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Luxury Performance Sedans

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  • docnukemdocnukem Posts: 485
    Biodiesel is a different animal from fossil-fuel-derived diesel:

    http://www.biodiesel.org/resources/biodiesel_basics/default.shtm

    Renewable sources are going to have to become huge in the next 20 years to avoid global economic meltdown.

    Read some of the horror scenarios about when the world hits peak oil production. Nobody knows when it's going to arrive. A very few believe it will get here in the next few months.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    "Comparing all brands, in September Mini spent only $17 while Scion spent $109 and Porsche spent $408 per vehicle sold. At the other end of the spectrum, Jaguar spent the most, $8,194, followed by Lincoln at $5,399 and Cadillac at $4,371 per vehicle sold. Looking at incentives expenditures as a percentage of MSRP for each brand, Mitsubishi and Jaguar spent the most, 16.1 percent and 15 percent, respectively, while Mini and Porsche spent the least, 0.1 percent and 0.5 percent, respectively."

    Jaguar outspends Lincoln by almost 3 grand?? Ouch. Something is going seriously wrong there. That certainly is not going to help Jag's notoriously bad residual values.
  • drtraveldrtravel Posts: 395
    While we are waiting for Audi to post their numbers (maybe Mark has them), do you have the August Sales numbers for the STS?

    Thanks
  • jrock65jrock65 Posts: 1,371
    September 2005 Sales:

    E = 4,544
    5 = 4,137
    GS = 2,739
    M = 2,351
    STS = 2,212
    A6 = 1,640
    RL = 1,552

    August 2005 Sales:

    E = 5,011
    5 = 4,359
    GS = 3,335
    STS = 2,818
    M = 2,623
    RL = 1,721
    A6 = 1,509
  • drtraveldrtravel Posts: 395
    Don't forget the better leasing deals. Seems like BMW is actually in the car rental business more than in sales.
  • drtraveldrtravel Posts: 395
    Wow, a two minute turnaround for my request! I'm going to contact Guinness - has to be a record.

    March thru September 2005 Sales:

    E = 30,216
    5 = 29,149
    STS = 22,631
    GS = 22,313
    M = 16,920
    A6 = 10,827
    RL = 10,663
  • bdr127bdr127 Posts: 950
    My 2005 545i is one of the most striking vehicles I have ever seen. The iDrive is so simple to use. I don't know what all the fuss is about.

    A lot of people are still knocking the iDrive based on their first impressions from the original version in the 2002 7-Series..... The iDrive has improved by leaps and bounds since then. Every year it gets better and easier to navigate through the menus. The most recent versions in the 3, 5, 6, and 7 cars are all much more straight-forward than anything in the past. You can really get to everything you need within 3 clicks. Most of the fussing you hear is based on old prejudices.
  • I completely agree with hpowders and bdr127 -- my 2006 530xi looks great, drives even better, and iDrive is easy to use and leads to an attractive uncluttered dash (have you seen the number of buttons in the M and the RL?).

    One other excellent feature that my manual transmission 530xi has -- Hill Start Assist. This holds the car for two seconds when you are starting on an up-hill slope -- more than enough time to get your foot onto the accelerator before you start releasing the clutch. Takes ALL the stress out of manual driving, and makes it even more fun!! When I demo this to my buddies they are amazed.
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    Well, wouldn't you say that BMW vehicles make the best rental cars?
    Full maintenance coverage for the entire lease with very fair residual values. Compare this to Lexus where you pay for the maintenance and the residual is kept artificially low on their leases to keep their monthly payments high.

    I compared the GS430 to the 545i about 6 months ago, and the GS430 on a great deal would have cost me $40 more a month plus $1500 more in maintenance over a 3 year lease. So I saved the almost $3000 and got the 545i.
    You have to be nuts to buy a BMW in my opinion. It gets too expensive to own once the warranty runs out after 4 years.
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    You know freddybb, even one of the auto mags. is having second thoughts about the E60.
    Motortrend recently came out with "You were right Chris" in their re-evaluation of the 5 series recently.

    I am very happy with my decision to lease the 545i and find my average 20 mpg driving 70% highway, 30% city quite satisfying for a V8.

    Good luck with your new 530xi.
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    ... My 2005 545i is one of the most striking vehicles I have ever seen. ...

    Yep. Like being struck in the face by a board with nails protruding from the end of it! LOL! :P

    j/k ;) I believe the Bangle style is starting to grow on people. It usually takes a while for a completely redesigned vehicle to be generally accepted; especially when it's a drastic departure from the previous version. You have to admit, the previous 5 was pretty boxy. Adding all these curves threw folks for a loop.

    As far as i-Drive, I've been reading that it's nowhere near as bad in the 5 as it is/was in the 7.
  • I am NOT a chemist or an engineer or a fuel expert. But, here is what I think:

    o - biodiesel can be made from CORN OIL

    o - corn oil is, after all, made from corn

    o - corn, as a crop, is essentially renewable

    Therefore, it would seem that we can grow corn, make corn oil, use it to fry stuff (potatoes for example), process the "spent" corn oil into biodiesel and fuel our current technology diesel engines successfully.

