Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Lincoln Zephyr/MKZ

12728303233100

Comments

  • prigglypriggly Posts: 642
    calidd,

    Thanks for your kind comment.

    Yes, according to the Lincoln Canada website and the sales associates the car in Canada comes with "No-Charge Scheduled Maintenance: 4 years/80,000 km (approximately 50,000 miles)."

    http://www.ford.ca/main/default.asp?language=en&sVehCategory=Lincoln&model=Zephy- r&source=FC&session={595AE9B4-7C43-4472-BA44-944E2132071A}&section=1

    Yes, it is different in the U.S. where the vehicle includes "12 months/12,000 miles complimentary maintenance." I am not sure why the difference.

    The car is a seriously and surprisingly good car, soon to become even better, and should be considered by all who are interested in purchasing a car in the entry luxury category, which includes the Acura TL, the Lexus ES 330, the SAAB 9-3 and 9-5, the new BMW 3 series, the Mercedes C class, and the new Buick Lucerne. In my estimation the new Zephyr offers a unique combination of value, quality and rich feature content unmatched by any of these except possibly the Acura TL which, unfortunately, has a much stiffer and rougher ride and some inconsistent quality foibles.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    After looking at and driving the Zephyr, it does seem to be--like most 2006 well-equipped mid-size (and even near luxury class) entrants--well screwed together, decently styled (if a bit stiff and dated on the interior), and a reasonably good drive. The whole field has moved forward in the past few years. That said, like Car and Driver, I did not find it particularly compelling by comparison with others available.

    However, C & D did like the LS when it was first offered, so maybe their lukewarm response means Lincoln is onto something. After all, Buicks sell, but there are few cars of that price class that are as boring.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    "What happened to Navigator's market dominance?
    I guess attaching $60k of bling to a 97 Expedition isn't fooling buyers anymore."

    Dennis, I'm getting really tired of your incorrect depiction of Ford's SUV evolution. For one thing, I bought a 99 Navigator, the finest truck I've ever had, BTW.
    Sure, it's based on the Expedition - as the Escalade is based on the Tahoe, the LS-470 is based on the Land Cruiser, a 20 year old truck BTW, the QX-56 is based on the Armada, etc. Only Range Rover has a unique truck.

    The Navigator broke new ground that everyone else laughed their asses off at in 98 with the Navigator, the pimped up Expedition - but it created a whole new profitable segment in the industry. It was more than just the Expedition. The Dash was different, the interior was subtly different, the seats were different, it had Quad Seating in the second row, another innovation this truck created in the masrket. The engine was 30hp more powerful in early 99, then went to the 4 valve 300hp engine in mid 99, which the Expedition didn't get. It had the air spring suspension, and virtually all the rest of the top line options of the Eddie Bauer Ex.

    Why did Cadillac take away the Navigator's domination of the segment? Style, and Rappers, and a bigger motor. Ford let that happen. Bad move. But it was a hellova truck and a great market creation.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    >The Camry/ES do not share a single visible part. They have enough respect for their product and consumer to make them completely different, yet I do not see why they made them look so similar.

    You don't think the hoods are the same? You think every body panel is interchangeable between the Navigator and the Expedition, which you are wrong about, but NO body panels are the same between the Camry and the ES? If you're right, it's because the ES is based on the Avalon, not the Camry.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "I think of Lincoln like Buick, and it's hard for me to imagine any young person ever wanting to drive a Lincoln"

    I'm on my 5th Lincoln, my 3rd LS, 1 Navi and 1 Mark8. MY first Lincoln was a 97 Mark 8 LSC, at that time I was about 20-21. It didn't bother me (then or now) to think I'm driving a "Lincoln" perceived as an old man's brand. Pretty interesting to see my 4.6L DOHC V8 290HP "Land yacht" at 204-208 Inches in length blow by these little Civics and Accords my friends had, with the numerous toys/gadgets that at it's time was ahead of many others.

