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Lexus GS 300/GS 430

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  • My current car is a 98 Lexus GS300 with 53k miles - a fabulous car but hopeless in the northeast this time of year [I put my snows on each winter - they don't help much]. I have driven the GS300AWD and the RL - both great cars. I have a bad back and am looking for the most comfortable of the two - the RL seems to have an edge, but its not a Lexus. Any thoughts?
  • what is the HP and Tourque rating on the 3.5L. I dont think the VDM is offered on the 300, on the 430 here in America which sucks.
  • cove148cove148 Posts: 117
    First, the 6 speed has been supporting a V8 in the LS430 starting with the 2004 model, combination seems to be working great.
    Second, Check the specs on the 3.5L in the 2005 Avalon, by all indications this will be the engine in the GS300 update expected in model year 2007.
  • 2007 seems to soon, if it is the same engine from the avalon which it very may be, then why not put it in now? That leads me back to the whole too much Hp close to the V8. Hopefully your right cause that would give the GS300 some real power. If anything it would be a 2008 model.
  • oacoac Posts: 1,594
    The 4.6L motor goes into the MY2007 LS first. This car debuts late Summer/early fall 2006. Then the GS430 becomes GS460, and a hybrid version - GS450h, also debuts in MY2007 (next year). At which time one can/should expect the GS300 to also move up to the GS350, where the output difference is now more comfortable - 280hp v 330hp (projected numbers).
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    280 horses and 260 ft.lbs of torque. The VDIM system is currently only on the 430. The 300 just gets the old VSC stability styem.
  • I thought Lexus was gonna put changes in gradually, staggered to enhance the lifespan of the car over time?

    Putting a new V8, V6, and Hybrid in within 6 months doesn't make much sense, compared to what Clements said is the strategy.

    One engine will have to wait for '08. My guess is it would be the V8. If it is running under 6 seconds now, there is no need to rush a bigger engine in.

    My question is, as the LS has a history of appearing in redesigned form between mid-October and mid-Novemeber, when do you release new V6 in the GS?

    I'd do it right around the first of the year, 2007.

    The marketing blitz on the new LS has died down, the year end sales event is over, and it gives customers a reason to go to the dealership in the dark cold months of January and February.

    I'd expect the Hybrid in Summer of '07, and the V8 a year after the six.

    DRFill
  • oacoac Posts: 1,594
    You make good points.

    Here is what we know. The new LS will come with the new V8 engine. Should arrive in dealerships by mid-October 2006 as MY2007.

    The GS350 would have been around in Japan for 18 months by end of 2006, so maybe bring it in March 2007, as an early 2008 GS350. Maybe release the hybrid GS450h about the same time as this engine upgrade. Then bring in the GS460 before end of 2007 as an MY2008 release.

    What do you think of this staggered guesses ?
  • Why let the GS go ICE cold, with no upgrades between now and winter 2007?

    I woant the GS to still have something going for it when the LS hits, so the GS isn't totally forgotten.

    It would be best if Lexus would bring one new engine 2 months before the LS lands, so the GS can enjoy a strong close to '06, and have sustained momentum into another engine release in early '07, and get additional quality traffic, as the LS' market dominance continues to grow.

    I don't think the car (GS) is competitive enough to go through Winter '07 without a new engine (3.0 notwithstanding).

    I'd try to have the 3.5 ready just as the LS arrives.

    The Hybrid would take away too much from the LS launch.

    The 4.6 GS would do the same.

    The 3.5 will be ready within a year. I'm hearing it's not just a straight swap out of Avalon, but more powerful. And the 3.0 may saty in the lineup.

    Given the price of the GS430, the LS doesn't look like it'll go much past $60k base price. I thought they may go right to $65k, but $15k is too big a gap to leave.

