2005-2007 Toyota Avalon

jlsexton

Hyundai Genesis, this is only a question. I looked at them, they are not much different from the Azera in size and a lot of money,($42,000) what about resale, did you consider that prior to buying ?

tjc78

I leased at a great rate (.0006 MF and $1,000 rebate) and residual value after three years was 48 or 49% so I don't think resale will be much worse than many others. My V6 Genesis had a sticker of $35,100. It has the premium package which is equipped like an Avalon Limited without NAV. The $42,000 is for a V8 with tech package.

Anyway, its a good car, handles much better than the Avalon at the expense of ride quality, but is quieter than the Avalon. Very similar interior dimensions to the Avalon too, although the Av is a little bigger in the back seat.

All in all I do like the car, but I have to say everytime I drive it I miss my Avalon. IMO the Avalon is still the best large car on the road for those looking for a roomy highway cruiser.

fin

As one who has owned an Avalon of each generation, let me assure you there are differences each five years. Most things improve because it's a Toyota. But not everything, depending on what you need in a car.

The post from *tjc78* is very accurate. The '03 seats were a lot more comfortable on long trips than my '07 Limited seats are. But the power train, gas mileage and suspension are far superior in the '05 up models. My only real complaint is that the trunk has gotten slightly smaller with each generation even though the overall car is slightly longer. There is also a little less outward visibility in the latest model and that might make the car seem larger than it is.

As for Lexus, the ride is pure luxury, very soft in the corners. No sport or driving feel at all, small rear seat and outward visibility limitations. Great car, just not for me, I like a little feedback from the road but nothing really stiff and the '07 Limited has that. It's fun to drive, along with being functional, as we travel to FL a lot.

As a group, these three Avalons are among the best cars I have ever owned and that spans 50 years of legal licensed driving.. and the 3 years before that we won't discuss here.. Hope this answers your questions..

mxyz

I'm shopping for avalons and most dealers don't list if the car has VSC or not. On the 2000-2004 it was easy to tell if the car had vsc because of the vsc off button below and to the right of the steering wheel.

On the 2005-2008 (vsc was standard in 2009) is it true that you can tell if the car has vsc by the VSC light illuminating when you first turn on the car? Or do all avalons do this regardless of VSC? Is there another way to tell?

Thanks!

1lotlizard

The main differences are the Genesis is RWD, which is an advantage or disadvantage depending on your needs. Also, I looked at Genesis and immediately ruled it out because it's really a 4 passenger car. Try out the middle of the back seat if you have any questions about that. I also found Genesis less smooth and less vibration free than Avalon.

1lotlizard

The wipers are horribly loud on my '09 Limited -- very bad thing in a car that is otherwise so smooth and quiet. Any recommendations on blade replacements that are quiet and effective??? Thanks.

jlsexton

Probably made in CHINA like my so called OE replacements, not JAPAN. might just put back the originals because these, as you say, are noisy, sounds like hard rubber.

1lotlizard

Don't know where mine were manufactured, but they were put on by a dealer since the original ones on the new car were already decompsing and leaving smears of rubber on the window the day after I bought the car. That's why I'd like to know if anyone has found a non-Toyota replacement for these wipers.

tjc78

Most of the big chains (Advance Auto, Auto Zone, etc) have them or can order them for you.

ange

The recent recall about floor mats sliding forward and causing the accelator floor gaget to jam wide open on toyotas is surprising. My 2005 limited has holes in the back end that fasten to hooks on the floor and the driver side mat cannot move. This seems like an easy thing to do initially. I had an accelator sick during a winter icy condition when the linkage on turnpike driving formed ice and would not release. I pushed the gwearshift into neutral and left the engine roar. Then turned the key off.

Does anyone have a navigation disk to update the the maps.? My 2005 had mapes 2-3 years old to start. Toyota wants $275 to update the navigation computer. Anyone find a disK available elsewhere that is more reasonable.

ange

necro1234

Ye I have a 2007 XLS, I got the rubber all weather mats.
I dont see how that pedal can come close to jamming if you use the hooks, my guess is people are not and the mats are pushing forwards.
When those hooks are in place, the shoulder of my mats has about 4 inches of space to the closest point the pedal even comes near to when fully depressed.

