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Lincoln Zephyr/MKZ

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  • pnewbypnewby Posts: 277
    I saw this mentioned earlier, and when I just looked, no posts since 10/20. Here is hoping Ant hasn't been shown the "Way Forward" or other "Bold" moves. Seems as though every time someone from Ford gets too active in forums, they seem to vanish. Any other "insiders" here? Or maybe if you are you want to keep it quiet.
    I still miss the days of jroger19- that was the best experience ever, right heyjewel?
  • heyjewelheyjewel Posts: 1,046
    "I still miss the days of jroger19- that was the best experience ever, right heyjewel? "

    You bet. He was, for those who dont know, the VP of marketing for Lincoln back in the era when the LS was intro'd. Jim championed the car and the sports sedan aspect of it, put together a big test drive event in Irvine for enthusiasts with and without LSes, which is where I met him. He would post often on this board and personally solved many folks problems.
    If not for him, I may not have an LS because I could not find a Lincoln dealer around here in the Bay Area who would even ORDER a 5 speed manual LS for me. Want any MORE proof that Lincoln will never be a big player in the sports sedan market? Tough to sell a sporty Lincoln when the dealers wont order them. I'm sure the dealers are REAL happy now with the "D-L" shift gate. Oh, I got my LS because Jim called the local dealer and told them to order me a car. They did. It's great.
    After Jim left Lincoln, him seeing the writing on the wall, they dropped the 5 speed and the LS went back to blue-hair land.
    Recently, some may remember, Jim popped back up here and helped me dispell this supposed fact that the LS was a big money-loser. At least druing Jim's tenure 99-03 or so, he said the LS was making money. So if it did lose money, it was in the 03 or 04-06 era, after they basically let it die through neglect.
    I hope things are working great for ya, Jim.
  • bigtbigt Posts: 413
    Lots of buzz in the Lincoln area, of course the most folks were around the Mercedes, Infinity, and Toyota booths. The least traffic was at the Buick booth. I felt sorry for those guys. Anyway, the Lincolns look very nice. So did the Ford Edge, in fact color selection is key. The green Edge did not look that great but the Cooper Edge really stood out.

    The MKZ's looked great especially in Black. The MKX's are also very nice. I like the Lincolns and I guess it is ok that all of the interiors pretty much look the same. The Navigator has a lot more bling to it.

    I wonder about Ford's Hybrid commitment. The only Hybrid was a Ford escape (ugly green) sitting all by itself. Toyota had its Hybrids front and center at their booths with a salesman right there to explain all about them.

    I noticed the lack of Concepts at the show. I was looking for the 2009 Camaro, Chrysler Imperial, etc. Nothing earth shattering, lots of gas using trucks! They did have an outside driving facility where you could off-road several vehicles. I was interested in driving the H3 up a small hill!
  • bigtbigt Posts: 413
    These are the ones I like:

    Vivid Red

    Merlot

    Black

    Blue

    I like them with Black interior with the Nickel Satin package.

    I owned a Zephyr Merlot with Light interior. The color was classy but the interior did show dirt. I am sort of a techy type so I like metal.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,699
    The Hybrid Fusion and other concepts/new vehicles won't appear until the LA or Detroit Auto shows in January.
  • heyjewelheyjewel Posts: 1,046
    My Navigator is Merlot. It's classy. I'd get the Z in Vivid red though if I could.

    Sat in a Z for the first time this AM at my dealership. I was underwhelmed. Interior is nice, but certainly no award winner. This one was a very light parchment color with light wood. It was nice looking, but I gotta say it felt cheap. The door was so lightweight - is there a cross-beam in there? And the interior materials on the door felt really cheap - especially the handhold hole to grab when u close the door. Is it just me or shouldn't these people make the thing you actually touch everytime u close the door out of some nice-feeling long-lasting material? Or is ot OK to save $3.00 and use the cheap stuff?

    BTW, this Z was loaded and had AWD was $37K and change and the mpg was 18/26 IIRC. A nice car but no replacement for my LS for sure.

    This is an F/L/M dealer and they had 5 Mustangs on the showroom floor. One Z, One Mark LT and one F150. Are Mustang sales slowing down? I gotta admit, they had a new red/parchment convertible 06 stang with V8 for 26K on the floor that looked really nice.
  • Imperial and Camaro were at SF auto show. But because the were on pedestal it was difficult to assess how they would look on the street.

