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Audi S4 vs BMW M3

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Comments

  • aryn7aryn7 Posts: 1
    It's only fair if you compare similar model redesigns. M3 is due for a redesign which will give it a bigger engine, S4 just did that. So you can't really compare the S4 and M3 right now, they're playing leapfrog like Ford and Chevy does with its trucks and M3 is just about to leap over S4. However, the S4 is like Avis and the M3 is Hertz. BMW is just a superior brand and superior engineering. If you want a cushy interior, buy a Lexus. But if you want a car that performs, buy an M3 and pass the S4 by. If you compare the last S4 with the current M3, which is the valid comparison, and having owned both I can tell you, the S4 is a poor and distant second to the M3. It has poor reliability, sloppy suspension, poor driving dynamics and and simply doesn't hold up as well - hence the horrid depreciation of S4s. You can get into a used S4 cheaply because they fall apart, literally. Be prepared to make friends with your Audi dealer's service department. The M3 holds its value. It also has much tighter suspension (and I'm comparing an M3 convertible with an S4 sedan), precise handling, and is simply a better designed vehicle with better reliabilty. If you must drive in snow, you can do it in the M3 with snow tires if you just drive sensibly. Remember, all cars used to be rear wheel drive, the M3 has a lot of torque so you just have to drive rmore slowly and carefully. Frankly I feel a lot more comfortable in an M3 versus an S4, AWD just means all the wheels are turning, it doesn't mean the thing handles well. Even the new S4 just feels numb and lumbering on the road, the AWD gives it this clawlike feeling, whereas the M3 feels like liquid over pavement. It's hard to explain. Enthusiasts prefer M3 for a reason.
  • rjlaerorjlaero Posts: 659
    I wouldn't take 1/2 of what you said as being the truth. S4's do not "fall apart". That's a ridiculous statement. BMW's aren't the pillar of reliablity and are extremely expensive to fix with parts and maintenace. So don't go throwing stones at your German siblings.

    Even 5-6 year old S4's with the 2.7T Turbo can be rather expensive on the used market if they've been taken care of and can be hard to find.

    Keep your M3 and head back to the BMW forums. You obviously don't have any appreciation for the S4. The M3 is a fine car in it's own right, but you have no objectivity in being fair with other cars.
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    The truth must really hurt about the Audi S4 being inferior to the M3. If you read all of messages on this site you will see that the statements are supported by facts and not biased propaganda. I went to Kelly Blue Book to check the trade in values for the M3 and the S4 and this is what they said:

    2001 BMW M3 in excellent condition with 100,000 mi $20,375
    2001 Audi S4 in excellent condition with 100,000 mi $12,700

    2002 M3 ( Same as above ) $22,875
    2002 S4 ( Same as above ) $14,250

    2003 M3 (Same as above) $26,100
    2003 S4 (Model year change) No Data

    2004 M3 (Same Data as above) $28,475
    2004 S4 (Same Data as above) $20,975

    Perhaps the S4 is falling apart :lemon:
  • rjlaerorjlaero Posts: 659
    BMW's have also have had a much higher MSRP to start with. 3, 5, 7 series up and down the line. For the same equiptment, you can pay $5 - $7,000 more for a BMW or Mercedes than on an AUDI

    If a $60,000 car depricates 50%, the resale is $30,000

    If a $53,000 car depreciates 50%, the resale is $26,500

    Numbers are relative, lemon boy.
  • Mr. bmw, you consentrate to much on the price tag, more is not always better. You talk alot about 0-60's and 1/4 miles. How well does your dinan m3 match up touring.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    A good strong post in defense of Audi, though I don't agree with all the comments about Mercedes, but I like Audis a great deal so I'll let that pass. ;)

    Anyway, I do agree that Audi is on the move and that there is no weak vehicle in their lineup at this time. The question is how does Audi get out from under the shadow of Mercedes and BMW in this country? In build quality they are seemingly better made (at least initially) than BMWs and most Mercedes (the CLS, SLK, and new S being the exceptions imo), but Audi can't catch a break in the U.S. I've liked Audi since the 5000 days, but for some reason they aren't on a lot of buyers lists when the time comes to look at luxury cars. The A8 deserves a look more than any other Audi product (except the S4 Cabrio), but doesn't get looked at by enough luxury car buyers. The default choices are still the S-Class, 7-Series and to a lesser extent, the XJ and LS430. How does Audi change this? I mean look at the A6. Stunning design inside and out, but it isn't even close to the E,5,GS,M or STS in sales. There has to be something wrong with Audi's promotion or frachise for such a stellar car to go so unnoticed.

