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Toyota Yaris

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Comments

  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,716
    But this is coming from someone who says the Accent handles good!!!! Now thats funny!!

    What did you think of the handling of the 2007 Accent SE when you drove it? How did it compare to the Yaris?
  • In the December 4th sales database from Automotive News, the Toyota Yaris has greatly outsold the Honda Fit. The total sales numbers for the first 11 months of 2006 are:

    Honda Fit: 25,702 sold (all trims) :confuse:

    Toyota Yaris: 64,082 sold (all trims) :P

    For every 1 Honda Fit that has sold this year, 2.5 Toyota Yaris sold. If you want to check out the sales database at Automotive news, it will cost you $15 for a weeks online subscription. :mad:
  • bamacarbamacar Posts: 749
    Guess what Honda has limited imports of the Fit to 3000 for the year. You can't sell what you don't have. No supply means no sale. Many people want Fits and can't get them; they are having to settle for other brands and models. Not a surprise.

    Sales numbers are free at aicaautosite.
  • 1) Thanks for the information on where I can get free car sales numbers. :)

    2) The entry level economy car market is extremely competitive right now, and for Honda to act like it is Microsoft (Monopoly) is just stupid in terms of economics. The entry level economy car market is an Oligopoly, not a Monopoly. The competition is too good to limit the supply of a quality product in this market. Honda could be cashing in big right now, but they missed out because they missed diagnosed the entry level economy car market. :cry:

    3) I graduated with a degree in economics, so I have full understanding of its concepts and principals. :)
  • bamacarbamacar Posts: 749
    Honda is a much smaller company than Toyota and they don't have the capacity to adjust production immediately. When the new Fit plant in Indiana opens for the 2008 Fit model, production won't be a problem. I wonder if Toyota will move Yaris production to North America if sales hold up.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Posts: 1,690
    I hope not. One of the great attractions of the ECHO/Yaris is its built in Japan. My wifes American built Camry is noticeably less good than my ECHO.
  • "You can't sell what you don't have."

    This is very true. At one point early in the process (late summer) I got kind of ticked at the dealer I was going to buy from and was seriously considering changing my mind toward a Fit. I called a nearby Honda dealer to see if they had one on the lot and he told he didn't expect any more for the rest of the year. I had left my name with a Honda salesman at a dealer next door to the Toyota dealer I was dealing with. One afternoon I got a call that they had just received a Fit and I could have bought it. But, it was red and all pimped out with some kind of sport package. Probably real sharp, but too expensive and not my style. I would loved to have at least taken a test drive, so I called him the following morning to see if I could run over. But, he said someone had already put a deposit on it.

    We like our Yaris, but had Fits been available I just might be driving one--especially if that CR article had come out last summer rather than last month. Very glad to see the Yaris right in there as most reliable. The combination of reliability and great mpg is precisely why I was looking at the Echo and Yaris.

    Thanks to everyone who posted the info.
  • I find it hard to believe that Honda did not have the ability to produce larger quantities of the Fit. Honda has been a major mass producer of cars in the USA for the last 20 years. Nissan was able to sell over 60,000 cars for 3 different style cars (In 2006). To sell that many cars you have to produce that many cars or more. Honda is right up there with Nissan in terms of yearly profit. In my opinion Honda executives by choice, not financial/production restraints, decided to limit the quantity of the Fit.

    The Honda Fit is a top of the line car for this market, but bad business decisions by Honda executives have left potential Honda Fit consumers looking for alternatives. :cry:
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,691
    you make yourself appear foolish with such a strident tone. Furthermore, I will bet dollars to donuts you have never set foot on a Hyundai lot, much less driven the '07 Accent SE, which is the exact model and trim I was referring to. So I understand you sell Toyotas and all, but if you are going to speak so definitively, you probably should at least drive the cars you refer to.

    And backy, the Accent is a very good, moderately sporty econoride let down by a shifter which is mediocre at best. It is not a question of the notchiness or lack thereof, it is a question of wanting precision in the gates and NOT a ton of slop in or out of gear. A short shifter won't fix either of those problems. The shifter in the Yaris, while not exceptional, is very decent. The shifter in the Fit is true to Honda tradition, far and away the best of the bunch IMHO.

    And there is no question in my mind that Honda's Fit would be giving the Yaris a hard run for its money in the sales race if in fact Honda could have devoted enough production to the Fit to bring over more than 30-40K of them per year.

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • bamacarbamacar Posts: 749
    Honda is at or near capacity for Civic, Accord, CRV, Pilot, Odyssey, and even the Acura MDX and TL all in North America. All of the mentioned models will sell over 60k this year with the Accord and Civic over 300k for this year. The Fit is not made in North America. They don't have the Japanese capacity that Toyota does. Until the Fit plant opens in Indiana, don't look for Fit production to change much.
  • I understand that the Honda Accord and Civic are near capacity in terms of production, both have always been top sellers for Honda. I do not understand the Pilot or the Odyssey near capacity for production. Who's buying an Odyssey???? :confuse:
  • wave54wave54 Posts: 209
    Who's buying an Odyssey????

