Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Luxury Performance Sedans

1386387389391392502

Comments

  • breldbreld Posts: 1,127
    The Tip in my Cayenne is great when shifting manually. It's just not so great when left in full auto. I was just surprised at the different 0-60 times for the Boxter with Tip though. It's the same with the Boxter S too. The Tip is about .8 seconds slower than manual 0-60. The 911 Carrera 4S cuts that difference in half, and the Turbo cuts it to .3 according to the website. With differences that small I could see a really good Tip driver making up for them. I just wonder why 0-60 times are so different for the Boxter and Cayman, but not the 911. Is it the increased power?

    I'd point out that the preference for a manual over an automatic has little, and perhaps nothing, to do with how fast you get to 60 mph. It's the experience of getting there. As you pointed out, it seems the gap in acceleration between today's automatics and manuals is decreasing quite a bit.

    My wife doesn't quite get my desire for a manual in my potential 530 purchase - "Isn't a BMW fast enough with an automatic?" "Well, yes, but...oh never mind..." :)

    2014 Passat - 2010 328xi M-sport wagon manual - 2008 A3 - 2009 Ody

  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    But motor industry experts said that Ford might have to package Jaguar with its four-wheel drive marque Land-Rover to attract a big, established volume car maker

    Rumored suitor? Renault. Sounds like Ghosn's ambitions are beginning to resemble Napoleon's. A Renault-Nissan-GM-Jaguar-LandRover Alliance sounds like a beast that will be too humungous for its own good. The article is linked below.

    SOURCE: THE INDEPENDENT
    link title
  • james27james27 Posts: 433
    Not everyone is interested in power. The M is signficantly bigger than the G series. Both have adequate power. It is not unusual for the sales to drop a little prior to the newer model being introduced. I think that there was a group of people waiting for the M to come out in its initial year, and things became more predictable. The initial glowing press got more people to consider the M. Because it is no longer new, there isn't anywhere near as much press. Some out of sight, out of mind is going on here.

    The M will continue as a viable product for awhile yet.
  • rich545rich545 Posts: 386
    I'm not saying the preference for manual has anything to do with 0-60 times. The discussion is about why the Shipo's 328i with stick was able to beat the Boxter with tip that he raced from a toll booth. That kind of race has everything to do with 0-60 times in that the toll on the TZ Bridge is about 500 yards from the exit they both took. I love manual transmissions as well (in fact, my Cay S is only the second non-manual car I have ever owned) so I know about the joys of manual driving. I was just surprised that for the Boxter specifically the 0-60 times were very different for the Tip vs. manual tranny.
  • bw45sportbw45sport Posts: 151
    Statistics released by the German automobile association, ADAC, show that Mercedes passenger cars are among the most reliable vehicles in Germany

    This is an oft cited statistic. Unfortunately, it only measures one component of reliability, breakdowns. While Mercedes has suffered woeful problems related to electronics, their mechanical systems appear to be rock solid as ever, hence no breakdowns.

    Mercedes was my brand of choice for over twenty years and I never had a breakdown. However, the advanced control systems of the newer cars that rely so heavily on electronics malfunction far too often. The C-Class, "the most reliable" medium-sized car was miserable during the first year of its most recent overhaul. Over 30 percent of owners purchasing a C-Class that year reported "significant" electrical problems during the first year of ownership.

    While they deliberately avoided a "kill shot", Fifth Gear's attempt to stop an old E-Class wagon is quite entertaining and does illustrate the incredible build quality of pre-merger Benzes.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bIV_hHPAFQ&eurl=
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    The only thing that video really shows is that a Mercedes was a much simpler car back then. The physical build of a of certain Mercedes has changed dramatically for sure (first generation ML, W220 S-Class and 2001 C-Class comes to mind), so I think the fair thing to say is that they aren't all built the same anymore. Some of the newer models are physically built as robust as car can be without going overboard and paying dearly in increased weight. Also, the W124 had bascially what is about as sophisticated as truck engine (I6) compared to MB's current engines. The only thing comparable today is MB's iron-block I6 diesel engine. No car would be able to withstand water in the engine and the other things that car went through and still turn over the way cars are built today so it isn't just Mercedes-Benz. Also he electronics on the W124 are primitive by today's standards. The merger had very little or anything to do with how Benzes were built. Mercedes downgraded themselves starting in 1994 with the C-Class that came out that year. Now the ML that everyone likes to point too did come out in 1997, but it was already a done deal by the time Chrysler joined the mix. The bumpy road test that they subjected that W124 wagon through is the same one that most car makers used today to test durability, either that or they have a "shaker" machine that duplicates that kind of stress indoors.

