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Toyota Prius v. ??? (fill in the comparison)

SylviaSylvia Posts: 1,636
edited March 21 in Toyota
The Prius is being compared to non-hybrid vehicles - the Elantra, Corolla and more. Here's the place to discussion the Prius V. other vehicles.
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Comments

  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,758
    The Prius you get for $26k (double $12-14k) is far beyond "basic transportation" IMO. If you want basic transportation, you can go spend $10k on a Rio, Accent, Aveo etc.

    Also you won't find a new Corolla for $12k. You might find a basic one for $14k, but for that you won't get ABS/traction, power everything, remote locking, auto climate control, automatic transmission or many of the other nice standard features of the Prius. But if a strippo Corolla meets your needs, save the bucks and buy one.
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,979
    I can accept that folks buy a Prius for "other reasons", i.e., first amendment rights, status, image, so called environmental reasons, techno geek is cool! syndrome, etc etc! I think if you do not consider that the hybrid is specifically designed for "basic" transportation, i.e. COMMUTING, then you are bypassing the real reason for its utility and design!!??? If not, then you will have to accept that some folks positively have to commute in an suv, MB, BMW. :) I think you get the drift here.

    Actually, I have taken your advice! That is why I bought a TDI diesel over a 2003 Prius! Too bad the Toyota Corolla doesn't come in the USA with a diesel! Killer combo! But then I can be forced to commute in my Toyota Landcruiser! :)
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,056
    Has Toyota ever built a diesel engine? I know the Honda Accord Diesel that is now available in the EU is their first.
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > Also you won't find a new Corolla for $12k

    I saw one at the dealer today for $19,595.

    It was the Corolla SRX without an automatic transmission.

    JOHN
  • highenderhighender Posts: 1,362
    yeah for both the diesels and hybrids...

    and the SUVs for whatever purpose you need or want.

    :)
  • midnightcowboymidnightcowboy Posts: 1,978
    >> Also you won't find a new Corolla for $12k

    >I saw one at the dealer today for $19,595.

    >It was the Corolla SRX without an automatic transmission.

    >JOHN

    You can find new basic model 2004 and 2005 Corollas for around 12-13K, a few 2004 CEs are less than $12K

    The Corolla SRX that you mention is incorrect. You actually meant a 2005 Corolla XRS which is the performance version with the 170 horsepower engine, the same as in the Matrix XRS and the Celica GTS. It is for driving enthusiasts and comes only in a 6-speed manual, the same as the Matrix XRS. However, in the Celica version you can get and automatic.

    YMMV,

    MidCow
  • midnightcowboymidnightcowboy Posts: 1,978
    >Also you won't find a new Corolla for $12k.
    >You might find a basic one for $14k

    WRONG!
    Everyday in the Houston Chronicle:

    You can find new basic model 2004 and 2005 Corollas for around 12-13K, a few 2004 CEs are less than $12K

    The basic model does not have ABS, but is does include:

    DRL (daytime running Lights) - Prius doesn't have this!
    32/40 mpg (manual transmission 0-60 mpg in 8.5 seconds)
    external temperature display
    tachometer -Prius doesn't have this
    power mirrors
    tilt-adjustable steering wheel
    air conditioning

    Cruise control, ABS brakes, sunroof and power remote locks are options.

    The Corolla makes a very nice economy car with good acceleration and good miles per gallon at a price less than half the Prius.

    YMMV,

    MidCow
  • john1701ajohn1701a Posts: 1,897
    > You can find new basic model

    You can order a basic model (which is rather well loaded) of Prius too.

    So why are some people insisting that comparing the lowest cost Corolla to a every-tech-item-possible Prius is appropriate? They are opposite extremes.

    JOHN
  • midnightcowboymidnightcowboy Posts: 1,978
    >> Also you won't find a new Corolla for $12k

    >I saw one at the dealer today for $19,595.

    >It was the Corolla SRX without an automatic transmission.

    >JOHN

    You can find new basic model 2004 and 2005 Corollas for around 12-13K, a few 2004 CEs are less than $12K

    The Corolla SRX that you mention is incorrect. You actually meant a 2005 Corolla XRS which is the performance version with the 170 horsepower engine, the same as in the Matrix XRS and the Celica GTS. It is for driving enthusiasts and comes only in a 6-speed manual, the same as the Matrix XRS. However, in the Celica version you can get and automatic.

    YMMV,

    MidCow
  • midnightcowboymidnightcowboy Posts: 1,978
    Okay lowest Corolla $11,800 (actual cost you can buy for after $1,000 rebate)

    To lowest Prius $20,810

    The Corolla is $9,010 less.

    Anyway you slice it if you are looking for a reliable (i.e. Toyota) car and you are concerned about miles per gallon and Total Cost of Ownership, then the only obvious answer is the Corolla. $9,000 buys a whole lot of gas!

    Both are economy cars: the Prius is on steriods with tech options and is classified as a midsize only barely and only because of its hatch back design.

