Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Subaru Crew Problems & Solutions

1935936938940941959

Comments

  • aathertonaatherton Posts: 617
    edited March 2011
    Pre-2008, the automatic transmission had an external spin-on filter as shown here:
    http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/attachments/problems-maintenance/15283d12614- - 43974-2005-ob-oil-filter-imag0021.jpg
    and here:
    http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/9540/5064502498b0501f6cfus1.jpg

    For the 2008 MY the filter mount was plugged with a bolted cap:
    http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f280/vintagefortytwo/Forester/IMG_0692.jpg
    And for 2009 the filter mount was closed with an integral casting:
    http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f280/vintagefortytwo/Forester/2009ForesterATfi- - - - - - lterhole.jpg

    Those photos of the 2008 and 2009 Forester automatic transmissions are not misleading. They show where the external spin-on transmission filter was mounted on the transmissions before mid-2007. It was identical in appearance to an engine oil filter but stenciled with "transmission" to avoid confusion. People with a pre-2008 can look under their left front wheel and see it. And it is frequently mentioned in forums as here:
    http://www.carkb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/subaru/1098/30K-transmission-fluid-flush-and- - - -filter-2002-Forester-L

    After the external spin-on filter was dropped, the internal screen filter remained as the only filter in the transmission, like all cars' automatic transmissions have.

    Are you saying that the turbo cars now have an external transmission filter located in the fender well under the battery? Connected by hoses to the transmission?

    Are you sure you want to label me as giving out mis-information?
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaPosts: 8,391
    Mike, I get what you're saying. However, if the trailer you are pulling is not equipped with brakes (especially if it is the only trailer you anticipate ever pulling), it is a bit foolish to install a brake controller in the car that will see no use. Ergo, keep it simple: If the trailer has brakes, take advantage of them! ;)
  • sgloonsgloon Posts: 303
    Couple of questions:
    I have a 2010 MT Premium model Forester.

    1. When talking about pre vs post 2010---I don't know which variation actually refers to the 2010?? (pre or post, or if it applies to my car at all?) I think this is more for the hole drilling that I am concerned.

    2. Cost of flat bed or plain truck rental is way too costly. Trying to get the stuff from Maine to Colorado. any other suggestions?

    3. Curt hitch is almost 1/3 the cost of the OEM hitch. ($130 vs $300) wow! Great idea there!

    4. There is discussion about what to do for an AT. I have a MT, is there anything special I should do with regard to MT ?

    5. This will be a one haul trip, as Xwesx mentions, of approximately 2500 miles. So, I expect if the trailer I rent has brakes, that's great, but I expect it might be too small (5x8 or 8x10 size is what I'm looking at)?

    6. Does anyone know how to figure out the weight of this miscellaneous stuff ahead of time? Probably the heaviest stuff will be the table saw, band saw, jointer/planer and some hand tools. The "table" tools are old, so they will be all metal and not much plastic that today's 'new' tools would have. I don't have brands to be able to even try to look anything up. They would have been bought well before internet accessibility, so I expect any specs are unavailable? (Band saw could stay there if it is too heavy.) The furniture will be the real wood type, so is much lighter than the glued composite stuff that is out there now. Thus, I'm thinking that won't be too heavy, more bulky. Furniture looks to be dining room table with 6 chairs, sewing machine cabinet, wood chair and one overstuffed chair.

    Anyone for a road trip? ;)
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaPosts: 8,391
    edited March 2011
    I love road trips!

    1. The 2009-2011 models are all the same as far as the hitch installation goes. For the Class III unit, minor frame hole modification is necessary. You can get an aftermarket Class II unit, which would not require any modification (as the hardware is smaller). However, it would be subject to the same forces as noted by fibber2 and aatherton, only with smaller hardware.

    2. Not by me - your plan seems reasonable (note comments below).

    4. Nothing special, just note that you are likely to smell clutch burn from time to time, especially if you start on hills, because Subaru clutches are very touchy that way. The transmission itself shouldn't have any problems at all. If you're concerned about it, you might consider replacing the gear oil in the transmission with a synthetic 75w-90 before you embark.

