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Subaru XT Turbo Forester

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Comments

  • hayduke01hayduke01 Member Posts: 128
    I had Fiats, too. First a '75 131, then a '79 X/19.

    The X/19 was a fun car, fast (for 1979, anyway), still +30 MPG.

    Never read the Nader book, though the title rings a bell.
  • bobshere1bobshere1 Member Posts: 59
    I'd strongly suggest a visit to your library to check out the excellent Nov '03 CONSUMERS REPORT on High Performance Tires, as well as the Jan '04 issue on Plus Sizing. They don't recommend going more than 17 for us, with excellent reasons given. Keeping our tires close to the OEM with the Plus Size does limit the possibilities (see below) and there aren't that many tires/brands that fit the bill :(
    Going to 225/55R17 does introduce a bit more error (1% vs 2% from OEM) but opens up the possibility of additional highly rated Summer Bridgestone Potenza S-03 Pole Position, Goodyear Eagle F1 GSD3, and Continental ContiSportContact.

       I charted the possibilites and 225/50R17 is the best fit.

        Bob

        XT TIRE SIZES COMPARED FOR PLUS SIZING TO 17 INCH WHEELS

    Tire Size Comparison
    Specification Sidewall Radius Diameter Circumference Revs/Mile Difference
    215/60-16 5.1in 13.1in 26.2in 82.2in 771 0.0%
    215/60-17 5.1in 13.6in 27.2in 85.3in 743 3.8%
    215/55-17 4.7in 13.2in 26.3in 82.7in 767 0.6%
    215/50-17 4.2in 12.7in 25.5in 80.0in 792 -2.6%
    225/60-17 5.3in 13.8in 27.6in 86.8in 730 5.6%
    225/55-17 4.9in 13.4in 26.7in 84.0in 754 2.2%
    225/50-17 4.4in 12.9in 25.9in 81.2in 780 -1.1%
    225/45-17 4.0in 12.5in 25.0in 78.5in 808 -4.5%
  • lbhaleylbhaley Member Posts: 91
    Jack often mentions the ability to pass safely on mountain roads as one of the reasons he bought an XT. I had that exact experience last weekend in Vermont. I was bringing my mother home after dining out. We were on a very steep winding road and came up behind a double trailer logging truck. On the steeper sections he was down to about 5 mph. It was night and I could not see very far ahead. After following him for about three miles we came to a steep section where I could see a road sign a reasonable distance ahead. I dropped my XT down to 2nd gear and floored it. We were by the truck in an amazingly short amount of time. My mother said "Wow, this thing has good pickup!" I just smiled. I never would have attempted that pass in my old 98 Forester S or even in our V6 Passat. This is an example of all that extra power being very useful in tight situations.

    -les
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    I took some heat for those comments and still have no idea why. Consider: You're driving an old 36HP VW Beetle having very little acceleration in top gear and not much more in a 3rd gear that redlines at only 45MPH. It takes a very long time and a very long straight section to pass anything at all on a 2-lane road, and you're out there exposed in the oncoming lane for what seems like an eternity. Ergo, places where you can safely pass in an underpowered car are rare.

    Cars with abundant power, like the XT, can safely flash around in much less time and shorter distances. That fact alone means that in the more powerful car, there will be many more opportunities to pass safely.

    In addition, even cautious drivers occasionally encounter situations where things don't always go exactly as expected, including in passing situations. Having ample power in reserve to deal safely with the unexpected is, in my opinion, always a good thing.
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    I only had to consult my Checkbook, now if I could only find a Wife!

    If you get a wife, lock up your checkbook.
  • lbhaleylbhaley Member Posts: 91
    I can't imagine why you would take heat for that comment. I totally agree with you that power used intelligently is a safety feature. There are situations that arise in traffic where it is much better to accelerate away from the problem rather than brake into it. The key is making the right snap decision. That is one of the (few) safety advantages of a motorcycle. You can often accelerate out of potentially dangerous situations before they develop. I am talking about short bursts, not holding it until you are doing an insane rate of speed. The XT is the first car I have ever owned that gives me the same feeling of confidence about being able to accelerate at will, that I get on my BMW motorcycle.

    -les
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    I can't imagine why you would take heat for that comment.

