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Pontiac Grand Prix 2004 Redesign Questions & Comments

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Comments

  • ruskiruski Posts: 1,566
    there is a space in the link that's screwing it up
    (before view_album)

    try this:
    www.oqcgp.com/gallery/view_album.php?set_albumName=scott_d

    And that's not the 2004 Grand Prix GTP. That's the show car called G-FORCE.
  • orwoodyorwoody Posts: 269
    try clicking on this and then you can see the galleries posted
    http://www.oqcgp.com/gallery
  • Throughout the 90's and now into the 2000's, Pontiac has had a serious case of "cheap plastic". What is up with the interior of this brand? Pontiac must be the last remaining GM brand that is saddled with the previous incestuous relationship the automaker had with the plastics industry.

    I don't care how streamlined you make the dashboard look - if it's covered in dimestore plastic - it's still cheap looking. Push on the plastics in any Pontiac, new or used, and the miserable things sweek and moan and rub. It's pitiful. It's as if the manufacturer got a bunch of high school students to outsource the production along with their homecoming floats.

    Get behind the wheel of a Honda, Toyota, Ford, Chrysler, or just about any other auto brand, and the plastics are supple and, increasingly, rich looking. Slip behind the wheel of a Pontiac and it's liking getting in your kid's dimestore car - only cheaper feeling - and with a very high price for such shoddy production and execution.

    I'll not buy a Pontiac until they can make the car worth my while. I've been waiting since the late 1970's, so I guess they're in no hurry either...........
  • P-O-N-T-I-A-C
    Pitifully Out-of-step Non Technologically Innovative American Cars
  • wgrwgr Posts: 127
    Mediocrity is so entrenched in General Motors that Bob Lutz will not live long enough to change things across all product lines.
  • evandroevandro Posts: 1,108
    The plastic in the GP steered me towards a Bonneville. Every sq. in. of plastic is smooth and soft. They can do it, know how to do it yet follow Chevy standards. Pitiful...
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 10,890
    OK, rather than focusing on the brand as a whole, let's save this discussion for talk about the future Grand Prix only. There are plenty of general GM topics around (check News & Views).

    kirstie_h

    MODERATOR
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    Share your vehicle reviews

  • orwoodyorwoody Posts: 269
    The 2004 GP I sat and played in at the auto show has a much improved interior and no more "hard" plastic than the Maxima or Accord. It has less than an Altima or Intrepid. Some of the perception is based on their presentation and even with the 2004 I think some of the (in my opinion poor) choices they made such as the window, door lock toggles, air vents and steering wheel give more immediate an impression of cheap plastic. Unfortunately that takes away from an otherwise greatly improved GP interior. So each and his own - go buy whatever hits your fancy.
    After spending most of a day at the auto show I narrowed my choices for my next down to 3 models and one of those is the 2004 GTP. I'll know much better after test drives.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    It would tell us a lot about the Grand Prix, orwoody, if you told us what the other two models are. This helps us understand your preceptions of the Pontiac. Makes a big difference if one of them is, say, a Jetta or an Audi8!
  • orwoodyorwoody Posts: 269
    nope, Mazda6 and Acura RSX. I like the extra space in the GP and previous experience with my GTP. But the interiors of the Mazda6 and RSX hit me well. It'll come down to overall feel, comfort and fun to drive. (My wife is making me get an automatic since she refuses to drive a stick)
  • snaabsnaab Posts: 69
    orwoody: if you have to get an auto, stay clear of the rsx. i drove one with an auto and it robs the power. the car loses its appeal. im guessin the same holds true with teh mazda 6 (if its a 4cyln that is). Otherwise the 6 aint too bad but quite tacky looking in my oppinion wiht the body kit and all. anyway... anyone know when the new GP is set to arive in dealers? thanks
  • orwoodyorwoody Posts: 269
    My dealer expects the first 2004 GTPs to arrive by mid March.
    snaab; I agree about the Mazda(got to have the 6 cyl) spoiler, which I was told at the auto show could be deleted. But I really liked the interior and electric blue paint. The RSX is appealing, but I'm afraid as you state, the 4 cyl with a auto will drive more like my sister's Sunfire. But I'm willing to give them all a test drive. I probably wouldn't look as hard at the Mazda or Acura, but I'm still not sure how the interior(albeit much improved) of the new GTP will grow on me. If I still can't decide after driving all three, I will just have to wait, save more $$ and try the new GTO when it hits the lots.
  • richm4richm4 Posts: 169
    I saw the new GP for the first time at the Chicago Auto Show tonight. I was not really overwhelmed. Here are some of my first impressions:

    - Exterior shape was pleasing, especially the rear view, which I had initially disliked when I saw some of the pictures previously posted.