    M
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    The Numbers are not relative. MSRP for both cars is in the $50,000 range and are virtually the same. Audi's can acutally cost more than their German competition. Also, if you go to a used car lot the higher quality cars will cost more than lesser quality cars. For example a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord will be worth more than a domestic because they are higher quality cars and are much more in demand than domestic cars. The same is true for the M3 vs the S4. More of the buying public will demand the M3 ten fold to the S4. Consumer Reports stated that the Audi S4 (A4) reliablity is BELOW AVERAGE which is why the car is less in demand and will cost less than a M3 on the used car market.

    Sorry S4 owners :sick:
  • logjamlogjam Posts: 1
    Not a very convincing article. If you look at page 6 the M3 easily won both the Performance and Subjective ratings - just got dinged on price.

    I'm a bit biased as an M3 owner, but I find the exterior styling of the S4 to be a bit boring. Looking forward to the RS4, thought.
  • s4lvrs4lvr Posts: 7
    Just so we can have a fact-based conversation, the 2006 S4 sedan has an MSRP of $46.4k vs $49.6k for the M3 (base version). Similarly spec'd out their price tags are $50.9k for the S4 and $54.2k for the M3. So there is a $3.3k difference in MSRP right there. Granted, looking at KBB for both cars (2004 versions with 40k miles), the trade-in value for an S4 is $27.5 vs $36.4 for an M3. Even adjusting for the $3.3k difference in MSRP, that is still a $6k upside for the M3.

    I have always had a bias for BMWs but I really wanted 4WD (midwest weather) and I didn't like the look of the 3X-sedan (previous model). So I went with an A4 3.0Q. Have had it for 3 years now, have never had a problem with my car and I drive 18k highway miles p/year. I have test-driven an M3 cabrio and an S4 cabrio recently as I am looking to trade-in. They both drive amazingly, although the M3 feels more "racey" while the S4 is a lot more refined. Having said that, the heavy rumble of the S4's V8 is just that much more exhilarating than the high-pitched whine of the I-6!! Either way, both absolutely waste most other things on the road, eventhough the S4 is so much more understated that most people don't even know what they are up against (so I think I would quite enjoy the look of the Porsche driver who challenged the S4 and lost).

    So what do you prefer? I guess it is just personal taste. Even to the M3 lovers, you can't deny that the S4 cabrio looks stunning (and the fact that there are not that many out there means resale values are actually much better than the sedan's). Personally, I have to commute in this car and that includes 3 months of snow ... so from a safety perspective I think I am going S4

    cheers -
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    If this is going to be a fact based discussion then by all means use accurate facts. Consumer Reports and Kelly Blue Book clearly show the M3 to be more reliable and a much better investment than the S4. Also, there is no 2006 M3 to compare to the 2006 S4. If you had your facts straight you would know that the M3 is due for a change and won't be available until late 2007. I was in Atlanta this weekend and stopped by an Audi dealer to check in on what the competition is being sold for. The MSRP for the 2005 S4 was $51,000. This is exactly what a 2005 M3 would cost. After only a couple of years of ownership the S4 will be $8,000 less valuable than an M3. If you want to buy a S4 than by all means do so. My problem is with this S4 crowd is using subjective opinions and distortions to make the unrealible and service prone S4 seem superior to the M3.
  • s4lvrs4lvr Posts: 7
    OK let's have a fact-based discussion.