    And the Prius only comes with an automatic. If you want or need a manual transmission, you can get one in the Corolla!

    YMMV,

    MidCow
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,979
    "$9,000 buys a whole lot of gas!" I would agree with that!

    @ 1.59 for #2 diesel and 1.95 unleaded gas:

    this converts to 4,615 gals and at 38 mpg that is 175,384 miles! :)
  • djasonwdjasonw Posts: 624
    Midcow... maybe that's the car you should get! You'd save a ton of money and then you can wear the following T-Shirt.

    MY WIFE BOUGHT ME
    THIS BORING BUT
    ECONOMICAL CAR

    Oh.. one more thing.. why would you want a TACH in a Prius with a CVT? It serves NO purpose at all. I can't remember the last time I looked at a TACH in a car with automatic.
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 14,979
    To keep from being bored? :)
  • midnightcowboymidnightcowboy Posts: 1,978
    >Oh.. one more thing.. why would you want
    >a TACH in a Prius with a CVT? It serves
    >NO purpose at all. I can't remember the
    >last time I looked at a TACH in a car with automatic.

    How much real information does the cartoon on the Prius multi-display console provide when it shows the schematic of the ICE, MG1, MG2, Battery and wheels, when it shows sources and users of power.

    Are you advocating that tachometers be eliminated from all automatics. What about tiptronic shifting? Oh Yeah! I forgot, they won't let you exceed red-line; electronic protection.

    Where can I get the T-Shirt ?

    YMMV,

    MidCow

    P.S.- That is probably why the boss hasn't given me approval to buy a car
  • midnightcowboymidnightcowboy Posts: 1,978
    Referring to a Corolla compared to the Prius
    >MY WIFE BOUGHT ME
    >THIS BORING BUT
    >ECONOMICAL CAR

    What makes the Prius not-boring?

    It isn't accleration
    It isn't handling
    It isn't the throaty exhaust
    It isn't the smell of leather on the seats and the sun shining through the sun roof.
    It isn't the medoicre JBL stereo

    Please don't tell me it is the multi-display console screen.

    So if the Corolla is boring what makes the Prius non-boring ( or you might go as far as to say exciting)????

    YMMV,
    MidCow
  • bamacarbamacar Posts: 749
    Must be the way it gets their heart racing and blood pressure up when writing the check for that big monthly payment. :-)
  • djasonwdjasonw Posts: 624
    What check? I paid cash. Can't deal with payments.
  • djasonwdjasonw Posts: 624
    Dunno. I usually invoke the command SCREEN OFF. Then a few minutes into my trip I switch to either SAT1, SAT2 or SAT3 and listen to comedy or dance or 80's sometimes Franks Place if I am in the mood. Yes the Prius is a nice place to spend time commuting. So much to do!! Coastal Dave is working on a hack to enable the screen to play DVDs for the passenger. Will get that when its available. Back to the drive... 10 minutes into the drive I will have the NAV screen on so that I can take an instantaneous detour if the need arises. 15 minutes into the ride my phone is ringing and the SAT XM goes silent. I press a button and voilia, its my friend asking me what's on for the weekend. I end the call, and change the SAT to comedy ( I need it by now). About 30 minutes later I am coasting on electric only (SO COOOOOL) and switching to the cartoon channel (AKA engine schematic) so that I can see how well I did on the trip. Quite a nice SMOOOOTH ride with the CVT not jolting you every moment. Yes.. the Prius is one nice ride. Try and replicate that in a Corolla. DUH????
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,758
    Now I know where to go to buy a Corolla (if I wanted to buy one): Houston! New CEs start at $14k here in the Twin Cities.

    I agree the Prius is an "economy" car if you look only at fuel economy and TCO. But in other aspects it is far above economy cars: features, interior quality, ride quality, interior room, and NVH for example.
  • bamacarbamacar Posts: 749
    Try replicating the $10-15,000 in the Toyota Corolla owners' hands since you paid cash. Double Duh????
  • prius4meusprius4meus Posts: 22
    ""$9,000 buys a whole lot of gas!" I would agree with that!

    @ 1.59 for #2 diesel and 1.95 unleaded gas:

    this converts to 4,615 gals and at 38 mpg that is 175,384 miles! :)"

    Do all those interested in diesel live in the US? If so, is there some secret market for reduced sulfur diesel about which I am unaware? My understanding is that this won't be available until at least 2006 (and the way thing work in this arena, I wouldn't bet the farm on that one). If so, in figuring the "cost" of fuel, diesel drivers should factor in the tremendously detrimental health effects yielded by the emmisions from their tailpipes.
  • djasonwdjasonw Posts: 624
    For people that don't care about ride quality and other virtues, the differences may not be a determining factor. If you're frugal, go with the Corolla. If you like to avoid ubiquity and boredom stay with the Prius. I've driven a Camry, Echo, Corolla and Prius. The ride quality of the Prius is VERY close to that of a Camry (smooth and quiet).