    Me neither, but it began with my message #2272. Several that followed it over the next day or two took some strange tangents.
  • akasrpakasrp Member Posts: 170
    t's great if you take your XT up to 80/90 MPH, however exceeding the posted speed limit by 25 MPH in most states can take you to Jail too!

    Mea Culpa.
    I did not intend to condone or advise doing 90, regardless of posted speed (many stretches of 1-5 down here are posted 75 - folk moving at 90 being rather commonplace).
    FWIW, I usually keep my speed at the posted limit just to enjoy the envelope of space that develops as the herd rushes past - my mention of 90 was just to state the fact that I did run it up to 90 (in an open & safe place where the only threat of death was to myself!) - it will get to 90 before you know it - you do not need the whip the horse's eyes - and to note that despite this gulp of fuel, I still managed an average of 22 mpg. I grew up when kids had to take and pass Driver's Ed. I am a defensive driver. I have no patience for rod-nuts, street-racers and the like. My only citation occurred in the late 70's when we had all gone to 55 and I was pulled over with a dozen or so others in a huge trap in AZ - doing 62. Our surface streets here in the High Desert are posted 50! Keeps the body shop and morgue busy. I rarely exceed 40 around town.
    I apologize if my flip remarks were read as irresponsible.
    Speed Kills.

    -srp
  • p0926p0926 Member Posts: 4,423
    srp- Don't sweat it.

    however exceeding the posted speed limit by 25 MPH in most states can take you to Jail too!

    Depends totally on the state. CA definitely has more lenient rules when it comes to speeding (at least the did). I don't think it matters how fast you're clocked, it's still a mail-in fine.

    -Frank P.
  • hayduke01hayduke01 Member Posts: 128
    Pretty rare in Colorado I believe, even for way over the speed limit.

    Only case I'm aware of where a speeder got jail time was for 103 in a 55, and that was in Douglas County. It probably didn't help that the speeder was a kid in a Porsche. Most other counties wouldn't have been so harsh.

    While I don't make a habit of 90, I see it occasionally. That's probably true of most Forester owners, and even more of the XT owners.
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Your Highness was just pulling your leg...needling you a bit, as it were. However, if they ever do name me dictator-for-life, you'll rot in jail for your irresponsible, inexcusable (albeit fun) crimes against humanity.
  • akasrpakasrp Member Posts: 170
    this hot looking ZKLLRXT license plate and matching flaming tattoo are here to stay, regardless.

    I Am Not A Crook!
    -srp
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Would that be on your arm, or on some more disgusting part of your anatomy?
  • akasrpakasrp Member Posts: 170
    that got it Flaming.

    Hot Stuff!
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Or more likely too much chili. Methinks srp's XT is too prosaic for someone who wants to fly that low that fast. Trade it in for one of these:
    http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid99/pac2e2e56ec0c6ef65be9- - 3c13e7f79991/f9ee114a.jpg
  • akasrpakasrp Member Posts: 170
    Have a similar Blue Beauty (albeit without the Long Legs and GoGo Boots) in the neighborhood. One of the main reasons I fell for Subaru - she looks as good as new!
    Tragedy the Forester doesn't sport the suave pop-up headlights...
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Now THAT's a WING!
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    It is true that summer tire choices are few and far between in 225/50/17. All things considered, 225/55/17 might be best- At least mileage would improve a bit, right?

    The other option is another set of 16" rims with 225/55/16 tires, which opens up lots of possibilities tire-wise, but not wheel-wise.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    but you gotta love the ground clearance.

    Driving distractions, what makes you a bad driver? (going 90 with or without the latte perhaps?)

    That's the topic for tonight's Town Hall wide chat, for those of you who can't wait until tomorrow night's Subaru Crew chat fix.

    The link is on the left and it starts in about 2 hours from the time of this post.

    Steve, Host
  • miamixtmiamixt Member Posts: 600
    It IS possible to be taken to Jail for Speed Infractions in all States, no question about it, do a Google search. It is even more of a reality to be assigned some Jail Time with a Fine during an appearance in Court. And I really find it hard to believe when you Zoom by a Cop at 100 MPH that you will get the friendly Wave. Drive Responsibly® SUBARU!
  • p0926p0926 Member Posts: 4,423
    And I really find it hard to believe when you Zoom by a Cop at 100 MPH that you will get the friendly Wave

    Oh the stoires I could tell...