    M
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Rumored suitor? Renault. Sounds like Ghosn's ambitions are beginning to resemble Napoleon's. A Renault-Nissan-GM-Jaguar-LandRover Alliance sounds like a beast that will be too humungous for its own good. The article is linked below.

    At least that would give Jag access to a decent V6. A Jagified VQ would probably be good for well over 300hp. They'll never reach that with a Taurus engine.
  • designmandesignman Posts: 2,129
    I just wonder why 0-60 times are so different for the Boxter and Cayman, but not the 911. Is it the increased power?

    You will always hear the rationale to be the difference in torque and it’s true, but ultimately the gearing and shift points in the Porsche Tips are not optimal. There’s really no reason why most cars should have less disparity in acceleration between auto and manual. I guess Porsche couldn’t give a flying fajita because 85%-90% of their sports cars sold have manual transmissions.

    BTW in normal situations, the Boxster Tips start in 2nd gear. Not sure about the 911s. Is this the case with your Cayenne S? I had one as a loaner once but forgot to take notice. The SUV is one thing, but with the Boxster I am sure I would be quite miserable with the Tip.

    Low end torque with a nicely geared auto transmission that has optimal shift points equates to point-and-shoot acceleration. We don’t see that in Boxsters. You have to be between 4500 and 7200 RPM (redline) and precise shift points to get max acceleration. Below that the car just doesn’t move. So if someone is not familiar with the transmission and engine power curves he ain’t beating too many cars.

    Well we’re really OT now thanks to our pal Shipo and his duel at the friggin’ Tappan Zee bridge. ;-) Rich if you would like to continue I guess we should move to a Porsche thread.

    Oh, one more thing now that I’ve already risked getting sent to the spanking machine in the principal’s office by digressing. Coincidentally, the headline on the front page of today’s local paper is about shipworms eating the piers that hold up the causeway of the Tappan Zee bridge.
  • designmandesignman Posts: 2,129
    I didn’t think it was to much of a stretch to put together that automatic is the word. Hopefully i haven't offended anyone with that.....automatic, automatic, automatic. OK, back to hitchhiking

    Thank you for explaining yourself. Your reference to the A word as ungentlemanly suggested another word in my mind, something less flattering than merely an “automatic” transmission. I’ll leave it at that with no offense taken. We move forward.
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    In Wall Street Journal today there is a rumor that a Korean auto maker(Hyundai most likely) is interested in Jaguar.

    What better way for Hyundai to make a splash in the luxury segment, IMO. Also the high quality and reliability of the Hyundai marque may prove to be a great a benefit to Jaguar . Only problem is Hyundai will have to work overtime in developing engines and platforms that are suitable for Jaguars (good luck)
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    What better way for Hyundai to make a splash in the luxury segment, IMO. Also the high quality and reliability of the Hyundai marque may prove to be a great a benefit fir the Jaguar marque. Only problem is Hyundai will have to work overtime in developing engines and platforms that are suitable for Jaguars (good luck)

    That doesn't seem likely. Hyundai was basically put on hold while the chairman was in prison, and they have a lot of work to do just to get things back to normal. Not a great time for a major aquisition.
  • rich545rich545 Posts: 386
    Yeah, we are off topic a bit so this is the last I'll post about it here. Yes, the Cayenne S starts in 2nd (all Cayennes do) which is really annoying. I often find myself "tipping" down to first just to get moving more quickly (obviously it takes a good amount of power to get that 5,500 lbs moving). The poor TZ Bridge. I grew up in Sleepy Hollow so the thing dominated my landscape for quite some time. I bet Shipo and his buddy didn't get to race TO the toll given how backed up it gets!
  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,152
    "I bet Shipo and his buddy didn't get to race TO the toll given how backed up it gets!"

