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Subaru Legacy/Outback 2005+

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Comments

  • ssmintonssminton Posts: 155
    As a 2003 Honda Pilot owner, I question Honda's current committment to their renowned quality and reliability. I am on these boards today because I am considering selling the "Best SUV". Not that the quality is poor. My Pilot has the same problems every other car has or maybe a few less. Why give up performance, comfort, and ammenities for reliability that is just above average. Not too sure about the TSX, but I know the MDX and Accords are facing similar reviews.
  • c_hunterc_hunter Posts: 4,487
    MDX, Odyssey, and Pilot have all had assorted quality issues over the years. I test drove an MDX back in fall 01 and it had a lot of noticeable defects. I thought these vehicles were getting better recently.

    I perused the TSX boards, and noticed the usual share of first year bugs. I'd try to wait for an 05 if we end up going for a TSX.

    Craig
  • kenskens Posts: 5,869
    cbell: Congrats on the purchase! I'll soon be joining you with a silver Legacy GT Ltd wagon! Let us know how you like it. I'll also be checking for that rear outlet.

    The Subaru website and brochures are wrong. All Legacy GTs (Limited and regular) get auto climate control.

    Ken
  • k9nolesk9noles Posts: 14
    Hello all...just an observation since 1st fill up of GT Ltd 5MT...averaged 24 MPG for full tank in very mixed stop and go and highway driving. Also, in 35 mile trip to Denver airport this a.m., averaged just under 30 for that trip, which was also mixed driving.

    Driving the car as aggressively as I dare while still in break in-no redlines!

    Getting all kinds of looks everywhere we go-kids just stare, adults ask questions. Amazing power-both low end torque and high end HP.

    Question...My dealer in Boulder, CO (supposedly through their SOA rep-name's John Mergen)said "The offer for a free 3-year maintenance plan was sent to a select group consisting of members of affiliations to Subaru of America. We do apologize for any inconvenience this causes. However, as you were not on the mailing list for this offer, we cannot extend this offer to you."

    I GUESS that makes sense, but we're prior Subie owners, and besides, from the way some of you here have volunteered to give your coupons away, it seems as if the things are completely transferable anyway! Dealer claims only knolwedge of free service is on a 39 month lease.

    Any thoughts or advice? We ordered in late April and took delivery 6/22/04-got all options and paid 3% over invoice.

    Thanks very much...Sorry for protracted post...

    Steve
  • bblachabblacha Posts: 160
    ... I'm with you on Honda. I bought an Accord to experience "the perfect car," but it's not perfect. Nothing serious, but rattles, rough-shifting slushbox etc. Going back to Subaru now; if there's no "perfect car", might as well get one that's fun. And still pretty darn good.
  • kenskens Posts: 5,869
    Slightly OT, but still related to the 05 Legacy...

    Until someone figures out how to connect an iPod directly to the stock headunit, should I even bother with a FM modulator? I don't see any other option in the short run. I also don't want to be the first to take apart the center console and start poking around.

    Anyone know which of the FM modulators are better? iTrip, Monster, Belkin?

    Ken
  • c_hunterc_hunter Posts: 4,487
    The best FM modulators go inline with the radio antenna cable. Everything else is a crapshoot because it's going to be based on reception between the modulator and the in-glass antenna.

    I'm not even sure where to buy an inline modulator -- Crutchfield did not list any on their website. I have a vintage one sitting around in my garage, from 1989 when I hooked up a Sony Discman in my car!

    Anybody on nabisco figure out pinouts on the new Legacy radio yet? I know somebody came real close with the Forester XT radio.

    Craig
  • legacy191legacy191 Posts: 29
    Craig, I feel your pain !!!! we were in the same boat except we were comparing the GT LTD 5EAT to the Acura TL. It came down to price and the secuity of AWD in the winter in Minnesota. The TL was a tough car to walk away from but she compared both cars side by side and she felt that for her the GT LTD was the better fit for her. Hope to be a NEW OWNER of a GT LTD in september of this year..

    Tony T
  • goneskiiangoneskiian Posts: 381
    cbell - I don't have an outlet in my cargo area either. I don't think the Legacy's get one, just the Outbacks.

    As for the dual zone climate control it seems both the GT's and GT Ltd.'s get this feature (contrary to what both the website and brochure state).

    I'm over 1000 miles now and have averaged 21.38, 22.28 and 23.48 respectively on my last 3 tanks of gas. FWIW, the trip computer average mpg readout has been slightly higher each time reading 23.1 and 24.3 on the last two tanks (forgot to check on the first tank). I'm not sure why it's reading higher, but the OCD in me is annoyed. ;-)

    The first two tanks were about 65/35 city/highway and the last tank more like 75/25.

