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Luxury Performance Sedans

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Comments

  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    Sure, the practical move for a starter would be a 4 cylinder Corolla or Civic-preferably a used one.
    This young man is very status conscious, however, and the cars in his school parking lot are all BMW's and the like.
    One has to hope he will be responsible.
    Not all young people are defendants on Judge Judy and/or have a death wish.
  • dhamiltondhamilton Posts: 873
    A couple of thoughts on the driving dynamics front which most people on this particular thread are concerned with.
    The BMW has slightly superior steering feel and handling. That said I feel BMW's can tend to be a little nervous. Audi's to me have a more planted feel.[Like growing grass under the wheels.] Audi's have a beautiful quality to them that allows you to drive them all day and not feel beat up. You will lose a little of that "at the limit telepathy" that the bimmer offers.
    So, have you driven them? The biggest advice I can say to you is, when you are driving a car with the capabilities, and reputation that these two auto makers have earned, you are either driving them out of an educated decision, or as a poser who drives whatever the "cool people" drive.
    Don't be another moron who bought a bimmer cause it's cool. Buy it as an educated car enthusiast who can answer the questions asked by non- car peasants :P. Understand that a fine German automobile is an experience. Most other makes are a tool for point A to B.
    Now, no more questions until you have driven them both. :mad:
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    Not all young people are defendants on Judge Judy and/or have a death wish.

    If every 15 year old in the world was showered with gifts like a A6 or BMW5 , then there would be no need for any youth to face Judge Judy or have a death wish.(unless ofcourse if daddy changes his mind and buys his son a Corolla instead, then things might get homicidal)
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    It's sad but true. Go to any wealthy suburban HS student parking lot and the cars you will see will be BMW's and Corvettes.
    The Corollas will be found in the teachers' parking lot.
  • cmybimmergocmybimmergo Posts: 265
    Go to any wealthy suburban HS student parking lot and the cars you will see will be BMW's and Corvettes.

    And how many memorial pages are there in the yearbook?

    Call me the stick in the mud if you insist, but I'll repeat what I said before. Even the wimpiest car is a dangerous weapon in the wrong hands at the wrong time. Or even the right hands at the wrong time. Careful, experienced drivers die too, even when they're driving carefully, because you just never know what the other guy is going to do. So why look for trouble unnecessarily? Inexperience plus a powerful engine is an ill-advised combination. My children are way too precious to me to take that chance.

    YMOV.
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    go tell a kid you're getting him a used Civic when fellow classmates are driving 330i's.
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,093
    My TV comes on at 7AM to the Today show. Although my alarm had gone off 30 minutes earlier, I was a bit in a fog still and heard Katie say something about a "girlie man."

    I am a tech-weenie, so you will pardon me for having Tivo in my bedroom. Well it was actually 7:12AM and I rewound and fast forwarded whilst having a cup of coffee until I found the reference to "James Bond, Aston Martin, Stick Shift and Girlie-man."

    The new James Bond, so says Katie or Matt, is being forced to "drive a Ford" since he can't drive the Aston Martin with the stick shift (hence Katie's comment that any [Bond} man who can't drive a stick is a "Girlie-man.")

    Then it hit me -- the paucity of stick shifts in THE place or at least A place where I would expect them to be "universally" offered (the LPS cars, natch) has nothing to do with their suitability or even appropriate-ness in this class, it simply is (or must be) that driving a stick shift is a skill that has for all practical purposes atrophied.

    No wonder the [high school] "boys" (and there are some "girls," too) at my local full-service car wash seem un-phazed by my assertions (hopefully delivered and taken in good nature) that "real men" (and "real women") can drive sticks. I tell them not to EVER admit they can't drive a stick and to make haste to learn to drive one.

    "Buggy whips will be back again, you mark my words!" :surprise:

    I used to get a rise out of these "kids" when I would needle them as they attempted to find the correct match of engine RPM and clutch slippage to move my car foward starting out in 5th gear (amid the smell of burning clutch and whisps of bluish smoke) as I ran toward the car yelling "stop! stop! I'll take it from here!")

    No more.

    Stick shifts are officially off the "cool-dar" apparently. For if even James Bond cannot drive a car with a stick, what are the rest of us to do to even attempt to perpetuate this drive line?

