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Lexus GS 450h

frenchornefrenchorne Posts: 31
The hybrid story continues with the 2007 Lexus GS 450h. It was introduced today at the NY Auto Show. Some interesting numbers are include in the press release ...

http://www.lexus.com/about/press_releases/popups/2005/pr_03_23_b.html
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Comments

  • yerth10yerth10 Posts: 428
    GS450h will have 3.5 liter V6 engine giving the power of GS430 which has 4.3 liter V8 engine.

    So Toyota is going in Economy route. After all 300 hp (with 0-60 in <6 seconds) is more than enough. If this can suceed, then it will bring an end to V8 engine in many household vehicles especially sedans.
  • yerth10yerth10 Posts: 428
    In RX400h, 2 motors are driving the wheels and it gives around 260 hp while in GS450h, only 1 motor is driving the wheels (Rear) giving 300+ hp. That means motor has been improved further.

    Looks like Toyota is moving from Engine to Motor.
  • The car does not signify the end of V-8s. The GS 460 is coming too. The 450 just shows you can have the best of both worlds.
  • trialgamestrialgames Posts: 1
    Does anyone have an idea or info on the pricing for the GS hybrid? I'm trying to be patient and hold off on the 06 GS430.
  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    I was hoping for AWD. I think their fas engine counterpart may have this feature soon. Would be a nice package if there was an option for AWD in their hybrid version.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    "In RX400h, 2 motors are driving the wheels and it gives around 260 hp while in GS450h, only 1 motor is driving the wheels (Rear) giving 300+ hp. That means motor has been improved further."

    You're not telling the whole story there. Remember, the RX400h does not use the GS450h's 3.5L V6. It uses the old Camry derived 3.3L, modified to be more fuel efficient, and making just 208hp on its own. The electrics add a maximum of 60hp. The version of Toyota's all new 3.5L V6 that we've seen thus far makes 280hp in the Avalon. Assuming Toyota chops out 20hp or so for fuel efficiency, that same 60hp electric motor will take it to 320.

    falconone, I agree that Lexus has missed an opportunity to make the GS450h AWD, since that would be something Infiniti cant match. Having the GS450h and GS460 both be RWD seems kind of redundant.
  • maxhonda99maxhonda99 Posts: 1,289
    "falconone, I agree that Lexus has missed an opportunity to make the GS450h AWD, since that would be something Infiniti cant match."

    How is INfiniti going to match the GS450h any which way?? Infiniti has no hybrid plans for the M35/45 that I know of.

    "Having the GS450h and GS460 both be RWD seems kind of redundant. "

    First of all, we don't know what the horsepower will be of the GS450h. It could be around 350, since in the IS350, the same 3.5L will produce over 300bhp according to Lexus. Also, just because the current GS430 doesn't have AWD doesn't mean the V8 version of all future GS's will be RWD only.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    I didnt mean that the M was going to get hybrid power. What I meant was, from what I've read Infiniti says either that there's just not enough demand for an M45x, or the platform literally cant support it because of engine bay space. Most of the cars in the segment offer a V6 and AWD, but the A6 4.2 Quattro is pretty much the only 8 that has it. A GS450h with AWD would allow Lexus to compete with that car, something Infiniti and Acura cant do. It would also provide something more than fuel economy to differentiate itself from the 460.

