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Ford Fusion/Mercury Milan

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  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,690
    Frankly, the reason could be anything - taxes, shipping, plant capacity, purchase agreements. But isn't it fun to speculate? I'll see if my Ford contact has any other insight.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,693
    as an fyi, multiply the number after the 'F' by the number of cylinders to get the transmission torque capacity.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Yeah? I believe ya, just wondering how you explain that the EcoBoost uses the 6F55 (= 330lb-ft capacity) with the engine producing 350 lb-ft. Does your figure assume driveline losses or something?

    :)
    Just curious.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,690
    According to my former Ford transmission engineer friend you multiply by 10 to get the torque capacity. If you think about it - the number of cylinders in the engine would have nothing to do with the torque capacity of the transmission that it's attached to.

    So a 6F35 has a capacity of 350 ft/lbs. Sounds like a lot but this is AFTER the torque converter and the torque converter can double the amount of engine torque at low speeds.

    The first number is the number of speeds, then F for FWD or R for RWD then the torque capacity.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,693
    maybe it only applies to the 'R' transmissions.
  • Karen_CMKaren_CM Posts: 5,014
    Here's your chance 2010 Fusion owners - http://www.fusion41.com

    Eight 2010 Fusion owners from throughout the country will be selected to participate in the Fusion 41 program. They will be chosen based on their passion for Fusion and their ability to share compelling information about the vehicle on the Internet. Applicants must have a current Facebook profile with a minimum of 100 friends and an active photo collection.

    Each of the eight Fusion owners will then choose four friends or family members to join their team, and each team will be given a 2010 Ford Fusion or Fusion Hybrid to drive in an automotive relay race. To complete the relay, each team member must fulfill an assigned task within 41 hours, tracking competitive variables such as miles driven, stops made or the number of passengers picked up.

    The winning team will be chosen based on their ability to complete the activities and provide proof by uploading photos and videos to various social media sites, including Facebook.

    The Fusion owner of the winning team will have their vehicle paid off, and team members will win free gas for one year.

    Community Manager If you have any questions or concerns about the Forums, send me an email, karen@edmunds.com, or click on my screen name to send a personal message.

  • samnoesamnoe Posts: 731
    Consumer Reports rated the Ford Fusion Higher than Toyota Camry & Honda Accord.

    Unbelievable.

    Note to Ford: Fix those few little complaints, and the Fusion would be a winner. Even more than it's now.

    The controls are too low mounted and have too many look alike buttons together, which is hard to find/adjust while driving. Copy the Camry for simplicity, lagre, big controls, clearly marked & illuminated (also light the ignition key ring insert and the glove box), design a new updated steering wheel (smaller size. prefer size as the Honda Civic..) Re-arrange the stering wheel mounted controls to be easier to use, the interior door pull should be like on the MKZ/MKS, and a few more improvements, and you have one of the best sedans.
  • I am renting 2010 Ford Fusion right now while I am on the vacation at Hawaii. It is 4 cylinder AT. And I have a lot of complaints. First - exactly the same you pointed out - ergonomics is probably the worst in its class. All controls are too low to be comfortable to use. Controls on steering wings is impossible to use without taking look out of road and even then it is difficult to press correct button because all buttons look alike and confusing. Odometer reset and info buttons are hidden in the left low corner of dash - you may crash the car if try to bend down to try find out them. Both left and right armrests are kind of useless because are too far away - nowhere to put you hands to rest. Dead pedal is uncomfortably far away and my legs are not short.

    In general I have an impression than cabin was designed without much thought - probably most expensive and experienced engineers were laid off from Ford in recent years.

    Driving expressions. Steering has kind of numb and artificial feel to it - what do you expect from electric steering? But it is common downside of cars with electric steering - Ford is not alone. Engine is very quite at low rpm - you may even think there is an electric motor. But when push hard it sounds harsh. Transmission is not matched well with engine - it feels kind of clunky and confused hardware - it switches abruptly and when you do not expect. I have Ford Focus and I do not feel transmission at all - it is very smooth, responsive and perfectly matches 2.3L engine.
  • xmechxmech Posts: 90
    I know how you feel about the console. I was overwhelmed at first, but after about a month, you know where everything is, and personally, I'm mostly happy with it. (But then I'm a geek and love stuff with lots of buttons and stuff to fiddle with.) I know where the steering wheen buttons are already by feel. Just don't like the fact the A/C and recirc button lights are impossible to see in direct sunlight, and the traction control (Or whatever Ford calls it.) button is right where you inadvertantly hit it when putting stuff in and out of the little fwd ash tray or whatever.

    As far as the steering feel goes, I was thrilled with how it felt after test driving a Sonata. Holy moly! It was like a video game controller!

    My transmission feels great. Early on, a couple of clunks, but the computer must have learned.

    As far as the engine noise, either it quieted down or I got used to it. (Probably the latter...) For the MPG improvement over my Grand Cherokee I could get used to alot. Also, I'm always impressed how smoothly it transitions into cruise control. The Grand Cherokee that I traded for the Fusion always kind of lurched.