    Ahhh -- James driving the Audi 200 turbo quattro in "The Living Daylights" (with a stick of course) and now James driving a Ford whatchamacallit instead of an Aston Martin, signifies the end of an era.

    I'm turning my Audi in right now and getting, wait a minute, I already have become the "girlie man" of my nightmares, what with my lousy two-pedal emasculated but still pretending LPS car. Luxury Posing as Sport is the new TLA don't you think?

    Or don't you? :confuse:

    Apparently, you aren't out there, Lunatic Fringe. :cry:
  • acctprofacctprof Posts: 41
    I'm turning my Audi in right now and getting, wait a minute, I already have become the "girlie man" of my nightmares, what with my lousy two-pedal emasculated but still pretending LPS car. Luxury Posing as Sport is the new TLA don't you think?

    Thirty years ago I made fun of my boss (delicately, of course)for driving a Jaguar with an automatic. I told him that no sports car should come with an automatic.

    He replied "They stopped making sports cars when they put in A/C and rollup windows."

    You are one of a dieing breed. The rest of us are why the L is first in LpS. I'm sorry for your loss.

    Len
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    Imagine never being able to experience what must be the incomparable pleasure of driving an S4, M3, Porsche Boxster or 911, etc; all because one never took the time to learn how to drive a stick.
    And for those for whom the above is an impossible dream, one can still test drive these vehicles.
    Can you imagine ordering any of the above with automatic?
    Absolute heresy, I say.
  • dhamiltondhamilton Posts: 873
    on order is with a stick. I don't think they make a real S4 without one. I think those may be called an Audi S4*
    "Lunatic fringe reporting for duty sir"
  • garyh1garyh1 Posts: 386
    Imagine never being able to experience what must be the incomparable pleasure of driving an S4, M3, Porsche Boxster or 911, etc; all because one never took the time to learn how to drive a stick.

    I agree that it would be sad to not be able to experience the joy of driving a true sports car with a stick on a hilly and winding country road because you never learned how to use a stick. But I still think that Mark and you other "purists" are missing the point that a stick is neither fun nor beneficial to use in bumper-to-bumper urban traffic, when you are creeping along going somewhere between 0 and 15 mph with your left foot riding the clutch. I would bet Mark doesn't spend much time doing that in Cincinnati, but move to LA or NYC or DC and try it, and I think you'll change your perspective on this.

    Len's correct: should we give up electric windows just because it is harder to adjust the space of the opening exactly as much as you want than it is with roll-down windows? There are trade-offs to many technology upgrades, but people are willing to weigh those trade-offs and make a decision based on their own needs.

    Mark is not a lunatic on the fringe; he is just in a minority of drivers in how they want to drive their everyday cars (most people don't have the luxury of having a sports car in their garage for weekend driving only).
  • bdr127bdr127 Posts: 950
    You will be disappointed with the 525's acceleration.

    A 15 year probably has no prior experience to compare to.... A 525i will seem absolutely fine if he doesn't jade himself by driving a 550i.

    When I was 16, I got my first car... a used 1987 Mazda 323 LX sedan (stick, of course!), and I never thought twice about its power. Of course, I got a new Nissan Maxima as my first car out of college... only then did I realize the Mazda was pretty weak!
  • cmybimmergocmybimmergo Posts: 265
    go tell a kid you're getting him a used Civic when fellow classmates are driving 330i's.

    All it takes is a spine.
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,093
    Then what does the P stand for "Pampered?"
  • brightness04brightness04 Posts: 3,151
    My main concern for a 15yr old car would be the reliabilty of airbag deployment. Don't quote me on this, but from what I read years ago, the gunpowder/explosive charge in the airbag system was designed to be good for only 6 years or so. But then again, hopefully it never comes to using airbags ;-)
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,093
    Re the wimpy-ness of the 525xi.

    I will try, I mean really try, to take a 525 i or xi for a test drive this Saturday whilst our X3 3.0 stick is in for its first oil change @ 17,000 miles.

    Oh, BTW, I mean ONLY a manual version of this car, I have no doubt it is less than fun with the auto and the lower powered engine.

    Unfortunately, we have plenty of grid lock here in our big town (or, if you like small city) -- yet the stick would still be my pref.

    Listen, I only want the choice -- I really want us each to have what we WANT.

    I am given little choice is my point.