    Firstly, which consumer report are you talking about? Go to Consumer Reports.org , and look up the BMW 3-series and Audi A4 reports. Granted, the Audi has atrocious reliability through 2001 (it is that reputation which hurts its resale value now ... ) but has shown consistent improvement since the new shape was introduced in 2002. Indeed, in 2003 it received only excellent and very good ratings and in 2004 ONLY excellent reliabillity ratings across EVERY category. Against that, in 2004 the 3-series scores only Very Good in Fuel System, Transmission, Electrical, Power Equipment, Body Integrity and Body Hardware. Again ... these are hard facts from Consumer Reports.org

    Secondly, talking about a depreciating asset like a car (regardless of brand) as an "investment" is not particularly useful. You would normally expect an investment to appreciate, not lose 30% of its value the moment you drive it off the lot!!!

    Thirdly ... I would direct you to BMWusa.com and go to "build your own M3". Look to the left of the screen and you will see that BMW itself classifies it as a 2006 model. I am more than fully aware that the M3 is up for a model change (and it will get a V8, and that it is expected to deliver 400 HP , etc etc etc ....). I did not intend it to mean the new model, if you want to use that logic then Audi will be introducing the new A4 series shape in the 2007 model year which will mean a new S4 which will undoubtedly be pushed to match the Bimmer for power (it is [non-permissible content removed] for tat between those brands).

    Fourthly, get your facts straight. The 2005 MSRP for a sedan with stick was $45850 (before gas guzzler tax. See following website http://autos.yahoo.com/newcars/audi_s4_2005/4129/model_overview.html). The comparable M3 coupe was $47300 (http://autos.yahoo.com/newcars/bmw_m3_2005/4243/model_overview.html;_ylt=AondEun5GacdcWhT- dpCbfLuzIMQF) Even the 2006 model is $46,400 base MSRP before gas guzzler tax, which is materially lower than the $51k your are quoting. By the way .... if you talk facts - quote your source (I have as per the above links.

    It is interesting that you would say "subjective opinions and distortions" and then follow that up with "unreliable and service-prone S4". Do you have a published data source that confirms that statement? Again, Consumer Reports.org dispute that view ... published data (not my opinion)

    At the end of the day, though, all this is pretty useless. Cars are so much about personal taste ... if you fall in love with a car, who CARES about the fact that after a couple of years of enjoyment it is worth a couple of grand less!! Over the same period I will have spent more than that on dinners and drinks ... something I will never remember. The car will give me daily enjoyment - can't put a price tag on that. For the record - I love the look of the M3 (especially convertible) and if I lived somewhere where it did not snow, I would buy it without a doubt ... however, I really want the 4WD because it just deals much better with inclement weather.

    Cheers -
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    Sorry if you are having trouble accepting the truth about the S4. Let me see if I can help you understand the facts.
    1.Consumer Reports sells monthly magazines and also has a website. Got it? OK.
    2. If you go to their website you can check to see what they say about many different products including cars. Got it? Take your time, this is not that difficult to understand. I'll even make it easy for you. I have a subscription to Consumer Reports and I will for the 3rd time post what they said about the BMW M3 and Audi S4.
    Pasted below is what Consumer Reports said about your beloved S4:

    "See a summary of test findings and Quick Picks--the choices that merit first consideration.
    In a sports car we look for quickness, agility, and responsiveness. Comfort, convenience, and fuel
    economy are important, but less so than with regular cars. Of the nine cars listed in the chart below, we recommend three. The Audi S4 (1) and Cadillac CTS-V (5) have had below-average reliability in their standard versions, the A4 and CTS, respectively, so we cannot recommend them. We lack reliability data on the Mazda RX-8 (4), Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution (6), Pontiac GTO (8), and Chrysler Crossfire (9).
    The Ratings rank vehicles based on their overall score in our tests, irrespective of price or reliability. Recommended models ( ) not only tested well but have shown average or better reliability, and performed at least adequately if crash-tested or included in a government rollover test. Quick Picks are recommended models that in our judgment deserve special consideration based on your needs".