    Agree those buttons on the lower left (Odometer, info, etc.) are poor, especially the pushbutton dash light brightness controller being pretty much identicle and right next to the trunk release. Duh! I haven't done that yet.... I think they already moved some of those to the wheel in a new 'build' version of 2010.

    Anyways, everyone has their preferences, and the Fusion was a good fit for me. Alot of what you guys just posted about are things I haven't experienced, or disagree with, but that's what makes the world an interesting place. If we all liked the same stuff, we'd all be driving the same car, and after the same girl! :shades:
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    " I think they already moved some of those to the wheel in a new 'build' version of 2010"

    Yes they did. The Info, Setup, and Reset buttons have been moved from near the headlamp dial to the steering wheel and what were single function switches on the steering wheel are now dual function rocker switches to make room for those three new functions. Click here to see it. The bottom two switches on the left side of the steering wheel contain the Info/Reset and Setup functions respectively. The top two switches house all of the C/C functions now and are more logically laid out IMO. The top left switch is a rocker that increases or decreases speed (hitting either one will SET your speed too) as opposed to two separate switches doing one or the other. The other switch rocks to Resume or On/Off. The switches on the right of the wheel are unchanged for the audio/SYNC functions.
  • xmech, how long it takes AT to learn? I own Mercury Sable. Beside of being very reliable car - I did not experience any problems in 120K miles I have driven this car - it has transparent and precise hydro-powered steering. I do not get this electric steering thing - it is artificially heavy and numb in all cars I drove. Ford version may be better than others by not by large margin. And BTW when I disconnect battery AT in Sable takes about 30 miles for AT to relearn my driving habits. But with Fusion - I drove it already 200 miles and do not see any improvement - it is still clunky and unpredictable. Buttons are located too low and no matter how long I it drive it is impossible to get used to it. I cannot replace Sable even though I own it over 7 years because I cannot find affordable midsize car I am comfortable with. I am start thinking about moving to premium cars like Acura or Buick because I simply cannot find well designed midsize car in lower price point.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,690
    The transmission does not learn "driving habits". It only learns how to vary the pressure required for each shift to maintain factory specifications for shift times. This accounts for individual variations in each transmission and for wear over time.

    I don't recall anyone (owners or reviewers) who had problems with the steering, transmission or button placements on the 2010 Fusion. I think you're just extremely hard to please, especially if none of the other mid sized sedans work for you either.
  • samnoesamnoe Posts: 731
    "...I don't recall anyone (owners or reviewers) who had problems with the steering, transmission or button placements on the 2010 Fusion..."

    Wow. In almost every review I've read, especially from the pro's, it was mentioned about "button placement". and not in a good way. Recently, Ford started to offer an abundance with look-alike buttons, which is hard to de-chiper while driving, and on top of that (or should I say "below that"...?) they're placing'em very low, hard to reach area, sometimes blocked by the shifter.

    Here is what Consumer Auto Guide says in one review: "Audio and climate systems rely on too many buttons and take time to sort out. Ditto look-alike audio/cruise buttons on the steering wheel. The low-set climate panel can force a long look from road."

    Also, in another Ford review, they write: "Some testers complain that the stalks for the windshield wipers and turn signals are too far from the steering wheel..." I would like to know, did anyone found the signal stalk is a little weird, pointing way too up, instead of just being straight?? (you could see it in the photo mentioned in message #5485 above).
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,690
    Sounds like minor quibbles to me. Certainly nothing that would affect a potential purchase.
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    Also, in another Ford review, they write: "Some testers complain that the stalks for the windshield wipers and turn signals are too far from the steering wheel..." I would like to know, did anyone found the signal stalk is a little weird, pointing way too up, instead of just being straight?? (you could see it in the photo mentioned in message #5485 above).

    The signal stalk in our '06 Explorer was tilted upward somewhat and I found that to be a good thing because you could easily use it when your hands were in the 10:00 and 2:00 driving position. If the stalk is lower, as it is in most other vehicles, you have to take your hand off of the wheel to use it. Not a big deal, but it's a minor convenience you don't notice until it's gone. I noticed the difference immediately when we turned the Explorer in and leased a Flex which has the straight out signal stalk.

    Here is what Consumer Auto Guide says in one review: "Audio and climate systems rely on too many buttons and take time to sort out. Ditto look-alike audio/cruise buttons on the steering wheel. The low-set climate panel can force a long look from road."