    That's a bet that you'd win. ;-)

    I commuted from Bergen County New Jersey to Elmsford for over 5 years, and I gotta tell ya, I don't miss it.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • sfcharliesfcharlie Posts: 402
    Audi A6 sold 1,468 in July, 2005, and 1,652 this July -- a 12.6% increase. Up 8.7% for the first 7 months of 2006.

    MB S-Class has sold 17,817 units so far this year, up an astonishing 95.8% over first 7 months of last year. Maybe that's where the action is for MB, as people await 2007 E-series.

    BMW 5-series sold 31,309 units this year, up from 27,765 last year, for a 12.76% increase. But 7 series only sold 10,831 units, up from 9,726 last years for only an 11% increase.

    So people are buying more big Mercs and mid-size BMWs.
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    "So people are buying more big Mercs and mid-size BMWs".

    Exactly!

    Should be interesting to compare the new S Class sales figures vs the 2007 LS say from about May 2007 going forward.

    Funny how the auto-rags did their best to trash the "ugly" Bangle 5 Series with its "frustrating to use" iDrive and rather "stark" interior.

    Obviously, the buying/leasing public thought otherwise, pretty much rejecting their "built to out-perform" champion, the Infiniti M.
    And it can't be because of BMW's good leasing deals, because the leasing deals are pretty good for the Infiniti M also.
  • RE: "...auto-rags did their best to trash the "ugly" Bangle 5 Series with its "frustrating to use" iDrive and rather "stark" interior

    Remember, beauty is in the eye of the beerholder. I don't think BMW's are as nice looking as they were previously (especially the Dame Edna headlights), but I understand why people buy them. They are just great cars.
  • jrock65jrock65 Posts: 1,371
    On July 31, 2006, Nissan trademarked the following:

    M40
    M50
    M55
    M60

    This follows on the heels of the trademarking of "FX50" in April 2006. Which followed on the heels of "G37, FX37, and M35" in January 2006.

    So, it looks like there is definitely a new or revised V8 engine in the works.

    My guesses:

    2008 G37 coupe w/ 325 hp
    2008 M37 sedan w/ 325 hp
    2008 M50 sedan w/ 400 hp
    2009 M60 sedan w/ 500 hp (presumably to go up against the M5 and E63, but I don't think it'll happen)

    The M40 trademark is interesting. It could be possible that the M will get a 4.0L V6, but I doubt it. I think they just trademarked it with the "throw in the kitchen sink" mentality.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    The M40 trademark is interesting. It could be possible that the M will get a 4.0L V6, but I doubt it. I think they just trademarked it with the "throw in the kitchen sink" mentality.

    Yeah, I dont get that one either. Nissan already has the VQ40DE, but its a truck engine designed for torque, not horsepower. Perhaps "M40" could mean a turbocharged engine like the GT-R?
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I think they're just covering all possible combinations, I doubt we'll see half of those come to market. For some reason "G37" just doesn't sound as good to me as "G35". I bet BMW would have a problem with "M50" though. Mercedes trademarked SL69, S69 and CL69 a little while back. I can't imagine what the hp would be for such models.

    Then again Nissan is hell bent on Infiniti having more hp than the Japanese competition so they'll be a revised V8 for the M's facelift for sure.

    M
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    For some reason "G37" just doesn't sound as good to me as "G35". I bet BMW would have a problem with "M50" though. Mercedes trademarked SL69, S69 and CL69 a little while back. I can't imagine what the hp would be for such models.

    I agree, G37 doesnt have a great ring to it. I think Mercedes is probably mad that VW, by way of Bugatti, has 1000hp and they don't. Mercedes doesn't like to be outdone in the crazy German hp wars.
Sign In or Register to comment.