2013 and earlier BMW 3-Series Prices Paid and Buying Experience

kyfdx

Sounds great.. Premium package, or just moonroof? What was the MSRP?

regards,
kyfdx

diye

Thanks to boxztrs' posts, I went to Norwalk, CA dealer to check out the 27K deal ( 325 with Auto, Moon Roof, Metalic Paint).

I was told ther deal was no longer good. The first sales person just fooled around with me and gave me rediculous numbers.

I called the dealer again to be transfered to another salesperson, he called back and said another special was going on: 28k even for a 325i Auto, Silver with premium package. (they said there were 6 cars at this price, all silver)

One hour and some paperworks later, I got the car. Got 2.9% financing rate, I know the 1.9% speacial rate, but hard to get it with the 28k price. 2.9% instead of 1.9% will cost me $700 more over 5 years.

Didn't lease because they were firm on $3000 down, 10k/year for $259/month -- a number too high for the purchase price of 28k.

cartalk

MSRP on that configuration is $33,645 with an invoice of $30,885. There seems to be an overstock of silver cars as the dealers near me have several silver '04's left, most with grey interiors.

kyfdx

If they have grey interior, that means they also have leather..

$28K would be an incredible price with an MSRP of $33,645.. That is why I wondered if it just had moonroof, rather than premium package.. $28K is under invoice minus incentive for the one with premium package.

regards,
kyfdx

kyfdx

Of course, everyone knows that Steel Blue is faster....

I see lots of Titanium Silver left over every year.. But, it seems that 30-40% of 3-series are made in that color, anyway... So..

I really like the grey interior.. it would be my choice over sand or black.. but, I agree.. not enough contrast with the silver..

I have black leather interior... bought mine used, so less choice that way in color combination..

regards,
kyfdx

spacewormfx

Congrats!, that is a nice price indeed. A couple of weeks ago i got offered a 325i Auto, Moonroof and Xenon for 28K even at this norwalk dealership.

I'm from SD so I will try here and see what offer i get.

diye

It indeed has primium package. It has black interior.

By siting at the car briefly, I saw power seats and auto dimming mirror, wood trim, on top of moon roof.

Didn't have time to check trip computer, etc. As you can imagine, I took the deal immediately.

There is no other add-on fees either, I just paid 28K + tax + registration.

Here is the way I look at it:
invoice - 1500 = 29600, they got me $700 on that 2.9% rate instead of 1.9%. So their true invoice is 28900, I got 900 below that -- how they do it, I don't know.

boxztrs

I'm glad to hear someone else got a deal. I was starting to think that nobody believed me. Now you see why I bought 2 cars. They weren't offering the cars with premium packages several weeks ago. I think they are moving up the line to higher equipped cars as they sell all the base models.

kyfdx

That is a great deal.. It is even better than you think, because the dealer doesn't get ALL the extra money you pay for the interest markup.. Probably only half that amount.

I can see why you grabbed it, and didn't squawk about the interest markup... Part of making a good deal is knowing what that is, and snapping it up quick. You did well.

Some deals happen below cost... Who knows why? My goal is always to get the best deal I can, and not worry about how the dealer will pay his bills..

WARNING for others: Don't assume your dealer will make a deal like this.. You will probably be disappointed.

regards,
kyfdx

cartalk

Most, if not all, of the captive finance companies pay the dealer the "dealer reserve" on the financing as a lump sum payment shortly after the loan is booked. The issue of dealer reserve is an issue with lower income buyers. The link below highlights a 60 Minutes story earlier this year. No comments on the credibility of the story ;-)

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/01/60minutes/main609870.sh- tml

kyfdx

But, it isn't just the captive finance companies.. Any bank that the dealer obtains business for will pay them a reserve or commission for booking a loan... and it is more, if they book it at a higher rate..

It works the same way as a mortgage broker.. They get paid a varying amount, based on the spread between the base rate and the rate on the loan.

Dealers do a lot of sleazy things, and I'm sure they take advantage of unsophisticated buyers, but I just don't see this as being much of an issue..

