MazdaSpeed3: Styling Impressions

aviboy97

Why can't a crossover vehicle be sporty? Or better yet, how come you claim that it is not worthy of the "zoom-zoom" label, yet, you have not driven it, and better yet, you did not build it?

Does "zoom-zoom" only apply to sedans, coupes, and sport's cars? Because, if you think about it, the CX-7 is built on the Mazda6 platform, has the Mazdaspeed6 power plant, and drive train. It definitely is sporty looking. I don't understand you train of thought.

There was an article a couple of years ago that questioned what Jesus would be driving today

What does that have to do with anything? lol....If Jesus was to return again, it would be into poverty (if you read the Bible, you would know that) so, he probably would not be driving anything! :P

chacobleu

"Well guess what some of the competion is doing?"

Ummmm.....introducing high output FWD 4-door hatchbacks?

More like stalking each other.

rorr

"More like stalking each other."

I could say the same thing if the Mazdaspeed3 was introduced as an AWD edition - 'stalking' the WRX/Evo.

I'm not sure what your point is regarding what some of the competition is doing? :confuse:

chacobleu

Actually, he may drive a poor man's BMW = VW.

And because Mazda makes vehicles, does not qualify all their vehicles for "zoom-zoom" title. e.g. MPV. Now, I own an MPV. But one look and it's not zoom-zoom that comes to mind. At best, the MPV is nifty (at least once driven).

aviboy97

Well, I do have to agree with you on the MPV..It is not going to win any races...However, the exterior styling IS zoom-zoom. It's a sporty looking mini-van. Take a look at the new 2007 Japanese version. It's a sweet looking mini-van (yes, I said sweet.)

Mazda say's that zoom-zoom is more then just performance, it has to look the part as well.

chacobleu

No u couldn't say because you already said Mazda is not going after the WRX/EVO with the 3 and I, contrary to your belief, concur. My point is clear: AWD has NOTHING to do with WRX/EVO. If one were to remove the AWD from WRX/EVO (rendering them FWD) while everything else remaining the same, the Mazda would win instantly on paper alone (ok, and maybe seat of your pants).

If Mazda were to build an AWD version of the 3 (I'm sure they have a prototype somewhere), it would be so well tempered and so behaved, that ONLY on paper would it have anything in common with the WRX/EVO

chacobleu

Yeah,

and a Ferrari body kit built on a Neon platform is a better looking neon.

seanwms6

http://wardsauto.com/ar/mazda3_designed_mazdaspeed/

Nice info on the mods made to the to hatch to reduce roll, etc. Also discusses how they designed the regular 3 hatch to be ready for the Mazdaspeed treatment due to heavy demand for a P5 Mazdaspeed which they say couldn't have stiffened enough.

ambull

Okay article, but they did make one mistake:
"A limited-slip rear differential also is part of the Mazdaspeed3 package."

seanwms6

Maybe Ms. Schweinsberg was subconsciously aligning herself with the fairly large number of potential MS3 buyers who wanted AWD.

aviboy97

yeah, I was going to mention that...lol....who proof read's these articles?? Somebody at Ward's dropped the ball on that one..lol.

autonomous

Has anyone heard any more about the estimated arrival date? Journalists have predicted summer and fall. If it follows the pattern established by the Mazdaspeed6 it would be September/October rather than June/July.

aviboy97

We actually did not receive the Mazdaspeed6 until late November of 2005. It was supposed to be released in the spring of 2005, not the late fall.

We have received no order forms for allocations on the 2007 Mazdaspeed3. There is no concrete specs yet, either. I don't think we see this car until December, at the earliest.

rorr

"We have received no order forms for allocations on the 2007 Mazdaspeed3."

Well, playing devil's advocate, have you received order forms for allocations for the regular '07 Mazda3?

I can understand a bit about why the MSP6 was a bit delayed (new engine certification, kinks in the AWD system to work out, etc. etc.) but, from an engineering standpoint, I don't see what could hold the MSP3 up?

seanwms6

Per a Mazda "insider" on msprotege.com's 3 section, the plan is for the Canadians to get their MS3's in Aug/Sep with the US 2-4 weeks behind, or Sep/Oct. FWIW (not much), I predict it will Oct/Nov for the US since I assume the plan is optimistic. But without the snafu's associated with the MS6 (gearing change/port program) maybe Dec/Jan is pessimistic.

qddave

rorr,
My dealer here in Grand Rapids, MI put his first order in for 2007 3's back in the beginning of May. He's expecting them in late August.

