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Nissan Titan vs. Ford F150

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Comments

  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Hardly, when the F-150 has won 28 awards from numerous different outlets....

    http://www.fordvehicles.com/Trucks/f150/awards/index.asp?bhcp=1
  • bowke28bowke28 Posts: 2,185
    funny...the "5best" article from car and driver was a comparo with the 5 1/2 ton trucks, and the titan took 1st place in it. (i have the article sitting next to me.)

    funny how ford claims something that isnt there.

    dont get me wrong, the f150 is a FANTASTIC truck, but i dont think they used their imagination. they just built "another pickup". nissan went outside the box on the titan. the only thing working against them is brand recognition. most folks dont even know that nissan has a full size truck to offer in the first place.
  • bowke28bowke28 Posts: 2,185
    car and driver rated the f150 #1 before the titan came out. here is the link to the ACTUAL comparison.

    http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=15&article- _id=7692
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Default may be the only way the Titan would win - because it appears sales aren't going to carry the day for it. Still, it's a good truck, for a first effort. A hellovalot better than Toyota ever put out.
  • keaneckeanec Posts: 349
    "Default may be the only way the Titan would win - because it appears sales aren't going to carry the day for it. Still, it's a good truck, for a first effort. A hellovalot better than Toyota ever put out"

    It seems to me, that Titan sales are continuing to increase each month as they are able to produce more each month and increase inventory. I remember when the F-150 was out for three months and ANT and leghumper were saying to give it time that they need to be able to get more inventory and ramp up production and the sales would start to increase more. Its called double standard. Nowhere have I seen Nissan say that the Titan wasn't meeting expectations and nowhere did they say they were going to challenge any of the Big three for sales With the Titan. They want to reach the 100,000 level in the first year. Judging by the continual monthly increases, they are on their way there.

    I do know this, though, with all the talk about how great the sales of the new F-150 is, the sales level still haven't reached levels in 2002 and 2001. And Ford is starting to pile on the incentives. Where are the Titan incentives if Nissan is doing so badly?

    If you compare Nissan's 1st effort with the Titan to Fords umpteenth effort with the overweight, underpowered F-150, Ford sure looks bad, IMO.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "I do know this, though, with all the talk about how great the sales of the new F-150 is, the sales level still haven't reached levels in 2002 and 2001. "

    Not correect....SO far this year (Jan-Mar) sales are up to 209,021, compared with last year's (Jan-Mar) 183,544. That's a 13.9% increase overall. Since it's release, they have reached double digit percentage increases each month.

    Sales for the month of March itself were 80,056 compared with last year's 67,697, an increase of 18.3% for the month of March.

    So far there's still 2 factories left that have yet shifted to the new F-150, and will do so by the end of the summer.
  • keaneckeanec Posts: 349
    "I do know this, though, with all the talk about how great the sales of the new F-150 is, the sales level still haven't reached levels in 2002 and 2001. "

    Not correect....SO far this year (Jan-Mar) sales are up to 209,021, compared with last year's (Jan-Mar) 183,544. That's a 13.9% increase overall. Since it's release, they have reached double digit percentage increases each month.

    Sales for the month of March itself were 80,056 compared with last year's 67,697, an increase of 18.3% for the month of March.

    So far there's still 2 factories left that have yet shifted to the new F-150, and will do so by the end of the summer.

    You say I am not correct but then you throw figures from 2003!!!!!!!! Where did I say 2003? Go get your figures and prove that I am incorrect. I said 2002 and 2001. You will not find 18% increases.

    And you also prove my point of double standard with your give Ford more time as they haven't got up to full production yet. My point was that Nissan hasn't got up to full production either.

    What the new F-150 has down is reverse the decline of the old one. It has yet to reach the heights (I am not saying it won't) of the old f-150 in prior years - not 2003 which was a horrendous year for the F-150.

    I fact, the pickup market has really being growing over the last number of years. Unfortunately for the old F-150 and the new F-150, Ford is losing market share, even this year when compared to 2001 and 2002!!!
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Geez, I love the "double standard" accusation.... I don't think anybody gets crapped on more than Ford does across the board! Every car mag in the country has reported that the Aviator has been cancelled for "poor sales", when in fact, it has met expected sales every month, I think, and is being redesigned, not cancelled for 2006. No, there's not a double standard there.

    I like Nissan. I own an Infiniti. I like the Titan and Armada.
    As I said, it's a good first effort, better than Toyota did twice. I just don't see many around these parts, and I see tons of new F-150s everywhere I look. I see tons of new Rams around. That's all I'm saying.
  • bearbrawnbearbrawn Posts: 19
    That "Import" stigma is tough to overcome.