    The information so far says the 450h will be RWD, have 300+ hp, and go from 0-60 in under six seconds. The 460 will most likely be RWD, have 300+ hp, and go from 0-60 in under six seconds. Why are both of these cars necessary?
  • maxhonda99maxhonda99 Posts: 1,289
    I don't see the point of the GS450h and GS460 either. It seems like the 2 will have similar power and similar price points. At this point it seems like the GS450h will merely cannibalize sales of the GS V8.
  • gmershongmershon Posts: 1
    I ordered a GS 450h on May 1st. The dealer guessed that the price will be about $4000. higher than the GS 400. Ordering early seems to be a good idea based on the success of other hybrid models.
    George
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Interesting. Did the dealer give you any idea of how many other people were interested in the 450h? I think its going to be popular, but I doubt that its going to have the kind of demand that the RX400h does. The GS450h is much more of a niche product.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,043
    I would think if they offered the GS hybrid in AWD it would be a much more popular vehicle than the RX400h. It would be faster, better handling, safer and probably better mileage. Plus it looks a whole lot nicer. The popularity of the the RX300 series completely baffles me.
  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    Have no idea why it baffles you Gary. People know a good car when they see it. I actually owned a 99RX and it was one of my favorite vehicles. Now they're too ubiquitous, but it's no wonder it is the best selling Lexus. Certainly deservedly so. I also wish the GS would have an AWD option in their hybrid version. Maybe...
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,043
    I guess I am a Lexus traditionalist. I liked the early LS400 and think the SC300/400 is the best looking cars Lexus ever built. To me the RX are gaudy and not at all Lexus like. Just opinion and you know what they say about those. I do think the newer GS are nice. My tax man traded his ES300 for an RX330 and was not that thrilled. His wife wanted a nice place for the dog in back on long trips. He has gotten used to it. To me an SUV is for utility and that is it. I would never buy another Suburban. When I sell this one I will buy an old 3/4 ton truck for my hauling needs. I doubt I would ever buy another SUV. With all the AWD cars and wagons they seem useless, unless you have 4 or more children.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    For its mission, the RX is a truly great car. Its not a "driver's car" in the slightest, nor is it a mud-slogger. Its for people who want the high driving position and all-weather security of an SUV with the luxury of an ES sedan. My wife loves her '01 RX. It seems to be a much bigger hit with women than men. If it were me, I would've gone with an FX45, but then again I wouldnt want an SUV for myself.

    The GS will never outsell the RX though.
  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    Agreed... very not Lexus like which is maybe why it has such mass appeal. The initial design took me a while to get used to. An alternative would be the very handsome Dodge variant of the Chrysler 300. Their wagon thingy... not sure what the name is. Very, very sharp.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    The Magnum.. which isnt really RX330 competition. The RX competes with the MDX, FX35\45, ML, X5, XC90, Toureg, B9 Tribeca, and SRX. The next Lincoln Aviator will also join this group. Way to strike while the iron is hot Lincoln!
  • callmedrfillcallmedrfill Posts: 729
    By the time Lincoln can produce a vehicle that isn't a direct knock-off, the SUV market will be all Hybrid (for 1st-rate manufacturers) or diesel.

    The next car-based Aviator won't be here until late-2007 (at the earliest). Yawn!

    DrFill
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Ooo but it will have a 3.5L V6 with as much as 250hp! 3.5L! Wow! Oh wait, everybody has that now. You were correct. Yawn.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Consider buying a hybrid? Reconsider after you learned about the long wait? Whether or not you chose to add your name to the waiting list, a reporter is hoping to hear your perspective. Please respond to jfallon@edmunds.com with your daytime contact info by May 27, 2005.
    Thanks,
    Jeannine Fallon
    Corporate Communications
    Edmunds.com
  • 4lexusguy4lexusguy Posts: 2
    It has been interesting to read the string on the hybrids...
    I started my "Lexus career" with an SC300 - a truly great grand tourer with long legs, great cruising capability and I commuted a round trip of 986 miles from home in FL to office in Charleston SC for two years. Kept it a total of six.

    Got my wife in an RX 300 in 2000, which she loved and I thought was pretty good. Sold the SC a couple of years ago at 186,000 miles (I still look at them on the road with affection and nostalgia) and got a 1998 LS 400 which is another really great car - smooth, fast, comfortable, quiet, great stereo, navigation. Only thing that's dated is the diameter of the cup holders... oh well!

    Traded the RX 300 a month ago for an RX 400h. My wife loves it and so do I. Other than a slow leak on the front left tire it has been faultless. Just came back from a 1,600 mile trip to the NC mountains and thoroughly enjoyed the car. It's amazingly fast for the type of vehicle, with tremendous mid range acceleration, and from Orlando to Cashiers it averaged 24.8 mpg (25.1 until the mountain stage) while traveling close to 80 the whole way. It now has about 4,600 miles on it and the mpg has been improving as time has passed. Doubt it will ever reach the sticker consumption levels of 29/31 - least of all with my foot on the accelerator!

    The Mark Levinson sound system is one of the very best I've ever heard, the car is comfortable and quiet, except under hard acceleration when it makes a strange unaccustomed roar, since it doesn't change gears in a conventional way. The navigation is excellent, the bluetooth phone a wonder. In all I'm very impressed.