    An S4 just isn't quite big enough.
  • brightness04brightness04 Posts: 3,151
    That's why IMHO 525i is a good choice: all the safety features, yet slower than a Civic Si or V6 Accord. An X5 3.0 would be even better; more survivability in a crash with SUV's, and more room in the back for making out ;-)
  • brightness04brightness04 Posts: 3,151
    Exactly. Nor would any LPS make for a satisfying weekend sports car. LPS and automatic are a very natural match indeed; that's why the overwhelming majority LPS's are sold with automatics.
  • acctprofacctprof Posts: 41
    "Nor would any LPS make for a satisfying weekend sports car. LPS and automatic are a very natural match indeed; that's why the overwhelming majority LPS's are sold with automatics."

    Exactly on point. LpS.

    BTW, my boss was lamenting the loss of the bolt-on windows, as in the 1950's MGs. Roll-ups did not belong on a sports car.

    Len
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    Sure. I agree. Unfortunately, practicality must prevail over fantasy, which is why I ordered my 545 with steptronic transmission.
    Ideally it would be great to have 2 vehicles-an Accord with automatic for daily city driving and a 911 stick for exhilarating weekend jaunts.
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    "All it takes is a spine."

    Looks good on paper. :)
  • bjbird2bjbird2 Posts: 647
    "All it takes is a spine."

    A 16 yr. old will be better off in the long run without being given one of these cars. What would they have to look forward to, or earn themselves? A Saleen S7 :confuse:
  • dhamiltondhamilton Posts: 873
    I live in Houston Texas. 4th biggest city in these here United States. lot's-o-traffic. Give me a stick.
    Lunatic fringe reporting for duty sir
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    You're missing the whole point about the auto biz, there's always something to look foward to! Just look at the difference between the old RL and the new one. As good as these LPS cars are now, they're going to be very different (and most likely much improved) 10 years from now.
  • rayngrayng Posts: 70
    I'm guessing that 10 years from now, we'll be driving golf carts if we don't find an alternative to fossil fuel. This is the golden age of luxury and performance. We should enjoy our rides while we can.

    I'd argue that LPS in the future will be self driven. But at least we'll have our fun on the race track.
  • cmybimmergocmybimmergo Posts: 265
    "All it takes is a spine."

    Looks good on paper.



    Feels even better in person. ;)
  • cmybimmergocmybimmergo Posts: 265
    the gunpowder/explosive charge in the airbag system was designed to be good for only 6 years or so.

    Hmmm...if this were so (and I have no clue whether it is), then wouldn't it be checked out and/or replaced during regularly scheduled maintenance? (Not that I remember any mention of it during any of the car's service visits.) To knowingly have a non-functional airbag in a car that's just been serviced makes about as much sense as neglecting to replace the brake pads and rotors when they've worn down to where they can't stop the car.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Eventually the ICE is going the way of the dodo, but I'm sure that it will still be with us in 2016. Its an old dog, but it still has a few tricks (such as HCCI) left up its sleeve, and hydrogen has yet to make any real world sense.

    I'm sure that self-driving cars will have a "manual override" mode (they always do in the movies) so I'm not worried.
  • gohorns1gohorns1 Posts: 53
    My first car was an '81 Olds Omega. Yes, we were one of the 3-4 people to buy one. I knew it was grossly underpowered. When you can clearly tell the difference in power when you turn the A/C on and off, its a pretty strong clue. But, it was a great high school car and I had this car through college (really impressed the babes with it :D )and into med school. It was a great car for what I needed. It got me where I needed to go, at least until the end. I then moved up to my dad's old '84 Maxima with a stick (after the "blue chariot" as it was affectionately known, died on the 5th floor of the garage of the public hospital at 2AM. My parents took pitty on me). The Maxima was a blast to drive, especially relative to the chariot. I am still partial to Nissan and now Infiniti due to that car. I guess first, or in this case second, impressions due count. I also certainly appreciated the nicer car having driven a car that was extinct after two years :) .
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    Ideally it would be great to have 2 vehicles-an Accord with automatic for daily city driving and a 911 stick for exhilarating weekend jaunts.

    Ideal with two cars? Maybe for you.

    My ideal is one and only one car. And that car would be a BMW M5. With an M5 who needs a sports car? And in addtion the M5 is a practical family hauler. It is two cars in one. . If I had an M5 I would never ever have a roving eye for a second car, not even for a sexy red 911.
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