Subaru Crew Problems & Solutions

ateixeira

Reminds me of my Escort. The speedo cable would make a chunk-chunk noise that was speed dependent. The car was totalled before I got a chance to fix it.

-juice

kens

The heavy clutch can be just from age. I've been told that clutches get heavier with age due to a build up of debris throughout the system. A new clutch feels like a knife cutting through butter.

On the other hand, if you have an early production 98, you may have one of the older clutch assemblies that are indeed heavier.

Ken

bat1161

This may sound like a silly question, but I figure better to ask rather than guess. I recently switched to Mobil1 5W30 oil; on my next change should I use 10w30, or stick to the 5W? I want to pick up a case to save a little $$, but which one? I admit to being confused by the owners manual, that's why I'm asking.
TIA
Mark

ateixeira

I believe the 5 is what's recommended nowadays. If you're in a really hot climate, I'd use 10w30 though.

-juice

bigfrank3

I use Mobil1 5W30 here in MA, and it should work fine for you in NY.

Regards,
Frank

paisan

I use that in my Trooper about 3 miles from your place!

-mike

bat1161

Thanks guys! For some reason I thought that the 5W30 is for one time of the year, and that 10W is another. It didn't make sense switching back and forth, especially if with the synthetic the oil changes are done every 7500 miles as opposed to 3000. Like I said, this is how I learn, by asking. BTW, someone on the I-Club posted that Kmart has Mobil 1 in the gallon container on sale for $14.98.

Mark

fibber2

Thanks guys for setting me straight. I should have done more checking before going off on such a tangent. Yes, the specs are on the sticker under the hood. Curious that they are 'cold' specs. My previous 'rides' have called out lash on a hot engine. Obviously cold is a lot easier to handle, especially if you are setting it up after a rebuild, or extended waiting time. I guess that I was also thrown off by not having an interval specifically mentioned in the service schedule.

So other than those who have installed hotter cams, or done other major work, has anyone adjusted valves as a maintenance / precaution move??

Steve

sing4me

Hi all,

I've owned a 98 OB wagon since November and have been having it serviced at the local dealer. The service dept gave me a maintenance schedule but it's THEIRS (as in, they included their own little bells and whistles). The maintenance schedule I pulled off Edmunds doesn't match the dealer's schedule. My owner's manual doesn't have a maintenance schedule in it.

Does Subaru publish a maintenance schedule and if so, how can I get one?

Many thanks.

Elizabeth Templeton

[Deleted User]

Hi, Elizabeth.

To get a manufacturer's recommended maintenance schedule, go to www.subaru.com.

At the main website, place your mouse cursor over Owners. A submenu will appear underneath. Place your mouse cursor over Subaru Care. Another submenu will appear. Click on Maintenance Schedules.

That will take you to a listing of different years. Click on 1998, then click on "Click here for Schedule of 1998MY Federal Specification Vehicles."

That will take you to the maintenance chart.

Ty

kens

Elizabeth,

As you've suspected, the dealer throws in a bunch of "preventative" maintenance items to increase their margins. You'll be suprised at how little maintenance is required on the official maintenance schedule.

Ken

dmanzi

I've got a 2000 Outback wagon, and it's now in the shop for its second major repair in two months. It has less than 50K on it, and its already had both head gaskets replaced. Now the heater coil inside the car has failed, and turned my car into a moving steambath. Before that there were several minor problems, like the seat heaters failing. Do I have a lemon? Have these cars slipped? I'm looking at a repair bill of over $1,000, since, according to the dealer, the heater coil isn't covered. I believe it should be, since its part of the cooling system.

paisan

I don't believe the cooling system is covered under the powertrain warranty. But I could be wrong.

-mike

kens

Sorry to hear about all your problems. You might want to give Subaru customer support a call at 1-800-SUBARU3 and see if they can help out in any way.

Have all your previous problems been addressed, however? Technically, a lemon is defined when a specific problem can not be repaired in a "reasonable" amount of tries/time.

Ken

bluesubie

Elizabeth - Since you're in NJ, I highly recommend Flemington Subaru if you're within an hour or so.
They generally go by the book and have very good service, techs and prices. Their major services (15k, 30k, etc.) are about $100 cheaper than my previous dealer. Plus they'll give you a loaner on the major services no matter where you bought the car.
My previous dealer loved those add-ons and Flemington goes pretty close to the book. IIRC, the only extra they added for my 60k was fuel additive.

-Dennis

hypov

Elizabeth-

The schedule is available on-line @ http://my.subaru.com

I think you can access the schedule from the main website too.