    -Frank P.
  • bluesubiebluesubie Member Posts: 3,497
    Other than speedo differences, are their any downsides to running a larger diameter tire?

    edit: Just did a quick nabisco search. Luke@tirerack said that other than possible rubbing issues, you might lose a little acceleration. I think the 225/55 wouldn't be bad enough for rubbing issues, and better grip should help the acceleration anyway.

    Comments?

    -Dennis
  • akasrpakasrp Member Posts: 170
    And I really find it hard to believe when you Zoom by a Cop at 100 MPH that you will get the friendly Wave

    Early AM (5:30) Summer 1980. Interstate from Phoenix to Tucson. ‘77 VW Rabbit doing just under 100 mph - fast lane - highway to myself. Cop hiding behind over-pass support shoots me with the thumb and forefinger gun as I turn my head to see him. No stop. Wild Wild West.
    Again, not condoning or advocating excess speed - or VW Rabbits!

    (Hope I didn't just tack on a concurrent Life Sentence in Ballistic's Black Hole...)

    Waiting for someone to recommend which cleaner-protectant I should use on the XT's black painted dash. Still in our heavy petting phase...

    -srp
  • lfdallfdal Member Posts: 679
    Jack - I agree, one of the reasons I wanted the XT is that I frequently travel Rt3 in Maine from Augusta to Belfast - One lane each way, fairly hilly in spots, only a few two lane passing zones, and relatively few open areas to pass. In other words, if you don't want to commit suicide, or kill someone, you'd best have a car capable of short, quick passing.

    As an alternative you can resign yourself to being behind someone doing 45 for long, long stretches of road (then the guy behind you will try to pass a number of cars at once with often really, really, unpleasant results). I don't know anyone up there who doesn't hate that road.

    Relative speed limits - coming back on the Maine turnpike last night I was doing a steady 80 and frequently had my doors blown off. At 80 I was passing (slowly) probably 60-70% of the cars.

    WOT tests - I finally got to try a couple of WOT tests. I made two observations - first, the engine is definitely quieter when it spools up from 0 mph thru wherever. Second, going at 55 mph or so and booting it results in a lot more wastegate noise. No clue as to why, that's just what it does. I'd really like to know why, however. At that the rev's never exceeded 5500 or so.

    Speeding - In Maine, and I believe MA as well 30mph over the speed is a felony. In MA after you pay the initial fine you get surcharged points for ** 6 ** years. Mathwise - if you get 3 points added on you pay roughly $70 per point * 3 * 6 so a $200 ticket for going 15 mph over the limit ($50 + $10 for each 1 mile over) actually costs over 1260 + 200 = $1460.

    Dash treatment - Low gloss Armorall or Lexol Vinyl protectant both have worked well for me - do not use hi-gloss or you'll go blind.

    Larry
  • akasrpakasrp Member Posts: 170
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    any downsides to running a larger diameter tire?

    Depending on how much larger, there's the possibility of interference with the struts and/or fenders, which might occur only over bumps or with sizeable steering angles. Even if there's no actual interference, you might leave yourself with no possibility of mounting cable chains. Also, larger diameters are functionally equivalent to taller gearing, which will reduce acceleration proportionately. Taller sidewalls often translate to less-crisp steering response and lower lateral adhesion limits, all other things being equal.
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Life Sentence in Ballistic's Black Hole...

    The dungeon door is open, beckoning...those who enter, never leave.
  • lucien2lucien2 Member Posts: 2,984
    after driving in Europe for extended periods where, because of lane rules and taller gearing (certainly not a USDM XT), 100 mph highway cruising feels safe and comfortable. Returning to the I-95 corridor and the accompanying lane squatting, weaving, lack of signalling, and general lack of attentiveness always takes some re-adjusting.
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Having the power to safely pass at will on uphill climbs is truly gratifying. I remember musing, years ago while stuck behind semitrucks on 2-lane mountain roads, how great it would be to have Ferrari power and just blast past 'em. Now the XT shows that you don't necessarily have to spend Ferrari bucks to get that capability. Doesn't quite match the styling (or exhaust note) though.

    first, the engine is definitely quieter when it spools up from 0 mph thru wherever.

    Explain?

    Second, going at 55 mph or so and booting it results in a lot more wastegate noise.