    5. Hard to say regarding the trailer brakes. 5x8 is pretty small and may not have them; an 8x10 most likely will. At this point, you should plan on the cost of the brake controller + install (unless you feel comfortable doing it yourself). I haven't looked recently, but I want to say controllers run about $100? Still, with an aftermarket hitch, you're breaking even compared to the OEM hitch and getting a lot more for your money.

    6. Keep in mind that the weight of items adds up quickly! If you want to weigh things before packing, you might consider buying or borrowing (depending on your friend network!) a flat parcel scale with a remote readout. You could put a base (such as a 4x4 piece of plywood) on it, tare it to remove the plywood's weight, then put each item on individually. If you consider that the (enclosed?) trailer is right at 1,000#, you have about 1,500 of capacity. If you estimate each item at 150 (all chairs would be one item), you can put a max of 10 items in the trailer and you're topped out.

    Now, if you don't think it will be much of an issue, you could load it up, take it to a local scale (such as a landfill or a weigh station) and see how much it weighs. If you end up being significantly over (I would use 10% as my personal mark), take some stuff out.
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaPosts: 8,391
    edited March 2011
    Oh, I should note that for a single axle trailer, tongue weight will play a significant role in this load... make sure it is well-balanced! I imagine your car will be well-loaded in addition to the trailer, so this is going to be a significant journey for it. Fully inflate your tires (I'd run 40-44 psi rears, 35 front) and spread out your load as much as possible. The more the back end squats, the more "floaty" the steering is going to feel.

    Here's a general-info towing article put out by NHTSA:

    http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/problems/equipment/towing/towing.pdf
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    After the external spin-on filter was dropped, the internal screen filter remained as the only filter in the transmission, like all cars' automatic transmissions have.

    Are you saying that the turbo cars now have an external transmission filter located in the fender well under the battery? Connected by hoses to the transmission?

    Are you sure you want to label me as giving out mis-information?


    Yes, there is an external mounted filter in the fender well under the battery on the newer turbo cars. How do I know this? I run a shop that works exclusively on Subarus and we do 30k/60k services almost daily! So yes that is what I'm saying.

    Sorry but to make a blanket statement about them removing the filter is giving false information.

    -mike
    Subaru Guru and Track Instructor
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    Mike, I get what you're saying. However, if the trailer you are pulling is not equipped with brakes (especially if it is the only trailer you anticipate ever pulling), it is a bit foolish to install a brake controller in the car that will see no use. Ergo, keep it simple: If the trailer has brakes, take advantage of them!

    Sorry but I still have to disagree. All it takes is one jerk to cut you off trying to exit the freeway to throw your car and trailer into a spin/jackknife. Now you have a wrecked car, wrecked trailer, wrecked person who cut you off's car, possibly injuries, and your insurance company sends you a nice letter to the effect of:

    "We are sorry to inform you that we are denying your accident claim. After a thorough investigation of the wreck, we see you were towing a trailer above the mfg. recommended X,XXX lbs w/o electric brakes. As stated in section XYZ in your policy, operating the vehicle with a trailer without the mfg recommended brakes renders your policy void. Have a nice day"

    -mike
    Subaru Guru and Track Instructor
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    1. When talking about pre vs post 2010---I don't know which variation actually refers to the 2010?? (pre or post, or if it applies to my car at all?) I think this is more for the hole drilling that I am concerned.


    2009-2011 Foresters are all the same chassis so you should be good.


    4. There is discussion about what to do for an AT. I have a MT, is there anything special I should do with regard to MT ?

    Depending on how many miles you have, I would suggest getting your 30k/60k service done at a reputable Subaru shop using synthetic gear lube for the trans/diffys as this will take the most beating while trailering. Add in a coolant additive such as Redline's Water Wetter to the coolant as this will help things stay cool. Also put in synthetic 5w40 motor oil as it's a little thicker and will hold up better to the extra heat you will have while towing.

    Another consideration is that you should plan if possible to do the trip before the hot weather rolls in which will put even more strain on the car.

    5. This will be a one haul trip, as Xwesx mentions, of approximately 2500 miles. So, I expect if the trailer I rent has brakes, that's great, but I expect it might be too small (5x8 or 8x10 size is what I'm looking at)?