-Dave

edit: I checked, and it is available in the main website http://www.subaru.com/owners/care/schedules/middle.html

dmanzi

Previous issues have been taken care of, but I've never owned a car that's been in the shop asmuch as this one. Seat heaters fail, temperature controls fail, head gaskets, heater coils, won't stay aligned, and the list goes on. I know there's a technical definition for "lemon." But this car, by my definition, stinks and is a lemon. It's my last Subaru, for certain. There's something wrong when I'm stuck for a $1,000 repair on a two year old car for a component that simply shouldn't fail. By comparison, the Dodge in my garage that's older has never neede anything but an oil change.

cautiouswp

I'm not an owner yet but I am gathering information before my purchase.

I'm looking for information from owners with 15k to 25k miles regarding your routine service experiences.

1. Are you following the recommendations of Subaru or the dealer?

2. What is your experience regarding cost for routine service.

3. Are the dealers suggesting changing filters, wiper blades, brake pads, etc. prematurely?

4. How difficult is access to the oil filter? .....gas filter? ......air filter? ...etc.?

5. Do you void the warranty if you perform routine maintenance yourself?

In the past my experience has been that following routine service at the dealer something always gets messed up.

I would appreciate your input.

locke2c

41k on my '99 2.5RS, can I answer?

1. Subaru. dealer has done 1 warranty repair and 1 service on my car (first oil change, it was a freebie)

2. Dealer mails me offers every few months for service at laughably high prices. I buy parts from internet/mail order Subaru dealers at significant discounts and perform all maintenance myself.

3. n/a

4. oil filter is extremely easy, within arm's reach from the front bumper very near the front of the block. even though my Impreza is lowered 2" I can change the oil without jacking the car and am done in 10 minutes. fuel filter is in the engine bay, right next to washer reservoir. changed that in 5 minutes for 30k service. air filter is on passenger side near ABS controller. changed that once with Subaru replacement part, the next time replaced it with an AMSOil reusable foam filter.

5. ABSOLUTELY NOT. Keep your receipts and log your service items on my.subaru.com

-Colin

kens

68K on a '98 Forester, but here are my answers:

1. Subaru
2. Dealer recommended service is always high due to the extra items thrown in. I'm not as mechanically inclined as Colin so I have the dealer do certain items (spark plugs, coolant flush, brake fluids, etc.). I personally have been doing oil/filter, air filter and other minor items on my own.
3. I've found that dealers tend to recommend items like timing belts before they're needed. They tend to stick to schedules for older Subaru models.
4. Easy, as Colin wrote.
5. Not at all

Ken

subaru_team

I'd really like to see if we can help you in some way. Please make sure you call.

Patti

subaru_team

Ditto Ken and Colin's post.

Patti

shortlid

This company is offering FREE Oil Analysis to get there name out!! Take advantage fellow import lovers!!

http://www.pdma.com/sample.htm

Joel

bluesubie

1. Subaru. I take my car to the dealer for the major services (30k, 60k). Luckily, my dealer is almost "spot on" with the manual.
2. It varies by dealer. Over $100 on the major services.
3. Current one, no. Previous one, yes.
4. Oil and air filters are easy. Prior to this car, the only maintenance I performed on my own was helping my dad change oil when I was a teenager (20 yrs. ago).
5. No.

Luckily, I'm within 25 minutes of 4 Subaru dealers. I tried them all and stuck with the one I like.

-Dennis

cliffy1

OK, another Toyota perspective incoming so be warned:

No matter the manufacturer, I strongly recommend using the dealership for maintenance. This is not because I think they always do a better job, but if they do mess something up, you have a much easier way to address the problem. For instance, if you take the car to your local quick lube place and they fail to install the oil filter correctly and you get a small leak, this could eventually lead to severe engine damage. It might not even be caught right away. When you take it to the dealer, they will claim (correctly) that proper maintenance was not done, even though you have receipts. You will be left holding the bag or going back to the quick lube place.

If, on the other hand, the dealer did all the maintenance, they can't deny a warranty claim for improper maintenance without indicting themselves. Most manufacturers do not require maintenance be done at their dealerships, but it is good protection for you.

paisan

Becuase ITS AGAINST THE LAW!

On a side note, Cliffy, I'm still waiting for the pitfalls of the Isuzus that you mentioned some time ago, but never produced these pitfalls. (I think it had to do with the 4wd/TOD system)

-mike

cliffy1

Sorry for even mentioning the Isuzu. Really. I further apologize to you that I will not be getting into the whole Isuzu thing here. I actually like some of their products but this is not the place to discuss it.

paisan

You can e-mail me off-line. Don't go making statements that you don't plan to defend. Or come over to the Isuzu topic and discuss it. I just want to know what the pitfalls are so that I can counter-act them with aftermarket or what-not.