    I've never heard anything out-of-ordinary that I'd attribute to the wastegate. Maybe it's doing it and I just don't know what to listen for.

    At that the rev's never exceeded 5500 or so.

    Why? I'm losing track of who has which transmission. If yours is the automatic, the one I drove shifted right at the 6500 redline under WOT even when left in Drive. Sheer perfection.

    Speeding - In Maine, and I believe MA as well 30mph over the speed is a felony.

    Some years ago I drove with wife & daughter to Buffalo for a nationals swim competiton, then Springfield Mass to visit friends. Left from there heading for the submarine base. Just before we crossed the Mass state line, we were on a wide 4-lane highway with a 55 posted limit. Wife was driving, probably around 59-60. Went around a gentle curve, suddenly, with zero advance warning and for no reason, the limit dropped to 30 - and right there were about 8 cop cars with radar doing a land-office business ticketing virtually every car. They nailed my wife for 57 in a 30. The fine was $200 IIRC, and being from the west coast, there was no way we could stick around to fight what clearly was nothing but a flagrant speed trap. I probably came close to getting tossed in the pokey for telling the sapsuckers exactly what I thought of them.

    We won't be returning to the land of the Kennedys anytime soon.
  • hayduke01hayduke01 Member Posts: 128
    While it's POSSIBLE to be sentenced to jail for almost any offense, that doesn't mean it's likely.

    The reality is that it's extremely rare for someone to be sentenced to jail for speeding. Of course if you combine the speeding with a third-offense DUI, or with driving with a suspended license, etc., then that changes everything.

    I have to admit that I do occasionally exceed the speed limit. I've been driving with a radar detector since one of the early Escort models, if not the first, in the late 70s.

    But with that said, I am slowing down. My wife still asks me to slow down a little at times, but now it's as likely that she'll exclaim, "Did you know you're driving UNDER the speed limit?"

    Don't know if that's due to aging, or that the Forester is so comfortable at any speed.
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    There you go, Hayduke: The perfect follow-on sequel to Nader's '60s Corvair-obliterating "Unsafe at any speed" diatribe.
  • hayduke01hayduke01 Member Posts: 128
    I wasn't viewing it in the Nader context, but it is an interesting comparison. Sounded almost like a compliment, as did my "liberal probation." :)

    For those who choose to do so, it's easy to find fault with anyone or anything. Not sure how "noone" fits into that picture. There are even some who manage to find fault with their Subarus!

    As an attorney, I deal with people who've found fault, or who perhaps are trying to avoid the wrong side of that finding. So unless it's business, I'd much rather focus on the positives. Come to think of it, even in the context of my practice, I'd still rather focus on the positives. But there are times when the negatives are out there, and you just have to deal with them.
  • lfdallfdal Member Posts: 679
    In Maine 30+ mph results in a free trip to the pokey (at the officer's discretion). Being nice goes a long way.

    I'm not ever going to find out in MA if I can help it - not with the surcharges that my insurance rates would incur.

    I can remember some wonderful highway speed traps set up in Conn for those of us coming from MA.

    Jack - Engine has no valve train or (what I hope) is wastegate noise - just smooth as can be all the way up. 5500 is as fast as I've pushed it because with the automatic I'm way over the speed limit before I hit the red line.

    Now if you mean that an automatic under WOT shouldn't shift until 6500, mine definitely does shift before that. I thought about leaving it in 3rd, under WOT but I'm not sure of the max rpm/mph combination.

    I'm hoping the high frequency "fluttering" sound I hear when I tromp on it after its already at speed is the wastegate. This sound is unique in my experience to this car, which is the only turbo-model I've ever owned.

    Larry
  • overtime1overtime1 Member Posts: 134
    What you are hearing is definitely the wastegate. Its pretty easy to discern if you are cruising along and rapidly depress the gas pedal and then let off (I also have an AT).

    I just hit 1000 miles and the AT will not shift until redline for 1st and 2nd gear under WOT. I'm just beginning to get some experience with this so I'll have more to say later.

    overtime
  • corkfishcorkfish Member Posts: 537
    Yep. That's wastegate flutter. When I first heard it I thought it was engine ping.
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    if you mean that an automatic under WOT shouldn't shift until 6500, mine definitely does shift before that

    If so, all is not well. As you saw from Overtime's note (and several others have said the same), when your XT automatic is in D (Drive) and you take off from a standstill under full throttle, the transmission should let the engine just touch its full 6500rpm redline before upshifting to 2nd, and then again from 2nd to 3rd. That's how the one I test-drove behaved, and it was wonderful - hands down the most enjoyable automatic-equipped car I've ever driven.

