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Any downside to buying a hybrid?

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Comments

  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    I just happened to see that 90% of your posts were in the hybrid forum so I thought you were looking to get a nice green lean machine.
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,752
    I am sure you will get a nice tax break. However until the IRS issues it opinion the sources, be them reliable or not, are still a source of conjecture. It may be less than they expect, or it could be more.

    The sign said "No shoes, no shirt, no service", it didn't say anything about no pants.

  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    I look at it with a bonus. I would still buy the car regardless of the credit. I am not sure how many people are actually even motivated to buy a hybrid because of the credit. It appears that sales have NOT stalled, so people may be unaware of the credit which starts in nine weeks.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    I was paraphrasing your previous comment ;) BTW, how would you know from the auction lanes that the Prius' were getting as you say '.. in the tall 30's..' Were the drivers still sitting in the cars answering questions to the buyers???? Never saw that before, weird if they were.

    You still havent shown me that you know even a little abt the Prius except what you hear and what it brings in the lanes. The specific questions I've posed to you have either been ignored or answered with offhanded non-sequiters.

    'Fess up now, Terry. Your 7 stores are Used Car stores with nary a Toyota store amongst them so your acces to Prius knowledge is secondary at best except for what they bring in resale which is your area of expertise.
  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    Perhaps he's a little miffed that he can't get any used ones at a reasonable price.
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,796
    "As to the CRV.. Absolutely hate the styling, but that's just me. Don't take any offense. The new Rav4 is worlds better than the CRV. I hope they have a hybrid version soon."

    No offense taken. Actually, it is rather funny you say that, because I feel the same way about the Prius styling. Eye of the beholder and all that, I suppose.

    I don't agree with your opinion of the new RAV4. With the larger engine, it gets worse gas mileage. The advantage it used to have over the CR-V was size and smaller engine.
  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    I believe the new RAV4 has the option of the V6. I wouldn't be surprised if they convert that RAV to a hybrid within the next two years. That would really be sweet. The CRV is a wonderful reliable small SUV. I know the Liberty folks would disagree, but after owning one for 3 yrs, the CRV is much more refined. Is yours a 5sp or auto?
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Its going to have the 3.5L Avalon engine @ 268 HP, which is wicked, making it more powerful than the V6 Highlander... But most RAV buyers are frugal so I really think it wont sell much. But in 2 yrs if they take the 2.4L HSD which will be in the Camry and add it to the RAV.. that'll grap the RAV buyers' attn... V6 power and 30+ mpg fuel ratings on a mid sized SUV.
  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    WOW... the 3.5 engine!!!! That thing will be wicked!! Thanks for the info!
  • miniokminiok Posts: 14
    The American Council for Energy Efficient Economy is a very authoritative source. Their site has good information. ACEEE.ORG
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,752
    OK, but I will wait to see what the IRS says. Their figures are the ones you have to use. So I will wait until then. Thanks

    The sign said "No shoes, no shirt, no service", it didn't say anything about no pants.

  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    It's not going to vary by much.
  • heyjewelheyjewel Posts: 1,046
    Hey birdman, if it's a tax credit you want - buy a Navigator. Could practically buy a Prius too with the money saved.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Posts: 9,359
    ..... Hmm, interesting ...

    I thought I posted about gas mileage in hybrids, considering the topic is: "Any downside to buying a hybrid?" ... maybe I misread it.

    To answer your question, there is 7 new car stores .. but thats not what this topic is about ..

    This topic is about hybrids, not just about Toyota, not about me and certainly not about Kdhspyder ...... hybrids are good vehicles for the right people, some better than others, some work and some break, some get 45 mpg and some can even get 50 mpg with the right driver and with the right driving circumstances ....

    Then again, some only get 35 mpg, like in Michigan in the cold winters and some in the southern states get even less, depending on if it's 95 degree's or 105 when the humidity has been 90%+ for the last 2 weeks ... but if you were a good car man, you'd know this. ....... how about if we do this, if anyone has any questions we can just call your employer and ask him .. he probably doesn't appreciate you using his computer on business time, especially since you need to be selling something to someone, cuz' you're just a salesman --- most folks here are pretty savvy, I'm sure they'll figure it out on their own.

