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Luxury Performance Sedans



  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    We're on the same exact page reguarding the E-Class and 5-Series. I agree the 5-Series is only right in certain colors (which is my excuse for liking the car), but more importantly it needs the big wheels and tires. I keep seeing silver 525/530s with those little wheels...yuck.

    The RL and M45 I'll have to see in person.

  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,152
    I drive a 2002 530i, and its engine is fully VANOS, as was my 1999 328i (the first year for fully VANOS engines). What the I6 engines are lacking are the new ValveTronic valve trains that no longer require a throttle body with a conventional butterfly. With the ValveTronic, throttling is achieved by varying the rise and duration of valve openings. By using the valve train as the only means of throttling the engine, I have seen estimates that engine efficiency can jump by as much as 30%, although in practice, I've never seen anything anywhere near that number.

    Best Regards,
  • i have an 2001 A6 2.7T and really like it, and my wife has a 2001 Volvo S80, and i like it. Is the 2004 model any different from the 2001 one? Also, which enigine do you think is faster and more fun? i think that the A6 is a slightly nicer car, although with some options (and standard stuff on the premier) the S80 can be equally as nice. So simply, which would you reccomend? thanks.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    The S80 is a nice car, but its not something I would recommend that anyone buy new. The front end got a slight face lift for '04, and there are some new gagues, but otherwise its the same car. The reason I wouldnt recommend a new one is that the value of the S80 tanks immediately after it is driven off the lot. Of course.. the A6 is exactly the same way. I wonder if A6 4.2 buyers kick themselves when they find out their 2 year old $50K car is worth $30K.

    That said, the S80 is infinitely more reliable than the A6, which is one of the worst cars mechancally Audi has ever made, and they make a lot of bad cars.
  • spaldingspalding Posts: 1
    S80 depreciation can be bad the first year, but w. $5000 manuf. to dealer incentive in April, L.A. dealers are offering $10k off of a new T-6, bringing price down to about $38,000. Very attractive at that price, given that a 2-3 year old BMW 530 costs about the same or more. Any opinions on the S80 at that price?
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Why was your own name your subject? Anyway, even at $38,000, I just dont think the S80 is that strong of a value. The interior is kind of bland, and its not all that much fun to drive. For a FWD car, the new Acura TL is more reliable, has a much nicer interior, and the engine has more power than even the T6. All for maybe $34,000, and it will retain its value, especially considering how high demand is for the TL at this point. Another option would be like an '02 Lexus GS430, which would be around $38K. It has MUCH more power than the T6, and is much nicer and more fun to drive as well.
  • jrock65jrock65 Posts: 1,371
    Motortrend (June):

    "From Here to Infiniti

    Nissan's luxury division is developing a coupe and convertible off the upcoming 2005 M45 sedan. The new M45 is based on the Nissan Fuga concept unveiled at the Tokyo Motor Show last fall. The Fuga is, in turrn based on the Nissan FM (G35) architecture, but it's longer and bigger than the Skyline (G35). Indications are that the Infiniti flagship coupe and convertible both will be four-seat cars and won't be ready before the 2006 model year."

    I guess they're not going to waste any time going after the 6 series and CLK. Wonder if they'll make a G35 convertible as well. Bet that car will look sweet.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    I assume that this mystery Infinti is our Skyline GT-R. The timeframe would make sense, as that car is supposed to hit in the '07 model year, and its logical that it would be built off of the FM-L V8 RWD platform. I really hope that they get it right, it would be nice to have another sports car to compete against Corvette at the $50,000 range.
  • jrock65jrock65 Posts: 1,371
    I'm not sure about that. Apparently, the GTR has been pushed back until MY 2008. Plus, the GTR will be a high-performance machine to go against the likes of the NSX. This M based coupe/convertible sounds more like a luxo-cruiser to compete with the BMW 6 and the MB CLK.

    Guess we'll just have to wait and see.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    I dunno, I think the FM-L could be adapted to sports car duty. The 350Z and the Alitma share the same platform, but they are hardly similar cars. I'm just not sure that Infiniti would want three coupes in their lineup.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    The 350Z and Altima don't share the same platform. The FM (Front-Midship) platform is the basis for the 350Z, G35 Sedan & Coupe and the FX35/45, as well as the upcoming M35/45. All these cars have a rwd bias.

    The Altima is on a totally different fwd-biased platform (FLL??), which includes the Murano, Maxima, and Quest.

