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Luxury Performance Sedans

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Comments

  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    That makes perfect sense. Thanks Capt. Phil!
  • commofficercommofficer Posts: 50
    Thanks for all the input. My wife says my car needs to be replaced and I thought this would be the perfect "classic" LPS. I didn't know that the mileage was that bad though. :(
    I will stay clear of the V8, thanks. I like the old straight 6. It seems like a relatively simple engine.

    Capt. Phil
  • cmybimmergocmybimmergo Posts: 265
    Guess I learned something today.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    "Which is faster..has more power..my friend and i are arguing about this. I have a Lexus LS400 and he has a Buick Regal with a supercharger. I think his has more power at first, then mine will pull away. We can't really race them though, we live in the city. I thought i would ask people who probably know what they're talking about, because we don't."

    I was curious about this, so I did the research. As pearl said the Buick will win, at least in a 0-60 test, but not by all that much. You have the advantage in engine power, 290 hp @ 6000 rpm and 300 ft-lbs @ 4000 rpm, vs. 240 hp @ 5200 rpm and 280 ft-lbs @ 3600 rpm for the Buick. Unfortunately, that difference is offset by 328lbs. of weight in the Lexus.

    He'll get to 60 about a half tick before you will (6.6 vs. 7.1). On the other hand, he drives a Buick regal thats currently worth about pocket change, and you drive an LS400, so I'd feel pretty good about that :) If you're that concerned about beating him, trade for a GS400, and you will.
  • maxhonda99maxhonda99 Posts: 1,289
    Lexusguy,

    How do you know which LS400 he has??? He could have a 1990-1994 or a 1995 to 1997 model. In which case the Regal supercharged would dust it in every which way possible.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    True, I did assume it was a '98+. Could you help us with this question lpc05? What year is your LS?
  • drtraveldrtravel Posts: 395
    Curious to see how the Luxury Sports Sedans did last month.

    Thank you
  • jrock65jrock65 Posts: 1,371
    April 2005 Sales

    5 = 4,571
    E = 3,731
    STS = 3,541
    GS = 3,198
    M = 2,288
    RL = 1,304

    March 2005 Sales

    5 = 3,949
    E = 3,608
    GS = 3,209
    STS = 2,954
    M = 2,253
    A6 = 1,681
    RL = 1,376
  • cheerioboy26cheerioboy26 Posts: 412
    edit: jrock posted as I was typing :D
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,049
    I presume Audi has not released figures yet?

    I also presume STS incentives are doing the trick?
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    Mark,

    Are there incentives on the STS? All I've seen is 5.9% financing.
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    If someone tried to predict real world sales from comments on this board, they would fail miserably. Big surprises, considering consensus opinion here:

    5, E, and STS are selling surprisingly well. Why is 5 selling so well??

    (I also think Lincoln LS sales are surprisingly high--jrock, do you have this?).

    More surprises: STS and GS selling better than M.

    No surprise: RL coming in last. Acura, however, must be shocked, shocked, especially after C&D included it in the 10 Best Cars in the World shortly after its introduction (but before the M and GS debuted).
  • docnukemdocnukem Posts: 485
    Is anyone really that surprised? If you ask around at most places of work, I would bet that only a small minority subscribe to any auto mag. I would bet that even fewer would know about web sites like Edmunds or the car connec...something.com.

    The average buyer has heard about Mercedes and Cadillacs all their life. During the 80's, BMW established such an image of being upwardly mobile that they are just as easily recognizable. I would bet that most people who buy a Jag like the look and the name, but don't care too much about performance (unless they shop for the R versions)--my wife is one; she loves the look of the S and I would have felt guilty not getting one if the rear seat had had more room.

    With Lexus being (relatively) much newer and Infiniti being just as new but out of the spotlight in recent years (until the G35, then the FX, and now the M). These are just below many people's radar.
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,049
    Here in River City the newspapers are replete with $7,000 OFF of the new STS.