    THIS IS WHAT WAS STATED ABOUT THE M3:

    All four cars have a strong engine and manual transmission, and can accelerate from 0 to 60 mph in less than 6 seconds. The Audi and Cadillac are four-door sedans, while the BMW and Pontiac are two-door coupes. The Audi is all-wheel drive, while the others use rear-wheel drive. The M3 is the only one that meets all of our criteria for being recommended. (See CR Quick Recommendations for more details.)

    Consumer Reports would not recommend buying a Audi S4. I wonder why? :lemon:
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    BMW clearly shows it's superiority over lesser cars like the S4 by using a inline 6 engine to trump the larger V8 in the S4. Even with the S4's larger displacement engine it will always lose to the M3. I look forward to showing all you S4 owners my tail lights should you ever be brave (or foolish)enough to make a run for it. All the talk about all wheel drive won't keep you from breathing in the M3's exhaust. Better hope Audi gets the new V10 right or develop a better supercharger like the one it uses in it's V8 in the RS6 to keep up with the mighty M5. ;)

    <a href="http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars/past-road-test/sports-cars
  • rjlaerorjlaero Posts: 659
    So the M3 has a better resale value than the S4. Who cares?

    I'm not going to by a car I don't want simply because it's worth a few thousand dollars more 3-4 years down the road. People with high discretionary incomes who purchase 50-60k cars buy what they want. Getting money back on resale is obviously a good thing. And no doubt the M3's do have a super strong resale value. So I'll give you that.

    But why act like a child about it and say the S4 is a Lemon? That's not the case.

    BMW's are no pillar of reliability and are very, very expensive to repair and maintain after they are out of warranty. So I don't what what you think you have in your M3.
  • I agree that the S-4 is a better car, faster, handles better and is a better value. BMW is a great car, but lets face it, an S-4 w 4 wheel drive cannot be beat. http://www.ehlinelaw.com
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    Who cares about resale value? Most of the informed buying public cares about resale value. Resale value is a reflection of quality and dependability. Audi will always be the step child to BMW and Mercedes for performance and image. Have you noticed how Audi is still trying to establish is image by adding that hideous snout to the front of all new cars? You don't see that non sense from BMW, Mercedes or Jaguar. Audi is still trying desperately to find it's identity. Just look at the multiple engines Audi has used over the past ten years in an desperate attempt to compete with the current German kings of the automotive industry. If image and quality doesn't matter then by all means stay with your S4. However you know in the back of your mind when you see an M3 your first initial reaction is one of admiration and respect (perhaps even fear). Audi is and will always be the step child and under dog to BMW. Accept you fate, get out of denial! :lemon: :sick: :confuse: :mad:
  • lets not talk about the future and resale values. Every article I have read writes, Audi rs4 makes the curent bmw m3 look like a civic merging on the freeway. You don't bash the rs4, because you know its better. Bmw has the 325, 330, and m3; Audi has the a4, s4, and rs4. Bmw has met its match, and please Audi the step child?, underdog?, look around, Audi is on top ;) .
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    Do you actually think you make a case for Audi with biased unsupported comments like the one you just posted? I have the cure for you not knowing the truth or as I posted earlier "living in denial". Remember, the first step in dealing with a problem is admitting you have one. I have two answers for the humorous comment you posted about the RS4.
    1. Do your research and check out the M3 CSL Light Weight.
    2. If you are still in denial (and I suspect you will always be) check out the M3 GTR 450 hp V8(street version) that will make your RS4 wet it's pants. :P
  • Ok so I have been reading all of your posts and I have to say that I have never heard more ridiculous comments in my life! M3_R1... WOW... I think snobby BMW people like you are the reason I will never buy into the BMW brand. I would never want to be a part of such blind ignorance. I acknowledge that BMW makes amazing cars, but have you ever even driven an Audi? You are making some pretty presumptuous comments if you haven&#146;t. It seems to me that you are just making all of you assumptions off of some magazine articles that you read. (Most magazines are biased, so I suggest you read more than CR before posting your "facts") The first thing that I would suggest to anyone looking to buy either of these cars is GO DRIVE THEM. Both are amazing cars and both are ridiculously quick and fun to drive.