    Most Uhaul trailers out there will have what they call surge brakes, where you will not need any kind of brake controller in the vehicle. I know that the dual axle box trailers which is what you will need will have them.

    You will also want to get mirror extensions as the trailer will be wider than your mirrors. They usually sell ones that clip on the edge of your stock mirrors to be able to see around the trailer.

    -mike
    Subaru Guru and Track Instructor
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    mike - easy on our colleague, I can vouch that he's been very helpful to others in a few threads. I've even bookmarked a few of his posts.

    Thanks. :shades:
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    Sorry, but he has been off on quite a few things in terms of Subarus. He may know a lot of general car knowledge and "I read on the internet" but this isn't the first thing I've corrected him on!

    :confuse:

    -mike
    Subaru Guru and Track Instructor
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Just tryin' to keep it friendly & constructive.

    Any how, you shared pics which were useful. :shades:
  • samm43samm43 Posts: 195
    A U haul 8x10 dual axle covered trailer is one heavy beast even when empty. And besides the static weight, it will have considerable wind resistance. Plan on keeping your speeds under 55 and 50 would be far better still. I think you are going to be quite overloaded if truth be told here. Very good, defensive, think-ahead drivers can manage overloads but that still won't protect them in an unfortunate event of liability issues.

    If you could post a picture of the tools I think we collectively could guesstimate the weight. From what you describe, I think there is a lot of cast iron involved which is very dense and heavy metal. Without knowing the size of these tools it is next to impossible to help guess a weight. Table saws alone can range from 2' to 10' in length. Dining room furniture could be solid oak, maple, birch and are all very heavy hard woods. If you have a fairly accurate bathroom scale, it might help if your tools are small enough that you could set one end at a time on it. Or stand on it while you lift one end of the saw and have someone else add up all the numbers. The scale will be very handy to find out your tongue weight as you load and sort to get the desired tongue load. Going heavier is preferable to lighter if you have trouble getting an exact ideal tongue load as per the link sites you get advice from. I think tongue should be 10% of gross trailer weight (gross meaning trailer curb weight empty and the payload).

    Once you get some pictures for us or a weight, I would ask some of the Subaru guys here about exhaust manifold temps with this trip and whether you are doing hills or not and whether Subaru's have sturdy e manifolds or not.

    U haul should be able to give you weight of their trailer over the phone. I'm going to throw a guess out there of a U haul dually covered 8x10 will be at or over your 1500lb limit empty. They make them heavy (strong) because they know people will fill them with bricks, gravel you name it.
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    http://www.uhaul.com/Reservations/EquipmentDetail.aspx?model=MV

    You were very close, 1,250lbs empty. 2,800lbs gross trailer weight. 1,550lbs max carrying capacity.

    It does include the brakes that do not need a controller, so that's good.

    Here is the bad part...

    Forester Towing Capacity 2,400 lbs.

    2,400-1,250 = 1,150

    That's 1,150 for all the cargo in the trailer AND all the cargo in the vehicle and passengers.

    So that really isn't an option IMHO.

    -mike
    Subaru Guru and Track Instructor
  • kurtamaxxxguykurtamaxxxguy Posts: 1,714
    edited March 2011
    Hi there. I had my '09 Forester XT in for 30K service and its required transmission filter change. I had asked the dealer to flush the transmission, but they never did (they __did__ change the spark plugs ahead of schedule, though. :surprise: ).

    To get this flush done, I took it to an independent shop with subaru trained techs and the trans was flushed for real with the warranty required Subaru Trans fluid. The shop had an excellent reputation from several discerning friends of mine.
    Surprise, surprise, I learned the old trans fluid was marginal, showing signs of breakdown despite relatively modest driving.

    The new fluid didn't change how the trans works (that 4 speed AT sometimes grabs rather roughly, but the 2 different dealer techs I spoke with claim its behaving normally), but at least it's clean. :)
  • sgloonsgloon Posts: 303
    Thanks all for pointing out all this info I would not have known about!!!

    Unfortunately, I don't have weights on anything as the stuff is in ME and I'm in CO, so won't know until I get there, which would be too late to plan anything, as Im just going there and coming right back. :-( I'll try to see if my brother is willing to get over there and take a pic or two, but he tries not to go there as it is about an hour out of his way.