    And even to this day I still have people asking about the cooled seats, Navigation, THX stereo system, flip-open stereo/Navi screen, and seeing what the car can do when I drive it.

    You make the car, what it is. Which is why the Camry and Accord have received a bad reputation for being bland, stale and boring.... Because of who, and how, it's driven. I've always made my Lincolns sporty, fresh and energetic, and have changed the perception of many once they took a spin with me :)

    Reminds me of one of the most interesting salespeople I ever encountered showing me an Explorer. Without any warning at 40mph veered off the road down an embankment, hit the top of a crest, bounced the vehicle off of it, down the other side, through the woods, came out on the opposite side. He showed (as a few others in the car), WHAT the vehicle was made for...how it took it, and kept on going. And just as any other vehicle, it is how you apply it, use it, and be creative with it.
  • The key words in your post are your repeated use of the words "was" and "had".
    Ford is still using the same body shell as the 97 Expedition. That's a fact. I never said all the panels are the same. I said the body shell and doors are the same. They are.
    Yes, it's been thoroughly updated but it's still the same basic body. Cadillac started a year behind the Nav and is now on it's third completely new model.
    We can all wax nostalgic about when the Nav had it's own specific engine or all the special features it had 9 years ago when it was introduced but that's like a fat middle aged guy who works at Wal-mart telling stories of when he was the high school quarterback. It's a little interesting, but mostly it's sad to see he only lives in the past and how far he's fallen.
    I don't think hanging a new cheese grater grille on a 10 year old body is going to do anything other than embarass itself against the all new 2007 Escalade, anymore than a gold chain makes a sad old guy cool.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    >Cadillac started a year behind the Nav and is now on it's third completely new model.

    All new? Do you share what you smoke? Same engines, same 4 speed transmissions, no IRS, no fold away flat seats, no OHC or multi valves....yeah it's all new alright.
  • navigator89navigator89 Posts: 1,080
    Nvbanker what are you talking about? The new Escalade has a 6 speed tranmission and a 6.2L V8 making 403hp, way more than any of its competitors. It can dust the 5.4L V8 in the Navigator both in torque and hp. The interior is competely revamped and looks great. It's no longer a Tahoe dash with wood and chrome.

    And in any case, this forum is for the Lincoln Zephyr - not to discuss Cadillac vs. Lincoln.
  • You should try actually READING posts instead of REACTING to them.
    Yes, the 1999 Cadillac, the 2001 and the 2007 were each new vehicles. Lincoln has been freshened but is still using the same body shell as in 1997. The market has voted what they think of this, that can't be debated.

    Unlike Lincoln which uses the same engine as in your landscapers work truck, the Cadillac has it's own specific engine with 375 hp and gets better MPG than the "Lincoln". Of course Lincoln has that snazzy new grille...

    What does this have to do with the Zephyr?
    Ford has given up on Lincoln and now it's the "fancyford" division of badge engineered shared product.

    Remember those few years when Lincoln was outselling Cadillac? Lincoln had specific vehicles and every vehicle had it's own body on a shared chassis or with Navigator, it's own specific engine to make it distinctive. Cadillac was getting it's butt kicked because all it had were boring front wheel drive vehicles shared with other divisions and a rebadged Chevy SUV.

    Isn't it ironic that they copied each other?
    Lincoln is going all front wheel drive and a rebadged Expedition and Cadillac has distinct vehicles and it's SUV has "Cadillac only" engines.
  • poodog13poodog13 Posts: 320
    Reminds me of one of the most interesting salespeople I ever encountered showing me an Explorer. Without any warning at 40mph veered off the road down an embankment, hit the top of a crest, bounced the vehicle off of it, down the other side, through the woods, came out on the opposite side. He showed (as a few others in the car), WHAT the vehicle was made for...how it took it, and kept on going. And just as any other vehicle, it is how you apply it, use it, and be creative with it.

