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Subaru Legacy/Outback 2005+

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Comments

  • chronochrono Posts: 149
    Your not alone. I prefer the Legacy over the Outback but I'm also looking into the performace aspect of these cars moreso then others. I've got the Legacy GT as my next car to buy with the 330i being second. I don't think the 11K premium is worth the cost for the 330i.

    BTW, someone off the Legacy Owners Association has scanned the entire 2005 Legacy brochure ..
    http://www.legacysti.com
  • lark6lark6 Posts: 2,565
    Or a WRX with a little more cush and a little less rally inspired styling.

    Sounds like a Saab 9-2x might be to your liking. Saab is doing ride & drives of the 9-2x at various places around the country. I've signed up for the one near Philadelphia; others here have signed up for the events in their areas as well.

    Ed
  • salbaby1972salbaby1972 Posts: 165
    Maybe Bob and Juice won big in LV and SOA gave them free Legacy GTs to be quite.

    I'm betting that the Legacy GT will be alot like the WRX. Just by looking at the GT's weight/power compared to the WRX's weight/power, it should be a great ride. I like the WRX wagon but it is too small to be the ONLY car in the family.

    I like the GT as well, but the wife seems to think it looks unfinshed when comparing to the OB.
  • pon1pon1 Posts: 196
    Thanks for the heads up on the review. I was just thinking how the 3.0R was going to be passed up in all reviews by speed junkie journalists in favor of the XT. Great to get some detail on the motor, no mention of Sportshift but auto sounded like a champ.

    Any idea which model is shown in the interior shot (pre-production I assume...but could be the first sighting of the Canada-only 3.0R base cloth model which I have on order)?? The green car (our color pick) was likely a 3.0R VDC with moonroof and the white one was a base 2.5i.

    JP
  • stevekstevek Posts: 362
    I would not ever buy an outback, however my Legacy GT is one of the best vehicles I ever owned. My 78 year old mother: hey it rides better than our LaSabre, my 40 something cousin with a SAAB and an Acura: wow can I drive it some more, my rich friend with a BMW 8 series: I could not keep up with you on that off-ramp curve.
    Now with a nice turbo (or even better suprecharger) would be sweet.
  • bookemdanobookemdano Posts: 55
    Have you seen the new Outback up close and personal?

    Last Saturday, I went to Carter Subaru in the Seattle area. I got a chance to drive an Outback and to see an Outback next to a Legacy Wagon. (For pics, see my post above.)

    When I went in the dealership, I had a neutral opinion about the Legacy design versus the Outback design, with a little more positive impression of the Legacy. I took one look at them side by side and lost interest in the Legacy.

    The the Legacy looks sleek and dynamic in pics and the Outback looks "bulgy". In person, I got a much different impression. The Legacy wagon looked delicate and small. The Outback looked much more robust. The Outback design looked balanced, while the Legacy Wagon looked "unbalanced" (I really don't know how to explain it better).

    I think the issue is pictures. The Legacy wagon takes good pics, while the Outback looks great in person. You can't appreciate the more robust appearence until you see the Outback in three dimensions.

    Anyway, this is impression. YMMV.

    Regards,

    Dan.
  • luck11luck11 Posts: 425
    Hi. Strange request for anyone out there that might find themselves beside an 05 Outback or Legacy Wagon and have a measuring tape on hand!

    I just picked up a cargo carrier for my 00 Outback, and tried it on this evening. The mounting brackets just barely fit inside the rails (needs some extra install fiddling). My concern is whether this carrier will fit an 05 OB or Legacy Wagon since I plan to upgrade this year. What I need, is the measurements between the rails (inside to inside of rails). I need one near measurement between the rails at the back and another at the front since the rails might taper in at the back as they do on my OB.

    Also, if anyone has close up shots of the rails and cross bars, I would certainly appreciate if you could post.

    Subaru Canada is doing a Test Drive Event in Montreal in June...hope to get there, but in case I cannot, appreciate anyone that can help.

    Thanks in advance.
    Cheers.

    BTW, Subaru Canada website also has a new spread on the 05 OB and Legacy:

    http://www.subarulegacy.ca
    http://www.subaruoutback.ca
  • bookemdanobookemdano Posts: 55
    Be careful what you ask for. You may get it.