I'm thinking this is more than likely user error in the fact that if the hooks where used, this would not have happened.

neil5

I went to Toyota yesterday. Only applies to rubber Toy mats not carpet...

popsavalon

I have never seen a OEM rubber mat in a Toyota product. Is this offered in certain areas of the US?
I agree with necro1234, if the mats are properly hooked, it is impossible to get them under the accelerator. Maybe broken hooks are the problem.

necro1234

Ye, when I got my 2007 XLS, first thing I did was order these:


I've had carpeted mats that came with my driver side slip forward and bind under the pedal once (when the hooks where not in place).
Once I got my all weather mats from Toyota put in with the hooks though, this has never happened again. (and they have been there now for over a year).

The toyota dealership removed my driver side mat and stored it in my trunk.

To my annoymance (since my mind is logical enough to not see how it is possible for the mat to bind with the hooks in place, since I went to the trouble of actually testing the distance between the closest point of the pedal and the edge of the mat) my carpeting now has the oppertunity to get all that dirt pushed into it that these matts where purchased to avoid :P

I took some pics in my Avalon of the mat and distance, it measures to about 3" from the edge of the pedal to the edge of the matt when fully depressed. (with hooks in place).

I took some quick pics in my Avalon of what I see with the Toyota All-Weather matts.

Just look at the distance between the pedal here, the only way I can see such an event occuring is if those hooks are not used or if they BOTH break.






And here are our trusty hooks...


Cheers

Sheldon

wwest

You're forgetting that here in the US all automotive dealers are "free-lance" operations. No reporting responsibility to the parent marque whatsoever. So Toyota's TSB may be in response to so many of their dealers selling cheaply purchased aftermarket floor mats that do not have "hookability".

rewop

I recently paid $5,200 to have my valves replaced. There is a TSB out for "engine clicking noise," just the problem I was having. I am within warranty in years, but not in miles. I have asked Toyota customer service in CA to pay for the repair since no modern engine should experience valve failure shortly after 60,000 miles. I do not expect them to pay. I have an early-production Avalon and just about every problem that came with them and now the valves. Do you have any advice to help me handle the problem if I get rejected by the Toyota customer service department?

popsavalon

Please describe the repair procedure in more detail. What is the specific TSB?
I don't see how actual "valve replacement" would be required for an engine clicking noise. 60K miles does not seem to be enough to require replacement of major engine components like valves. What year is your vehicle, you mention "early production"?

If the repair was quoted at $5200 on a 60K vehicle, I think I would have had a lot more conversation with Toyota up front.

jlsexton

First, you're correct, my Camry has 130,000, no problem with valves. If you maintained the Avalon properly then.

My opinion, be nice, ask politely, talk to a rep, try to get them to pay at least half.

Lastly, what is your small claims cap, if not high enough, than you must initiate a lawsuit to recoup your funds. I don't like having to sue but I have, usually the judge is sympathetic, especially in your case. And again to all, never purchase the first model year on any vehicle, too many bugs to work out. To rewop, you have my sympathy, I hate getting screwed, especially by Toyota.

fin

Once again, your post correctly points out a subject of great importance: the infamous "first year model" problems. Yes, you might get a good one. But the odds are that the following years will be better. Anyone wishing to confirm can read this forum end to end. Or read the 2007 up Lexus LS460 forum. Same story at twice the price.......

rewop

Popsavalon: In response to my complaint of a ticking noise in the engine, the diagnosis for this 2005 Avalon was "found rear engine lifter starting to collapse. R-R rear engine cover and replaced lifters and gaskets." The TSB that addresses the engine ticking sound is TSB 0094-09. I think it was issued in March of this year but I'm not sure. The dealer who did the repair suggested I contact Toyota Customer Service and he gave me the number. He said Toyota would "do the right thing." I called and they rejected my claim. I wrote them a letter and got a form letter response. I called the letter writer who said she would talk to the supervisor and get back to me. I'm waiting.