Dave

audia8q

My dealer here in Grand Rapids, MI put his first order in for 2007 3's back in the beginning of May.

I think the question was about Speed3's...which have not had an allocation/orders yet. Just regular model MZ3's so far.

rorr

"I think the question was about Speed3's."

Actually, I HAD asked specifically about the regular '07 MZ3's. It had been already been stated that no orders/allocations could be made on the Speed3's (possibly indicating late fall availability) and I was wondering if the same was true of the regular MZ3.

So......it seems to be confirmed that we definitely won't be seeing the Speed3 until mid-fall (my now optimistic guess) at the earliest. Bummer.

aviboy97

Well, playing devil's advocate, have you received order forms for allocations for the regular '07 Mazda3?


We placed our first allocation May for the 2007 Mazda3 which will probably be here sometime in August, early September at the latest.

No word yet on the MS3. I'm sticking to my earlier prediction of November/December. I hope I am wrong.

aviboy97

How funny is this, we were just talking about not knowing when this car would be out. Well, just placed our first allocation for the Mazdaspeed3 in Cosmic Blue. I'm not quite sure what color that is, but, at least we got one. It should be here in September!

rorr

"It should be here in September!"

Hmmmm, looks like my memo got to the right people.... :shades:

I knew you were being too pessimistic....

audia8q

I guess I'm going to order blue also...maybe true red. If we could get somebody else in our area to order silver and black we would be in good shape...

notice the new Miata also???

rorr

Since we're talking about colors:

Will the MSP3 be available in the same colors as the regular Mazda3 or are there any colors unique to the MSP3? Or do you guys have that info yet?

Dang it - why can't one of you guys be located in Texas...

audia8q

cosmic blue
black mica
true red
sunlight silver

black cloth or black leather

rorr

Muchos gracias!

pmeilakjr

I was driving home last night behind a silver Mazdaspeed3 - rear lights are a little different design, the rear valence was a bit bigger, and the rims and front brakes looked a little larger than the regular Mazda3. It had dealer plates. Don't know much more they turned off at Alicia.

aviboy97

notice the new Miata also???

Sure did, I posted that in the MX-5 forum. I have yet to see pictures, though, have you?

aviboy97

Well, considering that every car in the past 2 years that Mazda has released has come out AFTER speculation, I think I was within my right to hesitate on speculating that this car would be here on time! LOL :shades:

aviboy97

Are you near Irvine,CA? And are you sure that this was not just a Mazda3 with Mazdaspeed accessories on it?

seanwms6

Apparently they had one at Mazdafest in CA recently and another poster on msprotege.com saw a black MS3 on the road. They are out there!

rorr

"Apparently they had one at Mazdafest in CA recently and another poster on msprotege.com saw a black MS3 on the road. They are out there!"

Yes, I've seen pictures of the red MSP3 that was at Mazfest.

I think it's probable that the occasional sightings are of vehicles undergoing road tests by various members of the automotive media (R&T, C&D, Edmunds, etc.).

aviboy97

I think it's probable that the occasional sightings are of vehicles undergoing road tests by various members of the automotive media (R&T, C&D, Edmunds, etc.).

I doubt they have been driven by the media yet, considering we wont get them for another 4 months or so. They usually get them around the same time the dealers do.

It is common for Mazda corporate employees to have them before they are available to the public. They were driving the CX-7 months ago.

I actually drove the Mazdaspeed6 before the media got a hold of it. ( Mazdaspeed test drive event for Mazda dealers)

autonomous

Recently published information about the Mazdaspeed3:
http://www.mazda.com/publicity/release/200606/0606.html

Notice the pricing in yen; it appears that the Mazdaspeed3 is priced about 10% higher than the regular hatchback.

aviboy97

I saw that. I wonder if Mazda North American Operations will price it how it is in Japan.

ambull

I thought that sounded too good to be true - actually it's about 12% higher. But that still seems very reasonable.

olga626

http://www.kirill626.com/mazdaspeed3/_catalog.html
VIN # JM1EK34A871600004

seanwms6

Looks like titanium grey may be an option after all!

aviboy97

That is not Titanium Gray. It is to dark to be. They have discontinued that color, however, Carbon Gray Mica is still in use for the Mazda5, and was used on the Mazda3 SP23 in 2005.

