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Insurance and NJ No-Point Ticket option

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  • dbl3dbl3 Posts: 7
    http://www.trafficticketsecrets.com/plea-bargain.html

    Thank you for your response. On this site, they have a couple types of plea bargains, if I approach the prosecutor and say I would like to have one of my two tickets, the careless driving one, reduced to a fine without points, a moving violation to a nonmoving violation, because I am generally a good driver.

    I guess that is the "reduced" type of plea bargain on the site then?
    So would I be considered guilty or nonguilty when I ask the prosecutor this? I already told the cop I was guilty.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,317
    I think you are getting too caught up in the logistics.

    You'll see when you go, it is not very involved. Traffic court is nothing but a business. They want you in and out as quick as possible while getting the most money out of you.

    So, you get there, wait, they take roll call and want you to state "guilty or not guilty." When they call your name, you state not guilty. They finish roll call, then say, "OK. Everyone who pled not guilty can go out into the hallway."

    You go and wait in line to talk to the prosecutor. When it is your turn, you go in. The one time I did this, he didn't even look up from his desk. He didn't ask me any questions. He said, "Ok. Let's see..... mmm-hmmm.... this is what I'm going to do. I'll reassign this violation to to a nonmoving violation for this dollar amount. Bye."

    I suppose, maybe, at that point, you could say, "um, but could you...?" But, honestly, he'll probably give you exactly what you are looking for right off the bat without you having to say a word. They love nothing more than to change violations to nonmoving violations with MUCH larger fines. Like I said, it is a business. They are there to make money, Period.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • dbl3dbl3 Posts: 7
    Oh thank you thank you thank you. Between you and my boyfriend - I finally get it! The light went on. Hooray! Hooray! I got caught up on why you would say you are not guility at first when you end up saying you are guilty and getting a higher fine. You say that just to talk to the prosecutor and go into the hall. I get it. Then I ask him to have both tickets or one at least changed to nonmoving violation with a higher fine although you are guilty. I was confused about the non guilty but guilty thing. Thank you so much. I'm playing word and business money games I see lol.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,317
    you are welcome

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • dbl3dbl3 Posts: 7
    edited May 2010
    Thank you also for your posts! I finally get it. It truly didn't make sense to me before. Thank you for writing about my defense "nonmoving violation too". I looked it up and it was valid as something people do.

    I went to lawyers.com and asked and also tried to ask about court procedures as I thought that was something I didn't understand as maybe that was tripping me up (and it was, as "the not guilty but guilty thing" like I said before), but I got nothing but snotty vague responses! Nothing about court prodecure or my defense! Between the two of you on this site and my bf and the other things I was able to look up, I finally got it. http://community.lawyers.com/forums/t/99711.aspx
  • tdl2tdl2 Posts: 2
    I hope I could find this discussion earlier. Back in 2008, I ran into the car-rail on the ramp to turnpike without any other car involvement. The police came and filed a report with no ticket or warning. In 2009 I got a ticket for not having my car inspected (prior inspection just expired the prior month and I forgot to do it on time). Then in late 2009, I got a speeding ticket for driving 52mph on 35mph zone with 4 points and $130 fine. I paid the fine without considering going to the court to plea non-guilty. Then I had an online driving class in order to reduce it to 2 pts.
    Now my 2010 NJM renewal form came and I need to write my speeding ticket on the form where it's asking for any moving violations within 3 yrs. Would they find out anyway if I don't write anything? I don't want to be kicked out to NJRe and have premium go up way too high. Their current year flyer comes with the renewal package says that they will waive a violation of 2pt or less. For my case, would they consider it to be 4pts or 2pts (since I had the driving class)? Would they also find out the outdated inspection ticket and police report in 2008?
    Thanks for any answers.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,317
    The no inspection is not a moving violation, so they don't care about that.

    What you did not mention was whether or not you filed an insurance claim for the guardrail incident. If NJM had to pay out to fix your car for that incident AND you have the 4-point ticket (yes, it is still 4 points as far as they are concerned), then I am afraid you may be in trouble here.

    And, no, not writing it down won't help at all. I'm not even sure why they ask you to write it down, as they will just pull your report anyway.