If you don't shop for the best finance rate, it is the same as not shopping for the best price on the car....

regards,
kyfdx

cartalk

Agreed regarding other banks - I was identifying the captives since we were discussing the 1.9% vs. 2.9% offered through BMWFS.

However there is a very big difference between a "dealer reserve" on a car loan and a "yield spread" on a mortgage. The mortgage industry is considerably more regulated and the yield spread is disclosed on the settlement statement as are any fees and compensation to the mortgage broker.

kyfdx

Regulated and disclosed, yes.. but, yet.. it is exactly the same thing.

I would guess that even though it is on the settlement statement, that 90% of home buyers still don't know what it means..

People that do their homework save money.. People that don't can be taken advantage of.. I think that is fairly universal...

Getting back to the deal we were discussing, the buyer knew that the car was already way under "cost", and knew what the extra finance was costing them, and recognized a good deal. That is what successful car shopping is all about.

regards,
kyfdx

jsb3

I am planning on purchasing a 2004 325i. From what I have found, the majority left are ones that are dealer or demo cars. They have around 2000 miles or so, how much should be discounted off the car due to this?

Thanks for any help!

ksdc

kyfdx, spacewormfx; thanks very much for the guidance. I am going to the dealer later in the evening for the final negotiation. Let's see what happens...

Regards,
ksdc

kyfdx

What they "should" be discounted, and what they "are" discounted seems to be a wide variance. It seems that most dealers want their cost out of the car, even though they have used it... Usually, the best deal you can get on a demo or loaner is invoice minus any incentives.. That is only about $500-$1000 less than brand new '04s are selling for..

  If the car only has 2K miles and has recently been put into service (say, in the last 3 months), a dealer cost deal might be okay... But, if it is 9 months old, and has 8K-10K miles, I'd want it for at least a thousand or two cheaper than that.... but, most won't go that low.

Usually, demo cars aren't great deals..

regards,
kyfdx

justin2

Just bought a 04 325i sedan, titanium silver, sport package, auto, and xenons. Paid $650 under invoice and got the %1.9 financing. I think it was a good deal, based upon what I've learned from this group.

The dealer was Century West in Los Angeles. Overall a good experience with the internet sales manager.

They did try to mark up the extended maintenance program to $1395 from $985, but agreed to that price after I offered it.

Thank you to everyone who posts on this board.

powermatic66

I recently learned that I can extend the lease on my current A4 on a month-to-month basis up until May 2005 at the same payment. The car will be under warranty until end of Feb. 2005. My original lease contract expires on 11/24/04

Essentially, I have way more time than I originally thought to buy a 2005 325xi. In order to get the options I want, I have to buy a 2005. But there is a lead time from what I understand (6-8 weeks?), and there don't appear to be any deals on 2005s at this point.

My questions are these:
1.) Will I be able to get a better deal on a 2005 in late December 2004/early January 2005, given that the car is being remodeled for 2006?
2.) I have heard that one can get better deals at Xmas time, b/c people are Xmas shopping and not car shopping. True?
3.) Are there ever incentives mid-model year? Or are they always at the end?

kyfdx

1) Probably

2) Usually.. The week between Xmas and New Years is dead for dealers.. If you buy from stock, you can probably do even better.

3) Mid-year incentives are usually lease-based on BMWs.. very few cash incentives.

  If you extend your lease, I wouldn't want to take it past the warranty period.. Will they let you extend it month-to-month, or do you have to commit to the whole six months? Watch out for service intervals due within the extra time or possibly the need for tires with the extra miles.. Those items could make a lease extension expensive.

regards,
kyfdx

powermatic66

Thanks kydfx.

The warranty expires at 50,000 miles or May 2005, whichever comes first. I have 45,100 on the car now. At 1,000 miles/month, I'll be covered until the end of February. Service intervals are not an issue as the car has factory maintenance for 4 yrs/50K. It is a month-to-month option to extend the lease.