    On the strength of this experience I called the dealer today and ordered a GS 450h. Sure, I've done the math, and one can't (yet, at current prices) justify the fuel consumption differential, but these are really cool high tech cars that are fun to drive, and Toyota is leading the pack by a country mile, and I believe this is an initiative worth supporting.

    Ok, so now the retaliation in advance, since it seems customary for BMW and Benz drivers to attack us Lexus chaps. I'm a Brit who has had a few interesting bits of iron: several flavors of Porsche (3), Bentley (3), Shadow II, MGC and MGB (Stage III tuned), Benz 450 SLC, Cooper and Cooper S, BMW 323i (bits fell off it and it felt stodgy on the road), etc., etc. The BMW was the only car I've ever had that was taken from the front of my house on a trailer because of a total engine failure. Pathetic!

    I'll go on record and say that fun though all these were I've left them all behind for the Lexus range. These are unequivocally the best built cars on the road today, with the best service support and overall ownership experience. I went with a friend who owns an MB wagon and an AMG 55S (he had the E model before) and couldn't believe how discourteously the Benz dealership treated him - and that was after the AMG was trailered in from a remote roadside with a "smoke exhalation" problem! (But he did get a nice Chevrolet Cavalier loaner, complete with cigarette ash all over the floor!) Check out the JD Power listing. Benz is somewhere between Yugo and Kia in the initial quality rating, just below Pontiac.

    Gotta run home now!
  • how much did you pay to be on the waiting list?
  • I have a GS400 and was ready to buy a 2006 GS430 having read about it in the auto magazines, when I found out that only the GS300 came in All Wheel Drive. Does anyone know if the GS450H or GS450 is going to be offered in All Wheel?
  • falcononefalconone Posts: 1,726
    I would tend to doubt it as the RH has the AWD but you never know. Too bad there's not more information out there.
  • 4lexusguy4lexusguy Posts: 2
    I didn't pay a dime. I put my name on the list about 6 months before the end of the lease on the RX 300, and then when the time came for the dealer to allocate cars, about 4 weeks before taking delivery, the dealer asked me to firm up my order with a $1,000 deposit.
    That was credited to me at the time of the purchase.

    The dealer was Claude Macrina at Lexus of Melbourne in Florida. He dealt with me fairly and straighforwardly and I thoroughly recommend him.

    Incidentally, a friend of mine bought a Lexus SC 430 from Lexus of Melbourne when they were first released, totally hot, and most dealers were charging a premium of $8k - $10k. They charged him list and not a penny more.

    Now that's an honorable dealer - quite different from the sharks further south, all of whom were charging an "Additional Dealer Fee," aka a gouge that should have had the disqualified from the Lexus dealer network, in my humble opinion.
  • zoranzoran Posts: 68
    Any final words on pricing, or options etc, and miles/gallon yet?
    High 20s do not excite me at this point, if Lexus can get mid 30s from 07 LSH then what the heck wrong with GSH?
  • I've been reading up on these cars and excited about the possibility of getting one.
    However - if the NM price is somewhat close to the MSRP - it's going to be out of reach.

    GS450h
  • ideleidele Posts: 200
    I have read the press release at the current Tokyo Motor Show on the GS450h .Hybrid technology has taken another leap forward. The transmission has six speeds and from the quote that follows, apparently dual range.
    Quote from press release: The 3.5-liter V6 engine employs the new D-4S fuel injection system using duel injectors with both in-cylinder direct fuel injection and ported fuel injection. In synergy with the electric motor, this provides 2.0 liter class fuel economy along with the acceleration you would expect from a 4.5-liter power plant..Another feature of the GS450h is its new transmission designed for hybrid applications. The motor power transmitted to the reduction gear has two modes: In high gear, it adds high-speed cruising pleasure, while in low gear, it controls generation of powerful torque, thereby enhancing acceleration and fual efficiency, while reducing noise.
  • hendjazhendjaz Posts: 155
    Looking forward to the US release. Ist that still planned for Spring 06 and does anyone know if that is closer to April or June, for example?
  • ideleidele Posts: 200
    So am I. I expect to see it by June. The technology on the GS450h is phenomenal. It's regrettable, when I read all the messages on the various Lexus and hybrid forums, how very shallow the comprehension of this technology is. I got an RX400h a few months ago. I just put in my order for a GS450h. This will be the first time I've traded a year old car. With Lexus one knows the vehicle will be cpmpletely debugged.
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