    The current S4 is only a &#147;refreshed&#148; version of the old S4 (As is the same with all the A4 family). Audi has done this to hold the market over until the new B8 A4 is out in early 2008. So it comparing the current S4 and the current M3 is totally legitimate.

    M3_R1. If you don&#146;t understand the benefit of having all four wheels able to put power to the ground (weather conditions aside) then I think you should probably do a little more research, and next time you floor your car off the line, or take a corner faster than you should, and you get those tires a&#146; spinnin&#146; out of control… maybe… just maybe you&#146;ll get it.

    I love BMW, I love Audi… I think both companies are totally innovative and make amazing cars. Audi has had a rough past with their quality, but that HAS been turned around. To me the reason to go with Audi is because it is not a BMW. But like I said you cant go wrong with either.
  • 1. Do your research and check out the M3 CSL Light Weight.
    2. If you are still in denial (and I suspect you will always be) check out the M3 GTR 450 hp V8(street version) that will make your RS4 wet it's pants.

    r1,

    Unlike its Euro-spec counterpart, the M3 CSL, the CS is not a stripped-down,lightweight flyer. ... 1/4 Mile: 13.38 s @ 105.73 mph Price as Tested: $52300
    M3 GTR is a car for true purists. An empty weight of approx. 1350 kilograms has been achieved. The 4.0 litre V8 engine with a cylinder bank angle of 90 degrees resembles the race version featuring in excess of 450 hp. Due to the necessary adaptations regarding emissions and noise levels the road version still generates more than 258 kW (350 hp).
    - Im not even going to show the price!
    - m3 gtr=350hp, The rs4=420 source www.fast-autos.net/bmw/bmwm3gtr.html
    - I hope your new m3 doesn't come with this engine.
    p.s.- I hope this shows the rs4 is more powerful and has a better drive train but another note I believe your in denial the proof is in the ink. :surprise: also do your home work
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    You step children of BMW just don't get it. To say that Audi has had "some" quality issues in the past is an understatement. The resale value reflects what the public things of Audi and it's permanent state as a "catch up brand". BMW has NEVER compared itself to ANY car to make it's point. BMW is the industry standard. It's Audi who constantly needs to pick a fight with a superior brand to feel relevant. Remember, step children need to feel relevant and what better way do do so than to challenge the company who sets the standard. We can go on and on for eternity about this debate. I just came here to add substance to this twilight zone fantasy about S4's being superior to the ruling king A.K.A M3. Someone asked if I have ever driven an S4. I'll put it this way; why would I stay at a motel 6 when I can stay at the Waldorff? I own the best, pass the less and dominate the rest. When Consumer Reports (A non profit/Unbiased Consumer Product Agency) States " We cannot recommend the S4 due to reliability problems" Why would anyone in their right mind test drive let alone purchase a S4? Tell me S4 owners, which car did Consumer Reports recommended in the comparison test between the M3 and the S4? Believe me if the S4 was recommended this page would be flooded with those facts. S4 owners remember, all wheel drive doesn't mean a car drives or handles better. In my next post I'll explain to you drivers of Audi's how all wheel drive is not always a good thing. I have posted many facts in setting the story straight. When and where do you challenge or refute the evidence of poor quality and substandard resale values? Do I care if you think I'm arrogant? NO. The Audi slogan says "Never Follow". Consumer Reports, Resale values, and my M3 will say different. Tell me...How does BMW Exhaust smell?
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    1. You are aware of the fact that the current inline 6 in the M3 will dominate the V8 in the S4. I find it interesting that S4 owners never comment on this point.
    2. The new M3 will sport a 400hp V8 that will easily make quick work of the RS4 and any other Audi product on the market. In fact I will take on any RS4 with my current M3 and I promise you that a Dinan M3 will never lose to an Audi. :surprise: :surprise: :surprise:
  • 1. Are you aware the current rs4 makes the current m3 inhale Audi exhaust?
    2. The new m3 just might come with a 400hp 4.0l but it will weigh more and the Rs4 will make quick work of it.
    3. Back to my s4, ko4 upgrade distorys the dinan, Im sorry but that is just a fact. I know it is because after racing one, into second gear I could see the dinan m3 on my side view mirror.
    4. This a forum, just because you read an article in your favor doesn't mean much. Audi doesn't compare its self to bmw, you do, and any brand of car that threatens you. All cars have there ups and downs.
    -- M3's are rwd coupes, the S4 is awd 4 door sedan "diffrent class."
  • m3_r1m3_r1 Posts: 32
    TALK IS CHEAP. Anyone can make a claim about beating a M3. Actually doing it is another matter. Every S4 I have ever encountered on the open highway NEVER challenged my M3. You S4 owners do your challenging here on TALK FORUMS. And when you comment you side step or flat out ignore the independent sources that tell the truth about the S4. ONCE AGAIN! ALL NON SUBJECTIVE SOURCES place the S4 far behind the M3. If the S4 is so great then; 1.why the pathetic resale value? 2. Why is the S4 NOT RECOMMENDED by Consumer Reports? I know it's hard to admit it, but you own an inferior car. This is why the S4 crowd constantly avoids dealing the facts. Honestly , I don't blame you. If I were foolish enough to buy an S4, I would either drive it off a cliff or come to sites like this one and pretend I out run BMW's. Next time spend your money on a quality car and you won't have to defend a lemon :lemon: .
  • So I have only one question? Have you had your e46 m3 engine replaced under recall yet? Please. When an entire production line of current vehicles need to have their drivetrains replaced, you really should get off your soap box and stop with the step child jokes. Both are nice cars. I own both. The Audi has much MUCH better fit and finish. The BMW has a much harder performance edge. Both are a blast to drive. AWD wins hands down.
  • _matty_matty Posts: 28
    Every S4 I have ever encountered on the open highway NEVER challenged my M3.