Do you know what a typical lead time is for an ordered car - I'm assuming around 6-8 weeks.

spacewormfx

Good luck ksdc, let us know how it turns out!!

sw

desi1

Hello,

Can someone tell me the Residual Value Chart for 2002 and 2003 330Ci and 330xi for a 6-yr period?

I am thinking of leasing 2002/3 and want to confirm dealer's payment calculation. Therefore I am looking for the residual (%) value remaining as each year goes by.

Truly appreciate your help. Thank you,

SS

kyfdx

Generally, 8 weeks is enough.. It all depends on your dealer's allocation.. If they have a lot car set for production, they can change the options last minute, and get your car sooner, that way.. I would be prepared to go to Enterprise for a weekly rental, if you have to.. If you set it up ahead of time, you might be able to rent an economy car for $100/week, in case you need it.

regards,
kyfdx

kyfdx

I doubt you will find anyone with this info.. Most used car residuals are figured on a fixed dollar amount, assuming a certain level of standard equipment, then adjusted for current mileage.

Have you received any type of preliminary quote? With the incentives right now, you could probably lease a new '04 for the same money as a CPO unit.

regards,
kyfdx

desi1

Thank you kyfdx.

Yesterday, I saw two loaded (prem, sprt, cold pkgs ~20-25K miles) 2002 330Ci's on the lot, which had $426 & 399/mo lease stickers on them. I do not know the details. I assume there will be a down payment.

With 2004, the lease payment of a similarly equipped model comes to $629/mo. So, it got me interested. With $475/mo, all I can get is a loaded 2004 325Ci.

What do you think?

SS

kyfdx

I'm just guessing..

Those numbers on the '02 330Ci's are probably with a $2500 or more cap cost reduction.. I didn't realize you were looking at coupes.. Their lease deals are not nearly as good as the sedans..

I understand the desire for a 330... but if $475/mo is with nothing down and is a $39K 325Ci, I'd rather do that, than lease a used one.. Also, if the used ones are CPO, you will have warranty, but might have to start paying for maintenance in the last 2 years of the lease.. Unless they pony up the $1400 to extend the maintenance out to six years..

Leasing is tougher on coupes.. You could check to see how much they want up front on the used ones, but make sure they are CPO.. The last thing you want to do, is lease a car out of warranty..

regards,
kyfdx

desi1

Most certainly. I agree with you on all counts. Both were indeed CPO.

I guess, one has to make a decision to either pay the 1st yr (higher) depreciation on a new car or pay higher dealer margin and maintenance/repair on a used one.

I was also inclining toward leasing an 04 325Ci, but the lease stickers on 02's caught my eyes. Well, that's what they are suppose to do. :-)

SS

spacewormfx

Hey ksdc, how did it go with the dealer??

njgil

Hey folks,
Just discoved this site last week, so bear with me. Ive been shopping around for 2005 325xi's, and here's what I've found:

MSRP $34,495
- Auto
- Black Sapphire metallic
- Cold Weather Package.

A couple questions

1) I got a quote at $1200 off MSRP ($33295). Can/Should I go lower like to $1500 off, or even lower than that? I also managed to get $1300 off MSRP for similar car at another dealer, but it didnt have cold weather package(I want the fold down rear seats; its hard to find)

2) Where can I find TVM's (and invoice price) for 2005 325xi, if they are even available?

3) What does 'Out the door' mean? I've seen it mean everything except TTL, while others have included TTL. How can I use this to my advantage?

Thanks guys, and keep the great posts coming!

kyfdx

OTD can mean different things..

For most people, it means everything except TTL. It keeps things simple...

That way, you don't get a dealer low-balling the taxes, then coming back later asking for more money (hey, its the government's money, etc.... I have nothing to do with it).

When you make an offer OTD, stress that the only thing you want to see added on to that is what you pay the state. No extra fees, etc.. Then, they can break it down however they want, as long as the bottom line before TTL equals what you offered.

