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Cadillac STS/STS-V: What's New for 2007?

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Comments

  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    Motor Trend did a V6 comparison including an STS. 0-60 was 6.8 seconds and the quarter mile was 15 seconds @92 MPH. The V8 with or without high performance axle gearing does 0-60 in 6 seconds and the quarter mile in 14.5 seconds @ 100 MPH or so. The high performance gears are only slightly faster, but fuel consumption is worse.
  • 14871487 Posts: 2,407
    How could Caddy build a car to blow the E55 and M5 out of the water? What you are asking for is impossible. You cannot blow a 469hp and 500hp car out of the water. If the STSv is the slowest car out of the bunch it is still better than anything being offered by Lexus, Jaguar, Acura or Infininit right now. They are not even playing n this league at this point in time. As I said before, I dont think the M5 is going to be a geat commuter car and many BMW fans are mad than the car will not have a true manual at launch. The true test of these cars would be on the track and I'm sure the STSv will hold it own there. It's hard to believe that people are complaining about 440 these days when there are only two sedans available ( or will be available) under $100K that have more power.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    Yes, I think that the STS_v is designed for street use. The M5, while drivable on city streets, is not well suited for such use I think. I don't know if that is true, but that is my opinion. Until the STS_v is available for the magazines to test, it's overall performance is a guess. There is a limit to how much power a car can use. The 3 ton Bentley can utilize more power than a 2 ton car.
  • prophetprophet Posts: 72
    After buying 5 STS's & SLS's over the last 10 years, I purchased a 2006 Infinity M35. Much more of a drivers car than any of the Seville's, and everything works!
  • carnaughtcarnaught Posts: 1,593
    prophet: Did you test drive and compare the Infiniti (note spelling, ( LOL) to the new STS? Why didn't you stay with a Caddy?
  • prophetprophet Posts: 72
    Every STS/SLS I've owned had at least 2 electrical problems during the first year. My wife's Deville's were much better although they had their share as well. Nice cars but not worth the service hassle. The M35 Infiniti drives & runs like my BMW 530i without the cramped quarters.
  • pearlpearl Posts: 336
    just a comment on some previous posts on this subject. "Back in the Day" you could buy almost any GM car at a base price and then add literally any option on the list, one by one. If you only wanted auto transmission, floor mats and power seats, you could do it. Today, most manufacturers, with Caddy being notable, make you take lots of stuff that you might not otherwise order just to get what you want. The result is $63+K if you want a STS AWD, for example. Why Cadillac does not see that they are shooting themselves in the foot with this approach is beyond me. Many of us waited with baited breath for the new STS, and were initially quite impressed. Then we found out about the options bundling and some chintzy bits on the interior and got turned off. In my humble opinion, Cadillac blew it on the STS. If they were looking in the 50-65K range on this car, they should have started by buying a few Audi's and ensuring that their interior was at least comparable. Then they should have ensured that people wanting certain key options did not have to "buy the farm" in order to get them. Caddy is not alone in this, but for a car as important as the STS, it is incredible that they set up sales to potentially turn away so many buyers.
  • carnaughtcarnaught Posts: 1,593
    Agreed. The bundling issue and the skyrocketing cost of the car in light of it is precisely why I didn't buy the STS.
  • jerrymcshane1jerrymcshane1 Posts: 195
    The STS is OVERPRICED to the "max." Plus, ONLY a current $1K rebate? Are you kidding me? They, Cadillac, are "eating" this car with over a 140 day supply inventory. Maybe somebody at Cadillac will "swallow" their giganic egos's and reprice this car via some REAL incentives.
  • bigmike5bigmike5 Posts: 960
    Add to the above the fact that they will only accept $1K credit from using the GM card toward the purchase of an STS. I've got almost $3k in credit on the account but could only use $1K. That sucks too.
  • xkssxkss Posts: 722
    The 184 hp BMW 525i is overpriced at $43,000.

    The STS is the ONLY car in its class that is available with a limited-slip differential.

    The new STS posted its best-ever sales last month.

