, something Toyota doesn't offer)"

    I thought we were comparing 1/2 ton versions? Are you claiming that only 3/4 ton and above are "real" trucks?

    FYI - the 1/2 ton market in the this country is HUGE. The Toyota Tundra compares VERY favorably with other HALF TON trucks. Personally, I think it would behoove the domestic fans if they pressured their favorite makes to BUILD A BETTER HALF TON, rather than pointing out Toyota doesn't make a 3/4 or 1 ton.

    What will be your defense when Toyota DOES begin offering 3/4 and 1 ton models? That they don't build something equivalent to a F450?
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    I get a sense that some feel that they are being backed into a corner. 'Well OK the 1/2 segment isn't really that important anyway.'

    I think that the detroiters have intentionally let the 1/2 ton segment 'get stale' over the last 10 years because they had it all to themselves essentially. Hey if you want a 'real truck' get an HD diesel. These are also much more profitable for the 3 with a diesel markup of $5000 - $8000 over their top price for a 1/2-tonner.

    This letting a segment 'get stale' situation sounds awfully familiar to the midsized and compact auto situation of the 80's and 90's. 'Well these segments aren't that profitable anyway so we'll just let the Asians have them.'

    So do GM/F/D have the will, the incentive and the funds to fight over this 1/2 ton segment or will they retreat to the HD segment? GM has two winners with its T900's. Ford and Dodge need injections of Viagra ( cash ) and backbone to stay the course try to leap over the four above them.
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Posts: 2,770
    No, nobody is saying the 1/2 ton segment isn't important. In fact w/o numbers, I'd be willing to bet that 2/3 to 3/4 of all trucks sold under the Ram, Silverado, and F names are 1/2 tonners. However, with all the competition, and this goes back probably when Dodge came out w/ the newer Ram in '94, everybody started pushing the envelope in regards to towing, payload, hp, etc. Years ago, a towing capacity of 10,000 lbs was reserved for 1 Ton trucks. Today, EVERYBODY has to "have" a 10,000 tow cap. Since when does a 1/2 Ton truck have the capability to haul over 2000 lbs? Last time I checked, 2000 lbs was 1 TON!!! Everybody, not just Toyota, is blurring the lines of what was 1/2, 3/4, and 1 ton trucks. IMO If you can tow 14,15,16,000lbs thats medium duty (thats old school) All the big 3's 1 ton rigs can tow in that range. So obviously, the lines have been blurred. Hell, a Subaru Outback is classified as a truck !!!! All I'm saying is that in the way we have been accustomed to classifying trucks in this country (1/2, 3/4 and 1 Ton), Toyota seems to be trying to be everything to everybody with 1 "model", while the big three have 3 "models" each. I don't think it would take much to just offer an 8.0 liter V-8 in the silverado 1/2 ton, or the Duramax for that matter either.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Valid points.

    GM has two engines ( 6.0L & 6.2L ) that approach or exceed the Tundra 5.7L. Howwever for now it seems that they are limiting the availability of both these engines in the new T900's. By doing this they are making the 5.3L the workhorse to fight the battle against the 5.7L Tundra engine.

    In another forum here back in the Fall a poster who worked in GM's heavy duty plant noted that since 2001 GM has moved away from making the 6.0L engines toward more DuraMax diesels. GM might be able to drop an 8.0L into a few vehicles but that's not representative of what the average buyer could drop into any store and buy on a moments notice.

    I don't see the point about the Tundra being one model vs three from the others. It only competes in the 1/2 ton segment ( now ). No one is saying that the new Tundra is comparable to the HD vehicles. I think that all that's being said is that the 1/2 ton segment now means a truck with a tow rating of 8000-11000# and a Payload rating of 1200-2000#. In this range the Tundra is the performance leader.
  • How is there always that mystery on that hitch with them tundra ones now? Seem to recall same hitch mystery on that older tundra limited ones now. Same tells then as now. Is that hitch factory or is them dealers addin that hitch later? Bet them dealers be addin them ones, and not that factory. Always a mystery with that hitch on them tundra ones, facts is facts. What say, is that tundra hitch factory or dealer? If not factory, what does this tell us all? Good luck on this one now!
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,668
    i think the point being made is it is not really a 1/2 ton truck. it is being marketed as that, though. toyota sold 1 ton pickups here in the states years ago. seems to me they were a bit smaller. ;)
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    It is just a 1/2 ton truck nothing more.

    Now if Toyota has discovered a small vein of buyers that want a 1/2 ton truck that does more than the 'usual suspects', a group of buyers who were being forced into HD vehicles at a $5000-$8000 premium, then it may have success mining this small profitable subsegment.

    If this subsegment has been forced into 3/4 ton HD diesels because the 'usual suspects' cutoff capability around 7500# of towing and 1500# of payload then the Tundra might be able to save some of these users $5000-$10000 by staying with a 'super 1/2 tonner'. Ditto the Sierra.
This discussion has been closed.