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Ford Escape Hybrid

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Comments

  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Seems high but small SUVs top out at about $28 grand now anyway. Go price a loaded Liberty.

    -juice
  • oldboyoldboy Posts: 59
    I admit that I was wrong in thinking that the Escape Hybrid would be about $23,000. It was based on (mis)information that it would be about $3500 more than the 4 cyl. Given the fact that Ford will only be able to produce about 4,000 this year and 20,000 next year because of a lack of battery packs, I suppose it makes sense to Ford to price the hybrid where they will make money, and supply it only to the most ardent buyers. I for one will not be among them.
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > The latest estimate is for the oil to dry up by 2026. What will your hybrid burn then?

    Simple... Ethanol.

    I'm using 10% in my hybrid now, and getting a little better MPG than diesel.

    85% is available locally too. And FFV technonology is quite common now. A hybrid adapted for that is no big deal.

    100% is just as realistic as bio-diesel. So you really don't have much of an argument.

    JOHN
  • gtyler2000gtyler2000 Posts: 17
    I ordered an Escape Hybrid from a large dealer in Rockland County, NY on May 29th. I gave them $1000 refundable deposit. The order states that I will get the vehicle for $1000 over list price, which they did not have available. I picked the dark gray exterior color and added the NAV and safety options. He told me 6-8 weeks and I told him no way. He looked at a calendar and said - oh yeah, probably not that soon. I have yet to receive an update from him. I will call this week because I just noticed that the AC outlet is not standard. I want to see if he can add it. I'm not sure if I'd be willing to pay the mark ups ($5000+) that I read other people are seeing.

    Now, here's my reasons for getting this car...

    I currently drive a 97 Ford Taurus and am getting 22MPG which I think sucks since it's mostly highway miles for a car nearly solely used for commuting. We are expecting our third child and, although I really would like to get the new Acura TL, my sedan days are over. We do have a minivan, but it gets 17MPG and I really hate using that for the short weekend trips around town - exactly the trips that the Escape will provide the best gas mileage. Anyone who tries to strap a baby into a car seat knows how much easier it is when the seats are higher up.

    As others have voiced here, I also believe that it is very important to send a message to the car companies that we want them to make the environmental impact problem a top priority.
  • moparbadmoparbad Posts: 3,842
    quote john- 100% is just as realistic as bio-diesel.-end

    Biodiesel can be made from palm oil, canola oil, hemp oil, corn oil, waste vegetable oils, animal fats, waste animal fat oils, soybean oil and more.

    There is much more feedstock availability for biodiesel than there is for ethanol.

    Other biomass feedstocks for ethanol besides corn are possible.

    Biodiesel require no modifications to diesel engines. Anything greater than 10% ethanol requires engine modifcations to gasoline engines.

    Ethanol is not as feasible as biodiesel.
  • f111df111d Posts: 114
    I'd rather have a common rail diesel, the Hybrid technology just a little too soon. I bet the dealers are not even prepared to send the mechanics to extra training. I know I asked mind and he did think much more training would be nessary??? Definitely wont' even consider.
    At least with the diesel goobs of good Ole low-end torque, if they would use the 2.7 that's in Europe.
    Paul
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > Ethanol is not as feasible as biodiesel.

    "feasible" is clearly the wrong word. The definition is "Capable of being accomplished or brought about".

    Perhaps, "more likely" is what you intended to say.

    What did you actually mean?

    JOHN
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > the Hybrid technology just a little too soon

    Huh?

    It will be about 3 years before large numbers of hybrids even hit the roads.

    How much more lead time do you need?

    JOHN
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > At least with the diesel goobs of good Ole low-end torque

    When it comes to low-end torque, electric is capable of putting diesel to shame. To verify that, just look at a train, forklift, or Prius.

    There is quite literally no way for a combustion engine to compete. It isn't capable of RPM as low as just 1. Needing to pump at a minimum of a few hundred RPM is a fundamental limitation caused by the pistons.