    3,541 STSs were sold.
  • erickplerickpl Posts: 2,735
    has LSD's in their line, including their new GS.
  • bigmike5bigmike5 Posts: 960
    Did I miss something in the brochure of the STS, or does this car not have a remote garage door opener in it. My wife's 00 Eldo did not have one as standard equipment, cost $105 for one to be installed, and I don't recall seeing one in the STS when I test drove it. Anyone got a definitive answer?
  • merckxmerckx Posts: 565
    That's typically what this option is called....It's extra on quite a few cars.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    It is included in the luxury package on both V6 & V8's. I'm not sure if it is available otherwise.
  • jerrymcshane1jerrymcshane1 Posts: 195
    So did Mercedes, Infiniti, Lexus, BMW, etc., etc.. In other words, America is MORE spoiled, pampered, arrogant, self indulged, hypocritical, materialistic, etc., etc., now more than ever. NO middle class anymore. Either your rich or the "other." 50 million visits to lawyers offices in 04' in America. Why? M-O-N-E-Y. People adopting this "screw em' galore as long as I make out" mindset that now permeates America.
  • pearlpearl Posts: 336
    I just checked out an STS 1SF (with Redline paint) and came up with a TMV of about six hundred bucks off MSRP (circa 59K). There is a current rebate of $1K to take it down to $58K. This seems insane. Is anyone out there paying anywhere near sticker for the STS, and if so, why? I think that the Edmunds TMV is not even close to accurate. Given the competition, the 140 day inventory, GM's problems, etc., it would seem that paying just over invoice would be more like it. Anyone have any thoughts on this one?
  • volvodan1volvodan1 Posts: 196
    GM is trying to stay away from rebates on the Caddys. The STS has nothing to apologize for in regards to it's competition. It is one of the best. Why does it seem insane? If we were talking about the Deville, I would agree.

    But this is one of the problems GM faces. Consumers think if there isn't $4,000 on the hood and buying at invoice that they are getting ripped off. They've been selling well for us. The STS is one of the best cars out there, but in the luxury market they are competing in, you can't just have a great car. You have to establish yourself. They are getting many new customers in, but the established Caddy customers have been hearing about the wonders of front wheel drive for 2-3 decades and are hesitant to switch back. Maybe that's good? Keep the traditional customer buying the Deville and the rest can choose from the newer models.

    Caddy has been at the value end of the luxury spectrum for a while. Most people still "ooh and aah" over Caddys. But the people who actually buy the $50, $60, $70,000 cars have not for a long time.

    Caddys cred is coming back. If they continue moving forward and don't sit on their hands for 5-7 years. They may be a few rungs higher in prestige by the end of the decade.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    I don't know what the STS costs to build. However, at $60,000 I think it is very profitable. I don't think the STS is much more expensive to build than the CTS, although the bodies are somewhat different. The base STS V6 is priced at near $40,000, and the V8 is probably not any more expensive than the V6, so is there really $20,000 worth of extras in a 1SG model?
  • hondacbr1khondacbr1k Posts: 12
    I just went to look at an STS yesterday and there is a great lease promo..$399 month for 36 months $2139 down. That is not a bad price at all. I pay $399 for my 2004 Maxima and that car retails for about $28K. I rented an STS with a V6 in VA and I was very impressed. I'm getting one!
  • hondacbr1khondacbr1k Posts: 12
    I too think the M35 is an impressive car...but I actually have the same car. It's a 2004 Maxima SE. The cars are built on the same platform and have the same engine (except a few HP difference) but the Max is FWD and the M has a much nicer interior. I am getting the STS because I couldn't get past the fact that I would essentially be driving the same car if I got the M as the Maxima. I also think the STS looks more distinctive.
  • volvodan1volvodan1 Posts: 196
    1. I would imagine the 3.6 is cheaper to build. The 3.6 is not only used in the STS, but also CTS, Lacrosse, G6, Rendezvous, etc. The STS version of the Northstar is only shared w/ XLR and SRX. The Deville version is vastly different because of FWD.