-mike

ateixeira

To me a lemon is a case of "3 strikes you're out". In other words, 3 failed attempts to repair the exact same problem.

If you've had multiple problems, you have an unreliable car. That's not the same thing as a lemon. I think the big difference is that the dealer has been working with you and correcting the problems, and apparently each fix has worked. It stinks to have to pay for it, absolutely. Open up a case number and give Patti a call, maybe she can help out.

I do my own maintenance myself on both my cars, but my wife goes to a dealer for most major services. Guess what? Her car is the one giving us all the trouble! The cars I service are trouble-free.

I seriously doubt the dealer techs are as obsessive as I am. Do they really, truly look up the torque specs for the lug nuts for each vehicle, and adjust their air wrenches? I have yet to see a shop/dealer/factory that doesn't overtighten the oil drain plug, despite their published torque specs. Every time I find greasy finger prints inside.

Nothing against your dealership, Cliffy, maybe they do look up torque specs and wear latex gloves to keep the interior spotless. But I do all that and spend about 10-20% of the fees they charge, and end up with a more reliable car compared to our only dealer-serviced vehicle.

-juice

cliffy1

Don't worry, I didn't even think to take offense. I have learned that there are times when a customer benefits from using the dealership. In a choice between a "quick lube" place and the dealership, I always vote for the dealership for the reasons I mentioned. While a semi-skilled person can handle most maintenance problems better than a shop, you still run a risk that warranties could be denied if you can't prove you did the required maintenance.

Oh and by the way. I agree with you on the torque specs. In 8 years of working in several dealerships (I'm embarrassed to say exactly how many, but its more than 5) I have only seen one technician use a torque wrench on lug nuts. He happens to work at my current dealership.

dmanzi

Sorry if my messages seem disjointed, but I'm having trouble determining who is replying to me and who isn't. I have spoken with Subaru of America, and they offered no relief. The car will be fixed (again) tomorrow, and when I can, I'll be looking for a replacement. Not a Subaru, for sure. I've never had to spend this much to fix a car with less than 50K on it, and it's leaving a real sour taste. Maybe having to tell my 9 year old that the trip to Orlando is off this April has something to do with it. FWIW, the customer rep from Subaru was very polite, he simply couldn't help.

locke2c

And there I would agree with you Cliffy, I would advise any sane person to avoid quick lubes. Non-existent or poor formal training, no vested intereste in your vehicle, just bad news all around.

Change your oil yourself or have a dealer OR independent servicer do it. I mean a real shop, not a quick lube.

For things beyond oil and air filter changes, then definitely ask yourself: can I do this? If you have a manual or previous experience, the answer is probably yes. If you have doubts or don't have the time, again see a qualified service provider.

-Colin

paisan

Are bad. I have had excellent service at my local Quaker State place. In and out in like 15 minutes, never any problems. I make sure they put everything back properly etc. But after about 250K+ of Quick-Lube places w/o any problems. You have to be prudent in which one you choose though. I've been to some poor ones.

-mike

cliffy1

Before you bring your car in for an oil change, there is one thing you may want to do. Take a grease pencil and put a mark on your oil filter. When you get your car back, make sure that the oil is fresh and that the filter with the mark is gone.

This applies no matter if you use a dealer, service center or quick lube. It is very easy to do and will protect you down the road.

ateixeira

We agree there - the quick lube places are known to drain the tranny fluid instead of the engine oil on Subies. DOH!

I guess I don't worry about warranty denials because we have Patti. :-)

Good suggestion on the grease pencil.

David: I'm not sure how you expect people to respond. Doesn't sound like anything will make a difference. I was discussing the issue in general. Your case is unfortunate, and probably an exception. I can't blame you if you buy something else next time.

-juice

paisan

I e-mailed you privately re: Isuzu, check your mail.

edit:

Thanks for the response. Too bad you don't remember the details of the problem

-mike

bluesubie

I'd be wary of anyone (dealer or quick lube) that does oil changes too fast. After changing my own oil, I've noticed that it takes 10 minutes or more for all of the oil to drain. Most quick lubes have a limited warranty covering their work if that's a concern.

Before I started changing my oil, I had bad experiences at quick lube places and my former dealer.
Wal-Mart apparently tried to take off the tranny filter and damaged it. A few thousand miles later, most of the tranny oil leaked out and my wife had to call AAA. That dealer had the nerve to blame me.