    If you did not file a claim on the guard rail incident, then you only have the 4-point ticket. I don't believe they will boot you for that alone.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • tdl2tdl2 Posts: 2
    gbrozen, thanks a lot for your thoughts. I didn't have collision coverage at the time of the guardrail incident, so I just fixed the car by myself, no claim filed. I will update when I hear back from them how my renewal rate will be. Thanks again.
  • precede240precede240 Posts: 2
    Hi everyone,

    I recently started driving on the highway (rt. 1 is basically a highway to me lol) in order to get to my internship everyday. Of course my inexperienced self would go over the speed limit to pass the car next to me in order to get to an exit near a construction zone, and get a 60 at 40 speeding ticket.
    This is my second offense. My last offense was also a 15mph over the limit at a suburban street. I went to court and paid off all my points (around $400, but I figured it was better than increasing the insurance). I swore that I'd never get a ticket again and have been following speed limits very well. It's too bad I suck at highways, but I've learned my lesson and definitely will be more careful next time.

    My questions are as follows:
    1) I'm a bit confused about the plea bargain. As I understand, I call in and plead not guilty, get a court date, beg the prosecutor to reduce my ticket and pay off the points if I can. Is that correct? Can I still do this for a second offense?
    2) If what I understood in #1 is right, by calling in not guilty, is that just calling the office and telling them I want to go to the date written on the ticket?
    3) If the prosecutor does not reduce my ticket, can I still pay off everything like last time?
    4) Are my options looking grim? Should I just call a lawyer?

    Thanks in advance!
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,317
    1. I don't know what the rules are for this. Probably depends on how long its been, etc. Can't hurt to try.
    2. yes
    3. Not sure what you mean here. If he doesn't reduce it, you owe the same fine printed on the ticket PLUS court costs. Chances are, since you showed up and pled not guilty, he'll do SOMETHING to give you a break. Even if it is giving you something with 2 points instead of 4.
    4. I wouldn't pay for a lawyer since you have 0 points now. If you already had points and were looking at more points, then yes. But try to avoid having that happen!

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • Sorry for replying so late, but thank you for all your advice! Hopefully it goes well (and it never happens again lol)
  • I was in Newark leaving UMDNJ and I was pulled over and the officer said I was doing 44 in a 25, never knew the speed limit was 25... Regardless, I got the letter that the charge was $105.00, and I was ok, I can do that, but I don't want points. I scheduled a court date for next Wednesday. I have a New York drivers license, should I just pay the $105.00 and be done with it, but not sure if I will get the points and that is my concern. I don't know how much the charge will be if I plead not guilty with no points.. Can anyone give me any answers?????????
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,317
    I can't tell you if the points will transfer, as that is up to your state.

    To go to court and get the no points I think will cost you over $300.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • valent2valent2 Posts: 3
    I have a question concerning my recent careless driving ticket in NJ. This involved another car but just scratches on both cars. The other driver doesn't want to file a claim either since he is under a high insurance bracket. I am due to appear in court to plead not guilty in about a week (the police officer determined I am at fault), in hopes that I can get a plea bargain for no points or a lesser offense. Which lesser offense is forgivable by insurance companies?

    My main concern here is that I may be getting 2 points for this offense. My DMV record is clean, however, just 5 years and 5 months ago I was involved in a single car accident which resulted in me filing a claim to repair my car. I also received a ticket for that, but I paid for the no-point ticket. However, I received 5 points on my insurance record. For whatever reason, it is still listed in the insurance abstract that was included in my most recent renewal form. It has passed the 3-5 year mark which I believe at which point most insurance companies no longer consider in calculating your current rates. Is it still supposed to show up in the abstract then?

    I am not in the financial position to pay for a second no-point ticket this time around ($500 or more). If I absolutely have to in order to avoid points on my DMV record and increased insurance rates, I will do it. What are my other options?

    My insurance is with the Fireman's Fund, but I have called several times to find out if a 2 point moving violation is forgivable, as some insurance companies will do, but I keep getting the answer that it is on a case by case basis. Does anyone know? I am no longer in the high risk insured category as I am 29.

    I am willing to take a defensive driving course to knock down the 2 points, but I am not sure what will happen given my prior accident. I have been looking for answers, but have not found anything, so if anyone has an answer, I will appreciate your time in answering me!
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,317
    I can't tell you anything about that insurance company, and that's the info you really need here. Did you try asking your ins company why the accident from over 5 years ago is still there?