    2. Is there $20,000 worth of extras? For that buyer I can see the value. Personally, the STS w/ luxury package would sticker for $43-$44,000 and gives you heated-memory seats and 6 CD changer among a few other things. That may be the best value in that price range. For $20,000 you get V8, DVD Nav, Magnaride, HID's, sunroof, Bose 5.1 surround sound, heated and ventilated front seats w/ heated rear seats, and 18" wheels. I'm sure I'm leaving a few things out. For many drivers it is worth it, but not all.
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,530
    "I would essentially be driving the same car if I got the M as the Maxima"
    The M is built on an enlarged version of the G35 platform (RWD) - Maxima is FWD - and used to share a platform with the Infiniti I30 and later I35.
    - Ray
    Driven 'em all . .
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    1. Yes, a few hundred dollars more perhaps. The FWD 3.6 is probably also different from the RWD version.

    2. Yes there are additional features. However, they may only cost a few thousand to put on the car, so the profit margin is perhaps more than 100%.

    I, for one, am hoping for some RWD's from either Buick or Pontiac in a reasonable price range. I expect to drive my FWD Seville for a few more years, so GM does have time to develope RWD in the lower price ranges. I also expect the STS to revise its packaging in the future, although the 2006 model seems to remain more or less as is. The CTS has changed its packaging since 2003.

    I see nothing wrong with Cadillac charging as much as possible for the STS, however, it is out of my price range unless there are incentives in excess of $10,000.
  • volvodan1volvodan1 Posts: 196
    I'm not sure if the 3.6 RWD is that different from the FWD version. I would think they made sure it was compatible for both when designing it. The FWD Northstar was not intended for the RWD applications it is being used for now, so it had to be modified heavily.

    The optional packages always give the manufacturer more profit. I don't think it is quite as much as most think, but they make money there. For $50,000 you can get the V6 loaded, so the Northstar is the big mark-up item there. But I think that's smart. 9 out of 10 of my customers who want the V8 would NEVER consider the V6. There is status in the V8 and they want the top of the line.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    Well, the LaCrosse engine is rated at 240 hp, down from the CTS's 255; the torque is 225 lb-ft, down 10% from the CTS's 252 lb-ft; clearly there are differences. The northstars are available as crate engines, the FWD version is $5000, while the RWD VVT is near $4000. Certainly, one would expect the V6 to be somewhat cheaper to build, but I would say that the cost difference is near $1000 at most.

    The magnetic ride is about $1500 on a Corvette...
    HID headlights are $500....
    Sunroofs are $1200...
    The other odds and ends are worth something, but for $10000 more than the luxury package V8, I think that the premium luxury performance package probably only costs $5000 more to build.
  • volvodan1volvodan1 Posts: 196
    There may be more differences between the FWD and RWD 3.6's. Maybe, maybe not. I would think that the power differences are more from differentiating the Caddy from the Buick. The SRX has 260 horses.

    Like I said, the options are where a chunk of the mark-up are.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    Cadillac's website currently states 255 hp for all of the 3.6L V6 engines, including the SRX. At the time that the 3.6 was going into production, there was some expectation of getting 260 hp out of it. However, that did not hold up.

    The point that I have been making is that the STS appears to be priced at a high profit level, particularly the V8. There is nothing wrong with that, but in the long run I think they will lose sales.
  • volvodan1volvodan1 Posts: 196
    You are right. Our initial training info had 260. It is 255.

    The loaded V8 is probably selling for a proportionally higher profit. Maybe Caddy should have done what Lexus did and price them artificially low to establish (or in Caddys instance, reestablish themselves).
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    GM is currently not profitable. They need to make money where they can. However, I think that most of the car lines are priced a bit high. The LaCrosse, for example is quite expensive when you get the top of the line model - priced in the $30,000 to $35,000 range. That is really quite high. The STS is priced quite reasonably compared to the BMW 5-series. However, the 5-series is highly thought of. There are some other quite good cars that are cheaper. Some posters here are looking at and buying the Infinity M45.
This discussion has been closed.