    I have a 2002 Audi A4 V6, 6Sp with 24000 mile. It is without question the single most UNRELIABLE car that I've ever owned.

    While it is a great looking car with excellent fit and finsh, it's a coverup for a multitude of sins. For example, it's been in the shop over 25 times for non-routine maintenance. I had to have it towed twice. It would have been three times, but I was able to push start the car once. The coils have been replaced(twice!). The battery has been replaced. An electronics module burned out the Battery and several light bulbs. It had an oil leak that was repaired.

    Besides things breaking...

    -- The radio is the single WORST radio that I've ever had in a car; my wife's RAV4 with basic OEM radio does better.

    -- The heater is abysmal. If the outside temperature is under 60 degrees and you set the thermostat to 64 degrees, the heater pumps 122 degree air (I measured it) in your face until the car temp reaches 69 degrees (I measured that too). The dealer and Audi said that the heater was "performing normally".

    -- The ventilation system is horrible. I couldn't figure out why the flow of air was so distracting from the eye-level vents. They are smallish, but not that small. Then I actually measured where the air is coming from. Even though the dash air vent is about 2 inches by 3 inches, the actual air comes out in the center 1 inch by 1 inch portion. So you get no air or a blast in the face. (The 2005 Outback that I drove had air vents that are quite nice by comparison. Large and useful.)

    -- The six speed Audi transmission sounds "spiffy" doesn't it? Well try shifting quickly. It's very notchy and slow shifting. You can NOT hurry the shift. In everyday driving it is one PITA (Pain in the ...). And I have 20 years experience in stick shifts. (My 1988 Acura Legend Coupe was wonderful.)

    -- The stick shift knob has a chrome ring that cracks and starts breaking off chuncks. These chuncks cut your hand (drew blood twice). It has been replaced once and needs replacing again.

    -- And that low slung, Audi looks great doesn't it. Well, with 4" of ground clearance, don't take it on a fire road. Or even over a good sized speed bump. I've bottomed the car many times.

    So, if you REALLY want an Audi A4, mine will be coming off of lease shortly. If you truly love pain, I'll put you in touch with Audi leasing. I'm sure they can arrange a quick transfer of my pain to you.

    Me? I'm going to get a Subaru.

    Regards,

    Dan.
  • iluvsubaru2iluvsubaru2 Posts: 56
    I've not got specs in front of me but the change in the shape of the OB roof (more domelike than 2004), seats that move further back by what seems like maybe 3 inches (driver's seat) meant I could operate an OB clutch safely and comfortably, which I've never been able to do before. 2005 OB seemed couple inches wider, and wheelbase a bit longer vs 2004.

    I tested a base model but it handled better than AT 2004s tested: steering very precise and superb cornering. Brakes are better, more like Forester's (ie larger disc, EBD). MT nice, smooth clutch. I love the 50/50 default torque split on MT AWD but that's old news for Subaru MT owners.

    Fit and finish was typical "Indiana Outback", by which I mean not as tight and precise as the 100% Japanese produced and assembled Forester. On the OB tested, two examples: actuation lever for tilt steering had too much lateral play, and I noticed the fuel lid was loosely seated. But this kind of thing is not unusual for OBs. Walking my dealer's lot after the drive I checked six 2004 OBs: one third had play in the lid, one had too much play in the tilt actuation lever. By contrast every Forester I checked was uniform with no play in tilt actuation lever or fuel lid. Japanese quality control.

    I mention this only to say it won't deter me from seriously considering the 2005 OB especially if I can fit in a VDC (which I just might). What seems to suffer in US "made" Subarus are fit and finish, usually not deal-breaking issues.
     
    What I'll be watching closely are reports on how well Subaru has implemented critical performance and safety features such as Side Air Curtains, the larger SABs, upgrades to the passenger cage, and braking system. Alot of what's added to 3rd Gen OB has been well-designed and executed on the 2nd Gen Forester. I want to see now if Subaru can walk the talk with the 2005 OB. We'll soon see.