    That has nothing to do with the car and everything to do with the driver, bro. Cars can only go as fast as the driver, not the other way around. If I saw you and your M3 on the open road I'd challenge you, and unless your willing to push it to 150 you wouldn't stand a chance. You may own an M3, but do you REALLY know how to drive it? Do you know how to drift? Do you have the guts to push that car to it's limits? If you put 2 good drivers who are equally skilled behind the wheel of each car, the S4 would win. It's a lighter car with AWD and it has a more powerful engine.

    Why is the S4 NOT RECOMMENDED by Consumer Reports?

    I would imagine that some of it has to do with the bad gas mileage. If you can afford this car though the gas mileage should not be an issue at all. Consumer reports also bases much of their opinion on value for the money. We're talking about a sports sedan here though, not a friggin value. If you want a value go get one of those stupid looking new Volvo's. If I was looking for a new washing machine I would definitely consult Consumer Reports, but there's too much opinion factor and manufacturer loyalty with high end vehicles to make Consumer Reports the last word in this case. Audi has greatly improved their reliability issues as of late as well. Any poor reliability claims are based on older models and as we all know the 2004+ S4's are completely different from their older counterparts.

    1) With options the M3 costs at least $10,000 more than the S4.
    2) The S4 has several basic standard features that end up costing an extra $3,000 in the BMW.
    3) The S4 gets maybe 2 less mpg on the highway, but it's V8 has more horsepower and much more torque which translates to a faster car if the driver knows what he/she is doing.
    4) The BMW weighs nearly 600 pounds more than the S4 which makes a huge difference in performance, especially when the engines are close in horsepower. 333/340.
    5) Both care have great handling and nice interiors. I test drove both and decided on the S4.
    6) I could go on, but I think I've made my point.

    There are some facts for ya.