rewop

My previous car was a '96 Toyota Camry XLE V6 which was a wonderful car. I gave it to one of my kids and he still has it. My '05 Avalon has been a headache since I owned it. I take care of all my cars (e.g. Mobil 1 every oil change) but in this case I would have been better off if it failed well inside the warranty. I haven't thought of a small claims court but I think I will check around and see if that might be a possibility.
One of my kids works in IT and he said to me before I bought the car "Dad, never buy version 1 of anything!" I should listen to my kids more.

jlsexton

Again, I am sorry that a manufacturer who boast of their quality put out this product. Sometimes it is good to procrastinate, me, I would have sued, something I don't like doing. I am checking out a Subaru Legacy as it is now much larger & ALL wheel drive. To all who read this, there is a recall out for an oil hose, I asked if it was critical, as my oil change is coming up. All I got was a, well if YOU want to take a chance, it's up to you, this from my local dealer where I purchased several Toyota's. SO, I am looking to perhaps move on, I certainly don't need this BS and I'm fortunate to be able to buy any vehicle I want. A headsup on the oil hose would help us all.

popsavalon

I'm not sure if you are asking for more info on the VVTi oil line problem for your vehicle, but if your Camry is a V6, 2005 or later, it applies.

To get the latest info, go to topic, "Toyota Avalon Engine Questions" and read the messages from #334 up. The web page identified as "oil line scandal" is a summary site for most issues related to this problem (all Toyota 2GR-FE engines, 2005-2008)..

tjc78

but if your Camry is a V6, 2005 or later, it applies

Not sure that is accurate. The Camry didn't get the 3.5L 2GR V6 until the redesign in 2007. The Avalon was the first Toyota vehicle with that engine starting in 2005.

popsavalon

Thanks, that was my error. I did not realize that Toyota staggered the incorporation of that engine across a couple of model years for various vehicles.

jlsexton

My vehicle is a late model 2006 Avalon, my service manager is on vacation hunting so I have not received an intelligent answer. Not that I expect one from him but maybe. I did get an official recall notice today, no urgency I could detect as one might expect. Only that it MIGHT produce an oil leak. As I stated, I will be looking at other vehicles come July, 2010, maybe even a Taurus SHO...............

tjc78

maybe even a Taurus SHO...............

Looks like a nice ride. Its has a lot of power in a full size car. Just wish it was RWD.

Anyway I have moved on from my 2006 Avalon as well. It was a great car for me. I now have a 2009 Genesis. Put that on your test drive list, as long as you don't mind a firmer ride than your Avalon you may like it.

As for the "oil leak recall" let us know. I have a friend with an '07 Camry V6 and have warned him of the possibility of the oil line failure. If there is indeed a recall I will make sure he takes it in.

jlsexton

They call it a limited service campaign, no TSB number. My understanding is the Taurus is available in AWD, it is not cheap, I hoping they will still honor my Xplan, as in family & friends. Bought my wife's Mazda 3 that way at $500 below invoice, will keep my fingers crossed. Still have about 200 miles before the oil change, don't do a lot of driving as I'm retired, not like the 600 a week I used to do going to Manhattan.

tjc78

it is not cheap, I hoping they will still honor my Xplan, as in family & friends

In another forum here on Edmunds (stories from the sales frontlines) I read that the dealers were not taking Xplan on SHOs. I am sure that will change once the model has been out for a while.

Here is a link to the post on SFTSF

spyder03

Had this recall done on my 2006 Avalon. Hose looks a little thicker than original. Still made out of a rubber material. Hopefully this solves the problem. Time will tell.

tjc78

So.. it looks as if Toyota is stepping up to the plate fixing the line that is causing quite a stir on the forums. Good PR move IMO. Now, anyone that paid for the replacement should seek some reimbursement.

popsavalon

Since the Lexus has always had the all metal line, and now Avalons past mid 2008 have the metal line (don't know the status of Camrys), it would be interesting to hear Toyota's explanation for why they are doing the recall with another rubber line.