    Short story... had a Mercedes E320 loaner 2 months ago while my friend's car was being serviced (he was away on business). I had to go to work and had a choice of a brand new E320 (actually it was an '03) or my '04 Prius. Needless to say, I chose the Prius. No, it's not a Mercedes but own one and you'll understand.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,056
    Seriously, I have the best break even vehicle to compare to the Prius. The Hyundai Elantra. It is slightly larger (12 cf more luggage space). Gets decent gas mileage, has the same 45 state emission rating of 9 and completely loaded with all options has a TMV of $15,857. Now that means if, no, BIG IF, you can get a stripped Prius for $25,000 (someone just paid $27k for a package 3 on this forum). For $9,143 less you can have a vehicle with as good emissions, I am assuming the ride and comfort to be the same for all these miniature cars. With that $9K savings you can buy enough gas to drive around the world 6 and 1/2 times. I call that a bargain.
  • djasonwdjasonw Posts: 624
    Problem is you can NEVER find an Elantra with anti lock brakes. I actually had an Elantra (1999) for a few months as a commuter car. Actually a nice vehicle but the mileage was fair (high 20's). My new criteria for any new car is to have stability control. The Elantra has it's place, just not in MY driveway. Better yet, why not suggest the Accent or the Kia Spectra. Much cheaper than a TDI too!!!! LOL
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,056
    I am sure there are many choices. That one had the good emission rating. It is a hatchback and about the same size as the Prius. there are evidently thousands of prospective Prius customers that may not want to wait for months or pay a big premium. Me I would not wait in line to see the Pope or the President, let alone some over hyped vehicle.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,758
    You make a good point that if a car like the Elantra GT 5-door can meet someone's needs, they will save mucho bucks compared to buying a Prius. But you don't get a Prius for the price of an Elantra. With a Prius you get more rear-seat leg room (could be important for some people), about double the in-town fuel economy (compared to automatic Elantra), AT-PZEV emissions vs. ULEV (in most states anyway). The features are mixed; the Elantra GT has some standard features and factory options that the Prius does not (power moonroof, leather, seat height adjuster, MP3 player, adjustable lumbar support, choice of stick or automatic) and the Prius has many features and options the Elantra does not offer. Also, IMO the Prius offers a notch higher level of quality than the Elantra (as it should for a $20k+ car). One thing on the cargo room, though--I think they're roughly equivalent. I really don't think the Elantra GT 5-door has 12 cubic feet more luggage space than the Prius. But I am too tired to check the specs right now.
  • djasonwdjasonw Posts: 624
    It's overhyped because it's a great car. Get used to it.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,056
    The Prius is the hands down mileage winner over the Elantra by more than 30%. I was a bit surprised on the difference in luggage space. Maybe the back seat suffered on the Elantra. My whole point was that I added everything to the Elantra on the Edmund's pricing and with the rebate the car sells for under $16k. You don't get the latest in technology. You get as much comfort as that class of car has to offer. And at today's premium (caused by media hype) the Prius is not a good buy. That is not saying the Prius is not a nifty car with the latest technology. It is just not a wise choice if you are economy minded. If you have to be the first on your block to get one you are going to pay a $9,000 premium to get it. That is a lot of gas, food and cloths for someone that is worried about economy.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,758
    I think you need to check your facts. The Prius' advantage in mpg over the Elantra in city driving is way more than 30%. Also, the Prius actually has more luggage space than the Elantra, according to manufacturer's specs--12.9 cubic feet for the Elantra 5-door and 16.1 cubic feet for the Prius. I think you may be comparing the maximum cargo capacity of the Elantra, with the rear seat folded, to the Prius' luggage space (rear seat up).

    If you are trying to make the point that some cars cost a lot less than the Prius, that is pretty obvious. If someone is really worried about lowest cash outlay, they can buy something like a slightly used Elantra for $7-10k. With the average price of new cars these days over $27,000 (more than what a loaded Prius costs), it's clear that lowest possible cash outlay is not the main criterion for many car buyers.

    Another way to look at it is total cost of ownership. It's interesting I think that Edmunds.com estimates the TCO for the Prius ($.38 per mile) is actually less than that of an Elantra GT ($.39 per mile). Purchase price is just one factor in "economy."
  • djasonwdjasonw Posts: 624
    The Elantra I owned barely got 28 average on highway and city driving. I tried very hard to find one with ABS. No can do. People who buy this class are NOT interested in safety features (at least the majority). Stability control? LOL.... Don't even think about it. With all these reports about the Prius performing exceptionally well in crash tests, I am very happy I made the decision to buy mine. Dollars to me do not matter at all. It's a Prius thing. You wouldn't understand. I feel I paid quite fairly (below list I might add) for my '04 Prius. I'd do it again in a heartbeat.

    Someone mentioned this class being miniature. LOL.. The Mini is miniature. The Prius is considered mid size. SUVs are super sized and pure excess and WASTE.
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