    Bottom line though, some people prefer BMW M3's and some prefer Audi S4's. Both are nice cars, so stop making dubious comparisons and be lucky that you're in a good enough financial space to be able to afford either of them. If you still have an inferiority complex just go buy an M5. They cost nearly 100K with options and taxes, but they can beat an S4. The M3 cannot.
  • rjlaerorjlaero Posts: 659
    I think that's the main difference between Audi and BMW customers. BMW folks think they own the world and have such an attitude just because they drive a BMW and have a propellar emblem on the hood. Who cares?

    I buy what I like to impress myself and be happy with my car.

    I'm willing to give up 1/2 sec 0-60 to get an AWD car like the S4. It rides much better. The M3 is a very harsh riding vehicle to drive year around.

    The interior on the S4 is much nicer, IMO as well. Those silk nappa leather seats are impeccable, and the whole interior vibe is better on the S4. Nobody can beat Audi for their interiors, and that's where you spend most of your time.

    And the sound of Audi's 4.2 is glorious. Just starting the engine and hearing that V8 purr makes all the difference to me.

    You guys can pick apart numbers all day long from Car & Driver, Motor Trend, etc, etc, about who's 1/2 second quicker here and there on the track. It's the everyday driving characteristics that make the difference for most people.
  • I had a chance to drive both of these a@? kickers the other day. I spent about 45 minutes in each on the highway as well as some twisty's behind the dealerships.
    I will start and end with this. BOTH CARS ARE "AWESOME"
    The bimmer was first. Amazing balance {no suprise there} and great acceleration. I think maybe a hair quicker in the first 20 or 30 yards than the S4. The sound of this mighty V6 is enough to stear one towards the the 4 rings. {the word ghastly, and strangling a cat come to mind} However this car is amazing. I think a better track car for sure. As someone intersted in autocross racing, this one get's the nod for :) that.Good seats great gearbox, clutch felt a mile long. Like I had to eat my knee to get it disengaged after upshift. The back end slid out in an absolutely delicous manner, never without letting you know ahead of time that was going to happen, and always so balanced. The ride was fairly quiet however, I would recommend re-gluing down any dentures that the pilot may have before entring vehicle.
    S4
    I had previously driven the 04 S4 and came away un-inspired. Not so with 06. Power comes without the tortured animal sounds and without fuss. There does seem to be a slight lag right off the line {even at high rpm launch} but it doesn't last long. Handling is great and very buttoned down. This to me is more of a GT car in the traditional sense. Better interior, smoother power, just not quite the out and out track car the bimmer is.
    I have come to the conclusion that I will autocross maybe once a month, but will drive the car every day. For me the winner is the Audi. BOTH CARS ARE AWESOME however and you can't go wrong with either. JMHO.
  • From your previous posts I gather you have never driven an S4. I have test driven both the 05 M3 and the 05 S4. I found the S4 to be more enjoyable(as well as flat out blazingly fast). Why do you find it necessary to insult buyers of a car that you have not even driven? Please drive an S4 and then come back to this forum with objective analysis. Until then, you will seem to the rest of us to be a bit wet behind the ears, kiddo.
  • _matty_matty Posts: 28
    True, the Audi does have a better ride and would seem to be much more comfortableon a long road trip. I only test drove an M3 for about 20 minutes, but I could tell that a road trip in that car would be murder. I have taken my S4 on a few road trips and loved every minute of it. The sound of the V8 is spectacular and even more so at high rpm. There were things about the M3 that I liked, but the S4 trumps it in just about every way. About the only thing the M3 has over the S4 is that it's maybe 0.3 seconds faster when going 0-60. Big deal. I can't justify spending an extra 10K on the M3 (14K if you want the spiffy gearbox) and I sense that some of you here are simply blinded by product loyalty.

    I encourage everyone to test drive both vehicles and use your own judgement. See for yourself. I'm trying to go light on the opinion factor and just give facts about the #'s. The extra cost for the M3 over the S4 is significant, but you're NOT getting more for your money. To all you BMW loyalists- Test drive an S4 before you rag on them. I know it's hard to do in this country sometimes but keep an open mind because that's the only way good decisions can be made.
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