    JOHN
  • maxx4memaxx4me Posts: 1,340
    thanks moparbad. Your timing is excellent. After reading your post, I gave up on the Escape hybrid and went out and bought an '04 Malibu Maxx for $19,237 out the door. The $4,000 GM rebate was the clincher. I certainly don't think I could ever make up $7,000 in gas savings in two lifetimes.
  • kokerkoker Posts: 23
    Thanks for the pricing info. I ordered one today price to be agreed on later (after the pricing is released.) Little did I know that Ford was releasing the price while I was at the dealer. They let me pick what I wanted and said I would have dibbs on the first one that came in (if it isn't the one I ordered.) A bit higher than I thought but doesn't kill the deal for me.
  • gtyler2000gtyler2000 Posts: 17
    The dealer that I ordered my Escape from had sent some of their salespeople and some of their mechanics to training at Ford. They told me it was required before they could be allowed to sell or service the vehicles. She even made a point of saying that there are special gloves required, which I assume is for the battery.

    Take a look at the first post in this group. The Escape Hybrid was certainly not rushed to market. Only time will tell if they've done it right, but so far it seems like they've put quite a lot of work into this project. I'm willing to try it out.

    In 2006, there will be some new diesel fuel and those diesel engines may very well take off. The technology sound very appealing to me! That's for sure. For me, for right now, the Escape Hybrid fits the bill.

    I have no doubt that they could make engines run on 100% bio fuel. However, it's quite an expensive undertaking to get something like that to the general public. The companies need incentive. Demand for hybrid vehicles is a start. Government tax breaks may also help. Ethanol 87 release in the midwest was followed by a substantial marketing campaign. These things take time people.
  • moparbadmoparbad Posts: 3,842
    feasible
    1 able to be made, done or achieved:
    2 possible or reasonable:

    I meant what I said. It is not possible or reasonable to expect ethanol to replace gasoline. It is possible to expect biodiesel to replace petroleum diesel.
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    But you still haven't explained *WHY* it could be more likely (no detail, like yields or refining). You just repeated the same statement.

    FFV is totally feasible, since over 3 million of them are already on the road in the US. And since Ford a leader in this, don't be surprised when you see it available in their hybrids.

    Ethanol is totally feasible, since those crops are just as easy to grow as the others.

    JOHN
  • moparbadmoparbad Posts: 3,842
    I do not have to explain, I've already researched the results of research. Ethanol is not sustainable as it can not meet demands. It is not my responsibility to spoon feed the "why" to you.

    This can be debated in another topic. Back to the Escape Hybrid.
  • thekingtheking Posts: 107
    I would not touch the Hybrid at any price...Look at all the recalls Focus had......Do you think dealers are going to make sure they have a staff that truly understands the hybrid principle ? All they know is "market price adjustment; that second sticker on your new Hybrid !
  • kokerkoker Posts: 23
    Now that the pricing has been released, could anyone comment on what prices they have been quoted at dealers? The dealer I am using is expecting MSRP. An earlier message implied $1K above msrp. Has anyone been quoted lower?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Congrats Jim, you finally got one eh? :-)

    I would expect MSRP as long as they have wait lists.

    -juice
  • maxx4memaxx4me Posts: 1,340
    thanks Juice. See ya around the beltway.
  • caperscapers Posts: 8
    Ford has been talking about this hybrid escape for years. Only to keep pushing the date back. And then so few will be released that only the rich or suck ups will get one. I hate the fact that they promoted a hybrid without having one in production.

    I still remember my 1984 ford, was the first year with fuel injection. It never worked right, mechanics told me o sell the car because the first year of any new gadget is bad news! I will not buy anything in the beta phase again! Hope you all will do the same.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Texaspam,

    That was a common issue that was later rectified (same as Focus), the brake pads they should be installing, should NOT be the same as previous, and if anything, an upgrade. Try http://flatratetech.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=forum;f=13

    That site (Flat Rate Tech) can help you and better explain the procedure, what to say, etc. when you go in next for repair.

    Capers,

      Sanyo who makes the battery packs, is only allowed to build a certain number of battery pack units because of limited capacity. It's not Ford's fault thay can only churn out 20K of them a year.
  • djasonwdjasonw Posts: 624
    I just saw a blurb on the news the other night regarding the '05 Ford Escape. It did NOT get five stars. They said that serious injury can result in a frontal collision. Does this apply to the Hybrid Escape as well?
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    That would be this story you probably heard about...