    I feel bad for whoever ends up buying that truck.
  • bobw3bobw3 Posts: 2,997
    MY first Lincoln was a 97 Mark 8 LSC, at that time I was about 20-21.

    That's nice, but I doubt if the average age of Lincoln owners is 21 ;)

    The 55-60+ generation is huge right now, so I don't see the problem of marketing to them. There are going to be a lot of people in their 70s driving, so why turn them away by marketing solely to 30somethings?
  • cobcob Posts: 210
    Don't forget the Navigator's quad tail lights. Looks like the station wagon used in National Lampoons Vacation movie. Thats probably where Lincoln got it's design from.
  • Hello I wanted to buy a aftermarket navigation system if I ever do get the Lincoln zephyr God willing, do you think this navigation system will fit in it? http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/product/detail/0,,2076_3151_295632461,00.h- tml

    I think the unit needs a double din opening, double sized, its a 7 inch screen, just wondering if it will fit? Thanks and God Bless.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    The Lincoln and Caddy conversation and points might need to be tailored in the sense of, they no longer compete with one another. Cadillac has moved up market, at least that's what the memo said 3 years ago...

    And now, back to our regularly scheduled program...
  • I wonder what Ford thinks of the fact the Crown Victoria/Grand Marquis are outselling the 500/Montego.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,689
    They think that they're making a TON of profit on those dinosaurs.

    The 500/Montego sales will be ok until they get the 3.5L engine and a facelift. There are a lot of faithful customers that will buy CVs and GMs as long as they're available. Not to mention the CV police fleet and livery sales.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    While the Zephyr's sales figures are not burning up the charts (translates annually into a bit over 20,000), it is doing OK.

    But yikes! The Ford people must be shaking now. The new 2006 Explorer is not doing well--even taking into consideration the cooling of SUV sales, and the sales of 2006 Mountaineers are absolutely tanking. There is one "redesign" that didn't take.

    The Milan, out since last fall, cannot even match last year's sales of the lame duck Sable. And no wonder Ford has extended production of the Taurus...it still sells more than double the 500. When it goes out of production next fall, the percentage drop in sales won't look good. That a specialty vehicle like the Mustang still handily outsells the excellent, mainstream mid-size Fusion is also troublesome. This is no longer introduction time, the media have been saturated with Fusion and Zephyr ads, and the dealer lots around here are now full of both of them.

    I don't know of course what the problem is, but I do know none of the Zephyr ads have spoken to me. The interior shot they use is especially not compelling. Until you see it "in the flesh" all of a piece, that driver's dash shot just looks "old."
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "But yikes! The Ford people must be shaking now. The new 2006 Explorer is not doing well--even taking into consideration the cooling of SUV sales, and the sales of 2006 Mountaineers are absolutely tanking. There is one "redesign" that didn't take."

    The Mountaineer and the Explorer sales ARE going to tank because one of the factories producing them was closed down. Hence, there's only factory producing them at this time, and that's at full capacity. This was planned on purpose knowing the segment was shifting, therefore you will continue to see the numbers drop to around 250K combined units.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    The segment may be shifting, yes. But just as in the minivan segment, a few names rise to the top of the sales charts while the others fade away. I do hope Ford shoots to be tops in more segments than just Mustang's.

    Regardless of how Ford adjusts production to meet demand, Ford has seen some of the greatest percentage decreases in the mid-size to full-size SUV field. No reason why the historically chart-topping Explorer couldn't wear a set of clothes and attributes that would continue its sales domination indefinitely. However, even with a new front clip, new tailgate, new interior, strengthened frame, stronger V8, and 6 speed transmission, it looks identical on first glance to the previous one. Lincoln, PLEASE don't take this route when you update the MKZ.
  • savethelandsavetheland Posts: 671
    Ford is notorious for saving money when making redesign. Take Taurus. When it was redone in 1992 the only change they made was rear and front end. Doors and etc were the same, engines were the same, transmission was even worse. And it is after 7 years without any change! But because original design was fantastic Taurus hold its best selling position with discounts (logical considering they did not spend money on redesign) until 1996.