    I don't care if they don't meet projections - I'm satisfied - and only hope the Service dept at my local Nissan dealer is more professional than the local "5-star" Dodge folks were.
  • keaneckeanec Posts: 349
    "As I said, it's a good first effort, better than Toyota did twice. I just don't see many around these parts, and I see tons of new F-150s everywhere I look. I see tons of new Rams around. That's all I'm saying."

    Cool - didn't mean to jump on you. I also think the F-150 is a very good truck. I just think Nissan one-upped them with a more advanced product. There are things better about the Ford and there are things better about the Titan. My only thing is Ford should have been able to outdo Nissan and they didn't. A friend who test drove the Ford said although it is better than the old Ford, it just didn't seem to be a big jump ahead like he thought it would.

    As to sales, it doesn't matter if Nissan built the best vehicle ever, it would take many years to start substantially hurting the sales of Ford or GM (maybe Dodge). The big three trucks are just to "apple pie" for two many Americans.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "And you also prove my point of double standard with your give Ford more time as they haven't got up to full production yet. My point was that Nissan hasn't got up to full production either."

    My mention of them not yet ramping up the other 3 factories wasn't a "Oh the sales are slow because they still have 2 more to go", it was with the intentions of just sharing. No "hidden agenda there".

    The double standard doesn't play when it's ONE factory going full speed (Titan's) which is easier to ramp up, over 4 different factories, in different states, ONE in another country having to change everything over, onto the new series.

    Ok, from the records I'm seeing, you want Jan-March sales?.... For 2001, 204,488 and 197,770
    for 2002. Compare it with these years Jan-Mar 209,021. This year's number's are still ahead than the year's you have mentioned.

    Now, I'm guessing your point is, going with the number's of 941K units sold, which were accomplished after 9-11. Which those rebates helped boost that years sales to 941K units.

    Now, I can tell you this much personally, Ford has made mention they wish to sell 1MIL units, for this year, but later re-assessed the situation and saw that might be a bit hard to reach because the factories have not yet gone full capacity. And they will have to run 3 shifts (overtime) to do so (the current one's are already on overtime). If it does happen, expect it for next year's number since not all factories are on-line.

    "Unfortunately for the old F-150 and the new F-150, Ford is losing market share, even this year when compared to 2001 and 2002!!! "

    Yes, that part is correct, If Johnny made and sold 3 kites, and Cindy made just 1, Johnny had 75% of the market. But if now Timmy is joining the market, and is making Kites and he has made/sold 1, now Johnny has just 60% of the market, because Timmy just joined in and the market has more products to sell. That doesn't take much common sense to see.

    But the truck segment is still growing, Johnny can produce 4-5 kites, and he still might not have the 75% market share he enjoyed, BUT it's 1-2 more units and PROFITS that he is enjoying.

    Class dismissed, cause I must retire and have dinner soon.
  • keaneckeanec Posts: 349
    You must be looking at different #s. As to ramping up - Nissan has been increasing production each month - their sales are not below expectations but are right where they wanted them.

    "But the truck segment is still growing, Johnny can produce 4-5 kites, and he still might not have the 75% market share he enjoyed, BUT it's 1-2 more units and PROFITS that he is enjoying."

    Man you guys are die-hards - In order to sell that 1-2 more units, Johnny has cut his price (can you say rebates - I thought so!) so his profits end up being less and he isn't enjoying them as much as his investment has increased (business 101) so his return is less.

    Go eat supper and enjoy! I will contiue class on my terms as Ford cries the blues :-)
  • keaneckeanec Posts: 349
    Sorry - I didn't go back far enough. silly me!
    2000 - 221,770 1999 - 213,910

    Then again, the increases of of 2004 over 2002, 2001 are sure not the same as over 2003 - which was my point in the first place. 2% and 6% in a growing market isn't something to write home about.

    Time for a beer. Ant have a good one! Cheers!
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "You must be looking at different #s. As to ramping up - Nissan has been increasing production each month - their sales are not below expectations but are right where they wanted them."

    I have at no time, questioned Nissan's sale. Nor am I going to hunt for them, since I don't CARE NOR, at any time have mentioned their number's since my point HAS NEVER BEEN, about number's, since ALL I posted recently, dealt with the awards the F-150 has received. The number's situation was something someone else had mentioned.

    Yes, for 2000-2001, the Jan-March number's were higher than for this Jan-March of 2004. The factories were running overtime those years, this year with only 2 fully ramped going overtime on 3 shifts, they can't make as much. But for those years, what's the point when the rest of the year's, the number's weren't as strong throughout.

    "Johnny has cut his price (can you say rebates - I thought so!) so his profits end up being less and he isn't enjoying them as much as his investment has increased (business 101) so his return is less."