The same dealer always overfilled both cars, and forgot to add gear oil (or enough) on my 15k visit.

-Dennis

owells

My experience at the local Subaru dealer for oil/filter service was worse than a quick lube. The tech used the wrong volume specs and overfilled the crankcase. Nor did they check/fill other fluids even though the work order specifically called for same. After two more tries contending with clueless and arrogant service writers and overfilled oil, I now do all oil changes myself. The dealer has a clean shop, however, and I can only hope that an upcoming 30k service goes better.

subaru_team

I did find your case. It is still open and your Customer Service Rep. is still working on it. Hang in there! I'm sure it will work out okay.

Patti

fibber2

Dave Manzi reports two head gasket changes, then a blown heater core. Sounds like combustion chamber gases are overpressurizing the cooling system to me. If the cap cannot vent the pressure fast enough, the next weak link is likely to blow.....

Steve

dmanzi

I was contacted by Subaru, and they have agreed to pay for my heter coil repair. For this, I am very grateful. Getting the part has been a problem, and the dealer still doesn't have it, but they hope to have it today. What I'm curious about is the cause of these problems. Another gentlemen mentioned that it might be an overpressurized cooling system. What could cause that? If the head gaskets are blown, then I can understand the blow-by into the cooling system, but what would cause premature failure of the head gaskets? Is it possible that some corrosive substance was present in the cooling system and has caused the damage? Anyway, with luck I'll have the car back in a few days.

ateixeira

Good to hear. Express those concerns to the service tech.

-juice

mrdetailer

At 85K I replaced the timing belt when it broke. At the same time I also repacked the CV boots and replaced the Cam and Crankshaft Seals.

A mere 40K later I have to replace both the cam and crankshaft seals, and the outer CV boots. And it's )((*&^%#F%^&**( expensive. Now I also have to replace the oil pump seals as well. And of course I'm replacing the timing belt for the 3rd time in 40k because the heavy labor involves removing and replacing the belt. Both Subaru specialist mechanics in 2 separate independant shops say that replacing seals is a common thing, even with the newer models. What's with that?

Other than these persistent issues the car is a dream.

locke2c

I have strong doubts that the timing belt needs to be replaced again! Removed and reinstalled as part of the seal work, no doubt about that. Replaced-- no way. Look here to see my efforts and look at the timing belt after 41k miles (you can click on a pic to see it fullsize):

http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292183933

it's in reverse chronological order, sorry. but yes, I've no idea what Subaru's hang up is but I would agree, the front crankshaft oil seal and the cam seals fail often on any EJ series motor at least through 1999 or so.

-Colin

cliffy1

While I am not a mechanic, nor a Subaru expert, I would assume that you are replacing the timing belt only because the front of the engine will already be open. The cost of the belt should be pretty low and since the labor is already being done for the other issues, you might as well replace it.

locke2c

I doubt the timing belt is that cheap. If it were $50 and the existing one was in perfect condition doesn't that seem wasteful to you?

I mean $50 versus the whole cost of the repairs he is faced with, no that's not a huge deal. But if you have the choice between $50 in your wallet and not, what would you pick?

-Colin

ffsteve

Colin,
My $.02 worth.

Well, if I had 40k on a 90k timing belt, I would replace it. Sure it still has life on it, but I could push out the replacement expense a couple of years farther down the road - assuming that nothing else requires disassembly again.

But mrdetailer mentions this will be the third belt in 40k miles. If that's not a typo, he might only have 5k to 10k on the belt and the decision become a little more difficult. (And why have they been replaced so often?).

Steve

cptplt

the material the oil seals gaskets are made of in the Sube engines was made of something which they found deteriorated with age and cuased leaks - they changed the material a few years ago - the new ones are a different color from the old ones. so any seal prior to this new one has this potential leak problem. My 92 had one replaced 3-4 years ago but before the new material and another but different one has just started to leak, the replaced one may be a problem eventually if I keep it long enough. it is a pain in the you know where.
actually I think I will stop checking my oil, when this car dies I can get my WRX :-)!

subieman

For all the critics of the belly pan, I've just had some real life usage of it. With my 2000 Subaru Forester (with brush guard) I crashed into a rock ledge at about 10 mph today.

The brush guard was bowed inwards, belly pan torn, but engine and oil filter well protected. Only worry is the exhaust manifold pipe has a slight dent in it, at the area right after the belly pan (before the cat. converter). But I must say, even though the belly pan is plastic, it saved my engine.

paisan

In the case above with 1/2 the life of the TB gone, I'd spring for the $50 for belt while the case is open. Just my 2 cents.

-mike