    At SF auto show there was no interest in Edge or MKX. Nobody even stopped to look at them. Yeah there was some activity around Navigator and MKZ but nothing compared to Lexus, Infinity or Mercedes and even Saturn. Mercury also was pretty quiet.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Posts: 2,697
    The interior needs a reworking. Way too much cheap plastic around the door panels, dash, console and even on the steering wheel itself.
    The ES350 is a gussied up Camry, but they did a great job of upgrading the interior so it really feels like the car belongs in that price range. The same is not true for the MKZ.
  • bigtbigt Posts: 413
    This is funny about the discussion my brother had a Lexus LS loaner 07 and I thought how cheap the Lexus interior looked compared to my Zephyr. The wood looked like plastic to me. I guess it is all in the eye of the beholder.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Posts: 2,697
    Yes.
    Retro 70' styling?
    The MKZ interior actually looks better in the photos than in person. The photo makes it look almost modern, but when I sat in the car, it felt old.
  • bigtbigt Posts: 413
    So the MKX made it to MSN.com however you cannot go to a showroom and purchase on of them yet! I have been driving around Orlando for about a week. Not one MKZ in sight yet. How many are they selling a month? Then again I have not see one Camry Hybird either.
  • caliddcalidd Posts: 60
    I was just at a San Antonio auto show. My impression is that many more people gathered around the MKZ than around the Acura TL or the Lexus ES. One gentlemen asked me (thinking I was a sales rep), "how much? $70,000). Another guy commented that this is the car that is taking over Cadillac (not sure exactly what he meant). It definitely drew a crowd.

    Anyone know if Lincoln plans to run 0% interest and cash back anytime soon? I was hoping it might run a "December to Remember" sale (ala Lexus). Anyone know?
  • bigtbigt Posts: 413
    Not sure but I am planning on my MKZ purchase in December. Should I wait until the end of the month?
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,699
    I doubt the incentives will get any better. It's not like they have a lot of them sitting around the lot. They're selling quickly even if in low volumes.
  • ehaaseehaase Posts: 328
    I am sure I am the only person who likes that Versailles interior more than anything made today.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    Yup. You are. The obvious fake wood, the huge gaps, mismatched trim, and pieced together dash are a turn-off to most people today. However, the big ole leather seats with pockets and pulls are darn nice.

    The Versailles was that era's MKZ. Built off a Ford Granada, it was easy to see it was but a glammed up Ford. They belatedly gave it its own roofline, a couple years in, but it was too late. Too Cimarron-like. ;)

    However, it's demise led to the very pretty (for that era) rear drive Lincoln Continental. The Conti was a Fairmont underneath, but not one bit of window glass or body part was shared. It truly stood out in a way the MKZ can never hope to do.

    Not that I'm slamming the Z..Lincoln has to start over somewhere, and they could have cheaped out even more, by skipping the Milan and making that badge engineered car the MKZ.
  • caliddcalidd Posts: 60
    I see very little similarity between the MKZ and the Versailles. In fact, I would say that their differences are like night and day. To take just the seats, for example, on the Versailles they are lush and pillowy. On the MKZ they are elegant, simple.

    And what does it matter if a car shares a platform with a corporate sibling, particularly if the quality of the sibling is very good. As many have pointed out, luxury brands do that all the time.

    I think the MKZ is a very stylish, roomy, and comfortable near-luxury sedan. And the feedback from actual owners, as recorded in JD Powers and Consumer Reports says something about its quality.
  • i totally agree, I am a BMW owner changing to a MKZ, good ride, I like the car. Can anyone tell mewhere I can get a largerview of the colors for this car on the internet.
  • Although they start off focusing on the Ford Fusion and Mercury Milan, they do get around to mentioning the Lincoln MKZ.

    CR Reliable Cars
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    And what does it matter if a car shares a platform with a corporate sibling, particularly if the quality of the sibling is very good.

    Of course it may not matter at all. It is all in the execution. If you read my post, you would note that I liked the old Continental, even though it was based on a "lowly" Fairmont. What Lincoln did was give it enough attention to merit its own body.