    As for the wastegate flutter, I still keep seeing mentions of it, but I haven't noticed any odd sounds from mine that I don't associate with the flat-four configuration (other than the expected turbo whine, of course). Certainly nothing resembling ignition pinging.
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    My message may have been unclear. I was amused by your "comfortable at any speed" line because it differs by only one word from fellow-lawyer Nader's infamous, incendiary, and destructive book title.
      
    By the way - eventually I'll get around to replying to your last PM. I don't usually procrastinate this long, but it's been a zoo around here lately.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I think having reserve power for passing, merging, towing, or hauling, is a critically important safety feature.

    -juice (trying hard to keep a straight face)
  • lfdallfdal Member Posts: 679
    Anyone out there know of a good oil testing service? I'd like to start doing that to each of the Subie's on an annual basis.

    That and I found a really strange yellowish residue on my dipstick this morning when I checked the oil.......

    TIA

    Larry
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Doesn't bobistheoilguy.com do that?

    Though I'll warn you, he's tired of getting "another clean Subaru sample", that's the norm.

    -juice
  • miamixtmiamixt Member Posts: 600
    It seemed my first Oil Change with Mechanic insisted Synthetic oil eliminated most of the flutter. However I would not describe this noise as high pitched at all, that's more like the minimal turbo wine from the XT. The flutter I hear around 2K is right when the turbo kicks in, and the waste gate activates, which I have been told here at Edmunds is normal! Now if I can only stop my A/T Transmission from acting up, actually slipping into Neutral? StuHall, was that the serious problem you were telling us about?
  • bluesubiebluesubie Member Posts: 3,497
    Yep, Bob's site is promotes http://www.blackstone-labs.com
    Pretty easy to do, especially with a Fumoto valve.

    -Dennis
  • lfdallfdal Member Posts: 679
    Thanks for the info folks. I requested a couple of kits from Blackstone last night. I think this will prompt me to go ahead and install a Fumoto on the the wife's OBW, as my Forester already has one. I think annual sampling is a good long term investment.

    Don't know what that residue was I found on the stick yesterday morning, but it was clean this morning. I'm racking what's left of my brain, because I've seen that exact same stuff on another dipstick a few years ago. I just can't remember the outcome. Oil smells fine as well.

    There's no way I'll have the dealer look at it until I have an analysis report in my hand. Then again, if the report comes out okay, I won't have to take it to the dealer at all.

    Also, anyone know of a source for a reasonably priced OBDII scanner?

    TIA

    Larry
  • subearusubearu Member Posts: 3,613
    an OBD-2.com scanner, just hooks up to a laptop pc and can read stuff in real-time (with a slight lag) and clear (or even set) codes.

    -Brian
  • lbhaleylbhaley Member Posts: 91
    Larry,

    Was the residue kind of yellow and foamy? If so, is the weather cold? I have often seen a yellow foamy residue on the dipstick in very cold weather. If I remember right I only saw it when checking the oil before the engine was totally warmed up. I don't think it is anything to worry about.

    -les
  • lfdallfdal Member Posts: 679
    les - Thanks for the feedback. It wasn't foamy, but was yellow - I'd driven the car 300 miles the night before and checked it first thing in the morning (about 25degF) before I warmed it up.

    Is it some kind of weird condensate?

    Still trying to remember where I've seen it before.

    Larry
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Maybe your car has bladder problems.
  • lbhaleylbhaley Member Posts: 91
    Larry,

    If you don't see it when the engine is hot then it probably is some kind of weird condensate. I would think if there was a foreign residue in your oil you would see it when the engine is hot as well.

    -les
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Lemme know the best price you find on that OBD2 scanner. Back when I looked they were $110 or more. I may be into a group buy if you're interested and can find one.

    -juice
  • lfdallfdal Member Posts: 679
    jb - now I know what my car means when it tells me it really has to "go" so often.... all this time I thought it meant go faster.
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