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Luxury Performance Sedans



  • I was wondering if anyone had recommendations for getting very dark, illegal, window tint in the central florida area.
  • I agree with the general sentiment of Domenick's post and those of others which question the value or enjoyment of reading "I've found the golden car at the end of the rainbow" claims, although I do understand the emotion behind such claims when they are offered in the spirit of "I'm in love with the car I just bought and I want to sing it from the rooftops."

    As some of you recall, in late May I bought an M35 and within a month wished I had bought the other of my two final choices, the Audi A6. I was quite hyperbolic and dramatic in the throes of buyer's remorse. After a few months, I came back down to earth and settled into this driver's version of Thoreau's "The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation." In this more sober state, I realized the car was the source of my discontent only in the sense that I knew, on some level, throughout the final stages of choosing between it and the Audi that I was being inexorably pushed toward buying it largely by what I had read and not by my own reactions to driving it and the A6. A couple of Edmunds forum participants picked this up before I did and even drew my attention to what they saw I was doing. I ignored them and my own feelings and bought the M35. The aftermath was made worse by the fact that there is nothing objectively wrong with the car. Trying to argue that it is better than the Audi or vice versa is futile. The auto mags were excited about the most acceleration per dollar of the M35/M45 and CR did its job of identifying the M's valium-value in offering relief from fear of visits to service departments. I was looking to be told, I realize in retrospect, by the voice of collective authority that one car had finally been found, which trumped all the rest and was guaranteed to fit all the best. Unfortunately, for me, it was like being allergic to wool and discovering that the new Armani suit was in fact pure wool. For many, it will be the best suit they ever bought. For me, it itched every time I drove it.

    Yes, past tense. My brother and his wife came to visit over Labor Day. Lo and behold, she had decided that in March 2007, she would start looking for a used M coming back off one of the first (February/March, 2005) two-year leases. She was in love with the car in my garage. She drove mine all weekend and fell more deeply in love. A local Audi dealer facilitated a buy-through process to avoid double tax paying. She has the M35 and I now have the A6. We are both as happy as each of us has ever been with a new car. Go figure.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Sorry, we don't do "illegal" here - check the Membership Agreement.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Congrats, Charlie, that's great! If you had told us that before, I missed it. Glad to hear you're both happy.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Good post, Pete.
  • I've driven and driven and driven quite of few of these LPS cars discussed here and I would argue some that aren't discussed here but could be.

    These days, I find so little differentiates them -- they are all quite good. I suspect style -- whatever that means to you -- does have a great deal to do with our choices and even the development of loyalties to a brand.

    Yet, most of us probably argue it is the performance, features, options, perhaps economy or value -- SOMETHING other than style that really, in the final analysis, had drawn us to THIS car, over the others.

    I'm gonna stick with the main reason to pick A over B or E over C is style.

    Of course, I know (and maybe you do too) that my choice (and yours, too, of course) really are more than about looks alone -- let the other folks buy on looks, just don't accuse me of that.

    Yea, that's it, my choice really is, objectively speaking, the best choice -- it is too bad YOU can't see that, for I alone, apparently (well maybe a few thousand other folks each year), know that my choice has that. . .ummm, er, it is on the tip of my tongue je ne sais quoi that your inferior steed will never have and that, frankly, most folks just don't get.

    Shhh -- thank goodness there are a few of us rational folks out here, buying up the truly good cars and leaving the dregs for the other poor slobs. Poor kids, they don't even know who they are, but WE do, don't we?

    Keep it under your hat, pretend you agree when someone says their brand new MSTSA635X530GSE45SRL is "clearly and objectively" the best car, just smile and nod knowingly. :blush:

    Quickly glance at them, and what ever you do, don't make eye contact. :shades:
  • I'm in the middle of reading a book that actually contributes to this discussion. Malcolm Gladwell's Blink talks about how an unconscious brain process makes certain kinds of decisions for us way before our rational, conscious mind analytically weighs and balances and arrives at a decision. Sometimes (like a pro quarterback finding the best receiver) it makes a good decision; sometimes (when a deep prejudice comes out), it makes a bad decision.

    Sounds to me that, like markcincinnati says, we make our car-buying decision quickly and non-rationally based on style and attractiveness and then spend an inordinate amount of time figuring out a rationale for it.

    At least that's the way the rest of you folks do it. I'm purely rational, of course. ;)
  • Oh yea, I'm absolutely rational, too.

    Almost forgot.

    And, Blink is a great book, FWIW.

    Another one I like is THRIPPPPPPPPPPP! :P

    Seriously, Blink is worthwhile, THRIPPPPPPPP! is just for fun! :surprise:
  • anthonypanthonyp Posts: 1,857
    I am so happy for you Charlie=====Tony
  • Pat, Tony:

    Thanks for the good feelings about this outcome.

  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Forest Lakes, AZPosts: 3,240
    Yeah, me too. You helped expand the definition of buyers remorse, writ large, but all's well that ends well.

    Your saga should give us all pause when we choose a new vehicle with which we expect to spend the next few/several years.
  • Style indeed is an important factor in choosing a car at this level. Let's also not forget prestige. Then there is the indescribable feeling that you get from the car. Have you ever actually looked forward to a traffic jam as it gives you more time in your car?

    And I'm sorry - it may in fact be the "best" car indeed but the M, and especially its rear end, needs a restyling. There is that style thing again.
  • After having received something like 10 nasty and irrelevant personal attacks, I want to congratulate you for being one of the few to actually reply on topic. :)

    No question prestige is a factor for most all LPS buyers. I admit that it matters to me as well, and I'd gladly pay more for prestige value alone. If there's any trade off on the M, IMO, that would be it. (Although it's not so strong a factor for me that I'd sacrifice my other desires.) I do note that the car gets a lot of respect and props wherever I go. (Far more than my last Lexus, and more than my CLK)

    As for style, there's not much to debate here. Personally I love the M's look, but I also love the look of the A-6, and the 5-series. Also, while I'm not too crazy about the E-series, I'd say the CLS beats them all style wise. The CLS-600 was the last car I was considering when I went to the M. That CLS is a great looking car.