    Jake,
    PS: 2005 OB seats are better for tall guys than a Forester: offers higher headrests which are safer and more comfortable.
  • nowakj66nowakj66 Posts: 709
    Thanks - there is a local Saab dealer and they might have a ride and drive. I'll reserve judgment till I see it, but I think I would feel like the 9-2x is not a good deal compared to a turbo Legacy or Outback. The 2.5 L should be stronger than the 2.0 in the Saab. But the price would be close.

    Maybe when I sit in one, I'll think the 9-2x the perfect compromise, but for now, it seems like not too much more in the way of content for the money relative to similar Subaru choices.
  • cdnp5cdnp5 Posts: 163
    Where did you find out about this drive event. I'm wondering if they would be having one in Toronto as I would like to participate in it. Could you let me know? Thanks.
  • snowbirdsnowbird Posts: 120
    You can register for a test drive in Toronto on line via www.subaru.ca. Good luck and tell us about the drive afterwards.
  • zman3zman3 Posts: 857
    Heads up for anyone interested: The Subaru dealer in Bloomington MN has two '05 3.0 LLBeans listed on their web page. I knew the base models were in some dealers but I thought the 3.0's weren't due until later this summer. If they indeed are out I think it is time for a test drive.
  • bookemdanobookemdano Posts: 55
    Hi,

    Last Saturday, I tested a 2005 base model Auto Trans Outback at a local Subaru dealer. I liked the car and the auto trans worked well. However, back at the dealers lot, I noticed something odd...

    If the shift selector is in "D" mode to and to the right side, it operates as a standard auto trans. If you then you move it to the left, and then forward or backward, it operates as a manual trans. Standard stuff so far. But...

    If the shift selector is in the "D" mode and to the right, and THEN moved to the left but NOT forward or backward, an indicator on the dash pops on saying "Sport". This implies some sort of Sport mode. Typically a "Sport Mode" means auto shifting, but more aggressive downshifting and higher RPM upshifting.

    Does anybody know what this means in the 2005 Outback? With this be on the 5Sp?

    Thanks and regards,

    Dan.

    p.s., One reviewer (I think at Edmunds) noted that the base Outback Auto seemed slow to shift. Assuming that the "Sport" mode makes the auto trans shift more aggressively, I'm wondering if the reviewer just didn't notice the "Sport" mode.
  • salbaby1972salbaby1972 Posts: 165
    Hi Dan,

    I feel your pain. We had a 01 allraod with tons of problems. We had over 20K worth of repairs on it. Thankfully it was covered under Audi's super warrantee. If me and my wife we'll get another Subie.

    Yes Audi's are pretty, to bad they go sour.
  • luck11luck11 Posts: 425
    Cdnp5....as stated, go to http://www.subaru.ca. Main page has link to the Drive Event, click on it and it opens another window. You'll see the link to the registration form that has all the dates and times available.

    BTW, check out the Subaru Crew - Canadian Owners thread (pon1 "Subaru Crew: Canadian Owners" Apr 26, 2004 3:12pm) for more Cdn specific info ...some of us have posted Cdn MSRP for the new 05s.

    Cheers.
  • lark6lark6 Posts: 2,565
    nowakj66: I understand what you mean. I'd have a hard time justifying the premium price for the 9-2x and intend to make that clear to the Saabites.

    Unrelated: I visited my local Subaru dealer at lunchtime yesterday and got to poke around inside and out of two '05 Outbacks (both 2.5i) and two '05 Legacies (2.5i sedan and wagon). All very nice in terms of fit and finish as well as quality of interior materials. OBs were two/tone green (very allroad-like) and monotone black (not what I'd expect on an OB, more GT); Legacy sedan was silver, Legacy wagon the darker of the two available blues (Regal IIRC?).

    Ed
  • saywhatsaywhat Posts: 61
    Add me too!!!!! Subaru is not paying att. Subaru should offer Sta.control, high int. dis. headlights, and a height adj. for the drivers front seat. What a shame.
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 7,844
    ...looks to have been updated with build/price for the 05's.
  • radianradian Posts: 21
    Saywhat: 2005 Legacies and Outbacks do offer Height Adjustment for the driver's front seat on all models.

    I agree that VDC and HIDs would be great to have across a greater range of Subarus. I personally don't care for HIDs, but some sort of stability control would be cool, and having options is always good.