    - The interior was slightly better than what I had initially imagined. The brushed aluminum looked better than I imagined, BUT the cheap, cheap hard Pontiac plastic still remains. Still nowhere near the quality of a Accord or Passat interior no matter what Motorweek says.

    - The interior panels on the doors also looked very cheap and felt very flimsy.

    - The seat design and leather texture was a slight improvement over the old GP.

    In summary, I was hoping to walk out of the Auto Show with a strong desire to head down to my dealer to place an order. Instead, I'm still debating whether to get a 2004 GP, Bonneville, ES300, Accord, or CTS.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Might want to consider adding Mazda6 to that list.

    I know I have...
  • orwoodyorwoody Posts: 269
    After thinking about it and looking at some of the deals GM is floating, I'm also thinking a 2003 GTP isn't all that bad. Especially with $3000 rebate and a new $500 bonus cash. I've seen a few dealers around here knocking $1500 - $2000 off the MSRP of the 2003s plus add the rebates and I've got some GM card dollars...
    So, when I go to test drive the 2004 GTP I'll try a 2003 too. Then if the Mazda6 or RSX don't really turn me on... heck $5000 plus could buy some pretty nice interior upgrade materials and a few suspension parts.
  • richm4richm4 Posts: 169
    I'd consider it, but I'd feel creeped out by that "zoom zoom" kid. ;-)
  • I'm more creeped out by the number "6". Just two numbers away from 666. Come to think of it, doesn't that creepy Mazda kid look like Damien in those Omen movies? Hmmmmmm....
  • orwoodyorwoody Posts: 269
    Well, I decided not to wait for the 2004. Was thinking hard about what to do with regular 87 octane gasoline getting near $2/gal here(I'm currently using my 2001 Yukon Denali as my 70 mile per day commuter).... I was seriously looking at the 2004 GTP, Mazda6s and Acura RSX. Got the opportunity to take the wife out to test drive the RSX and Mazda6.(no 2004 GPs delivered yet.) The RSX was toooo small and no fun with AT.(wife insists AT). The Mazda6s w/AT was much more fun, but not as quick as I was expecting(at least it didn't feel as quick.) It is smaller inside than a GP but we liked the interior layout. Trouble seems to be the funky options packaging Mazda is selling. We couldn't find a 6s with MSRP under $26k. To get a moonroof you had to have the sport package, to get leather you had to have the... sales guy went on and on. We like the car but best they would do was knock $1200 off the MSRP. Also, reading some of the forums on the Mazda6, the participants seem to grouse on workmanship and bugs they have had on the new model. After talking with a few folks, the 2004 GP/GTP will likely be introduced with no incentives and minimal use of GM Card $. We stopped by a Pontiac GMC dealership we've dealt with before: They didn't have a GP GT(shying away from GTP and premium fuel) in color or optioned as we wanted. He did locate one at another local dealer; GT Dark Bronzemist, Taupe leather. 1SB(Lighting, leather SW w/stereo controls...), Widetrack pkg(sunroof, leather, heated seat, bright Al wheels, ABS w/TC) and Drivers lumbar seat.
    MSRP was $26435 w/ dest chrg and after value group saving. Here's what he offered us

    sales price = $24297 + $83 title & license =
    $24380
    - $3000 GM rebate
    - $500 Bonus cash(if purchase by 2/28)
    = $20880 to me
    - $2150 redeemed GM card $$$
    = $18730
    gave an additional down payment and got 4.5% financing for the balance.
    signed the papers at 7pm on 2/28
    We're very happy - the Dark Bronzemist with Taupe leather is very attractive looking, plus we figured if the 2004 GP turns out to really excite us, a year from now we can sell the 2003 GT without loosing a bundle off what we actually paid
    and although the 2003 GT isn't quite as fun to drive as the Mazda6s it's roomier, about as quick and gets similar gas mileage... and with what we paid over $6k less than we could deal on the Mazda.
  • orwoodyorwoody Posts: 269
    Per the Motorweek website they are planning to run the road test report on the 2004 GP starting March 21st