I think it is a cheaper interim fix to get them past the mileage window for possible warranty claims from oil loss/engine damage.

jlsexton

now Avalons past mid 2008 have the metal line.

I haven't looked at any newer Avalons, so I ask, is it the same V6 engine in the newer vehicles. If it is, I will request a metal hose replacement, not for myself but for the future owner or owners. In 40 months I only have about 16000 miles, at that rate I might have 21000 or so when I sell it, if I decide to do so next August.

The fact that Lexus has a metal hose and the newer Avalons do also would present a good case should it ever break and destroy one's engine, it is an admittance of a mistake and a stupid one at that. What could the actual cost difference be, $10 ?

popsavalon

The engine is the same, 2GR-FE V6, but I think you hit the nail on the head. $10 x 1.5 million engines = $15 mil. It's all about the bottom line now. The customer is not number one with Toyota or anyone else these days.

jlsexton

That probably is their thinking but had they installed it in the first place they would not be shelling out the money to the car stores for the recall, more inane judgement. I will try for the metal replacement armed with some knowledge from this blog, as to the Lexus & newer models having it. they will probably present some stupid argument as to it not fitting, I will counter with the newer model argument. I might have a leg up as I know these people, some from when they were kids, growing up with my son. Actually that's how I purchased my Avalon, I bypassed the sales guys & went to the sales manager, told him what I wanted to pay, he stated that would be his mothers price, I countered with, call me Mom.

jeffm5

Count me among those who bought the 05 new and are well satisfied. 73,000 trouble free miles. Best car I've ever owned.

pcc49

I have 85,000 on my 2006 Avalon limited. Two weeks ago, the hose "finally" broke. I took it to the dealer and of course they replaced the hose free. Prior to this incident, the car has been performing beautifully and I have no problem with it.

doobre

Hi from Dubai again..
the VVTI pipe was leaking on my 05 Avalon (only 125,000KMS) and as in its usual form the dealer here (Al Futtaim) refused to cover the cost even though I had the TSB IN MY HAND.. made me pay for the change (not a large amount but....)

Which is the same answer they give to all other TSB's "they only cover the USA models".. as if the Avalon sold in the middle east is so different that it has a different transmission, steering rack, power steering pump etc...
cheers
CD

jlsexton

only 125,000KMS

Is equal to how many miles.

HAVE YOU ADDRESSED THIS WITH TOYOTA. Not the car store or the rep but Toyota Corporate as to see what their practices are ? Where was the Avalon made, mine was in Kentucky.

The Japanese are honorable people, it may sound corny but they are, so try it.

necro1234

125000 Kilometers is only 78125 miles, not much at all in my opinion for a Toyota, and especially a flagship model.

popsavalon

I agree with jls. The info that I find about the Gen 3 Avalon (2005-up) says that all of these vehicles were manufactured in Kentucky, US. You need to contact Toyota US, and stop being jacked around by a dealer who apparently believes he is insulated from the real world (and makes more profit that way).

doobre

Hi.. and thanks.. I hear your concern.. all avalons are made in Kentucky you are right there.. A delegation of Toyota staff from the Kentucky plant came through Dubai and I told them about the many problems I was having. They took it for a drive and said all was as expected (obviously some faults are intermittent in nature, like the vibrations in the car at a certain speed/gradient/loading, the steering wheel clamp coming loose, the wipers cancelling the cruise control etc etc......). However, one of the main issues (low frequency humming/vibration/noises inside the car above 120kmph) was fixed by a staff at Al futtaim a few weeks AFTER THE TEST by the Toyota team (by refitting the doors)...?!?!?

So I have NO confidence in Toyota cars or their "system".. I have been screwed from both ends, that's it, 2005 Avalon my first and last toyota...