    ’96 redesign was failure because it was overdone, quality did not allow to charge premium price and Ford was too late in shifting to bio-design – party was over when they came with this model (I still like it as a radical and interesting). This time it took only 4 years for remake – a big progress by Ford’s standards!

    But what they did this time around? Right – they only changed front and read ends. So with all this curves it looked obsolete from the beginning. Did they replace Vulcan with more modern engine? No, Camry’s 2.2L was superior to 3.0L Vulcan. Did they improve Duratec? No, Camry’s 3.0L was superior to Duratec.

    Ford always was famous for starting with breakthrough designs and then not improving it for decades until running out of money and being on the brink of bankruptcy. E.g. model T, model A, whatever they made in 70s.

    Ford also must improve interiors. Without good interiors they are never going to win. Ford interiors still feel cheap and ergonomics is not good. Honda and Toyota just running circles around Ford when it comes to interior design, quality and ergonomics. And Ford makes good interiors for European models.
  • navigator89navigator89 Posts: 1,080
    "Ford also must improve interiors. Without good interiors they are never going to win. Ford interiors still feel cheap and ergonomics is not good."

    Have you seen a Ford interior lately? No, I'm not talking about the Crown Victoria or Taurus - they are old designs. I'm talking about the Fusion, Explorer, Excursion, and Five Hundred. I dont see what they lack in terms of design and quality compared to the Japanese. This would have been a bit true a few years back, but now domestics are really making strong efforts in their interiors. In fact, I even think the Fusion design beats the Accord and the Explorer is much better inside than the Pilot.
  • prigglypriggly Posts: 642
    Ford also must improve interiors.

    The interior of the Zephyr [MKZ] lacks in nothing. It is stylish, functional, and refreshing. It wisely and tastefully omits the sullenness of the German interiors and the "Tokyo by night" effect of the Japanese interiors.

    When was the last time you saw a control for the HVAC fan speed on the steering wheel?
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    Ford has indeed come a long way. The materials in the Zephyr interior do seem to exude quality. However, in the evolution of the new Lincoln interior look, from the 2006 Navigator to the "newer" look of the 2007 Navigator and 2006 Zephyr, it is beginning to look less like classic Lincoln and more like 1980s dash design lines.

    The other thing Ford could do that would help is a small thing: stop with the gaping cupholder holes and at least provide a cover on those models considered to be near luxury or luxury.

    Look at the interior of an Audi A6, the Acura RL, the Toyota Avalon, the Lexus GS for how others do luxury ambience. I think Lincoln did a masteful job of saying "quality interior" on the MKS concept (and no gaping cupholder holes either!). I hope they don't water that interior down too much in bringing it to market.
  • ricwhitericwhite Posts: 292
    The interior of the Zephyr [MKZ] lacks in nothing.

    Hmm. . . well. . . C&D magazine said the zephyr's

    ". . . attributes seem better conceived for senior citizens than young affluents. . ."

    Not exactly a raving review of the interior, if you ask me.
  • caliddcalidd Posts: 60
    This message is for 06Zephyr,

    I did not receive the photos. Please resend with "Zephyr photos" on subject line.

    Many thanks!
    calid
  • prigglypriggly Posts: 642
    Not exactly a raving review of the interior, if you ask me.

    See post #881 regarding the joke that is the Car and Driver "review."
  • 06zephyr06zephyr Posts: 32
    please send ur e mail addy to my AOL acct and i will resend the pics
  • 06zephyr06zephyr Posts: 32
    instead of reading all the reviews and making an opinion....go see it for yourself and drive it....then make an opinion

    as they say "a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing" and you are making a judgement based on very little first hand knowledge

    the inside is both luxurious and up to date...is it right for a 21 yr old...probably not....but Lincoln is not targetting that market for this car
Sign In or Register to comment.