At this time of year $1200-1500 off might be the best you can do.. If their first offer was $1200 off, I would certainly counter back with $500-800 less than that.. If you don't ask, you don't get.

regards,
kyfdx

njgil

Thanks kyfdx,
I placed a deposit down for a 2005 325xi, Orient Blue, Auto, Cold Weather. Got $1800 off. Assuming everything goes well, I pick it up tommorow!

blueangel

This is my first BMW purchase. I have finally decided on a steel blue 2005 330xi with cold weather package, premium package, xenons, and possibly the sport package. Frankly, the only reason I would purchase the sport package is that I like the wheels (styling 98) on it and was told that the cost of just the wheels would be the same as the sport package -- $1200. Here are my questions:

1. How much over invoice should I be paying for the car ? What costs do dealers add on above the invoice price, destination (which I was told is $695), and taxes ?

2. In reference to the wheels I want (style 98), can the dealer just swap out the wheels on the non-sport package for the wheels on the sport package and have me pay a few hundred dollars. Has anyone had an experience of this type?

Many thanks for your help.

Blueangel

kyfdx

1) They are right.. the most cost-effective way to get the sport package wheels, is to get the sport package.. They can't swap.. who would want a sport-pkg car with non-sport wheels?

2) Most people go for the sport package, just to get the sport package seats.. try them out, and make sure you like them.. They are heavily bolstered.

3) The invoice price includes the same destination charge as the MSRP.

4) The poster above you, just got $1800 off MSRP on his '05 325xi... That is a pretty good price to shoot for.. Maybe a couple hundred less than that, since your car has a higher MSRP. There should be nothing added on to your offering price but tax, title and license fees.

regards,
kyfdx

kyfdx

Congratulations! Enjoy it..

jsb3

I have noticed a difference in the invoice prices listed on edmunds versus on kelly blue book. Anyone know which one of these is more accurate?

kyfdx

IMO, the numbers on KBB are more accurate.. they seem to have a better handle on what options are included in each package, keeping you from adding it into your price more than once.

regards,
kyfdx

cricfan

I purchased 2004 330i with the options
performance
leather
metallic
xenons
moonroof
cold weather

for $39250 (MSRP is 44470). This car had to be shipped from NY, i signed the deal last week. Including Tax & registration, final cost is 41520. I also got 1.9% financing for 60 months. How did i do ?

They are offering me a 7 year/100K warranty from the dealer for 2250. Is this a good price for the warranty, i usually keep my car for 6/7 years. Is is good to buy it now or later ? the dealer tells me that it costs a lot more later.

Thanks

kyfdx

You did well.. There is a $3K dealer incentive, so you paid about $1500 over cost.. Plus you got the base rate financing.

I wouldn't buy a third-party extended warranty.. A lot can happen in four years before your warranty is up..

regards,
kyfdx

cricfan

I purchased 2004 330i with the options
performance
leather
metallic
xenons
moonroof
cold weather

for $39250 (MSRP is 44470). This car had to be shipped from NY, i signed the deal last week. Including Tax & registration, final cost is 41520. I also got 1.9% financing for 60 months. How did i do ?

They are offering me a 7 year/100K warranty from the dealer for 2250. Is this a good price for the warranty, i usually keep my car for 6/7 years. Is is good to buy it now or later ? the dealer tells me that it costs a lot more later.

Thanks

tomc1

Congratulations on the 325xi! I placed a deposit with a broker on a 2005 330ci. Does anyone have a target delivery date for the US?

tomc1

Thanks
tomc1

tomc1

I live in Denver and placed a deposit with a reputable broker in late July for a 2005 330CI.
I thought they would be released after the European auto shows? Does anyone have any information on delivery dates?
My final number was $43,485 with the performance and winter packages and 6 speed.

I'm new to message boards.