    That would have to be one great platform to do both rwd (350Z) and fwd (Altima) duty at the same time.

  • proeproe Posts: 157
    If GT-R does hit the US market, then a lot of tuners will be very happy as GT-R has the nick name Battle God in Japan because it just beats any car that you put against it with or without mods on track. And, I am not sure even 911 turbo will come out on top if you put it against GT-R on the track. People have tuned the car to produce 1000 hps or more easily. Man, I wish we will see all the Japanese sports cars in US markets someday.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    What I'm really interested to see is a car from Japan in the $50K range that can compete with Corvette. For the moment, the Vette is pretty much in a segment by itself. Sure you can get a Boxster for similar money, but a Z06 would wax it easily. I want a far eastern that can finally take the Vette down a notch on its own turf.
  • jrock65jrock65 Posts: 1,371
    Autoweek tests a pre-production 2006 M45. e=reviews&loc_code=index&content_code=03145214

    Looks like Infiniti is really going for tight handling.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    There is a very interesting comparo in the June issue of Road and Track. The cars: CTS, E320, 530i, S-Type 3.0, S80 T-6, Chrysler 300 3.5 (not the "C" Hemi model") and A6 3.0.

    This is one of those controversial comparos Road and Track loves to do every once in a while.

    The CTS won based on price and performance. Impressive. I'm still not impressed with the interior, but for the money against these cars they see it as a performance bargain.

    The E320 came in second, but more importantly Road and Track's review of the car reads like a Mercedes-Benz product should behave. Unflappable road composure and more importantly quality of assembly inside and out, especially inside. They also remarked that for once the E320 is actually somewhat fun to drive!

    The shocker has to be that the BMW 530i placed next to last. This is unprecedented with a BMW in just about any comparo in any magazine anywhere! Idrive, styling and price did the car in. They did remark that were only 2 performance cars in the test, the CTS 3.6 and 530i. However the 530i's road prowess couldn't overcome the cars' more glaring faults.

    The new 5 didn't make C&D's 10Best list either this year. BMW is slipping here.

    I think Road and Track has a subtle but distinct bias for Jaguars. The put the outdated XK8 over the SL500 a few months ago and now they put the S-Type over the 5-Series and A6. I don't think so.

    I think they should have tested the A6 2.7t instead of the very pedestrian 3.0L model. The new A6's interior may have more features and even better build quality, but the current model has a better looking interior with much less clutter and confusion of Acura and BMW themes, like the 2005 model has.

    Leave it to Road and Track to mix things up a bit. I don't think any other magazine would have tested such a diverse group of cars.

    The test I'm waiting to see is when the new STS V8, E500, M45, GS430, 545i, new A6 4.2. Ditto for all the 6 cylinder versions of these cars which would include the new RL. The RL will probably win the 6-cylinder contest on price/power/performance.

  • saugataksaugatak Posts: 488
    Road and Track must have received a silver 5-series and thought it was too ugly.

    On a serious note, BMW has to stop the cost cutting with their interiors and beef up their I6 if they're going to compete. It's still the best handling, but at some point its lack of power is going to be a problem.

    Hopefully zey vil vinally bhut ze valvetronic technology from zeir v8 into zeir zstraight seex undt inclease displacement wizout incleasing zeir alvredy redikulus purayceez.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Actually the car was black I think, and they still knocked the styling! I think it looks best (if that is possible) in darker colors. This is of course a grand excuse, because a good looking car should be able to wear any reasonable color well.

  • mariner7mariner7 Posts: 509
    "The RL will probably win the 6-cylinder contest on price/power/performance."

    I think it will be hard for RL to come close to new M35. Reason: G has the better chassis than TL. Yes, Acura fans may argue over that, but for most people there's little argument over this. RL probably will have pretty much the same chassis as TL, with fwd. From AW review, looks like M chassis is significantly improved from G.

    Another reason TL and RL are close in ability: they're introduced one year apart. Whereas Z/G were introduced 3, 4 years ago, now it's time for a much improved platform from Nissan.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Good point, we'll just have to see.

  • saugataksaugatak Posts: 488
    just went back and read that article from the link you posted.

    wow, if nissan has already improved the FM platform that much, the new M45 might be a 5-series killer.

    and once they make the next generation G35 off of the improved FM platform, we might have a true 3-series killer on our hands.

    you gotta love the competition.

    now if honda would only make a RWD platform, sigh.
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