    What trim did they test and did it have the DEATC system or the manual HVAC system. The former requires the push of one button to turn on and the turn of a big knob to set the temp. I've changed the temp maybe twice in the nearly 7 months I've had the DEATC in our Flex. My wive probably never changed the temp in her Escape with DEATC and we both keep them on all the time for the most part. If they had the DEATC then they should not be complaining because the manual system is set up differently and may be easier to use.
  • xmechxmech Posts: 90
    I'm no automotive expert, so I don't know if it's the AT computer 'learning or whatever, but early on, I had issues where you almost came to a stop, then got back on the gas, it kind of jumped into gear, and a few times when it was still cold i'd get a hard 2-3 or 3-4 shift, but now at around 4500 miles, I haven't experienced any of that for at least a month. (Had car 3 months now)

    I'll have to agree about having buttons too low and small, hard to ID, taking too much attention while driving, but I still like the look of the panel, as I said before, being kind of a tech-geek.
  • "Some testers complain that the stalks for the windshield wipers and turn signals are too far from the steering wheel..."

    I agree. I always have a feeling that high beam is on while driving the car and every time I find out that stalk is in default position. It is difficult to get used. If you own Fusion you probably get used after while, but for rental car it is another annoying feature.

    BTW does Milan also has an electric steering? I hope MKZ does not have it.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    I wish the stalks on my '06 Accord were further away. In parking lots where I'm maneuvering quickly into spaces, I hit the windshield wiper stalk way too often for it to be considered good design.

    I haven't had that issue in my daily driver, or my girlfriend's car.

    I want stalks far enough away that I have to intentionall go for them to engage them!
    :shades:
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,693
    the 2010 fusion doesn't have a 2.3 4 cyl, but lets just ignore that.
    the steering wheel buttons each have their own 'brail' code in the corners.
    if you pay attention and want to, you can learn them by feel.
    it's just too much effort for some.
  • lazzolazzo Posts: 8
    I can't stand the buttons either. I'm currently test driving the Legacy, Camry, Fusion, etc... and find the other cars raised/positioned buttons much better.
    I also hate Fusion's steering wheel compared to the sportier wheels on some other cars.

    Do you remember that old cassette tape player from the 1970's? The one with the single speaker and the pull out silver handle? It had a row of identical black buttons on it that people would always mess up and press the wrong one. That is what I think of when looking at the Fusion's steering wheel. Have we learned nothing since then?

    I drive in the winter with gloves on. Try pressing these buttons with gloves on...Brail, with gloves? Forget it.

    The wheel and the buttons are something I am going to be looking at every time I drive. Ford should make this the main priority for upgrading on the 2011.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,690
    So how - exactly - do you think they should fix the buttons so you can operate them with your gloves? There aren't many options.
  • lazzolazzo Posts: 8
    Raised, contoured buttons located at different locations. Problem solved.
    I just test drove a 2010 Camry XLE and an SE. I had no problems with the buttons on these cars.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,690
    Sounds like your search is over then.
  • How nice is to come back home and drive car with hydraulic steering again! I probably will pass any car with electric steering in my next car purchase.

    Another thing I realized that I do not like in Fusion is how front seats are positioned - they are moved closer to the center of car than in other cars. First you seat too close to passenger and it makes center console narrower and forces to place most controls too low in center stack. Driver also has to compete with front passenger for space on center arm-rest which is too narrow compared to other midsize sedans. It also creates empty space between front door panel and front seat. It might be good for fat drivers, but I am rather slim and do not feel comfortable when on the left there is an empty space and on the right I have to compete with front passenger for space.

    Gauges are too bright and cheap looking. Doors do close with that assuring "thump" muted sound like in almost any other car today. It is difficult to open doors - they feel to heavy. Trunk lid is also is difficult to open and close. Both doors and trunk lid require too much effort to operate. In my Sable I can do all these seemingly basic operation without much effort and noise. I understand that Taurus/Sable are more luxurious cars but still Ford could make Fusion/Milan feel more expensive as GM did it with Malibu and Aura.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,693
    if you turn the heat on you don't need gloves, but i understand that the steering wheel buttons don't work as a feature for you.
    i agree that the fusion seating is not as wide apart as the old taurus and the trunk is an annoyance to close.
    maybe because i am left handed, i never noticed the extra distance to the arm rest on the left.
    i had one of the last original design taurus's as a loaner(05/06?).
    it was a sorry de-evolution compared to our 96 SHO.
  • tim156tim156 Posts: 308
    I let my blind friend drive my Fusion to see if he could read the braille buttons and he said they're not braille, there just small raised dots to indicate the top and third button down. Also, he said he didn't have any problem using the steering mounted control buttons. He also said their well lit at night and easy to read and use.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    He also said their well lit at night and easy to read and use...

    I let my blind friend drive my Fusion to see if he could read the braille buttons...


    This is a joke, right?
  • You are kidding. How blind person can drive a car. Does he have a license?
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Posts: 3,855
    I've not driven the new fusion with electric steering, so I don't know what it is like on that car. But, electric steering can be just fine. VW's version of electric steering on the Jetta is very good, imo. The VW system even allows for it to be adjusted...if you like it to feel heavier or lighter, the dealer can change the setting.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,693
    i didn't mean real 'braille', just that each button has a unique pattern of raise nubs you can use to figure out which button your finger is on.
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