    One other thought is this structure:

    GS300: 245HP - low $40's
    GS350: 300HP - under $50k (Acura RL with more torque)
    GS460: 350-360HP - $55-57k
    2007 LS: 350HP - 20/28MPG - $65-85k

    DrFill
  • cook3cook3 Posts: 2
    I will be looking at the M35 this weekend. The cowl height is quite high on the GS300. Not having seen an M35 in person, I was wondering if the dash is less obtrusive?
  • Hello lex4life
    The 3.5 engine would have the horsepower at around 270-280hp (depending environmental regulation for each country) with torque power that is very close to the Fuga 350 (Nissan) sedan since l don’t have the brochure with me. I also called the engineers at the Higashi-Fuji Technical Center last night and he told me the new engine design was suffering lower than expected “performance” and hesitation problems that is very similar to the Windom sedan selling in the America market when they installed environmental-related components to comply America environmental regulations (but such problem have not exhibit by the ones that’s selling for the Japanese market). Therefore they decide to postpone the launch date for the GS 350 sedan in America until the issue has fully resolved which they hopefully can be done by the time the LS sedan arrives in America. So what is likely to happen is both GS 350 and 430 would launch on schedule for the Japanese market, but the America market would have to live with the new 3.0 liter engine for a while until Toyota come up with the solution for the 3.5 liter engine.
    I am just wondering what are the types of hesitation/performance problems suffered by the Windom sedan currently selling in America since none of the Windom sedan in Japan I know of has suffer any sort of hesitation or performance problems? But I know there are researchers in Japan working on the engine/transmission problem for the Windom sedan selling in America market (is this the nature of the problem?). Any information available would be greatly appreciated.
    Ken
  • jrock65jrock65 Posts: 1,371
    Well, that makes the most sense, since Japan gets the GS350 from the get-go.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Did you mean our Toyota Avalon? That is the only Toyota vehicle currently available here that has the new 3.5L
  • Hello Lexusguy
    Toyota Avalon??? Humm..I never heard of this sedan in Japan before, but since you are talking about this car would also have the 3.5 liter engine like the GS-sedan does, then the problem becomes much more complicated. My best guess would be although the engine's basic platform between the two sedan would be very similar, but I think GS engine would be tuned for high sportniess, which make some of the parts used to produce the engine are differ than the Avalon sedan which I believe it’s built for comfort (am I correct??). Also the transmission used by the GS-sedan would be the ones coming from the Crown Athlete sedan (6-speed), which is tuned for sportiness. On the other hand, I believe from what I read from edmunds.com the Avalon sedan are using the 5-transmission that is similar from the Camry sedan, which is less expensive to produce it. Such difference between the engine components and transmission can explain as to why the Avalon sedan would be on sale on schedule and the GS350 sedan is not
    Hope this would help
    Ken
  • jim20jim20 Posts: 10
    I drove a GS 300 last night. For all of the complaining about its lack of a larger engine [Confession: Some of that was from me...] it did very well. It definitely handles better than the old GS 300. There is almost total road isolation, so if that is what you like, go for it.
  • Very nice. Power is excellent. Handling and braking are great. Takes a little while to set the car up, and I will have to get a bluetooth phone now.

    It did not come quite as loaded as I had hoped. No PCS or adaptive cruise control.

    Price was $58,334 MSRP. No discount, no markup.
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    Did you drive the AWD or RWD? Did you notice any pronounced tire thump over bumps?
  • Hello iunknown
    I am very surprised the new GS in America have no adaptive cruise and PCS Japan because these things are standard features if I pruchase the B package, which would cost me around 6.2 million yen (around 62000 US dollars). The package also include the lane departure warning system too! and they are selling the GS for $58 334; it's way too expensive. I think there's has some serious problems in Toyota America because why they don't sell the similar types of packages we have in Japan??? May-be they would come in later model years, but why not now???
    Ken
  • On the 2006 GS...is there an actual spoiler or do they just call that thing sticking out of the trunk the spoiler? Will it have one like the one on the 2005 GS or just that trunk extension?
  • does anyone know where i can find a picture of the 2006 gs with a rear spoiler? that is if it's not that trunk extension.
  • I also drove one today. Great Ride. What price were you quoted? My dealer quoted low $600's for a 36yr/15k lease.No money down just taxes. Anybody bought one yet?
  • I have the new RL and it is a great car. Had a GS400 in the past but it was awful in the snow. I love the Lexus but not enough power in the AWD GS300. When Lexus gets more power in an AWD GS, I will be the first one in line. Until then, I have a great car for another 2-3 years.
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    I highly recommend against a 36 year lease, for a number of financial reasons.

