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Lincoln Zephyr/MKZ

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Comments

  • ricwhitericwhite Posts: 292
    I read Car and Driver Magazine today and I was very surprised to read comments about the Lincoln Zephyr that were so negative.

    In response to Lincoln's attempt to attract younger drivers with the Zephyr, C&D responds, "Younger than whom? Alan Greenspan? Phyllis Diller?"

    "Here is a sedan that is exactly as stimulating to drive as a nice sofa."

    They went on to criticize the handling and power and then the interior. . .

    ". . . attributes seem better conceived for senior citizens than young affluents. . ."

    Overall, the review was very negative. Obviously one review is no death sentence, but if this is a pattern, then I think I'll have to scratch this off my list of cars to see. Usually "good" cars get good reviews overall.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Wait a minute. Although *I* very much agree with their review (I found the handling of Zephyr only slightly better than that of the Queen Mary), you owe it to yourself to test drive the car. Who cares what reviewers think? It's YOUR money and YOUR car to like or not like.

    For the record, I adored the Fusion. I just think FoMoCo went much too soft and floaty on the Zephyr suspension. You, on the other hand, might find it quite wonderful. Peoples' perceptions can and do differ. You'll never know what YOU think of it if you pass on even trying it.
  • prigglypriggly Posts: 643
    I read Car and Driver Magazine today and I was very surprised to read comments about the Lincoln Zephyr that were so negative.

    The opinion of Car and Driver is essentially worthless. Notwithstanding the fact they consistently demonstrate an anti-US car bias, they are in the business of selling magazines, not objectively reviewing cars.

    I would classify the magazine as essentially humor and much less objective information. I would certainly not be swayed by their drivel in advance of checking out the car for myself.

    As far as the power issue is concerned, yes, it does need a stouter engine and will get one in a few months. As far as handling is concerned, the car handles extremely well in a real world sense. It is not an Indy contender nor is it intended to be. It will certainly impress more than it will not.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    >Sorry NV, they use the same body shell with a different front clip as a 1997 Expedition. The doors and all the glass are all interchangable

    This is stupid to debate, scooter, but I owned a 99 Navigator, and an 03 Navigator, and the rear window and rear side windows were not interchangeable. I know, since I had to replace them. I'm not buying your statement this time. Some of the panels and parts may have been the same, but for sure, not all of them. I still doubt the body was the same, frankly. They seemed like totally different trucks to me.
  • 06zephyr06zephyr Posts: 32
    If I believed all the reviews I read id never buy an American car and Id never go to the movies. Go and drive one and see for yourself. I have one and love it..the power is fine and the ride is outstanding and the cabin is wonderful. Yes there are certain things Id like to see improved but that did not stop me from buying and enjoying this car.
    If you read the car magazines as i do you will realize that they usually favor the foreign cars over the American ones and usually give the American ones bad reviews. Go judge it for yourself as you will be the one riding in it not them
  • caliddcalidd Posts: 60
    Question for Priggly,

    When you refer to the "prepaid four year maintenance," do you mean that oil changes and general maintenance such as that is prepaid? I had understood that only one year of oil changes, etc. is provided. Wonder if provisions in Canada are different from those in the U.S. Wonder if this just varies by dealer or by region?

    Really appreciated your review, by the way.
  • bobw3bobw3 Posts: 2,997
    Maybe it's just me, but I don't know why Lincoln would want to market to the young and try to be sporty. What's the point of having a separate Ford-Mercury-Lincoln divisions if they're all marketing to the same folks? I think of Lincoln like Buick, and it's hard for me to imagine any young person ever wanting to drive a Lincoln or Buick.

    I think Lincoln should stick to marketing their cars to the 50+ crowd. Ford should be the division for the sporty & economy vehicles (Focus, Fusion, Edge, Escape, Explorer) and Mercury should become the more tame & upgraded vehicles (Freestyle, future minivan, Mariner, etc).
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,624
    That's the discussion we just had. It's 1 year in the U.S. but 4 years in Canada.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,624
    I think of Lincoln like Buick, and it's hard for me to imagine any young person ever wanting to drive a Lincoln or Buick.