    Titled: Ford Escape improves crash test rating

    Redesigned 2005 SUV earns 2nd highest rank

    http://www.detnews.com/2004/autosinsider/0406/15/a05-182743.htm

    Source: Detroit News
  • f111df111d Posts: 114
    Battery technology and Ford training programs leave allot to be desired.
    Paul
  • f111df111d Posts: 114
    Yes electric traction motors have awesome torque, but with the diminutive battery pack that will provide minutes of added help. Then the motor load goes way up to re-charge the battery. This is more of the automotive version of "Snake-oil". Give me the common-rail diesel if they engineer it for more than 100,000 miles? Unlike Fords CDE4 ATX was only engineered for 100,000 miles. (even less than it's Mazda mules)
    The more inside info I learn about the automotive industry the more I see the rip-off. By the way, my inside info sources have proven out over the last 30 years.
    The big Three has recently been raised parts prices ,on normal replacement parts 30-300%?, hoping to get buyers to replace there vehicles after 5 years.
    That would be nice, however early forced retirement has many of us Americans in a real bind. "Blood out of a Turnip"
    Thank-heavens for car buffs web sites, I'm keeping my 98 Mystique LS in excellent running condition for at least 10 more years!
    Paul Echelberger
    N8BUU
  • f111df111d Posts: 114
    I'm working on weasling a very important fact from a source, electric motor at full load how many minutes will the battery packet provide. If he says ok I will share. Even with a 42 vdc system it won't be many.
    The web site even says "assist lanch" only, restart and regeneritive from braking. All this thru the, I'm sure (larger), serpentine belt. Go the viseton's web site and check powertrains.
    For my money way to early for this to be of value out in the coutry-side. City would be ideal? Then their's winter temps. The military still has nothing affordable for what mother nature takes away from a battery. If it's not affordable it's of no value to the masses.
    Paul
    Sorry for the Rant, but just trying to uphold the Ole Marine teaching, who luckly survived Iwo Jima and the depression. Whole different set of values than what's out there now!
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Acceptable, whoop-de-doo.

    Subaru earned a "Good" rating way, way back in 1998, without even side air bags!

    This is 7 years of progress? C'mon Ford. They have about 10 billion times the resources, it really ought to be a "Best Pick", no excuses.

    -juice
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,221
    I think you're confused.

    2001-2005 Escapes without SAB/SAC rated poor in the IIHS' new side impact test along with many other makes and models. Like the Forester, the 2001-2004 Escapes rated good in the test when equipped with SABs (The Forester was not tested without them because they are standard as you already know). The 2005 model, which the hybrid is nearly identical to, has not been side tested by them yet. However, it does have the "Safety Canopy" system available and should do just as well as the older models.

    The acceptable rating you referred to is from their frontal offset test in which the Escape did improve to from marginal on the older models.

    Oddly enough, the '05 model went from 5 stars to 4 stars in the NHTSA frontal test. The rest stayed the same where the two in front are now 4 and 5's for the rest.

    Anyone know if they'll be testing the hybrid separately? I'm guessing yes.
  • bvabva Posts: 4
    For those of you who keep preaching about biodiesel, it does have significant drawbacks. The amount of NOx emissions and engine produces actually goes up with biodiesel. Yes it's a good alternative of a limited scale, but for cities with major ozone issues it's not a reasonable mass market alternative.

    And for some of you others. Are you this bitter all the time? I know it's a message board and they were basically created to allow people to bitc#, but come on. At least Ford is out there with Honda and Toyota on the Hybrid technology. Sure Honda beat everyone but at least Ford isn't last to the party. Will it have problems early on? Probably. Will there be some mark-up initially? Probably. Not many vehicles come out perfect out of the gate. Seen the reports on the Nissan Titan? Bottom line, it's an important step forward in technology that should be supported, not villified.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "Anyone know if they'll be testing the hybrid separately? I'm guessing yes."

    The Hybrid version (structurally) is the same, therefore it will not be tested.
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