    I am often wrong, but never uncertain -- and I watched a show on Spike TV where they made 20 gallons of biodiesel and put it into a 2002 Dodge Ram pickemup truck and the thing ran normally and the tail pipe smelled of french fries.

    The cost per gallon of this fuel was said to be something like $.70 per gallon.

    Renewable, good smelling (perhaps) and relatively cheap.

    What's not to like?
  • I like the looks of the newest BMW X3, X5, 3 series and 6 series. The 7 looks like it has a bustle butt (to me).

    The 5 series to this day screams Pontiac to me.

    I love to drive a 5 series, don't get me wrong -- I just can't get past the Pontiac face.

    Great cars (BMW's) -- I still haven't grown to "appreciate" the Bangle look.

    Perhaps this is why the new 3 has really only taken a half step in that direction.

    Give me the last model 5 any day.

    No offense meant to anyone.

    What the heck do I know, I bought one of the new A6's -- some folks think the front end is so bad it ruins the whole thing.

    Maybe yes, maybe no -- the A6's profile does appeal to my sense of proportion better than the 5 series. But, that is what makes the world go round -- we all see beauty differently.

    We can argue about the look of the car -- what cannot be argued are the facts: BMW's 5 is a very fine car from behind the wheel (especially in 530xi form).

    Eye of the beholder. :shades:
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    According to the current issue (November) of "Automobile" magazine, Lexus will release the GS450h in...March: over 300hp and a 0-60 time under six seconds. $49,000 base price.

    That should be interesting. What will they do with the 300 and the 430? Keep them both? Discontinue the 430? What's your guess?
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    I've been wondering what the guy in charge of Lexus engines has been smoking for quite awhile. The Avalon gets 3.5L and 280hp for 30 grand. The IS250 gets less power than the car it replaces. The GS300 has the weakest engine in its class, and is handily beaten, at least in a straight line, by the Avalon. The GS450h will be RWD, have similar power, similar performance, and similar price to the GS430. Makes sense. Wait.. what?

    Here's what I would do. Give the Avalon the new 3.0L... or just leave it with the Camry engine. I dont think most Avalon owners are lead foots. Make the base IS the IS300, leave the 2.5 for the countries that had IS200s. Take the G35 head on with IS350 AWD and a MT version. Introduce the GS with a single engine, GS350, with rear or AWD. Some 90% of sales are V6s anyway, nobody, despite what the magazines say, will miss the V8. A year later, follow up with the GS450h, and make it AWD to compete with the A6 4.2, then after the debut of the LS460, introduce a RWD GS460 V8, with a sport suspension and defeatable stability control. Doesnt that make a lot more sense?
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    Makes a lot more sense than what Lexus is doing. On the other hand, it's hard to argue with success (and Lexus is nothing if not successful). Whatever they do turns to gold. Considering their logic, what engine will they put into the next ES?

    The IS 2.5 doesn't seem to make a lot of sense, grossly underpowered. A slow sports car that's beaten at the stoplight by grandma's Buick. Reminds me of the old Toyota Celica, another sporty car with a puny engine.
  • bw45sportbw45sport Posts: 151
    One other excellent feature that my manual transmission 530xi has -- Hill Start Assist. This holds the car for two seconds when you are starting on an up-hill slope -- more than enough time to get your foot onto the accelerator before you start releasing the clutch. Takes ALL the stress out of manual driving, and makes it even more fun!!

    Isn't that cheating? I would think that would defeat the "ultimate driving experience". If you want to remove all the stress simply opt for an automatic. It's amazing how well they work.

    This message brought to you by a golfer who uses graphite shafts rather than hickory.
  • jimbresjimbres Posts: 2,025
    From your lips to God's ear. Too bad that you're not in charge of marketing for Lexus.
  • "I agree that diesel is an attractive alternative, but how, exactly, is it "totally renewable"?"

    The link that was posted on bio-diesel didn't work for me. Bio-diesel's can run on vegetable oil, which is why it is said to be totally renewable.

    I heard an interview with Willie Nelson (who has a tour bus that is bio-diesel) who said that regular diesel engines can be converted to bio-diesel. I know he's not exactly an expert on cars, but I think it is true.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    "..Lexus is nothing if not successful). Whatever they do turns to gold. Considering their logic, what engine will they put into the next ES?"

    Not exactly. The ES, RX, and LS are extremely successful, and they've been carrying the rest of the stragglers on their shoulders since the debut of the SC and GS in the early 90s. Those cars did better than the Infiniti J30 sedan and M30 coupe and convertible (anybody remember those?) but not by all that much. When the SC went in to its 7th and 8th model year with no changes, it was selling under 3K cars a year. While the GS was strong out of the gate in '93, it fell on its face in about two years. The exact same thing happened with the '98 version. The IS300 was hardly a smash hit either.

    I'm not really sure what the ES will get. Traditionally it has shared engines with the Camry, but nobody seems to know yet whether the Camry will keep its current 3.3L with a bit of a bump in power, or get a detuned version of the Avalon's 3.5. Its a safe bet though that were Camry goes, ES will go.
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