    Believe it or not, more Odysseys are sold than the top 3 subcompacts combined. About 170K for the year.

    Not even close to Chrysler's 350K in minivan sales -- guess someone's still buying 'em.
  • "I just could not stand looking at the exterior body of the Honda Fit (not to mention it cost more)."

    I agree. To me it has the styling of a grocery cart. Style wise I like the Yaris best of all--especially the liftback.

    Next I like the looks of the Rio. Looks kind of european, although I wouldn't have bought one after speaking with a neighbor who has both an Echo and a Rio.

    The Versa looks like it was built from plans smuggled out of the Honda design department.

    The Accent looks like a Ford.

    I like the looks of the Yaris best, although I will concede that, based on the CR report, the Fit might be a better car overall. Doesn't matter if you can't buy one, though.
  • Wow! The soccer mom market for vans is greater than I thought (Really its a family van market). Where I live and drive I rarely see those on the road, leading me to make the statement "Who's buying an Odyssey?" Maybe if I drove around Disneyland or Chucky Cheese I would see more of those vans.
  • When not comparing the Yaris to any other car for the best in its auto class, the Toyota Yaris is still a good stand alone value entry level car. Its reliable, gets very good gas mileage for a non-hybrid car, low cost to purchase, and smooth handling in day to day driving (Not driving to its limits like CR reported).

    Often times, including myself, in these forms people want to get into a battle royal in terms of comparisons. The topic is "Toyota Yaris: Is it a Good Value." Not Toyota Yaris verses Honda Fit, or any other car.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,716
    Value is always relative to what other use you could apply your money. Hence it's natural for other cars to enter into a discussion of value.

    I agree that if you are looking for an entry-level car (with few features) that is likely to be reliable and has excellent fuel economy and a smooth ride for the class, and those are your key criteria, then the Yaris is a good value. Unfortunately, there are compromises I see in the Yaris that do not make it a good choice for me, because my requirements go beyond those I listed. But for others it can be a great choice.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Posts: 1,690
    What did your neighbor who had both ECHO and rio have to say about the Rio?
  • And who really, in daily driving, drives these entry-level cars to their LIMITS (besides magazine staffers who have the luxury of playing around with all different kinds of cars)?

    The Yaris is to today's market as the original VW Beetle was to the 1960s: basic, reliable, durable, fuel-efficient, and fun to drive for what it is.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,716
    Driving a car to its limits is very possible in daily driving, in emergency situations. That's why CR among others does emergency-handling tests to see how a car performs "at the limits."

    I could make some other comparisons between the Yaris and '60s vintage Beetle... but I won't. ;)
  • I think you expect the Yaris to be a MINI Cooper.

    It isn't, and doesn't need to be.

    It IS a good value. The only other car in its class that is also a good value is the Fit.

    The Accent and Versa get poor MPG, as does Aveo (with poor quality to boot).

    MPG is the #1 consideration.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,716
    No, I don't expect the Yaris to be a MINI Cooper. I expect it to handle and brake well though. It doesn't do those things as well as other cars in this class, which affects its value in my eyes.

    The Accent gets very good mpg, e.g. 30 mpg average in CR's tests, which they stated was "very good." The Versa gets a bit less than that, but for a car with its size, power, and room still quite good.

    If mpg is the #1 consideration for you, wouldn't a car like a Prius, HCH, or Golf diesel (used, for now) be just the thing? Or even a used ECHO, which would return higher mpg than the Yaris.
  • "No, I don't expect the Yaris to be a MINI Cooper. I expect it to handle and brake well though. It doesn't do those things as well as other cars in this class, which affects its value in my eyes. "
    Readers should get better information from Edmunds long term test and automotive magazine reviews.
    We all know that this guy is bias in favor of Hyundai.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,716
    We all know CR has a bias in favor of Hyundai and against Toyota too, right?

    At its limits, the Yaris is sloppy with so-so grip. The rear end slid out too easily in our avoidance maneuver and around our track, especially in the hatchback. The Yaris would benefit greatly from stability control, but like on the other cars here it's not available.

    Stopping distances for our non-ABS hatchback were extremely long, and ABS is hard to find.


    -- From CR, December 2006, p. 62

    We also know that C/D has it in for Toyota, right?

    Third, its [Yaris S sedan's] steering, impressively light in town, is overassisted at speed and directional stability suffers--you'll want to keep both hands on the wheel above 55 mph.

    -- From C/D, May 2006, p. 70

    Yep, that bias for Hyundai is rampant I guess! Anyone who thinks the Yaris has compromises, even automotive magazine reviewers, and doesn't think the Yaris is the best-handling and best-braking car in this class is obviously biased towards Hyundai.
    Also, the only people who are permitted to express opinions here are those who love the Yaris. If you might prefer another car, say a Fit or an Accent, no need to post your opinion because you will be accused of being obviously biased towards Hyundai. Which is a felony in most states I think?