Funny that neither are on option for us dealers to order.

aviboy97

Were you at some sort of Mazda corperate location. I noticed an abundance of Mazda vehicles in the parking lot (Mazda6, CX-7's..many of them)

seanwms6

Some guy on Mazda3forums.com translated the color options on the Japanese MS Axela site:

Cosmic Blue
Carbon Gray Mica
Galaxy Gray Mica
True Red.

Maybe they just happened to bring one of the pre-production Carbon Gray or Galaxy Gray Micas to the US but don't intend to distribute it here.

seanwms6

I don't know why I didn't notice this before. The press release lists a power rating of 194 kw for the MS Axela, which is equal to 260 hp. I have heard unofficial ratings for the MS3 of 267 hp / 260 SAE net on other sites. One poster even had a scan of a US spec sheet confirming 260 SAE. But the info in the press release is the first official Mazda info showing a specific rating.

I suppose the US spec MS3 could have a lower rating, maybe due to different emissions standards or some such. But, FWIW, the MS Atenza is rated at 200 kw or 268 hp, 6 hp less than the MS6 274 SAE net.

aviboy97

I guess I was right about the Carbon Gray Mica. We will not be getting that color. We will be getting Black instead.

chacobleu

Hey,

Would anyone happen to know the power spec numbers (all of them) or a graph showing the same for the new 2.3L engine before Mazda bolts on the turbo?

I think the engine is identical in all applications (3, 6, & CX-7). The turbo size and calibration causes the numbers to vary from 1 model to the next.

cc4u

I don't think its just that simple . The cylinder head is definitely different , because its Direct Injection into the combustion chamber on the DISI 2.3L . Where the regular 2.3L is port Fuel injection . And from what I've read & understand the 2.3L DISI engine uses exclusively Forged engine parts , e.g. crankshaft , rods & pistons ??? Where as I'm not sure if thats the case on the Regular 2.3L ? I hope this helps ???

chacobleu

I meant that all Mazda & Mazdaspeed vehicles (CX-7 is not Speedster, yet) using the 2.3L engine use the same upgraded (from base) engine. Its common knowledge that those upgrades are standard fair for producing a much higher compression unit. But what does all that translate into (power) BEFORE they bolt on the Turbo????????? And I'm not only asking for peak HP & Torque. I would like to know where all that power occurs from 600rpm to redline.

modock

I think what he was saying is that there are not stages for this upgrade from the normally aspirated 2.3L. The DISI 2.3L is a completely upgraded engine and I have not seen it used without the Turbo. As for where the power comes in, that depends on the tuning of the "engine" (that includes the turbo). The CX-7 has more boost at lower RPM while the MS6 has a more conventional turbo setup where it has to spool up. Your questions BEFORE they bolt on the Turbo????????? is not really valid because the DISI is not currently used as a naturally aspirated engine.

seanwms6

Yeah, but if the didn't add the turbo, it would probably like a diesel: loads of low RPM torque and not a lot of peak hp. Not that I really have any idea.

aviboy97

I just saw the Cosmic Blue color tile on our dealer system. I do not know if I am a big fan. It looks to be a little lighter then the Squall Blue Pearl that is found on the Mazda6 wagon.

chacobleu

"not valid"

of course it's a valid question. there may be no answer, but the question is still valid.

the lower rpm boom of the CX-7 has to do with a different turbo being used vs. the speedsters (at least that is what Mazda says).

I was hoping to get a reply from a Mazda person with the inside scoop (anom.). U c, every engine is spec'd out - regardless whether peripherals are bolted on or not. And the engine need not be in circulation for specs to be documented. So, if u don't know I would prefer "I don't know."

maltb

I tend to agree with modock, the induction system and fuel delivery are designed around the turbo. Without the turbo, the engine is probably worse off than the standard 2.3. Forged internals don't add aditional performance, they simply add strength.

I'm sure some engine lab in Japan has the info you are looking for but I can't imagine what good it would do you.

Good luck on your search.