    What I want to say, however, is that the defensive driving course takes point off your license, but NOT your insurance. Will they give you a discount for taking the course? maybe. Again, that's a question for them. But that's a separate issue from insurance points.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • whitallwhitall Posts: 187
    Whatever happened? DId you go to court? My kid got a speeding ticket for 14 over, even though he was doing 83. The cop wrote the numbers 83 and 2 and circled them on the ticket, but checked the box for 5-14 over and speeding. He told my son it's no points, but that makes no sense. I wonder what that 83 means to the prosecutor? Is it code so he knows it was really 83 (more than 15 over) and not to plead it lower. The ticket for 83 would be 4 points, so I think the 2 represents a 2 point ticket.

    It's his first moving ticket. He has provisional license even though he'd 19. He was lazy and never got it officially changed. The rule now is that prov license holder can't plead, but he'll have it changed over by court date, so he can answer that he doesn't have provisional when he is asked (unless they ask what he had on day of violation) He can also play dumb and say that he's 19. He can act like he didn't know he had to go to DMV to change it.

    Mainly question is about the 83 in a circle and his chances of pleading down to no points. Wonder if he can be guilty on the speeding but pay off the points....not clear on how it works.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,317
    edited November 2010
    Sounds like you have it figured out. He cut your son a break by marking 14 over, which is indeed 2 points. For driving 83, with a provisional license, he should consider himself lucky to have just a 2-point ticket. Pay it, live with it, learn from it.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • k_anilk_anil Posts: 2
    My wife got into an accident in Oldbridge NJ, someone hit her car front bumper when she is merging from another road which has an yield sign. The police officer gave her the ticket with careless driving and appearence in the court. No one was injured, the car was damaged which was repaired, other car also got little damage and my insurance company is paying for them as far as I know.
    We went to court today and pleaded not guilty thinking to reduce the points, ($81 fine, $250 to reduce two points) the prosecutor told that they need another party to be heard before finalizing. Did we did a mistake of pleading not guilty, what are my options going next time to court? can we plede guilty next time when other party comes to court? what will happen next, please help.
  • I was pulled over last weekend (Saturday) at 7:30 AM by a cop in an unmarked car and was given 3 tickets. One was for failure to stop and two for failure to signal at a turn.

    What happened was that I got out of the holland tunnel from NYC and crossed over to a one way street. I took a left turn at another one way street, at which I probably didn't signal the turn and most likely did a california rollover through the stop sign. I proceeded to the next junction which was a T-junction onto a main street with a stop sign for me, and turned without signalling. (This junction is a no left turn during business hours). I was pulled over by the cop soon after and given the three tickets. This was early in the morning, there was no traffic in the streets or any pedestrians.

    This is in Jersey City,NJ and i looked up, this all adds up to 6 points, which'll add an additional surcharge by the DMV and I think jack up my insurance rate.

    I was wondering what would be the best way to minimize the impact (fine/points/insurance).

    Thanks,
    Max
  • joepal3joepal3 Posts: 1
    Hello,

    I actually am in the same situation in the town of East Brunswick. I'm curious what happened with your case. Did the other party have to be there when you went back to court? Did you plead not guilty? I'm not sure what to do and my court date is this Monday. Any advice would be appreciated.

    Regards,
    Joe
  • k_anilk_anil Posts: 2
    No, the third party is not required to be attended.

    We admit no fault, the procecutor said that he will take two points and we pay more fine, we agreed and the case is closed.
  • Did you win this case? I have a similar issue like yours. Few weeks ago I got a ticket for careless driving. I was making a right turn to a parking lot and accidently drove into the grass curve and hit the stop side. My car was stopped working. I called the police since I damaged the public property. The police came after he recorded everything and gave me a ticket for careless driving.

    I went to court plead not guilty. The prosecuter has offered if I plead guilty the points would remove and pay $89. Now I have to go to a trial. Should I accept the offer or go to a trial? Can someone help me?
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 10,876
    Will the charge also be reduced to something other than "careless driving"?

    In any case, that sounds like an easy call - you are probably guilty (most of us are in these cases), and if you can get out of it for $89 and no points (and no trial... I mean, what would your defense be?), that seems the easiest option to just get it over with with minimal pain.

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  • fezofezo Posts: 9,346
    $89 and no points? Take that deal pronto.
  • wnfe7twnfe7t Posts: 4
    edited December 2011
    For background, I'm 28yr old female, had my license for 11 years and not a single ticket for nearly 10 years, so totally clean record. I have been driving to work - northern NJ to midtown Manhattan - for the last 5+ years without incident, which I think is fairly remarkable of itself. My insurance costs are low considering and I get the safe driver discount etc.