    http://www.mpt.org/Motorweek/upcomingshows.shtml
  • The New GTP is a good car. The GTP is a beast compared to the Altima and Accord. I can't believe people say the altima and accord have similar power. What are they smoking. A lightly modified GTP is an easy 13 second car. When it comes to FWD powered sedans the GTP is the King.
  • 14871487 Posts: 2,407
    A while ago I saw an estimated 6.2sec 0-60 time for this car but now GM is saying 6.5 which is slightly faster than the current model. Iwould have to believe it can do 6.3 at the minimum. That would make it faster than everything in this class except the Altima V-6 with manual.
  • richm4richm4 Posts: 169
    My local dealers have been saying "any day now" for a couple of weeks. Has anyone actually seen any in stock at your local dealers yet? If so, what area of the country are you in?
  • snaabsnaab Posts: 69
    anyone run into any pricing info on the 04 GP? i know GM released the p[rices on thje base and GTP models, but i wanted to know individual option prices. ive seen many on the road and a few of my fathers friends are driving the GTP around (test cars). look nice. he said he'll try and bring one home.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Certain other websites have the pricing this time. Sometimes Edmunds is first, sometimes Brand X is.

    I believe in being polite, so I am not saying where it is. I bet Edmunds has it here within a few days at most.
  • 14871487 Posts: 2,407
    pricing is available on autosite.com
  • richm4richm4 Posts: 169
    Also try kbb.com (kelly blue book)
  • richm4richm4 Posts: 169
    First Drive: 2004 Pontiac Grand Prix
    Utility Player

    By John DiPietro
    Date posted: 03-13-2003

    After years of taking it on the chin spoiler for having an excess of body cladding and general busy-ness in its cars' styling, Pontiac has slowly been smoothing things out. Having to walk the tightrope between having a recognizable design theme and being boring isn't easy, but it seems that the company has a handle on it. Witness the 2004 Grand Prix, which will be available in base GT 1, midlevel GT 2 and supercharged GTP models.

    With a semifastback roofline, the four-door Grand Prix resembles more a sporty coupe (almost like a supersized Acura RSX in profile) than a four-door sedan. With the Grand Prix coupe being discontinued, this sporty countenance is probably no mere coincidence. A smooth nose with the trademark Pontiac dual-port grille and a clean profile with just enough sculpting to lend a sporty character highlight the elegant envelope. Only the rear end has a bit of awkwardness with a fussy rear spoiler that fills a depression in the deck lid. Overall, however, we have to say this is one handsome car.

    Moving to the interior, there is a definite cockpit theme, as the center stack curves to meet the driver. The assorted plastic trim seems upgraded compared to past GPs — a good thing as Pontiac has taken more than a few hits for its interior material. And we're glad to see the dowdy old steering wheel (that looked like a vinyl-covered throw pillow) gone and replaced by a much sportier three-spoke job with metallic accents and (on some models) controls for the stereo.

    Gauges and displays are done in red, and all controls, even the trip computer, are intuitive. The cruise control is worked via a small stalk located at 4 o'clock on the wheel (like a Toyota), as the old 1980s-style turn signal stalk-mounted control finally retires. Those with a copy of Top Gun in their DVD collection will be pleased to know that the fighter jet-inspired heads-up display now has a "stealth" function that kills the instrument cluster lights so the GP's pilot isn't distracted. Also helping during aggressive maneuvers are the firmly bolstered seats on the GTP that held us in place while running through the countryside.

    One of Pontiac's goals was to maximize this sedan's versatility in terms of being able to carry large, awkward objects. To that end, the new Grand Prix boasts a wide and low-cut trunk opening, a 60/40-split rear seat that allows a large pass-through, a fold-flat front passenger seat and rear doors that swing open nearly 90 degrees. To demonstrate the GP's almost wagonlike hauling capacity, a Pontiac rep tossed (OK, maybe not tossed) a nine-foot-long roll of carpeting into the car. Kudos to the interior team for designing a very functional yet sporty cabin; we would only suggest adding (or making optional) metallic trim (matching that on the steering wheel) to accent the dash on the left and right side of the instrument cluster and to cover the out-of-place dimpled portion of the door pull handles.

    As before, a pair of 3.8-liter V6s (newly refined and dubbed Series III) serves duty in the Grand Prix. In the GT models, the standard 3800 Series III makes 200 horsepower and 225 pound-feet of torque. In addition to furnishing brisk performance, this engine is great on gas, scoring mileage estimates of 20 mpg city and a highway figure of 30 mpg highway — numbers associated more with four-cylinder econoboxes than a roomy V6 sedan. The GTP once again has a supercharged version of the 3800, tweaked this year to make 20 more horsepower (for a total of 260 ponies) and the same 280 pound-feet of twist as last year. Both engines now feature electronic throttle control (often called "drive by wire") whose action is speed-sensitive, meaning that, when parking, the response is slower to allow smoother, jerk-free maneuvering, while at higher speeds it reacts more quickly, so as to allow swift passing and merging.