    Johnny's kites are looking much better overall and he's offering more decorations with them....So the higher end (more profittable) kites are selling more so than the lower end kites. Johnny has special sales on the cheaper kites, but since the high end kites are making 70-80% of it's new sales, Johnny is enjoying a much better bottom line, than the previous year, where the higher end kites made only 43-50% of overall sales.

    Since Johnny's new kites have been phased in, he has been able to work with supplier to lower the cost of producing his kites. So he's now enjoying even more of a profit, to offset any rebates he might be placing on his kites. :-)
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Then why has Toyota tried twice to copy it almost exactly, with the Tundra, and why has Nissan used it as the "truck to beat" when designing the Titan? Now, maybe the Titan has eclipsed it in some ways, maybe not. Certainly, they have come closer than anybody else. No question it will have an impact. No question, people will buy it. The Dr. across the street bought one, traded in his F-250 on it. He's not sure he made the right move though.....it has a few design quirks he's not thrilled with - other things he likes a lot. Time will tell.
  • haironghairong Posts: 153
    (This site needs registration.)

    http://www.autonews.com/article.cms?articleId=47903

    Nissan's truck sales stumble

    By Kathy Jackson
    Automotive News / April 12, 2004

    Nissan is struggling with disappointing sales for three models built at its 1-year-old plant in Canton, Miss.

    Dealers are having trouble meeting sales projections for the full-sized Titan pickup and Armada SUV. And Nissan already has backed down from aggressive sales projections for its restyled Quest minivan launched last summer.

    Nissan committed $1.4 billion to construct a multivehicle assembly plant in Canton to produce the Titan pickup, Quest minivan, Armada SUV and its QX56 Infiniti version, as well as the Altima sedan.

    "More marketing is needed," says Jed Connelly, senior vice president for sales and marketing at Nissan North America Inc.

    He says Nissan will begin a round of regional advertising for the Titan beginning this month and for the Armada in June.

    Up - selectively

    Overall, Nissan sales rose 32.8 percent through the first three months of the year compared with 2003. But its Altima sedan - in one of the United States' most competitive and low-margin segments - is carrying the weight.

    Nissan launched its first full-sized pickup in December. It predicted sales of 100,000 Titans during its first full year on the market. The Armada went on sale in October with expectations of 40,000 sales in 2004.

    In the first quarter, Nissan sold just 14,207 Titans and 7,633 Armadas. When Nissan introduced the Quest in July, executives predicted sales of 80,000 to 85,000 in 2004. But volume has been between 3,000 and 4,000 a month.

    The Armada "has the right hardware and pricing, but the name Armada is new to the industry," Connelly says. "You can't overestimate the time it takes to seed a new name in the marketplace."

    Swollen inventories

    Meanwhile, inventory is piling up for the three Nissan trucks. The company had a 110-day supply of Armadas on April 1, a 97-day supply of Quests and a 95-day supply of Titans.

    "We're ramping up on Titan," Connelly says. "Trucks are unlike cars. We like to run a 50-day supply of cars. But we found out days' supply of trucks need to be higher - about 75 days. That's because truck buyers like to see a lot more models."

    Nissan says the lower-than-expected factory volumes are not a problem. Canton's total capacity of 400,000 vehicles a year is divided among five products and two brands. Workers there can move from one product to another.

    Production of the Quest and Altima are expected to total 250,000 units a year. That leaves 150,000 units of annual production for the three big body-on-frame trucks.

    After the launch, Nissan heavily advertised both the Titan and Armada for several weeks, then pulled back.

    But the Titan faces powerfully entrenched competition. It is up against the redesigned Ford F series as well as the Chevrolet Silverado, GMC Sierra and Dodge Ram. And Toyota will be in the market soon with a successor to its Tundra full-sized pickup. The Armada competes against the Ford Expedition and the Chevrolet Tahoe.

    Nissan's smaller Murano SUV, introduced in late 2002, took time to catch on. "Murano was a new name but maybe not in as competitive a segment," Connelly says.

    Though Nissan will begin advertising the Titan and Armada again, he says the ad budget is limited.

    "Right now we're moving marketing dollars around; there are no incremental dollars," he says. "We want to continue the weight on Titan and Armada. Titan and Altima are the two core products for us. When we advertised the Titan, hits on our Web site went through the roof. As soon as we stopped advertising, hits went down."
  • keaneckeanec Posts: 349
    Kinda of perplexes me. But hey, I am enjoying my Titan and I couldn't be happier. Cheers to you!
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    You're just more alone than you thought, eh, keanec?
  • bowke28bowke28 Posts: 2,185
    that the f150 is not a great truck. as a matter of fact, i think it is the 2nd best truck on the market. sales #'s have nothing to do with how good a vehicle is. using that logic, you would say that a ford explorer is a better vehicle than a honda accord or a camry or a mercedes or a lexus.

    the explorer outsells all of those, so it MUST be better, right?!?!?!
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