    If your employer had any faith and trust in you .. they would probably let you go to an auction here and there and let you see what is there for their inventory, but obviously they don't .... if they had any faith and trust in you, they would let you look at the auction reports and you could see how many hybrids (including Prius) that travel through, but obviously they don't .. .. see, you would know this if you had any experience, obviously you don't.



    Terry.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Finally something more than an off handed comment.. Tks, Terry.

    I work my own hours, thank you, since retiring from my job selling steel to the automakers and others. Now I mostly play poker and its no secret that I work for Toyota selling specifically the Prius. I've disclosed it many times. Today it's from home.

    hybrids are good vehicles for the right people, some better than others, some work and some break, some get 45 mpg and some can even get 50 mpg with the right driver and with the right driving circumstances ....

    Then again, some only get 35 mpg, like in Michigan in the cold winters and some in the southern states get even less, depending on if it's 95 degree's or 105 when the humidity has been 90%+ for the last 2 weeks .


    Thats a more coherent explanation than your original off handed ' in the tall 30's..' but far from complete because even in the extremes you mention its the length of the trips more than the temps that effect the mileage. but you knew that I'm certain.

    The Manheim online reports are available anytime I want to log on... but thanks for the suggestion. ;)
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,752
    Thats sort of a very strange response since they don't make a hybrid Navigator so the only way you can save on your taxes is to use it for work (and its not even a tax credit but rather a deduction). Plus the base price is more than twice what the base price of the Prius is.

    So how can you save enough money to buy a prius?

    The sign said "No shoes, no shirt, no service", it didn't say anything about no pants.

  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    It could be that maybe if you forego buying the navigator the gas savings will enable you to buy a Prius. It's quite confusing.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,018
    I work for Toyota selling specifically the Prius

    So that makes you even more biased than the average Toyota sales person. The two times I have gone to test drive the Prius II the salesmen tried to sell me a Camry. Once in Hawaii and once here in CA. Both laid out the same facts of how an entry level Camry would save me money over a Prius. Almost like it was a scripted sales pitch. I wonder if that is part of their training. I will try a third dealer in the next few weeks and see if the sales pitch has changed. Short supply may be the biggest downside to even thinking about buying a Prius. The other hybrids seem easy to find.
  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    I've been to many dealers and they never try to do bait and switch. Why on earth would you even waste a saleman's time if you have no intention of buying?
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    quote gagrice-"The two times I have gone to test drive the Prius II the salesmen tried to sell me a Camry. Once in Hawaii and once here in CA. Both laid out the same facts of how an entry level Camry would save me money over a Prius. Almost like it was a scripted sales pitch. I wonder if that is part of their training. I will try a third dealer in the next few weeks and see if the sales pitch has changed."-end quote

    Gary, that's easily explainable and not at all surprising. The salesperson makes a higher commission on the Camry sale. Nothing conspiratorial or shady about - it's called GREED.
  • mistermemisterme Posts: 407
    Hello Kdhspyder:
    "some get 45 mpg and some can even get 50 mpg with the right driver and with the right driving circumstances"

    Sorry, you're providing more bad hybrid information.
    Most people report mid to upper 40's in their hybrid cars while some drivers get mid-upper 50's to upper 60's MPG.
    http://home.alltel.net/stevedez_00/gas.jpg
    66.6MPG displayed, 68MPG by calculated miles/gallons used and 932 miles to a single tank. All summer did mid-high 60's calculated.

    That was in mid 90's temperatures and around 95-100% humidity.

    That was with an HCH CVT. MT can do better.

    Prius can do a little better than that, and Insight is good well past 100MPG tanks, with the right driver under normal conditions.
  • nwngnwng Posts: 664
    they don't have any prius in stock but plenty of camrys. No sale today, no commission this month, it's pretty simple
  • nwngnwng Posts: 664
    while people who are baggering the prius getting lower mpg in the winter, doesn't that happen to ALL cars? My corolla gets mid to high 30's in the summer and drop to mid 20's in the winter, and I've got long, cold winters in NE. :confuse:
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,796
    "...the CRV is much more refined. Is yours a 5sp or auto?"