Thanks!

paule

I'd be careful with any non-written initial quotes. A lot of dealers will try to tack on the "dealer paperwork fee". I tried to swap wheels (to the style 98) and had absolutely no luck. I received quotes as high as $3,400 to swap wheels. I don't believe I saw anything as low as $1,200. I was thinking the same thing; a couple hundred bucks and the dealer keeps the stock wheels. That wasn't going to happen. I paid $1,400 over invoice ($1,386 below MSRP on an '05 325xi). It was a fairly low optioned car (split bench, metallic paint, sport pkg).
It sounds like some people are doing better than that but that was the best deal I was going to get. I gave 8 dealers the chance to quote and that was the best deal I got. The dealer was in Phoenix.

cartalk

8 dealers? There are only three in Phoenix and two are the same dealer. Tucson has one.

I also found it tough to deal in Phoenix as it seems the two dealers (Chapman and North Scottsdale/UAG) know how the other is pricing.

ashleyp

I'm looking at a 2005 330xi with an MSRP of $42,545 and have several questions:

1) should I expect to successfully negotiate a different discount off MSRP if I take one off the lot vs. order one?

2) what is the average range off MSRP (buying the car in Connecticut) ie. what is the best deal i should expect?

3) i've read some postings regarding 1.9% financing (assume that's over 60 months)...is that available in limited areas? got an email response from a local dealer saying they had "special" BMW financing of 4.5%!

4) also considering leasing...any clue as to a good monthly lease rate on a 3 yr lease at 10,000 miles/yr?

Thanks for your help.

kyfdx

1) Possibly.. but early in the year, the difference in lot car vs. ordering may be small.

2) No idea what Connecticut is like for purchases, but NY and NJ are close, right? Should be lots of competition.

3)1.9% financing was for certain '04 models.. Check with your local bank or credit union first.. That way, you'll know a good rate when you see it from the dealer.

4) New lease figures should be coming out tomorrow.. It usually takes a week for the good info to filter down to these boards.

regards,
kyfdx

ru777

I am a newbie to this message board.

I am in the market for a 2005 325xi with
-sports package
-Xenon
-automatic and
-Black exterior with sand leatherette

1) Is this a popular combination ? Any comments? (I have a hard time justifying the bum warmers I will use only for 4 months)

2) What is the cut off date for placing an order for a 2005 325xi in Pittsburgh?

3) Based on historical trends and the fact that this is the last model before the redesigned 2006 3-series -what would be the month I can get the best price. ?

4) The true market price (TMV) on edmunds, is it if you purchase it from the lot? or place an order?

All comments and suggestions are welcome.

Thank you for your help.
Ru

paule

I live in Durango, CO so I have no one close to me hence I had dealers within a 7 hour drive of my house quote me. That pretty much means Phoenix, Albuquerque, Tucson, and Denver/Colorado Springs/Ft. Collins area dealers.
I agree that Chapman and UAG (North Scottsdale BMW) know each other's prices. Chapman got my business due to UAG throwing in an outrageous doc fee at the last minute (almost $400!). Needless to say, that irritated me enough to reopen my negotiations with Chapman. Having said all that, the Phoenix dealers were about $400 less than all of the Denver area dealers.

kyfdx

In the home of the Steelers, huh? I like Big Ben, but they are going down this week to the Bengals!!

1) I don't know that the sport pkg is all that common on a 325xi, but the 17" wheels will sure improve the looks, and the sport seats are worth it.. Get the heated seats.. especially on an all-wheel-drive in Pittsburgh.. every other car your dealer sells probably has them.. when you get ready to sell, not having them would be a real negative.

2) No idea what the cutoff is.. but, I'm guessing it isn't until February at least.. No definitive word on when they will stop making the '05s.

3) Again..not sure about best month for price, because of the reasons stated in #2. Also, no telling how popular the new model will be, once people see it.

4) TMV of limited value.. Page back a hundred posts and look for what people are paying for '05s on this board.

If you are in the market sometime in the next three months, right after Xmas, is usually a good time to get a deal.

Also, without the premium package, you don't get power seats and some other goodies.. the package is pricey, though good for resale.

regards,
kyfdx

ru777

Its the home for the steelers indeed!

Thanks kyfdx.