    Just jabbin ya, I thought it was a funny typo.

    ;)

    ~alpha
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    Just don't drive it more than 416.66 miles per year!
  • I test drove a 2006 GS 300 (rwd) today and enjoyed it. I found the dynamics of the car better than expected. The brakes were a bit touchy but strong and after initial grab, progressive. The steering was a bit light. Suspension was most impressive dynamic feature. It let you feel the road without letting the occupants become jarred going over potholes and the like. Very little side roll going around turns but I set off the ASC/TRAC each hard corner.

    The engine was adequate. This is not bad and I could be happy with this performance given the mpg bonus. I was not surprised by more power than I expected from the stats though.

    I love the outside lines of the new car (very BMW 5 series and 1st generation SC coupe front end) but was disappointed by the Mystic Metallic (silver) color on this car. The interior design was pure Lexus/Heaven.

    I was VERY disappointed with the interior dimensions. My head scraped the border of the moonroof border cloth even with the seat full lowered and seatback tilted more than my usual. My left shoulder was too tight against the door and B-pillar area. Same noted when in the front passenger seat with my right shoulder. The rear roof is about 3 inches too low for me to sit up straight. I am 6'3" but still surprised as I fit fine in my Boxster. The trunk also was very small for a four door sedan. (I think only 2 cu. ft. larger than the Boxster!)

    Now, for my 'mistake'. I sat in an LS430. It was glorious. Inches of room top and sides leftover. The seats, particularly the front thigh supports, where better. GS and LS are both ventilated. Rear seats obviously were cavernous as was the trunk being nearly double the size. The exterior dimensions being 7 inches longer and two inches higher and width about the same as the GS. I took it for a test drive and found the acceleration much better than the GS (no suprise 0-60 5.9sec). What really suprised me was how much better it cornered compared to what I thought. While it was not nearly as good as the GS in cornering it made up for it (to my mind) with better ride and acceleration.

    The shocker was that the 63K sticker leased out to $799/month inc. tax(36months/15Kmiles/month) while the non-discounted GS300awd was $854/month same particulars. Both had Nav/ML.

    Needless to say, I am strongly leaning toward the LS430. While it has 'senior stigma' and no awd I can get past this. To be fair, if the GS 'fit' me then I never would have sat in or drove the LS. Bad things do happen for good reasons... :)
  • I think that the LS has universal appeal, just because it is a good car. You can use it for whatever you please, it's capable enough, and it's also uber comfortable. Don't worry about the stigma. I think that the LS looks stately and pleasant, and I'm not a senior, either. Sure better than a 7 series, and a bunch cheaper, too. The LS looks better than the GS.... maybe Lexus should have built the GS off the LS frame.....
    I've said it before, the LS is one of my favorites.
  • The new GS300 has slightly more power than my current model so although the RL has a lot more, its not the deciding factor. Maybe I am spoiled, having kept my GS for 7+ years, but I am hoping not to replace my next car for at least 5 years. Seems like you are waiting until the GS AWD gets more power and then you'll make the switch. The fact that you gave up the GS400 for the RL is a great testament to the Acura. My wife has an MDX - its a good car but very heavy on gas.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Hey Im no senior! The LS is a magnificent car, definitely anyone that hasnt driven the car since the 400 days will be mighty surprised. If you can, try and find one with the Euro-sport suspension and the big 5-spoke wheels. It wont be easy, it seems around 1% of cars actually have this instead of the air or standard suspensions, but its worth it.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I think the above post #1508 is exactly why the GS430 has always had a hard time selling. For the average Lexus buyer sport isn't important and the GS and LS are very close in price so the bigger LS starts to look like the obvious choice.

    I'm betting Lexus will fix this with the next LS. It will probably start at 65k or so to distance it from the GS430.

    M
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Yep, and Im sure that the LWB version and hybrid will probably push it to 80K, perhaps even beyond.
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