    Maybe that is a local incentive.
  • drtraveldrtravel Posts: 395
    When I was in the Mercedes waiting room (fixing yet another problem with the car) I would chat with other customers (who had the same quality issues) and many wouldn't even consider looking at a Japanese car. Probably the same with BMW. Fact is that a BMW or MB owner will likely replace their car with another BMW or MB. Image is everything here.

    The M will do fine over time - it will probably increase sales just like the G which started out slowly but has increased in sales every year since. In order for Infiniti to compete with Lexus they need a winning Q45. The LS has been such a fine (and good selling) automobile - it carries the entire Lexus fleet. So even though many believe the G is superior to the ES and the M is superior to the GS - no one believes the Q is superior to the LS. Infiniti needs to win the flagship car competition and enjoy the spillover effect on their other models. Plus they need a catchy slogan. The "relentless pursuit of perfection" or the "ultimate driving machine" are ingrained in many minds here.

    The GS has a history of starting out strong and then fading away. There was such a pent up demand for the car (it was due last year) that sales will be strong for awhile. There was NO demand for the M so I'm pretty sure Infiniti is happy with their sales so far. Will be interesting to see how these sales figures change over the next year or two.
  • xkssxkss Posts: 722
    Incentives are not advertised on Cadillac's website for the STS.
  • cstilescstiles Posts: 465
    Although obviously Honda would prefer to see RL sales higher, I'm not sure if they are shocked with their results so far. Compared to the previous model, RL sales are actually up nearly 200%. The fact that the previous RL was such a dog, and basically appealed to a very different customer base (retired, almost dead, or non-enthusiast), it will take a couple of years to regain their position alongside the elite.

    I think it's also more relevant to compare RL sales to the 6-cylinder versions of the M, GS, STS, and 5. That would still likely put the RL in last place (since something like 75% of luxury cars are sold with a 6-cylinder), but this car really doesn't compete with 8 cylinder models.

    Regardless, RL sales will likely end the model year somewhere between 15,000 and 16,000 sales, which I believe will be below their stated target of 20,000.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Oh I'm sure Infiniti is quite pleased. The new M sells more a month than the old M was doing in a year. If they can work the same magic with the FM platform into a new Q, and get the styling right, it will be like the spiritual successor to the original Q45, before Nissan started back pedaling and trying to compete with the LS400.

    While a majority of MB and BMW customers would probably thumb their noses at Japan, you can only punish your customers so much before they start leaving. I've known more than a few people who were stranded in Benz and BMW and traded them for reliable Acura and Lexus.

    Keep in mind that the G and ES are not really competitiors. The G competes with the IS300. Infiniti tried mostly in vain to compete with the ES with the '96 I30. Unfortunately they never realized that the ES is not a Camry with a fancy coat of paint, and thats always what the I was, which is what killed it. It most likely would've died anyway. The I30 was a product made during Infiniti's "lost years" where the company literally had no focus and couldnt decide what kind of cars to make, so they just put out barely modified Maximas and Pathfinders.

    Lexus is certainly well aware of the GS's tradition of being a flash in the pan. Thats why this time they are planning continual upgrades during several model years rather than leaving it alone for 8 years like last time.
  • cstilescstiles Posts: 465
    Of the Asian imports, Infiniti is clearly the most pleasant surprise so far. Sales of the M are up big time over anything they previously sold in that segment, and combined with the ongoing success of the G, Nissan is definitely on a roll. Shows what you can do when you deliver the right goods, performance, and styling at a competitive price point.

    The M appears to be hitting the right niches, and most importantly, crossing over different segments. They are obviously appealing to younger customers who rate power and performance near the top, while also conquering older, more conservative customers with the non-sport versions of the M35 and M45. And delivering an AWD model that gives up little in terms of performance is allowing them to cover all the bases.

    The current issue of Motor Trend shows a rendering of the upcoming Infiniti CX35, which will go head-to-head with the RDX, Cadillac BRX, and Benz MLK in MY2008. Infiniti and Nissan are clearly on a roll.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    It looks like the luxury "cute-ute" market is exploding, then huh?
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