    And that's the image they're trying to change. Otherwise you're stuck with a dying customer base and eroding market share.

    If Acura, Lexus, Infiniti and Cadillac can do it, why not Lincoln?
  • 06zephyr06zephyr Posts: 32
    this is for calidd..

    did u get the photos i sent to you
  • prigglypriggly Posts: 643
    calidd,

    Thanks for your kind comment.

    Yes, according to the Lincoln Canada website and the sales associates the car in Canada comes with "No-Charge Scheduled Maintenance: 4 years/80,000 km (approximately 50,000 miles)."

    http://www.ford.ca/main/default.asp?language=en&sVehCategory=Lincoln&model=Zephy- r&source=FC&session={595AE9B4-7C43-4472-BA44-944E2132071A}&section=1

    Yes, it is different in the U.S. where the vehicle includes "12 months/12,000 miles complimentary maintenance." I am not sure why the difference.

    The car is a seriously and surprisingly good car, soon to become even better, and should be considered by all who are interested in purchasing a car in the entry luxury category, which includes the Acura TL, the Lexus ES 330, the SAAB 9-3 and 9-5, the new BMW 3 series, the Mercedes C class, and the new Buick Lucerne. In my estimation the new Zephyr offers a unique combination of value, quality and rich feature content unmatched by any of these except possibly the Acura TL which, unfortunately, has a much stiffer and rougher ride and some inconsistent quality foibles.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,419
    After looking at and driving the Zephyr, it does seem to be--like most 2006 well-equipped mid-size (and even near luxury class) entrants--well screwed together, decently styled (if a bit stiff and dated on the interior), and a reasonably good drive. The whole field has moved forward in the past few years. That said, like Car and Driver, I did not find it particularly compelling by comparison with others available.

    However, C & D did like the LS when it was first offered, so maybe their lukewarm response means Lincoln is onto something. After all, Buicks sell, but there are few cars of that price class that are as boring.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    "What happened to Navigator's market dominance?
    I guess attaching $60k of bling to a 97 Expedition isn't fooling buyers anymore."

    Dennis, I'm getting really tired of your incorrect depiction of Ford's SUV evolution. For one thing, I bought a 99 Navigator, the finest truck I've ever had, BTW.
    Sure, it's based on the Expedition - as the Escalade is based on the Tahoe, the LS-470 is based on the Land Cruiser, a 20 year old truck BTW, the QX-56 is based on the Armada, etc. Only Range Rover has a unique truck.

    The Navigator broke new ground that everyone else laughed their asses off at in 98 with the Navigator, the pimped up Expedition - but it created a whole new profitable segment in the industry. It was more than just the Expedition. The Dash was different, the interior was subtly different, the seats were different, it had Quad Seating in the second row, another innovation this truck created in the masrket. The engine was 30hp more powerful in early 99, then went to the 4 valve 300hp engine in mid 99, which the Expedition didn't get. It had the air spring suspension, and virtually all the rest of the top line options of the Eddie Bauer Ex.

    Why did Cadillac take away the Navigator's domination of the segment? Style, and Rappers, and a bigger motor. Ford let that happen. Bad move. But it was a hellova truck and a great market creation.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    >The Camry/ES do not share a single visible part. They have enough respect for their product and consumer to make them completely different, yet I do not see why they made them look so similar.

    You don't think the hoods are the same? You think every body panel is interchangeable between the Navigator and the Expedition, which you are wrong about, but NO body panels are the same between the Camry and the ES? If you're right, it's because the ES is based on the Avalon, not the Camry.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "I think of Lincoln like Buick, and it's hard for me to imagine any young person ever wanting to drive a Lincoln"

    I'm on my 5th Lincoln, my 3rd LS, 1 Navi and 1 Mark8. MY first Lincoln was a 97 Mark 8 LSC, at that time I was about 20-21. It didn't bother me (then or now) to think I'm driving a "Lincoln" perceived as an old man's brand. Pretty interesting to see my 4.6L DOHC V8 290HP "Land yacht" at 204-208 Inches in length blow by these little Civics and Accords my friends had, with the numerous toys/gadgets that at it's time was ahead of many others.