    I'm also very impressed with the A/C. We've had some pretty warm days here in the PNW over the few short weeks I've had my new ride and it cools down VERY quickly.

    Thoroughly enjoying my new GT Ltd. Wagon!

    Cheers!
    -Ian
  • gotenks243gotenks243 Posts: 116
    Though the topic has long since been blown by, to be quite honest not even the manual TSX really felt that quick. Granted I haven't driven an auto TSX, but not even the auto 2.5i I drove really "felt" slower. Neither were super fast. Both were adequate. But I have trouble distinguishing between the feel of their acceleration in my memory. The TSX did come alive a bit more at the higher revs, true, but I didn't exactly redline the 2.5i either.

    Both did feel impressively quicker than my 97 4EAT Outback, which quite frankly can handle any merging situation and also outaccelerate 90% of cars at stoplights if you put the pedal far enough to the floor. Actual 0-60 doesn't seem like a big deal to me, particularly knowing that even 2.5GTs will spend most of their lives accelerating from a stoplight in traffic that doesn't believe in letting their engines rev over 3000 rpm. In normal situations, at least in my experience a TSX and 2.5i should feel about the same, and both offer ample power for the occasions that it is necessary.

    Mike
  • I saw the Motor Week review on PBS station today. Overall, it was a positive review. The outback XT with 5EAT was clocked at 6.8 Second for 0-60 MPH. The only negative which was mentioned in the review was the average stopping distance of 155 feet for 60 to 0 mph. I would have thought that the reduction in the weight of the vehicle, the stopping distance should be better than 00-04 model year. Subaru definitely needs to improve the braking system. With all the safety features (safety cage body, side and curtain air bags), braking system, which is the first line of defence for avoiding accident, is the weakest point for 05 model.

    Alland (02 Bean)
  • luck11luck11 Posts: 425
    My 00 OB has the option of installing some air filters to filter the exterior air coming thru the vents. I have used this since day one, especially here in Canada where on a cold dry winter day, you can cut the road salt clouds with a knife.

    Do the 05 OBs and Legacies also have this feature?
  • c_hunterc_hunter Posts: 4,487
    Yes, it's an option just like the 00-04 models.

    Craig
  • pathtomaxpathtomax Posts: 215
    I am a little behind everyone else here in NH, but I finally drove an '05! I am still very happy with my '01 OB 4EAT LTD Wagon, but I had the gift certificate for a drive and thought it would be fun.

    I really wanted to drive the Outback XT LTD 5-speed but all they had were automatics at the dealership. They are due in next week. I did get the chance to drive the GT wagon. I have a few notes:

    -The leather seats were MUCH more supportive and contoured than my leather seats. They have a great feel to them (higher-end) and they really hold the driver in place.
    - Love the sunroof configuration. The dual roofs that I have now are nothing like the quasi-convertible feel in the GT!
    -That engine is amazing! I kept throwing it into corners and it drove perfectly. Last year I drove an '04 Accord Coupe with 220 HP and the tires were constantly spinning. With AWD, the GT held onto the road with no problems!

    I do love my 4EAT, but 250 HP compared to my 168 HP on all highway driving.... I could see one quicker than I expected. :)
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,724
    Sounds like the XT, and maybe other Outbacks too, could use the larger Legacy GT's brakes?

    Bob
  • gotenks243gotenks243 Posts: 116
    I'm really surprised at the braking number. The biggest difference in feel between the 2.5i I drove and my 97 Outback when I got back in was the responsiveness of the brakes. The brakes were quick (G35 "touchy" if you will) and felt quite good.

    And the XT actually has 11.5 inch front rotors versus the 2.5i 10.8s. I guess the brakes only feel responsive? I'm confused. The XT even has wider tires...

    Mike
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Tires probably explain a lot. Outback will also have more dive/squat than a GT, plus it's heavier, so even the bigger rotors wouldn't help it match the GT's anchors.

    So, GT LTD is $2000 more than the TSX and AWD is worth about....$2000! So pick the one you prefer.

    On one hand, you already have an AWD car and your wife prefers the TSX, plus it'll be hers. Fuel costs will be lower.

    On the other, AWD is more versatile and you can get the 3 years of free service, plus you are more familiar with Subaru (and Patti just in case).

    Like someone said, the TSX is still just a FWD normally aspirated 4 cylinder. A european tourist might see your car and laugh if he knew what you paid. That might offset your wife's preference for the Acura badge.

    Tough call. Give her all the info you've heard here and let her decide. I think the TSX is fine. It's just the Legacy is more than fine - it's awesome.

    Jay: power or girl? That one had me rolling. Um, what's she like? ;-)

    -juice
  • bgsintthbgsintth Posts: 16
    This cannot be just tires alone. As I said elsewhere, I hope that this particular car had glazed rotors and air in the brakes lines as a result of another magazine's testing/flogging. From recollection as an avid motorweek viewer, I cannot recall any car/SUV/truck having such poor braking performance.