    The dining room table/chairs are Cherry, I believe, so not as heavy as Oak. It's the kind with the fold down sides and leaves to make it much larger. The sewing cabinet is cherry, too. All nice hardwood and much lighter than the furniture being made now a days because it is solid wood, no glue composite.

    The Table saw I don't think is more than 4x4, it may be more like 3x3 (I'm going on a distant memory). Band saw was more like 2x2 but tall. I have no idea what they would weigh? Both are probably 20-30 years old?

    I found the 5X8 trailer doesn't have the surge brakes and weighs 800# alone, leaving me only 200# to put in the trailer. The 5x10 or 6x12 are about 1800# and both have the surge brakes, so I could go to the 2400# limit with them, per the specs, which I believe would be plenty.

    Re: manifolds, I'll mostly be on interstates and will not be going up into the mountains in CO, I'll stop just before the foothills start. So, it'll be 5000 foot elevation gain over 2200 miles. Otherwise, just the hills I'll hit on the highways or near to highways.

    I didn't realize that the weight limit includes what is being carried in the car. The owner's manual words it as though it is only talking about the total trailer weight, (ie weight of trailer + stuff you are carrying in the trailer) not total trailer weight plus passengers and other stuff in the car. Comments??
  • samm43samm43 Posts: 195
    edited March 2011
    Glad we all could help.

    Pretty sure that gross weight they are talking about includes everything, car and trailer curb and payload weights. I know this for a fact on my last 5 or more cars and I think all before then too. Could you type out the exact wording? But OTOH there are some Subaru old hats here that will be able to confirm I'm sure without you going to that trouble.

    So according to your size guesses, I'll put a few weights out there and see what we all come up with. I agree with you on the cherry being a lighter hardwood. Makes a real nice set too. So I say the bandsaw is 250lb to 300 (allow my guesses 50 lb +or- each) The band saw likely has the most cast iron because likely both drive wheels, base and table will all be CI. If the table is 2x2 then it could have 20" wheels. Sounds like a nice old saw. Old tools like that are such a joy to use compared to so many of the Chinese stuff nowadays. And they are made to have bearings replaced and sized with common sizes that are readily available too. Tablesaw at 200 to 250lb. But to be sure it would be so easy to add 100 lb each to these without seeing them. You must have the turbo? Do a nice fresh oil change with 100% synthetic before you head out too. Unless others here say not to use the synthetic. I suggested it because it endures heat better than mineral and your turbo will be creating some pretty good heat at times.

    Not sure when you are leaving but would like to wish you a good trip. Successful and safe. ;)

    Sam
  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaPosts: 8,391
    edited March 2011
    Okay, here's the skinny on the total allowable vehicle weight, per the 2010 Forester owner's manual (beginning on page 8-12):

    Vehicle GVWR (does NOT include trailer): 4480
    Vehicle curb weight (manual transmission): 3250
    Max Payload (total weight of people, things in the car): 1230
    Max towing: 2400

    Now, while the GVWR for the Forester does not include the towed weight, it DOES include the tongue weight and the weight of anything borne by the car, such as the hitch receiver.

    So, the weight of your hitch and associated accessories will add 50#, plus your tongue weight of 200#, puts your effective total payload for the car at 980#. Remember, this includes the driver, so subtract your weight to get what is left!

    Sam, sgloon noted earlier that his car is a manual transmission, so no, it is not a turbo. From my own experiences, that won't be a problem as long as he is not expecting a speedy drive home! I should also note that fuel economy will likely be in the 18 mpg range, so plan on frequent stops for refueling!
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    On my 98 Forester manual towing reduced my mileage from the usual 25 to about 17mpg, so your estimate is pretty much spot-on.
  • phil2000phil2000 New JerseyPosts: 195
    I am having trouble uploading a contact to the phonebook through BlueConnect. I did one last week then could not do any others. Today I as able to do one more and that was it. Looks like BlueConnect has a one entry per day limit. Anyone have a similiar problem?
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    Depending on the frontal area of the trailer, you may further reduce down the MPGs. A flat front facing trailer like that can really bog down fuel economy.

    -mike
    Subaru Guru and Track Instructor
Sign In or Register to comment.