    Auto, though I think the MT is a 4 speed; the 2005 and later CR-V is a 5 speed auto.

    My wife doesn't drive a stick, and anyway there are two reasons I wouldn't have bought one.

    1. MT is rare - hard to find.
    2. MT gets worse MPG than auto.
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,796
    "while people who are baggering the prius getting lower mpg in the winter, doesn't that happen to ALL cars? My corolla gets mid to high 30's in the summer and drop to mid 20's in the winter, and I've got long, cold winters in NE"

    Here in SOCAL we get a "winter blend" gas, and the MPG goes down, but not by much for me - about .5 MPG.

    Of course, I'm only getting 22 MPG (city) to begin with...
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    Getting low MPG in cold weather is not a problem with hybrid technology, per se. If it was, there would be ZERO drivers achieving EPA numbers in the winter months, and that is not the case.

    There are many reasons for cars not achieving max MPG in the colder months...

    Car engines must warm up to a certain internal operating temperature before they most efficiently use the fuel. Winter months and colder temps make that transition from cold start to most efficient take a little longer.

    Also: new cars go through what is called a "break-in period" where the metal engine parts are still grinding against each other more rigidly, creating more friction, which also reduces efficiency. Over time, the "extra metal" shaves off and gets lubricated better (expecially if you use Synthetic Oil) and the friction is reduced, which affect MPG numbers.

    Winter formula fuels used in most states hold less energy and this also hurts MPG.

    Generally speaking, colder weather in many areas means "rain, snow, or slush or ice" on the roads - these things add additional resistance which the tires must push out of the way to contact the road, so they hurt MPG in that way. As someone pointed out to me, "Actually driving in snow kills your mpg. You're crawling and losing traction because the wheels have to spin more."

    Tire pressures also are lowered by the cold weather too. Most people fail to properly inflate their tires all year, but ESPECIALLY in the winter when it is cold and you might have dirty tires and you just dont want to deal with spending time in the cold airing up a dirty tire. Low tire inflation can cause blowouts and adds quite a bit of rolling resistance, which forces the engine to work harder to "push" the car forward, thus using more fuel.

    Additional idling uses more fuel and hurts overall MPG, and many people in cold climes by habit or necessity are warming their cars up in the morning. That is good practice to stay warm, but BAD for MPG numbers. While idling in your garage or driveway or carport, it is getting 0 miles to the gallon !! :D

    People who use the defroster in a Hybrid are many times using the A/C compressor to help reduce the humidity in the car and clear the fog. That is a MPG killer too. The compressor can be turned off, but usually by default it comes on.

    See this science page for more explanation:

    http://tinyurl.com/3s7lo
  • nwngnwng Posts: 664
    that's socal, I always wonder how you folks there get good mileage. When I visit my cousin who lives in socal, we're either crawling at 5-7 mph on the freeway or doing 95 mph and yet plenty of people passed us

    Actually driving in snow kills your mpg. You're crawling and loosing traction(wheels have to spin more)
  • They hardly make any MTs that are not 5 or 6 speed now.

    The CR-V is 5-speed Manual http://www.edmunds.com/new/2006/honda/crv/100650235/researchlanding.html
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    they don't have any prius in stock but plenty of camrys. No sale today, no commission this month, it's pretty simple

    This is precisely the position of most sales people since they have to pay bills next month so they are looking for an immediate sale this month..not in 3-4 months. In addition sales people are not different than many here as well. The technology is threatening to some and its more complicated to explain than a normal ICE vehicle. It's one reason why I emphasize Prius sales to the point where others even give me their prospects.. I'm not as concerned with immediate compensation as I am the long term results. In addition the hybrids appeal to me for the technology and the benefits to the environment.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Easy brother,
    That wasnt my info... that was a quote from 'rroyce' that's why I highlighted it.
    Previously I had taken exception to several off handed comments he shot out.

    My statement to him was that hybrid drivers are the most authoritative source on real world mileage numbers. Most of my customers report consistently in the 48-51 mpg range combined. Yours are very good to be sure.
This discussion has been closed.