If you have a suitable contact for TMC corporate in US??.. I might give that a go..
BUT, I have been already faxed the chairman of Toyota directly in Tokyo.. of course I don't know if he actually read anything.. but I was replied to by fax from the manager of regional distribution or something like that..
He just referred me back to Al Futtaim.. blah blah blah..
cheers

jlsexton

No, I'm sorry I don't. No vehicle is perfect, the first year is always a crapshoot, I've had good & bad GM's, Fords and Chrylsers. My Camry was great for the 7 years I owned it, my daughter has it now and has had to replace the struts but those are a wear item. My Avalon's keyless ignition acted up for awhile, disconnecting the battery cleared it up.

As I said in prior responses, I would sue, I don't know your laws but those problems are not normal, if they were, they would be on every vehicle. See if you can make a deal for a newer Avalon as a pre-owned, preferably certified, not that you should have to BUT piece of mind is sometimes worth the bucks. Do you have a consumer advocate on a television show, if so threaten them with exposure, I did that and got 1 1/2 years off my home mortgage as my mortgage was sold to another bank who had no real record of my payments, just a thought. In closing, I sincerely wish you good fortune in this endeavor.

gohawaiian

Thanks for this tip. It worked for me - and in case it's not clear to others, there seems to be a slight variation in the sequence of steps to disable the seatbelt chimes depending on whether or not they have ever been disabled previously. If disabling the chimes for the FIRST time, I believe you follow the instructions posted elsewhere on this board, which say to press and hold the ODO reset button BEFORE you turn on the car's electrical system (either by pressing the engine start button twice - or by turning the key to the Accessory position - so that the instrument panel illuminates, but the engine doesn't start) - and THEN buckle the seat belt. However, if (for example) you disconnect/remove/replace the car's battery after previously disabling the seatbelt chimes, I believe that you will only be successful in disabling the chimes once again by FIRST turning on the electrical system (i.e. illuminate the instrument panel, but don't start the engine) and THEN press and hold the ODO reset button for 10 seconds before buckling the driver's seat belt. (I recently put in a new battery, and was unable to get the ODO to display "b-on" & "b-off" until I finally tried the second approach described here.) Bottom line: if one of these approaches doesn't work for you, the other one very likely will.

jlsexton

Just curious, WHY would anyone want to disable the seatbelt chime. Sometimes it does drive me crazy, as when my wife forgets to put it on or she takes it off before we stop BUT it is a safety reminder. I see too many people not wearing one, my nephew at 18 didn't, he's been in a wheelchair for the past 22 years, can only use his arms slightly, went out the windshield during a crash. Happy New Year.

gohawaiian

Speaking only for myself, I disable the chimes because I always wear my seatbelt and I ensure that any passengers riding with me do so, too. Therefore, I judged that I don't need the annoying reminder, since I am doing what I'm supposed to do.

branch15_5

It's been a while since this issue has surfaced. Since I haven't done anything about my problem, I am bringing it back up.

I have an 06 XLS. The clunk, which sounds like it's coming from the steering column, is worse during warmer weather, and doesn't "act" like a steering problem. By that, I mean that turning the steering wheel doesn't always produce the problem. It acts like more of a suspension issue -- in a turn, if I accelerate or decelerate, it's likely to clunk.

There are a couple of TSBs having to do with the intermediate steering shaft and the steering box. Has anyone had this repaired and gotten a permanent fix?

Thanks in advance.

doobre

My 05 had the clunk noise, a muffled sort of knock when turning sometimes.. but it did not effect the operation.
The intermediate shaft was replaced.. no more clunking..

tjc78

Same in my '06 fixed under warranty.

mgold1

Had exactly the same problem on my '05. The car was no longer on warantee and the service dept. said that the steering probably needed lubrication and to diagnose the problem they wanted to charge me $90 which would be applied to the repair of $270. As you can imagine, I decided to live with the clunking and will never go back to the dealer unless it was for warantee service.