    Yep, for sure.
  • I dont like to treat forum readers as ignorant or dumb that is why I'm not going to attach selective quotes from the reviews. Here is the complete full testm test reviews for the Yaris and Accent and the complete CD "Cheapskate" comparison from CD.
    Read and weep Hyundai apologist!

    http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FullTests/articleId=115397
    http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FullTests/articleId=109860
    http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/10925/15000-cheap-skates.html

    The Yaris is faster at 0-60 MpH, faster at slalom and stops shorter by a foot compared to the Accent. The Accent has ABS at that. I dont know where you get the information that Accent is better than the Yaris in handling and breaking. Is it from your supposedly objective test drive review? Give me a break!
  • I have the Yaris with antilock breaks and they work great. Also in Edmunds.com video review of the Yaris they mention that with antilock breaks the car has excellent stopping distance (122 feet) for any car in any auto class.

    Also emergency situations are simply emergency situations, not day to day driving. Consumer Reports test drivers do many things that are not good for a car. For example slamming on the gas pedal to see how fast the car can go from 0 to 60 MPH or driving at the highest speeds and making sudden stops. Both ruin your miles per gallon. So most of the time there is no need to push your car to its limits on your way to a local grocery store 6 to 10 blocks away.

    If you are interested in a Hyundai verse Yaris discussion, that message board topic is available.
  • I ordered my Yaris with ABS (and side airbags), and I've seen three or four hatchbacks at local dealers equipped with ABS.

    It's NOT hard to find. And as pointed out above, the Yaris with ABS is very capable in braking ability.

    Maybe Backy thinks that all features should be standard equipment; that all options should be included on every car.

    But this is an entry-level, bare-bones automobile. (You can trim it out nicely if you want to.)

    Backy, the cars you mentioned as alternatives (Prius, for example) cost much more to purchase (and diesel fuel is not as available and higher-priced). I cannot afford such a car. My income dictates that the car should cost below $16,000 new. And why would I buy a used Echo, when the Yaris MPG is nearly as good and it's a much improved car over the Echo?

    The 30-MPG average you cite for the Accent is the absolute MINIMUM that a car in this class should achieve. It is barely adequate... certainly NOT a standout.

    I cannot fathom your intense dislike for the Yaris, unless you just enjoy being contrary. The Yaris is a simple, durable, fuel-efficient car that does its job well. Sales figures bear out my viewpoint.
  • Amen!!!!!!!!!
  • "What did your neighbor who had both ECHO and rio have to say about the Rio?"
    He said his Rio is more problematic than his Echo, and the 10 year/100k warranty is not what it's cracked up to be. He said that when you really get down to examining everything that is "excluded" from the warranty it is very disappointing.

    Driving a car to its limits is very possible in daily driving, in emergency situations.
    That's the whole point. If you discount those characteristics as not applicable in uneventful day-to-day driving, then why put in air bags, seat belts, or even bother with crash testing? In fact, wasn't it Mr. Ferrari who when once criticized about poor braking on one of his cars said something like, "This car isn't made to stop, it's made to go." So, why worry about braking at all? Yes, it's the emergency situations that we face that make these tests important. Granted, more important to some than others, but still significant and noteworthy.

    "Backy..I cannot fathom your intense dislike for the Yaris, unless you just enjoy being contrary.
    I think that's the case. It seems that some people's mission in life is to always find the cloud around the silver lining. Backy has made it clear that a Yaris isn't for him. Fine, why the obsession with running it down and splitting hairs over every comment someone leaves here?
  • I agree. Coming from someone who works in the insurance industry, you must always prepare for emergencies. That is exactly why I bought the power package with antilock breaks and side curtain air bags.

    Emergencies tend to be rare for drivers like myself who tend to cruise (not speed race). Most of the time I will not need the emergency features, but there is always that one crazy driver on the road who changes the situation from safe to dangerous.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,716
    I guess you didn't read Edmunds.com's conclusion on the Yaris, which is particularly relevant in this discussion about its value:

    Some are more valuable than others
    Ten years ago the Corolla was the standard against which every other subcompact was measured. These days, however, it's clear the competition has looked to a higher standard than the Yaris.

    For $2 grand less than the price of our test car, you could get a similarly equipped Hyundai Accent with a better warranty, an equally spacious interior and decent cupholders. Or for $16K you could go with the loaded Honda Fit Sport, which is more fun to drive and has a better stereo, superior ergonomics and a more flexible interior.

    Any way you look at it, the 2007 Toyota Yaris is average. And when you're trying to save the world, average doesn't cut it. Even people who wear hemp socks know that.

    Bottom Line:
    It's better-looking and more comfortable than its predecessor, but there's nothing unique enough about the Yaris to recommend it over its numerous — and often cheaper — competitors.


    And those competitors, as noted in the Edmunds.com review, include the Fit and Accent--two cars I happen to prefer over the Yaris. So call me a "Hyundai apologist" if you want, but then that label must apply to the editors of Edmunds.com too.

    P.S. See my earlier post for third-party comments about the deficiencies in the Yaris' handling and braking. Those were not MY opinions.
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