    PS: I'm a little bummed that the 2005 2.5GT doesn't have auto-climate control after all. Hopefully that'll make the Limited more of a value for those who thought it too pricey.
  • cdnp5cdnp5 Posts: 163
    I have now signed us up for the event, hopefully we get in. We're also signed up for the Chrysler even on the next weekend but I'm only interested in the 'Viper ride' and some free food, lol. More for fun. Now the Subie's are something we are very interested in. Can't wait. I'll also start tracking the Cdn content. Thanks again. Always a great board.
  • goneskiiangoneskiian Posts: 381
    Does anybody know what this means in the 2005 Outback? With this be on the 5Sp?

    I believe you've got it right. It means it will shift more aggressively by holding the gear longer before upshifting and downshifting quicker when slowing.

    Yes, the 5 speed Auto boxes get this "Sport" feature as well as the manumatic feature.

    If you search this thread, I believe one of our esteemed Australian compatriots posted a review of the 5EAT earlier in this discussion.

    Cheers!
    -Ian

    p.s. Where are juice and rsholland. They've got to be back from Vegas by now! ;-)
  • subaru_teamsubaru_team Posts: 1,676
    it is available for more aggressive up and down shifting. When I drove it, it really made a difference when I wanted that extra boost w/o going into manual mode.

    Patti
  • subaru_teamsubaru_team Posts: 1,676
    I'm sure you'll see more enhancements to this new model in the near future. When they first come out, they are trying to offer options and varying price ranges to help meet the needs of a wide variety of buyers. Everything can be added at a cost - but determining what folks will pay will be the true test.

    Please keep posting your thoughts and opinions. I promise I'll keep sharing them.

    Thanks!

    Patti
  • kenskens Posts: 5,869
    Patti,

    Did you get to try out the steering wheel mounted shift buttons?

    Ken
  • chenkechenke Posts: 14
    Maybe an odd question, but does anyone know if the new models will still have the weather band radio? I always thought this was a cool option on my Mom's Forester.

    TIA,

    Chris
  • goneskiiangoneskiian Posts: 381
    Good question Chris. I'm seeing conflicting reports on this. A salesman in Seattle has a great website with all the new specs (www.cars101.com), and according to him, yes, the new model Legacy's and Outback's do get the weather band on the stereo.

    On the other hand, I just picked up a brochure for the 2005's today from another dealership and they don't mention weatherband being included.

    Maybe Patti can clarify for us?

    Cheers!
    -Ian
  • bookemdanobookemdano Posts: 55
    Patti,

    Thanks for the feedback.

    I did a search as goneskiian suggestion (thanks goneskiian) and found a description of how it works. I think it's a nice design, because the driver only has to deal with one control to change from standard auto to Sport auto to manual. Very slick design.

    And, I'm very surprised that a base model car would have a sport mode. Many don't.

    One quibble however...

    The design is so integrated (a nice thing) that many people will never notice it. Especially when test driving the car. And especially with a base model car. I only found it after the test drive, when I was fiddling with the AT. Combine this with the fact that the Sales Rep didn't have much information on the car and I suspect that some customers will leave never knowing that the Sport mode can make the car feel snappier.

    A suggestion: Make sure that the Sales Rep explains this feature before the test drive.

    Regards,

    Dan.
  • bookemdanobookemdano Posts: 55
    Since I'm a contract software developer, I get paid for the hours I work. Over the last 2 1/2 years, I figure that I've lost about $4,000 in time lost due to my stupid Audi. Even with Audi's excellent warranty (and Barrier Motors' great service), I still took a financial hit.

    The thought of more work time lost, and the high cost and frequency of post-warranty repairs means that I'm NOT going to buy the Audi at the end of it's lease. I'm looking for a much more reliable car - like a Subaru. :-)

    Regards,

    Dan.
  • bookemdanobookemdano Posts: 55
    One accessory for the 2005 Outback is the "R5B Security System Upgrade Includes perimeter alarm." My Audi has this and it's works great. But the Audi system has an override so that you can turn off the motion detector when necessary (such as when I leave my little poodle-dude Sammy in the car).

    Does the Subaru system have a user-selectable override?

    Thanks and regards,

    Dan.
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