    And even to this day I still have people asking about the cooled seats, Navigation, THX stereo system, flip-open stereo/Navi screen, and seeing what the car can do when I drive it.

    You make the car, what it is. Which is why the Camry and Accord have received a bad reputation for being bland, stale and boring.... Because of who, and how, it's driven. I've always made my Lincolns sporty, fresh and energetic, and have changed the perception of many once they took a spin with me :)

    Reminds me of one of the most interesting salespeople I ever encountered showing me an Explorer. Without any warning at 40mph veered off the road down an embankment, hit the top of a crest, bounced the vehicle off of it, down the other side, through the woods, came out on the opposite side. He showed (as a few others in the car), WHAT the vehicle was made for...how it took it, and kept on going. And just as any other vehicle, it is how you apply it, use it, and be creative with it.
  • The key words in your post are your repeated use of the words "was" and "had".
    Ford is still using the same body shell as the 97 Expedition. That's a fact. I never said all the panels are the same. I said the body shell and doors are the same. They are.
    Yes, it's been thoroughly updated but it's still the same basic body. Cadillac started a year behind the Nav and is now on it's third completely new model.
    We can all wax nostalgic about when the Nav had it's own specific engine or all the special features it had 9 years ago when it was introduced but that's like a fat middle aged guy who works at Wal-mart telling stories of when he was the high school quarterback. It's a little interesting, but mostly it's sad to see he only lives in the past and how far he's fallen.
    I don't think hanging a new cheese grater grille on a 10 year old body is going to do anything other than embarass itself against the all new 2007 Escalade, anymore than a gold chain makes a sad old guy cool.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    >Cadillac started a year behind the Nav and is now on it's third completely new model.

    All new? Do you share what you smoke? Same engines, same 4 speed transmissions, no IRS, no fold away flat seats, no OHC or multi valves....yeah it's all new alright.
  • navigator89navigator89 Posts: 1,080
    Nvbanker what are you talking about? The new Escalade has a 6 speed tranmission and a 6.2L V8 making 403hp, way more than any of its competitors. It can dust the 5.4L V8 in the Navigator both in torque and hp. The interior is competely revamped and looks great. It's no longer a Tahoe dash with wood and chrome.

    And in any case, this forum is for the Lincoln Zephyr - not to discuss Cadillac vs. Lincoln.
  • You should try actually READING posts instead of REACTING to them.
    Yes, the 1999 Cadillac, the 2001 and the 2007 were each new vehicles. Lincoln has been freshened but is still using the same body shell as in 1997. The market has voted what they think of this, that can't be debated.

    Unlike Lincoln which uses the same engine as in your landscapers work truck, the Cadillac has it's own specific engine with 375 hp and gets better MPG than the "Lincoln". Of course Lincoln has that snazzy new grille...

    What does this have to do with the Zephyr?
    Ford has given up on Lincoln and now it's the "fancyford" division of badge engineered shared product.

    Remember those few years when Lincoln was outselling Cadillac? Lincoln had specific vehicles and every vehicle had it's own body on a shared chassis or with Navigator, it's own specific engine to make it distinctive. Cadillac was getting it's butt kicked because all it had were boring front wheel drive vehicles shared with other divisions and a rebadged Chevy SUV.

    Isn't it ironic that they copied each other?
    Lincoln is going all front wheel drive and a rebadged Expedition and Cadillac has distinct vehicles and it's SUV has "Cadillac only" engines.
  • poodog13poodog13 Posts: 320
    Reminds me of one of the most interesting salespeople I ever encountered showing me an Explorer. Without any warning at 40mph veered off the road down an embankment, hit the top of a crest, bounced the vehicle off of it, down the other side, through the woods, came out on the opposite side. He showed (as a few others in the car), WHAT the vehicle was made for...how it took it, and kept on going. And just as any other vehicle, it is how you apply it, use it, and be creative with it.

    I feel bad for whoever ends up buying that truck.
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