    I think SOA owes Motorweek/us a response, and if 155 feet is accurate, a major tire/brake upgrade.

    And to think I just sold my WRX's Stoptech BBK in preparation for trading the car in for the OBXT.....

    Martin
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    C&D's braking distances were a little long, but not out of the ordinary. Might have been an abused press car.

    -juice
  • kenskens Posts: 5,869
    Yeah, I know it's a crapshoot but I'm also bummed at the thought of not being able to use my iPod too. Again, it's just a temporary measure until *someone* figures out a hardwire solution.

    I'm kind of leaning towards either the iTrip or Monster iCarplay.

    I've seen some of the hardwire FM modulator mods and honestly, I think I'd rather swap out the head unit than go through all that trouble and still get FM-quality sound.

    Ken
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    For Karen:

    http://www.mpt.org/motorweek/reviews/rt2343a.shtml

    My favorite part:

    we don't think that Subaru will relinquish its position as leader of the crossover segment anytime soon

    6.8 ain't bad 0-60 for an automatic. The allroad (7.4) or XC70 (8.5) can't match that, nor can they match the fuel mileage of the XT.

    -juice
  • kenskens Posts: 5,869
    I just saw the latest episode reviewing the 05 OBXT this weekend too.

    I thought it was strange that Motorweek, perhaps one of the most conservative reviewers, managed to best C&D's 0-60 time of 7.1 seconds. I'm wondering if that's in any way related to what I experienced on my test drives. Some 5EATs just seemed quicker than others.

    Also, does anyone know if C&D factors in elevation at all? I believe their tests were held up in Lake Tahoe -- a 5000 ft elevation difference might have played a factor.

    The braking was a bit of a let down in an otherwise glowing review. I thought it was due to the OE tires as well as the visible dive. C&D also measured some longish brake distances too.

    Ken
  • Check out the 05 XT Outback review at Motor Week web site. The review has been posted.

    Alland
  • luck11luck11 Posts: 425
    Thanks Craig. Cabin fitration is a must on my next vehicle.
  • cbellcbell Posts: 11
    Thank you, kens. We are quite happy with the GT so far. I bent some of my own car-buying rules to get it; but, the value is so obviously there, and I decided to put happiness first. =-)

       I haven't seen any other Legacies out on the road yet, although I have seen several 2005 Outbacks. I predict that both models will be somewhat harder to come by in PDX, once awareness reaches critical mass. I doubt that many people will get close to invoice here.

       As for the cargo area outlet: After checking Subaru's website carefully, it seems clear that only the Outback gets the third 12V receptacle. That's okay, since nobody ever claimed otherwise. Again, this is my only disappointment so far, and I'm very persnickety.

       The first GT wagon that I test-drove was silver / charcoal, which looks very sharp on the Legacy. Good luck with your buying experience kens, and I hope that you will like the wagon as much as we do.

       -cheers, cbell
  • ash13ash13 Posts: 8
    After reading all the posts just thought I would chime in. Just put in an order for a GT 5EAT, spoiler, pop equip package 1, and all weather mats, for 26,600. Might have been able to do better but it would have been much more of a hassle. Car drives like a dream. Smooth acceleration considering it is a turbo. Couldn't deal with a manual in DC traffic, probably wouldn't have wanted one anyways considering how great this one drives and the sportshift. Almost got a WRX a year ago and now I am glad I waited. Hope the coupon book follows shortly to really complete this package.
    What have been the impressions on the stereo? I didn't think it was bad but was not blown away by it. Anyone looking into getting it switched out? With what?
  • luck11luck11 Posts: 425
    I haven't had the opportunity to test drive yet, but I too am interested in impressions of the stereo system.

    I switched out the factory deck on my 00 OB, kept the OEM speakers and it made a HUGE difference. Of course, as has been mentioned, the current configuration where the deck is integrated into the 'console' will make a switch rather difficult unless an aftermarket option becomes available.....any word on the street?
  • kenskens Posts: 5,869
    Thanks, I think I'm going to love my GT wagon. I also ordered mine in Silver/Charcoal and it should be here any day now.

    Ken
  • kenskens Posts: 5,869
    I've heard that there is a replacement center console cover sold in Japan for Legacy owners that want to swap in their own stereos. I'm not sure if it will be offered in the US quite yet.

    Ken
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    http://www.mpt.org/motorweek/reviews/rt2343a.shtml

    Jamie (aka Subie Gal) said they had a face plate in Japan that let you install any Double-DIN sized stereo, but she wasn't sure if there were selling it here yet.

    -juice
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