    This year, the supercharged engine can run on regular fuel, though premium is recommended for the best performance. We sampled both engines, which are teamed with a four-speed automatic. Of course we enjoyed the rush of the force-fed V6, whose transmission can be shifted manually via steering wheel-mounted buttons if the Competition Group Package is ordered. Pontiac calls this manual-shift feature "TAPshift," and we like that it has full manual operation during upshifts, meaning it won't baby-sit the driver like some other systems and thus will allow him to run into the rev limiter if he's not paying attention. We're all for anything that encourages more involvement and concentration from the driver. TAPshift is also pleasingly quick on the draw, shifting up or down virtually as quickly as the button is thumbed — a nice change from many other automanuals we've driven that have an annoying lag in this mode. Left to shift for itself, the tranny ran through the gears seamlessly, even under full throttle.

    Pontiac had a 2004 Grand Prix GTP tested against its competition (all 2003 models) under the supervision of the Sports Car Club of America (SCCA) at Firebird Raceway in Arizona and got a 15.0-second quarter-mile out of it, besting such cars as the Nissan Maxima and Dodge Intrepid SXT. Pontiac claims the GTP will cover the 0-to-60 race in 6.5 seconds. Even without the supercharger, the 3800 V6 furnishes plenty of thrust and continues to be a favorite engine of this writer for its great combination of performance and economy, as well as its solid reliability history.

    Hauling it all down are larger antilock (on all except the GT 1, where it's optional) four-wheel disc brakes that feature Electronic Brakeforce Distribution (EBD). These binders were easily modulated and felt strong while we subjected our GP to many elevation changes (and hence heavy brake usage), certainly an improvement over the previous brakes which didn't feel as hefty or have as much pedal feel.

    An independent suspension is found under the sleek bodywork, and in keeping with its performance-minded image, even the base cars feature antiroll bars fore and aft, 16-inch tires (225/60 Goodyear Eagles) and a quick (only 2.4 turns lock to lock) steering ratio. Step up to the GTP and the rubber is upgraded to Michelin Energy 225/55R17s. The Competition Group goes all the way with firmer suspension tuning, BF Goodrich Comp T/As (same size as the Michelins), 10-spoke alloys, enthusiast-oriented stability control (dubbed StabiliTrak Sport), a higher final drive ratio (3.29-to-1 versus the GTP's 2.93-to-1) for quicker acceleration and red brake calipers (just like a Porsche Turbo!).

    We drove a base car and then jumped into a GTP Comp G and immediately noticed that, while the standard GP handles fine and has more than enough potential to be enjoyable, the GTP Comp G is definitely the car for the enthusiast. Cornering is flat and composed; even through rapid transitions, the car never wavere
  • snaabsnaab Posts: 69
    my father just called me and said he got a 2004 Grand Prix as a 3-month company car! Not sure if its a GT or GTP. hes on his way home now so maybe ill take a few pics or something with my digital. im quite excited :)
  • snaabsnaab Posts: 69
    So my dad came home with a 2004 Grand Prix. Unfortunately it was a base model with NO options except a CD/Cassette player and an engine block heater. But after driving it you would never think it's a base model. Compared to the last generation GP (which I used to lease) this car handles a LOT better. It feels very tight and controlled. Throttle response and break pedal feel are great and the car truly feels smaller than it really is. Acceleration feels like its improved; I estimated a 0-60 time of around 7.5 seconds using brake-torque method and a stopwatch. The entire car feels tighter and connected when compared to the old car. In fact I would go as far as saying it's the best front wheel GM car I have driven to date. While im not a big fan of the exterior styling (kind of tacky in some areas) I love the new interior. The materials used are of much higher quality and the panel gaps are quite small, especially when compared to the previous GP. The seats are pretty deeply bolstered and remind me of those found in the CTS. The quality of sound from the standard 6 speaker setup makes me question if its really worth anteing up $600 for the better monsoon system. Overall: an awesome improvement over last generation's car and an above average mid-sized car. here is a link to the pics:

    http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/amaximeya/lst?.dir=/we+got+a+2004+Gran- - d+Prix+for+3+months&.src=ph&.order=&.view=t&.done- - =http%3a//photos.yahoo.com

    if ya got any qestions or want more detailed pics let me know. I gotta try and sell this car so GM gives my dad a bigger bonus this year ;)
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