    Lincolns deserve some level of exclusivity. The MKZ is little changed body-wise from the Fusion. It has the same windows, door panels, etc. That was traditionally how a Ford and Mercury related, but not a Lincoln.

    However, I know Lincoln couldn't afford to do more differentiation at this juncture. Once the Milan gets the 3.5, the MKZ's raison d'etre will be less clear until Lincoln gives it new clothes. Hopefully, the MKZ will have its own styling by 2010.
  • I think the Granada/Versallais comparison to the Fusion/MKZephyr is 100% accurate.
  • cg205cg205 Posts: 34
    I bought an Oxford White AWD MKZ last night in Cleveland, TN, a small town, but I saw 2 other MKZs on the road yesterday before I bought mine.

    I've been in and out of the car business for many years, retired now, but marvel at how much car this is for the money. I've owned many luxury cars over the years, and this Lincoln beats them all for quality, materials, and workmanship. Eight months ago I bought a new Corvette convertible (the Z is the wife's car) and her new Lincoln's quality puts my $60K+ Vette to shame. Panel fit, paint, leather, all materials are far superior to my GM product. And my premium Bose stereo doesn't hold a candle to the MKZ's THX system. All in all, I'm extremely impressed with the Z, and none of its competition even offers AWD.
  • cg205cg205 Posts: 34
    I find your comments about similarities between the Fusion and MKZ interesting. Today, I happened to notice a new white Fusion in the bank parking lot. I had to go in, so I parked next to it for comparison. I was struck at the number of differences, and doubt anyone who is not really familiar with FoMoCo products would guess they were siblings. And when I bought my car, it was parked next to a white Milan on the L-M lot. Again, I think Lincoln did a good job making the MKZ distinctive and more luxurious. I think we on the forum see the similarities much more clearly than do average observers.
  • cowbellcowbell Posts: 125
    From everything I read, the MKZ shares only 35% of its body panels with the Fusion. And as for the interior, there is no sharing.
  • bigtbigt Posts: 413
    I have to agree with you CG reference the quality of the Lincoln and getting 'big-bank' for the bucks. I purchased the base model of Zephyr last year for 28k. That was 2k less than the Chrysler 300 I purchased 6 years prior. Now I plan on getting th MKZ fully loaded and so far I expect to spend around 35k with my Ford X-plan pricing. If you price out the Lexus or Infinity or BMW you are about 6-10k more. So I will feel good with up coming purchase. I will keep this until around 2010 or so when the next round of hybrid technology hits.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    They share roof panels,windshields, door glass openings and frames, all door sheet metal, and all body and interior mounting points. Thus the 35% figure is a stretch to the low end...but probably not as bad a spin as the Edge and MKX sharing "50%." In fact, the Edge and MKX share the entire greenhouse, doors, both front and rear fenders, and most of the hatch.

    So the CUV twins' hood panels are slightly different, and the grills, headlights and tail lights differ. They probably call it a different panel if they apply a different trim piece to it or something like that. And it is a lot cheaper to differentiate interior trim and finishes, so Ford has tried now for years to get away with emphasizing that.

    Yes, some people don't care about exclusive styling for Lincoln. But I still say it is one of the main reasons Lincoln does not get much respect.
  • cg205cg205 Posts: 34
    Just a tip about X plan pricing, BigT. I used to use X plan but a couple of cars ago found that I can do better without it. My MKZ listed for $37,345. It's an AWD with all options except Sirius. X plan would have been just slightly above invoice. I negotiated a price of a hair over $34K, well under the invoice on the car...which I saw at the dealer and had figured on NADA.com. BTW, actual invoice may be over what you get at NADA because of a regional assessment and fuel charge added to it in my southeastern area.
  • cg205cg205 Posts: 34
    BeamerMan, what I did to see photos of actual cars in the various colors was go to autotrader.com, use advanced search, and look for '07 MKZs for sale 'at any distance'(to maximize reslults) and specify only listings 'with photos'. I found many hundreds of the cars listed at Lincoln dealers all over the country, and was able to see actual enlargable photos of all the colors available, many with 9 pictures apiece of both the exterior and interior of the cars. I found that site very helpful. Eight months ago, I actually found the new Corvette convertible I ended up buying on Autotrader.com, listed by a dealer only about 45 miles from me.
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