    I had the misfortune of working yesterday (12/26), and was basically the only person in the office. I was driving into the Lincoln Tunnel in the morning as I always do, but unlike every other morning there were very few cars on the road at all. After passing through the ezpass lane, I drove to the right tube and the police car blocking the left tube veered out and almost hit my car, so I swerved to the right to avoid him. He took out his megaphone just before I was about to drive into the tunnel, called me to stop and back up. He stopped me, asked for license and registration.

    I asked him why he was stopping me as I hadn't a clue what would warrant this (which was clearly a mistake in hindsight). He told me I was speeding through the ez pass and left with my information. When the officer returned, I saw that the ticket was written up for speeding 25mph in a 5mph zone! I was under the impression if a person goes too fast through ez pass, they send warning and collect the money. I've never gotten a letter like this before and ez pass gets plently of money from me.

    The ticket doesn't say points on it, so after looking it over, I went over to the cop and asked him how much $ and how many points this is. He said he didn't know, I'd have to call the Municipal Building but they were closed for the day. Then I asked him if he even knows its 5mph, I was under the impression it was 15mph through ez pass as I do the drive every day. Needless to say, it wasn't a polite exchange, and he left with some snide comment like, "It's not Christmas today!"

    I looked this morning, and it actually does say its 5mph thru the ez pass in a small sign by the toll, and I looked up the fines. 20mph over the limit would give me 4 points and $200 fine, when 19mph is same points but $105 fine. Its hard to fathom such a punishment for driving a max of 25mph in the 1st place! I don't think I was even driving as high as 25mph, but the ticket has speed measurement device checked.

    I also noticed that the officer wrote my old address on the ticket, rather than my new one on the back of my license, and I'm not sure if this makes any difference.

    From the other posts on this forum, it seems that if I go to court and plead not guilty, it should be simple to knock this down to 2 points with hefty fines. I also spoke to a lawyer in Weehawken who said of all his years working in the area, no one has called him about being stopped for speeding through ez pass before. He was very confident he could knock off all the points, but it would cost big fines, and his fee is $350. I tried to see if there was any way he could charge me significantly less if he only gets down to 2 points instead of zero, but he didn't go for that.

    I'm in the process of applying for life insurance and don't want a ding to my record. I also don't want any points for an auto insurance hike.

    What's the best way to proceed with this?
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,317
    there is no right answer here, in my opinion. Its all how you feel you should proceed. Personally, I'd go to court without a lawyer in this case.

    PS, I'm not sure why this would affect life insurance. (??)

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • wnfe7twnfe7t Posts: 4
    edited December 2011
    I'm not sure exactly myself, but when I met with the life insurance broker it was one of the few questions he asked - driving record - and he indicated it would get us preferred, cheaper coverage.

    I actually spoke to EZ Pass yesterday to ask them if I'd ever had any speeding warnings going through the tolls, and they said I didn't have any. When I asked to get that in writing, all of the folks I spoke with refused to put it in writing. Even better, when I asked how fast they clocked me going thru the toll on 12/26, they said 22 mph when the officer wrote down 25 mph. It doesn't look like I can get this documented either but I have a manager looking into it who is supposed to call me back. Its just frustrating that I have the information that could help in court, but no way to prove it.

    Have you heard of anyone before getting pulled over for speeding thru the toll lane?
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,317
    No I haven't. I think the officer was bored and cranky.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • fezofezo Posts: 9,346
    I agree. Sounds like officer attitude. He was probably pissed off that he got duty the day after Christmas and took it out on you.

    I also have never heard of anyone getting a ticket for speeding through an EZPass lane. I know where you got the 15mph from - that's the Parkway and Turnpike EZPass. Almost anywhere else they pot it at 5.

    There's not one correct way to do this. I think I'd try to go it alone and when court comes around approach the prosecutor yourself and say you want to plead guilty to a non-moving violation. There are a bunch of them. Any one will do. Obstructing traffic, failure to observe sign...... They may well buy that and let it go and will almost certainly bargain off 2 points.

    If you are nervous about this approach or if the extra $350 is worth it to you pay the lawyer but I'm betting you can accomplish what you want without him.
  • Thanks fezo and gbrozen for the advice. I'll try to go it alone and get as much evidence as my camera and ez pass allows.

    If anyone else has good advice or has fought a speeding ticket for ez pass toll lane, please add a thread.

    Otherwise, I'll just update post-court date, which is looking like mid-end January.
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