  • Here is the rest of what they said in the newest C&D comparo:

    1. Infiniti M45 Sport
    Highs: Playful spirit, sports-car steering, excellent chassis, lots of room, best buy of the bunch.
    Lows: Cheesy aluma-look dashboard trim, lane-departure warning system.
    Verdict: Even without the price advantage, a top-notch, no-excuses player in the luxo-sports-sedan game.

    2. BMW 550i Sport
    Highs: Unerring dynamics, seductively smooth power, superb comfort seats.
    Lows: Exasperating iDrive, skimpy small-object stowage, clutch-your-heart price.
    Verdict: A flawless driving machine diminished by pricey options and an infernal device.

    3. Mercedes-Benz E550 Sport
    Highs: Megawatt muscle, understated good looks, seven-speed automatic.
    Lows: Flaccid handling responses, noisy HVAC system, seven-speed automatic manual mode.
    Verdict: A superb cross-country ride, but hold the decreasing radii.

    4. Lexus GS450h
    Highs: Uptown interior, user friendly secondary controls, delivers on performance-hybrid promise.
    Lows: Numb steering, endless cycling of CVT, asthmatic power-train sounds.
    Verdict: Engineering that's easy to appreciate in a car that's hard to love.
  • erickplerickpl Posts: 2,735
    I wonder if magazine editor will ever shut up about iDrive and MMI and similar gadgets? Perhaps when the oldies die, younger ones who are more used to MMI and iDrive and computers in general will change the tune...

    I have used both MMI and iDrive and the only problem I have with them is that one scrolls down by going clockwise, the other counterclockwise...

  • My style remarks almost completely forgot Prestige -- that is a good point.

    And, I wonder, too, if prestige is a big draw and you are NOT particularly impressed with the car's style, if you grow to like the looks of the car after acquisition?

    The BMW 5's to this day look like Pontiacs to me. Now, since that may mean I find them gorgeous, or I may find them not so gorgeous, I just wonder were I to have gone with the cat eyed 5 look, if I would have found its look would grow on me.

    I liked the A6 (my current car) from the side "instantly."

    I am OK with the rear and went from trout mouth to, "I like it" regarding the front end.

    I had originally deposited money on an M35X and I do like the rear end of that car to this day. I am not anti the front end, it is just it looks pretty much like the G35, so much so, I often need to do a double take.

    The Prestige buyer, I am assuming, would never buy either the A6 or the M -- rather they would limit themselves, ?, perhaps to the other two Germans.

    My father-in-law, of course, still thinks the Cadillac is "the world standard."

    I have no axe to grind with the STS, and in fact have found it to be very qualified to run with this pack, at least when equipped with the bits that make it handle to its potential.

    Who am I kidding, with the possible exception of the Lexus, I probably would be pleased and proud to have any of these LPS cars, they just keep getting closer and closer to each other. The Lexus, for whatever reason, can't seem to "get no respect" in terms of its "handling," in that it seems to be called cushy and numb, but neither term seems to be intended to suggest they are meant to be a compliment.

    Oh wait, how 'bout this: Lexus: Comfortably Numb, with Pink Floyd underneath.
  • Relating to the MMI and iDrive, are two of the things I really enjoy about the M:

    1) The great majority of every day controls can be accessed instantly and intuitively from the dashboard, with physical buttons arranged in a very logical layout, and with a very silky feel. (In contrast, the buttons on my CLK, and in the S500 I had, have a really unpleasant feel to them. Many every day items in most LPS's are deeply hidden in the menuing system) Some of you may not like the look of those buttons, and others may agree with me that the whole dash, with its buttons and curved wood (or textured aluminum), looks great.

    2) For the less frequently used settings, steering wheel controls allow you navigate and choose from all of the M's menus, while keeping your hands on the wheel. Where they belong, IMO.

  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Lexus, for whatever reason, can't seem to "get no respect" in terms of its "handling," in that it seems to be called cushy and numb, but neither terms seems to be intended to suggest they are meant to be a compliment.

    What's aggrivating about the way Lexus designs products is that every Lexus has to be "a Lexus" and to the company that seems to mean limited feel, too easy steering, and overly cushy suspensions that get upset when pushed hard. Thats fine in the ES and LS. That doesn't mean every Lexus has to be that way. The Altezza\IS300 proves that Toyota does know how to make a properly sporty car with great steering feel if they really want to. The IS350 was their chance to go toe-to-toe with the 3 series, but they backed down and played it Lexus safe.
  • "For the less frequently used settings, steering wheel controls allow you navigate and choose from all of the M's menus, while keeping your hands on the wheel. Where they belong, IMO."


    Your opinions don't seem humble at all. ;) I think that's what has allowed your comments to catalyze such energetic responses and discussions. It's an ingredient of the whole experience I assume many of us come looking for on these forums.
  • Your opinions don't seem humble at all. I think that's what has allowed your comments to catalyze such energetic responses and discussions. It's an ingredient of the whole experience I assume many of us come looking for on these forums.

    I humbly apologize for what seems to be a lack of humility. It's really not my intention to antagonize.

    Are you saying that humility is an ingredient people are looking for on these forums or that energetic discussions are that ingredient?

    BTW, I did not count you among those making what I referred to as nasty irrelevant attacks.

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